I did not pay several hundred pound to not have access to the content I bought. From what I am reading we still have access to our content in compendiums. but its not a clear indication that we will be able to use this on character sheets, if this is the case I will cancel my Subscription immediately and Boycott WOTC.
you will not be able to use the 2014 spells on your sheets unless you homebrew, get your picket sign ready
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
Anything that is either entirely removed from the toolset or broken by the removal of other items from the toolset is being taken away. Any other stance is objectively wrong because whether the content is present or not is a binary.
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Grant K. Smith A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
So I will need to HB, hundreds of spells and almost a thousand Magical items to utilise the content in character sheets? not being obnoxious generally curious.
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
Some of the spells are completely changed in function. There's a number of builds that don't even function as intended any more under the new spells. There's no logical argument to say those are the same spells, even if they have the same names. If the new descriptions were simply incorporating errata, sage advice, etc. or cleaning up the descriptions to make them simpler, you'd have an argument to make here, but you don't.
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
Anything that is either entirely removed from the toolset or broken by the removal of other items from the toolset is being taken away. Any other stance is objectively wrong because whether the content is present or not is a binary.
Please reread what you responded to.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Grant K. Smith A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
Some of the spells are completely changed in function. There's a number of builds that don't even function as intended any more under the new spells. There's no logical argument to say those are the same spells, even if they have the same names. If the new descriptions were simply incorporating errata, sage advice, etc. or cleaning up the descriptions to make them simpler, you'd have an argument to make here, but you don't.
Please reread what you responded to.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Grant K. Smith A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
thing is if you pick a 2014 warlock and you get your invocations you will receive the 2024 spells and currently there is no way to homebrew the spells in to the invocations, so there will be no way to play a pure 2014 warlock therefor the class is broken in the since that they said we would be able to play our 2014 characters. this is all according to the sheets on beyond but thats what we all payed for and if we only wanted access in the compendium there used to be a way to buy books that way for a heavy discount. but they removed that because they knew this change was coming
There might be a bit of a Catch-22 in that if WotC both enforces it's copyrights in prohibiting copying of 2014 content directly into Homebrew, then they can't argue that Homebrew provides a means by which a customer can use their toolset with the digital books that the customer purchased. But I'm not a lawyer. That said, I've worked on a SW project that provided database information to customers, and the first thing we did was figure out how to make sure the customers had access to the version and features of the data that they had purchased, and not access to that which they had not purchased, because F*CKING DUH, if you're selling data, you provide the data you sold (and there were excellent legal reasons for doing so). Also ironically, as I've been checking with my various gaming groups, I can't cancel my subscription at this point - there's too many folks relying on it, and the consensus seems to be "ride it out until we switch systems" (that's fine - it renewed in May, and maybe in 9 months or so they'll fix things). Also anecdotally, the master DM at the local game store (organizes about a dozen ongoing campaigns with various DMs) announced her retirement from D&D this weekend. Coincidence, I'm sure.
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
thing is if you pick a 2014 warlock and you get your invocations you will receive the 2024 spells and currently there is now way to homebrew the spells in to the invocations, so there will be no way to play a pure 2014 warlock therefor the class is broken in the since that they said we would be able to play our 2014 characters. this is all according to the sheets on beyond but thats what we all payed for and if we only wanted access in the compendium there used to be a way to buy books that way for a heavy discount. but they removed that because they knew this change was coming
And I never said otherwise.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Grant K. Smith A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
There might be a bit of a Catch-22 in that if WotC both enforces it's copyrights in prohibiting copying of 2014 content directly into Homebrew, then they can't argue that Homebrew provides a means by which a customer can use their toolset with the digital books that the customer purchased. But I'm not a lawyer. That said, I've worked on a SW project that provided database information to customers, and the first thing we did was figure out how to make sure the customers had access to the version and features of the data that they had purchased, and not access to that which they had not purchased, because F*CKING DUH, if you're selling data, you provide the data you sold (and there were excellent legal reasons for doing so). Also ironically, as I've been checking with my various gaming groups, I can't cancel my subscription at this point - there's too many folks relying on it, and the consensus seems to be "ride it out until we switch systems" (that's fine - it renewed in May, and maybe in 9 months or so they'll fix things). Also anecdotally, the master DM at the local game store (organizes about a dozen ongoing campaigns with various DMs) announced her retirement from D&D this weekend. Coincidence, I'm sure.
#DDBClassic
This is one of my concerns too, If I cant even HB the spells and items, i have essentially wasted several hundred pounds to use them as reference documents. I am actually so frustrated by this
Yeeeeh... I've cancelled my subscription. I've had one for a long time because I DM a lot and liked to be able to content share with my players. We are in the middle of campaigns and don't want to change rulesets in the middle. So if the content I paid for is no longer going to be accessible on the character sheets (which is the reason I bought all the books in the first place!) I see no point in continuing.
I had been on the fence about 5.2024, I would have read things when it all came out and likely would have run my next campaign on 5.2024. But with this, plus the OGL issue before I just don't want to and can't support WotC any more. I imagine I am not the only one who feels this way either. I have been playing D&D since 3rd Edition and it looks like I'll be looking at other TTRPG's going forwards because the horror show that has been WotC in recent years is not worth supporting anymore.
Congratulations on alienating your entire fanbase just to try and force people to buy the new 2024 edition.
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
I cannot use any of the 2014 spells without homebrewing my own copy.
I cannot make a 2014 warlock, as warlock invocations do not grant 2014 spells and cannot be homebrewed.
I cannot play any 2014 spellcaster as the expanded spell lists from TGE do not grant the 2014 spells.
I cannot use any magic item that uses or grants spells, as they do not use or grant 2014 spells, and as far as we know cannot be homebrewed to use or grant homebrew spells.
I cannot use the character sheet itself fully, as all of the rules and references will be changed to 2024 rules.
I cannot use monsters with spellcasting, as while the monsters themselves will be preserved they will only show the new spells.
Even with the compendium, the text will be preserved, but it seems that all the tooltips for spells will show the new version making the whole thing inaccurate & confusing.
And that's just off the top of my head. Reading through the forums we're finding more and more issues all the time.
I know you have been in these threads over the last few days, so you know that this is more than just a few spells. I don't know why you're trying to minimise the effects of these changes, but you are 100% lying to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
(P.S., if your response is going to be along the lines of "they're not removing the 2014 warlock invocations, just making them completely unusable", then don't bother)
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
thing is if you pick a 2014 warlock and you get your invocations you will receive the 2024 spells and currently there is now way to homebrew the spells in to the invocations, so there will be no way to play a pure 2014 warlock therefor the class is broken in the since that they said we would be able to play our 2014 characters. this is all according to the sheets on beyond but thats what we all payed for and if we only wanted access in the compendium there used to be a way to buy books that way for a heavy discount. but they removed that because they knew this change was coming
And I never said otherwise.
you said you you would be able to pick a 2014 class [which is true] however the fact this update complete breaks certain classes on the sheets i feel makes that statement misleading. not trying to throw shade just trying to clarify. i do like your idea of a dnd classic i just dont want people misinformed
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
I cannot use any of the 2014 spells without homebrewing my own copy.
I cannot make a 2014 warlock, as warlock invocations do not grant 2014 spells and cannot be homebrewed.
I cannot play any 2014 spellcaster as the expanded spell lists from TGE do not grant the 2014 spells.
I cannot use any magic item that uses or grants spells, as they do not use or grant 2014 spells, and as far as we know cannot be homebrewed to use or grant homebrew spells.
I cannot use the character sheet itself fully, as all of the rules and references will be changed to 2024 rules.
I cannot use monsters with spellcasting, as while the monsters themselves will be preserved they will only show the new spells.
Even with the compendium, the text will be preserved, but it seems that all the tooltips for spells will show the new version making the whole thing inaccurate & confusing.
And that's just off the top of my head. Reading through the forums we're finding more and more issues all the time.
I know you have been in these threads over the last few days, so you know that this is more than just a few spells. I don't know why you're trying to minimise the effects of these changes, but you are 100% lying to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
(P.S., if your response is going to be along the lines of "they're not removing the 2014 warlock invocations, just making them completely unusable", then don't bother)
I'm pointing out that the 2014 content folks purchased in the big sale that was such a dirty deed because of all this is actually still accessible with the noted exceptions, thus claiming malice on the part of DDB having a sale is disingenuous, and you're calling me a liar.
Also, you're coming at it from the angle of trying to play 2014 rules and I'm coming at it from the angle of all this stuff is still usable AFTER the update in 2024 land, just like WotC said it would be. I did not minimize the issues with the 2014 situation at all.
But you resort to personal attacks so I'm done.
I've been advocating solutions and trying to squash the BS flying around this thread but nearly everyone just wants to throw tantrums and insult what they disagree with so have at it.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Grant K. Smith A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
I cannot use any of the 2014 spells without homebrewing my own copy.
I cannot make a 2014 warlock, as warlock invocations do not grant 2014 spells and cannot be homebrewed.
I cannot play any 2014 spellcaster as the expanded spell lists from TGE do not grant the 2014 spells.
I cannot use any magic item that uses or grants spells, as they do not use or grant 2014 spells, and as far as we know cannot be homebrewed to use or grant homebrew spells.
I cannot use the character sheet itself fully, as all of the rules and references will be changed to 2024 rules.
I cannot use monsters with spellcasting, as while the monsters themselves will be preserved they will only show the new spells.
Even with the compendium, the text will be preserved, but it seems that all the tooltips for spells will show the new version making the whole thing inaccurate & confusing.
And that's just off the top of my head. Reading through the forums we're finding more and more issues all the time.
I know you have been in these threads over the last few days, so you know that this is more than just a few spells. I don't know why you're trying to minimise the effects of these changes, but you are 100% lying to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
(P.S., if your response is going to be along the lines of "they're not removing the 2014 warlock invocations, just making them completely unusable", then don't bother)
this also breaks clerics getting there spells that cant be homebrewed and also breaks tashas additional spells that cant be homebrewed just so you know
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
thing is if you pick a 2014 warlock and you get your invocations you will receive the 2024 spells and currently there is now way to homebrew the spells in to the invocations, so there will be no way to play a pure 2014 warlock therefor the class is broken in the since that they said we would be able to play our 2014 characters. this is all according to the sheets on beyond but thats what we all payed for and if we only wanted access in the compendium there used to be a way to buy books that way for a heavy discount. but they removed that because they knew this change was coming
And I never said otherwise.
you said you you would be able to pick a 2014 class [which is true] however the fact this update complete breaks certain classes on the sheets i feel makes that statement misleading. not trying to throw shade just trying to clarify. i do like your idea of a dnd classic i just dont want people misinformed
It breaks them if you're trying to play with 2014 rules. It does not break them in the least if you're playing with the 2024 update and I did not claim otherwise, thus there was no misinformation provided.
But thanks for your clarification.
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Grant K. Smith A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
I cannot use any of the 2014 spells without homebrewing my own copy.
I cannot make a 2014 warlock, as warlock invocations do not grant 2014 spells and cannot be homebrewed.
I cannot play any 2014 spellcaster as the expanded spell lists from TGE do not grant the 2014 spells.
I cannot use any magic item that uses or grants spells, as they do not use or grant 2014 spells, and as far as we know cannot be homebrewed to use or grant homebrew spells.
I cannot use the character sheet itself fully, as all of the rules and references will be changed to 2024 rules.
I cannot use monsters with spellcasting, as while the monsters themselves will be preserved they will only show the new spells.
Even with the compendium, the text will be preserved, but it seems that all the tooltips for spells will show the new version making the whole thing inaccurate & confusing.
And that's just off the top of my head. Reading through the forums we're finding more and more issues all the time.
I know you have been in these threads over the last few days, so you know that this is more than just a few spells. I don't know why you're trying to minimise the effects of these changes, but you are 100% lying to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
(P.S., if your response is going to be along the lines of "they're not removing the 2014 warlock invocations, just making them completely unusable", then don't bother)
wotc/hasbro/dndbeyond staff
What solution will be provided for the issues with character classes raised in this post? We can't homebrew fix it.
One more Ugly thing Beyond did is - Big sale not so long ago. Imagine Doing a sale on 5e content and then after a bit telling all the people who bought the books on sale that your books are WORTHLESS! We got you! Ha Ha! You thought you were buying stuff for cheap and will be able to use! Well guess what! You`re not! Ha! Now so long sucker! Your money is now ours!
This is inaccurate. The 2014 stuff isn't going away. Some character sheet functionality is being updated to 2024 but all the 2014 stuff is still fully useable outside of DDB AND most of it is still useable in DDB. It's compatible with the 2024 update.
Toolset content is explicitly part of what was purchased during the sale. That is now being removed. It is an outright lie to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
No, it's an outright lie to say it is going away. Even using your definition, only part of it is going away, which is exactly what I said. You have no standing to call me a liar.
If you prefer, saying "The 2014 stuff isn't going away" is a totally misleading statement to imply that you can continue using the 2014 rules, to the point that anyone reading it would feel lied to.
In actuality most of the "2014" stuff is being removed or rendered unusable, and it will be impossible to play under 2014 rules.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
thing is if you pick a 2014 warlock and you get your invocations you will receive the 2024 spells and currently there is now way to homebrew the spells in to the invocations, so there will be no way to play a pure 2014 warlock therefor the class is broken in the since that they said we would be able to play our 2014 characters. this is all according to the sheets on beyond but thats what we all payed for and if we only wanted access in the compendium there used to be a way to buy books that way for a heavy discount. but they removed that because they knew this change was coming
And I never said otherwise.
you said you you would be able to pick a 2014 class [which is true] however the fact this update complete breaks certain classes on the sheets i feel makes that statement misleading. not trying to throw shade just trying to clarify. i do like your idea of a dnd classic i just dont want people misinformed
It breaks them if you're trying to play with 2014 rules. It does not break them in the least if you're playing with the 2024 update and I did not claim otherwise, thus there was no misinformation provided.
But thanks for your clarification.
99% of people in this thread DOESNT CARE ABOUT 2024 RULES! WE ONLY CARE ABOUT 2014 RULES! THATS IT! And we are saying that Beyond and WoTC and Hasbro Are killing 2014 rules for there GREED to shove people throats 2024 rules. WE WANT FULL SUPPORT OF 2014 RULES IN CHARACTER SHEET! No need to tell us about 2024 rules. People paid money for 2014 rules!
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you will not be able to use the 2014 spells on your sheets unless you homebrew, get your picket sign ready
Anything that is either entirely removed from the toolset or broken by the removal of other items from the toolset is being taken away. Any other stance is objectively wrong because whether the content is present or not is a binary.
Again, that's completely inaccurate.
If I make a new character on 9/3, I'll be able to pick a 2014 class or a 2024 class, so classes didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 subclass or 2024 subclass so subclasses didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick 2014 feats or 2024 feats so feats didn't go anywhere.... I'll be able to pick a 2014 species or a 2024 species so those didn't go anywhere either. All that content that was purchased is COMPLETELY accessible.
Furthermore, if I bought adventures, they're still accessible, the monsters from those adventures are still accessible, the player options from those adventures are still accessible.
The ONLY things that are not accessible according to the changelog are a subset of things that are being updated to the 2024 versions, namely spell descriptions and rule definitions.
So tell me again how I'm a liar when I say that you have access to nearly everything you purchased during the sale.
Grant K. Smith
A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
So I will need to HB, hundreds of spells and almost a thousand Magical items to utilise the content in character sheets? not being obnoxious generally curious.
Some of the spells are completely changed in function. There's a number of builds that don't even function as intended any more under the new spells. There's no logical argument to say those are the same spells, even if they have the same names. If the new descriptions were simply incorporating errata, sage advice, etc. or cleaning up the descriptions to make them simpler, you'd have an argument to make here, but you don't.
Please reread what you responded to.
Grant K. Smith
A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
Please reread what you responded to.
Grant K. Smith
A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
thing is if you pick a 2014 warlock and you get your invocations you will receive the 2024 spells and currently there is no way to homebrew the spells in to the invocations, so there will be no way to play a pure 2014 warlock therefor the class is broken in the since that they said we would be able to play our 2014 characters. this is all according to the sheets on beyond but thats what we all payed for and if we only wanted access in the compendium there used to be a way to buy books that way for a heavy discount. but they removed that because they knew this change was coming
There might be a bit of a Catch-22 in that if WotC both enforces it's copyrights in prohibiting copying of 2014 content directly into Homebrew, then they can't argue that Homebrew provides a means by which a customer can use their toolset with the digital books that the customer purchased. But I'm not a lawyer. That said, I've worked on a SW project that provided database information to customers, and the first thing we did was figure out how to make sure the customers had access to the version and features of the data that they had purchased, and not access to that which they had not purchased, because F*CKING DUH, if you're selling data, you provide the data you sold (and there were excellent legal reasons for doing so). Also ironically, as I've been checking with my various gaming groups, I can't cancel my subscription at this point - there's too many folks relying on it, and the consensus seems to be "ride it out until we switch systems" (that's fine - it renewed in May, and maybe in 9 months or so they'll fix things). Also anecdotally, the master DM at the local game store (organizes about a dozen ongoing campaigns with various DMs) announced her retirement from D&D this weekend. Coincidence, I'm sure.
#DDBClassic
And I never said otherwise.
Grant K. Smith
A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
This is one of my concerns too, If I cant even HB the spells and items, i have essentially wasted several hundred pounds to use them as reference documents. I am actually so frustrated by this
Yeeeeh... I've cancelled my subscription. I've had one for a long time because I DM a lot and liked to be able to content share with my players. We are in the middle of campaigns and don't want to change rulesets in the middle. So if the content I paid for is no longer going to be accessible on the character sheets (which is the reason I bought all the books in the first place!) I see no point in continuing.
I had been on the fence about 5.2024, I would have read things when it all came out and likely would have run my next campaign on 5.2024. But with this, plus the OGL issue before I just don't want to and can't support WotC any more. I imagine I am not the only one who feels this way either. I have been playing D&D since 3rd Edition and it looks like I'll be looking at other TTRPG's going forwards because the horror show that has been WotC in recent years is not worth supporting anymore.
Congratulations on alienating your entire fanbase just to try and force people to buy the new 2024 edition.
Well done, WOTC, screwing up people’s games mid-campaign.
My group uses DDB and Avrae. It looks like we now have to switch to Roll20.
It would have been easy to setup a toggle to switch between 5 and 5.5.
And that's just off the top of my head. Reading through the forums we're finding more and more issues all the time.
I know you have been in these threads over the last few days, so you know that this is more than just a few spells. I don't know why you're trying to minimise the effects of these changes, but you are 100% lying to say that "The 2014 stuff isn't going away".
(P.S., if your response is going to be along the lines of "they're not removing the 2014 warlock invocations, just making them completely unusable", then don't bother)
you said you you would be able to pick a 2014 class [which is true] however the fact this update complete breaks certain classes on the sheets i feel makes that statement misleading. not trying to throw shade just trying to clarify. i do like your idea of a dnd classic i just dont want people misinformed
I'm pointing out that the 2014 content folks purchased in the big sale that was such a dirty deed because of all this is actually still accessible with the noted exceptions, thus claiming malice on the part of DDB having a sale is disingenuous, and you're calling me a liar.
Also, you're coming at it from the angle of trying to play 2014 rules and I'm coming at it from the angle of all this stuff is still usable AFTER the update in 2024 land, just like WotC said it would be. I did not minimize the issues with the 2014 situation at all.
But you resort to personal attacks so I'm done.
I've been advocating solutions and trying to squash the BS flying around this thread but nearly everyone just wants to throw tantrums and insult what they disagree with so have at it.
Grant K. Smith
A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
this also breaks clerics getting there spells that cant be homebrewed and also breaks tashas additional spells that cant be homebrewed just so you know
It breaks them if you're trying to play with 2014 rules. It does not break them in the least if you're playing with the 2024 update and I did not claim otherwise, thus there was no misinformation provided.
But thanks for your clarification.
Grant K. Smith
A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
wotc/hasbro/dndbeyond staff
What solution will be provided for the issues with character classes raised in this post? We can't homebrew fix it.
99% of people in this thread DOESNT CARE ABOUT 2024 RULES! WE ONLY CARE ABOUT 2014 RULES! THATS IT! And we are saying that Beyond and WoTC and Hasbro Are killing 2014 rules for there GREED to shove people throats 2024 rules. WE WANT FULL SUPPORT OF 2014 RULES IN CHARACTER SHEET! No need to tell us about 2024 rules. People paid money for 2014 rules!