Hi guys! I apologize if this topic has already been brought to discussion, but I see a lot of divided opinions on the matter of the new Divine Smite spell and Critical Hits. Does the spell's damage double when you score a Critical Hit or not?
The casting time of Divine Smite says: Bonus action, which you take immediately after hitting a target with a Melee weapon or an Unarmed Strike. It's the immediately after part that makes me think it does not apply to Critical Hits anymore. The wording is clearly different from the 5e (2014) version, which states: Starting at 2nd level, when you hit a creature with a melee weapon attack, you can expend one spell slot to deal radiant damage to the target, in addition to the weapon's damage.
IMO I think Divine Smite not applying to crits is a good thing, it balances the Paladin Class and encourages the use of the other Smite spells. What do you guys think?
Divine Smite also states "The target takes an extra 2d8 Radiant damage from the attack", so I say critical hits do apply to Divine Smite. It is a bit confusing how you can make the attack do more damage after the fact, though.
The target takes an extra 2d8 Radiant damage from the attack.
The spell even tells you that it is part of the attack.
The wording is the same for features like Sneak Attack too
Once per turn, you can deal an extra 1d6 damage to one creature you hit with an attack roll if you have Advantage on the roll and the attack uses a Finesse or a Ranged weapon. The extra damage’s type is the same as the weapon’s type.
Smites still crit
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Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
As I always say, you have to ask: if it was the intent that this damage no longer got multiplied on a critical hit, is this the way they would've written it? Or would they have written it in such a way that a hugely impactful change like that was more explicitly clear?
There are damage boost effects in the game that are intended to not get multiplied by critical hits, but they don't use wording like this. They generally either make the extra damage a fixed value (rather than a die roll) or they instruct you to roll the dice and add the result as a bonus after the fact.
Smites obviously apply the effect of Critical Hits as the effect of the spell time (not it's cast time) that matters to determine that. Others have already pointed it out but Divine Smite adds extra damage to the attack, and additionally hitting is the Attack Roll, thus Divine Smite is cast between the attack roll and the damage roll. Until the damage roll is rolled, the attack is not fully resolved.
outside of subclass features, Divine Smite would be dead without the ability too critical. Other smites are already better in multiple situations and even with crit-fishing smites are not the best DPR that a Paladin can get.
There are three spells which are always going to be best cast in the first round before any attack is performed and those are Divine Favor (1st level), Spirit Shroud (3rd level - Tasha's) & Holy Weapon (5th level) these can potentially even out damage a Crit Divine Smite of the same level anyway, over the course of an encounter, at least once you have extra attack or additional attacks (i.e. from PAM). So there is also competition for some spell slots and bonus actions against smite spells. Really using smite spells now, you're doing it for the additional effects more than just pure damage.
Hi guys! I apologize if this topic has already been brought to discussion, but I see a lot of divided opinions on the matter of the new Divine Smite spell and Critical Hits. Does the spell's damage double when you score a Critical Hit or not?
The casting time of Divine Smite says: Bonus action, which you take immediately after hitting a target with a Melee weapon or an Unarmed Strike. It's the immediately after part that makes me think it does not apply to Critical Hits anymore. The wording is clearly different from the 5e (2014) version, which states: Starting at 2nd level, when you hit a creature with a melee weapon attack, you can expend one spell slot to deal radiant damage to the target, in addition to the weapon's damage.
IMO I think Divine Smite not applying to crits is a good thing, it balances the Paladin Class and encourages the use of the other Smite spells. What do you guys think?
It’s just saying, you are using your Bonus Action economy to do this extra damage, which is counted to the Action economy Attack action. So like everyone else said, all “extra dice damage” are included in the critical hit calculation (double the di).Nothing complicated. The player would have to know that BA was used, and can’t use it again this round.
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Hi guys! I apologize if this topic has already been brought to discussion, but I see a lot of divided opinions on the matter of the new Divine Smite spell and Critical Hits. Does the spell's damage double when you score a Critical Hit or not?
The casting time of Divine Smite says: Bonus action, which you take immediately after hitting a target with a Melee weapon or an Unarmed Strike. It's the immediately after part that makes me think it does not apply to Critical Hits anymore. The wording is clearly different from the 5e (2014) version, which states: Starting at 2nd level, when you hit a creature with a melee weapon attack, you can expend one spell slot to deal radiant damage to the target, in addition to the weapon's damage.
IMO I think Divine Smite not applying to crits is a good thing, it balances the Paladin Class and encourages the use of the other Smite spells. What do you guys think?
Divine Smite also states "The target takes an extra 2d8 Radiant damage from the attack", so I say critical hits do apply to Divine Smite. It is a bit confusing how you can make the attack do more damage after the fact, though.
The spell even tells you that it is part of the attack.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
The wording is the same for features like Sneak Attack too
Smites still crit
Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock)
Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric)
Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
As I always say, you have to ask: if it was the intent that this damage no longer got multiplied on a critical hit, is this the way they would've written it? Or would they have written it in such a way that a hugely impactful change like that was more explicitly clear?
There are damage boost effects in the game that are intended to not get multiplied by critical hits, but they don't use wording like this. They generally either make the extra damage a fixed value (rather than a die roll) or they instruct you to roll the dice and add the result as a bonus after the fact.
pronouns: he/she/they
Any source of extra damage from an attack get double by Critical Hit.
outside of subclass features, Divine Smite would be dead without the ability too critical. Other smites are already better in multiple situations and even with crit-fishing smites are not the best DPR that a Paladin can get.
There are three spells which are always going to be best cast in the first round before any attack is performed and those are Divine Favor (1st level), Spirit Shroud (3rd level - Tasha's) & Holy Weapon (5th level) these can potentially even out damage a Crit Divine Smite of the same level anyway, over the course of an encounter, at least once you have extra attack or additional attacks (i.e. from PAM). So there is also competition for some spell slots and bonus actions against smite spells. Really using smite spells now, you're doing it for the additional effects more than just pure damage.
Wow, a lot of answers! I can see the point everyone makes, thank you so much!! <3
It’s just saying, you are using your Bonus Action economy to do this extra damage, which is counted to the Action economy Attack action. So like everyone else said, all “extra dice damage” are included in the critical hit calculation (double the di).Nothing complicated. The player would have to know that BA was used, and can’t use it again this round.