Personally I will be happy with nothing less than a statement that assures us that 3.5 and 5e content we create will continue to be under the 1.0a OGL, as the wording of 1.0a has always been thought by the general public to mean that the document was to stand in perpetuity and would be irrevocable.
What they do with OneDnD/6th edition and what OGL they bring that out under is entirely up to them, however, and I could care less about it.
This current statement's tone shift is clearly meant to placate us.....for me, at least, it has not worked. I do not want a statement from the executive producer, I don't want this friendly conversational tone, I am not an idiot. What I want is a clear and concise statement from someone directly responsible for the writing of this new OGL, someone in the legal department, in marketing or both.
This is a good statement that should satisfy a lot of the outstanding anger. It:
1. Reaffirms commitments from the first statement;
2. Offers a full apology for both the drafts and the delays with responding;
3. Addresses the issue with modification the first statement did not address, and addressed it by committing to future comments rather than unilateral revisions;
4. Is letting folks know they’ll be able to to directly communicate with Wizards and provide feedback;
5. Clarifies what will not be covered by the OGL update; and
6. Specifically provides a delivery date for the actual text of the next draft of the document.
All of those items are things folks have been clamouring for since the prior statement, and represent solid positions on Wizards’ front. Certainly worth waiting until Friday to have the full document to know more, of course, but this was strong step in the right direction.
This is a good statement that should satisfy a lot of the outstanding anger
Ever the optimist, I see
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
Main thing I'm upset about is it seems like the apology isn't from upper management, the people steering the ship so to speak.
At least they didn't try stupid justifications or obvious lies this time - and they set a path forward that is reasonably public, along with a commitment for a chance for public comment.
If they had said this a week ago, we wouldn't be where we are.
I think the minimum change that I will accept. Put out a new 1.1 OGL make it identical to 1.0 OGL except make it irrevocable. This would automatically allow all content in the 5e 3.5e available. I mean literally identical. Only a statement about it being irrevocable by anyone.
After that create a 2.0 OGL for OneDnD or whatever they decide to call it. Until they make 1.0 OGL irrevocable all other discussion is disingenuous because tomorrow they can change their mind and put out 2.1.1110 "psyche we were joking".
It's a start, but it doesn't really address the main issue. They need to make a commitment to leave OGL 1.0a in place for 5e, 3e and 3.5e and make clear that any new OGL will only cover OneDnD/6e/Whateverstupidnametheyuseforit. That, or commit to dropping 5e and 3/3.5e under the ORC License when it comes out. Otherwise, you have a lot of people who are totally screwed.
I think the minimum change that I will accept. Put out a new 1.1 OGL make it identical to 1.0 OGL except make it irrevocable. This would automatically allow all content in the 5e 3.5e available. I mean literally identical. Only a statement about it being irrevocable by anyone.
After that create a 2.0 OGL for OneDnD or whatever they decide to call it. Until they make 1.0 OGL irrevocable all other discussion is disingenuous because tomorrow they can change their mind and put out 2.1.1110 "psyche we were joking".
This really isn't happening unless a court forces it, so if that's your minimum you may as well jump ship now.
If this had been the first statement that was released my mood with WotC would be very different. As it is they've destroyed 23 years of good will in the course of a week, and it'll take a lot more than that to get my faith back in the company. I'm still following this, and at the moment I'm waiting to see what they do. I'm more than prepared to unsubscribe from their content and boycott everything by Hasbro. This is coming from someone who has been a brand advocate for DnD for a decade. They need to know we don't need them, and we have other options. DnD's dominance in the TTRPG scene is a recent phenomenon that started with 5e, in large part because of the OGL and third party publishers almost exclusively publishing for DnD.
This whole debacle has decided for me that I will not be switching to 6th edition (I know they're calling it One DnD, but they've never called a new edition "x edition" when it was released except 4e)... What's on the line now is whether or not I permanently cancel my subscription. If the rumours circulating now about the 30 dollars a month increase are true, then that won't be a question, seeing as I'm currently teetering on the fence about paying 1/6th that amount.
I'm not at the point of switching yet, but I'm looking into other systems, I encourage the rest of you to do the same, in case WotC keeps pulling stunts like this.
yeah, they threw poor Kyle to the dogs. hopefully the community knows enough not to go after him personally.
I'm sure most won't. However, given the propensity of some to not only defeat Carthage, not only to tear down it brick by brick, but also to salt its fields, I'm not optimistic that it won't happen.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
I think the minimum change that I will accept. Put out a new 1.1 OGL make it identical to 1.0 OGL except make it irrevocable. This would automatically allow all content in the 5e 3.5e available. I mean literally identical. Only a statement about it being irrevocable by anyone.
After that create a 2.0 OGL for OneDnD or whatever they decide to call it. Until they make 1.0 OGL irrevocable all other discussion is disingenuous because tomorrow they can change their mind and put out 2.1.1110 "psyche we were joking".
This really isn't happening unless a court forces it, so if that's your minimum you may as well jump ship now.
Seriously.
People being upset halted 1.1 in it's tracks and forced them to the table to negotiate and do this as a public process.
Stop trying to convince people this goal is pointless - it's obviously something we can push for, and maybe reach.
A few nice words aren't making me trust them. I still don't support their goals and aims for updating the OGL. I think this whole thing was a poisoned pill designed to make it so no one but WotC can provide 6e content.
And I've seen how absolutely pointless and poorly designed their surveys are, so this is probably a PR stunt.
yeah, they threw poor Kyle to the dogs. hopefully the community knows enough not to go after him personally.
It's the organisation I direct my anger at, and while I think a few people at the top, including the current CEO of Hasbro (and former of WotC) as well as the current head of WotC are to blame, it's never cool to go after people personally.
a lot more details will get answered on Friday....and that survey will be important. cuz there are some points i think the community will like clarification about
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1428-a-working-conversation-about-the-open-game-license
annnnnnnnd GO!
It is actually reassuring, I guess ? Let's see how the conversation will go, but at least there is an apology and no royalty or ownership of content.
It may not be Kyle that is the problem but the people holding the purse strings pushing to screw things in every way they can.
If Kyle was behind it then we'd have to wonder what was he thinking and how did he get there.
Personally I will be happy with nothing less than a statement that assures us that 3.5 and 5e content we create will continue to be under the 1.0a OGL, as the wording of 1.0a has always been thought by the general public to mean that the document was to stand in perpetuity and would be irrevocable.
What they do with OneDnD/6th edition and what OGL they bring that out under is entirely up to them, however, and I could care less about it.
This current statement's tone shift is clearly meant to placate us.....for me, at least, it has not worked. I do not want a statement from the executive producer, I don't want this friendly conversational tone, I am not an idiot. What I want is a clear and concise statement from someone directly responsible for the writing of this new OGL, someone in the legal department, in marketing or both.
This is a good statement that should satisfy a lot of the outstanding anger. It:
1. Reaffirms commitments from the first statement;
2. Offers a full apology for both the drafts and the delays with responding;
3. Addresses the issue with modification the first statement did not address, and addressed it by committing to future comments rather than unilateral revisions;
4. Is letting folks know they’ll be able to to directly communicate with Wizards and provide feedback;
5. Clarifies what will not be covered by the OGL update; and
6. Specifically provides a delivery date for the actual text of the next draft of the document.
All of those items are things folks have been clamouring for since the prior statement, and represent solid positions on Wizards’ front. Certainly worth waiting until Friday to have the full document to know more, of course, but this was strong step in the right direction.
the survey will be the opportunity to provide feedback directly to them. one hopes it's a well formatted one and the community can give good input
Ever the optimist, I see
Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock)
Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric)
Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
It's progress.
Main thing I'm upset about is it seems like the apology isn't from upper management, the people steering the ship so to speak.
At least they didn't try stupid justifications or obvious lies this time - and they set a path forward that is reasonably public, along with a commitment for a chance for public comment.
If they had said this a week ago, we wouldn't be where we are.
yeah, they threw poor Kyle to the dogs. hopefully the community knows enough not to go after him personally.
I think the minimum change that I will accept. Put out a new 1.1 OGL make it identical to 1.0 OGL except make it irrevocable. This would automatically allow all content in the 5e 3.5e available. I mean literally identical. Only a statement about it being irrevocable by anyone.
After that create a 2.0 OGL for OneDnD or whatever they decide to call it. Until they make 1.0 OGL irrevocable all other discussion is disingenuous because tomorrow they can change their mind and put out 2.1.1110 "psyche we were joking".
Fantastic. And way better than "we both won."
Looking forward to Friday.
They're still trying to say that what got leaked was a draft?
Sterling - V. Human Bard 3 (College of Art) - [Pic] - [Traits] - in Bards: Dragon Heist (w/ Mansion) - Jasper's [Pic] - Sterling's [Sigil]
Tooltips Post (2024 PHB updates) - incl. General Rules
>> New FOW threat & treasure tables: fow-advanced-threat-tables.pdf fow-advanced-treasure-table.pdf
It's a start, but it doesn't really address the main issue. They need to make a commitment to leave OGL 1.0a in place for 5e, 3e and 3.5e and make clear that any new OGL will only cover OneDnD/6e/Whateverstupidnametheyuseforit. That, or commit to dropping 5e and 3/3.5e under the ORC License when it comes out. Otherwise, you have a lot of people who are totally screwed.
in a purely legal sense, it was a draft. a draft document waiting to be executed with signature. not a draft of a working document.
it's nitpicky
This really isn't happening unless a court forces it, so if that's your minimum you may as well jump ship now.
If this had been the first statement that was released my mood with WotC would be very different. As it is they've destroyed 23 years of good will in the course of a week, and it'll take a lot more than that to get my faith back in the company. I'm still following this, and at the moment I'm waiting to see what they do. I'm more than prepared to unsubscribe from their content and boycott everything by Hasbro. This is coming from someone who has been a brand advocate for DnD for a decade. They need to know we don't need them, and we have other options. DnD's dominance in the TTRPG scene is a recent phenomenon that started with 5e, in large part because of the OGL and third party publishers almost exclusively publishing for DnD.
This whole debacle has decided for me that I will not be switching to 6th edition (I know they're calling it One DnD, but they've never called a new edition "x edition" when it was released except 4e)... What's on the line now is whether or not I permanently cancel my subscription. If the rumours circulating now about the 30 dollars a month increase are true, then that won't be a question, seeing as I'm currently teetering on the fence about paying 1/6th that amount.
I'm not at the point of switching yet, but I'm looking into other systems, I encourage the rest of you to do the same, in case WotC keeps pulling stunts like this.
I'm sure most won't. However, given the propensity of some to not only defeat Carthage, not only to tear down it brick by brick, but also to salt its fields, I'm not optimistic that it won't happen.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
Seriously.
People being upset halted 1.1 in it's tracks and forced them to the table to negotiate and do this as a public process.
Stop trying to convince people this goal is pointless - it's obviously something we can push for, and maybe reach.
A few nice words aren't making me trust them. I still don't support their goals and aims for updating the OGL. I think this whole thing was a poisoned pill designed to make it so no one but WotC can provide 6e content.
And I've seen how absolutely pointless and poorly designed their surveys are, so this is probably a PR stunt.
It's the organisation I direct my anger at, and while I think a few people at the top, including the current CEO of Hasbro (and former of WotC) as well as the current head of WotC are to blame, it's never cool to go after people personally.
Fantasy Grounds Ultimate Licence Holder
a lot more details will get answered on Friday....and that survey will be important. cuz there are some points i think the community will like clarification about