Just wanted to make sure I understood the AL rules correctly on this.
My understanding is the only poison that can be bought is the basic one in the PHB.
Also my understand is that if you do use a kit to extract poison during a session you can only use that poison during that session. You cannot take it with you after the session is over and you cannot sell it?
So for example, you kill a Purple Wyrm. You extract 5 vials of poison. You can use those during that session/module only. It disappears after that module is done.
You asked where the ALPG v13 was. That's the question I was answering. The answer to your original question is that the DMG is not an AL legal source (being that it's not listed in the ALPG), thus you can't use anything from it unless you have a cert or specific documentation (such as a DM Quest). You can't harvest from monsters in AL at all as it's not a feature listed in an AL legal source.
You asked where the ALPG v13 was. That's the question I was answering. The answer to your original question is that the DMG is not an AL legal source (being that it's not listed in the ALPG), thus you can't use anything from it unless you have a cert or specific documentation (such as a DM Quest). You can't harvest from monsters in AL at all as it's not a feature listed in an AL legal source.
Okay...so even within the same module you are playing you cannot harvest and use the poisons?
So then why bother with the poisoner kit or the feat? Seems silly you cannot at least use it in the session you are playing.
That would be up to you to decide but neither the Poisoner Feat nor the Poisoner's Kit grant any special ability to make poisons.
The poisoner feat explicitly states the poison you create and can use.
"You can prepare and deliver deadly poisons, granting you the following benefits:
When you make a damage roll that deals poison damage, it ignores resistance to poison damage.
You can apply poison to a weapon or piece of ammunition as a bonus action, instead of an action.
You gain proficiency with the Poisoner's Kit if you don’t already have it. With one hour of work using a poisoner’s kit and expending 50 gp worth of materials, you can create a number of doses of potent poison equal to your proficiency bonus. Once applied to a weapon or piece of ammunition, the poison retains its potency for 1 minute or until you hit with the weapon or ammunition. When a creature takes damage from the coated weapon or ammunition, that creature must succeed on a DC 14 Constitution saving throw or take 2d8 poison damage and become poisoned until the end of your next turn."
The feat doesn't let you create any arbitrary poison, it specifically states that you create a poison that has a DC14 con save to inflict 2d8 poison damage and the poisoned condition. It also ignores resistance to poison damage but not immunity to either poison or the poisoned condition.
How the feat functions has nothing to do with AL - it is just how D&D 5e works.
Similarly, all a poisoner's kit does is:
"A poisoner's kit includes the vials, chemicals, and other equipment necessary for the creation of poisons. Proficiency with this kit lets you add your proficiency bonus to any ability checks you make to craft or use poisons."
The kit does not include any rules on making poison's themselves. These rules are either homebrew or are included in the DMG. Creating poisons is something that is campaign specific and in a home game would be up to the DM to implement if they wanted to allow it. However, AL is a shared campaign environment and the DMG is not a valid source for character creation or item purchase. In addition, the only optional rules used from the DMG are playing on a grid and skills with different abilities. The poison rules in the DMG are not a part of AL play. Basically, the folks who run AL decided that there was no need for anything but the basic poison in the PHB and that described in the Poisoner feat.
In terms of whether it is worth using for your character, that would be up to you to decide, but neither the kit nor the feat is going to provide any overwhelming mechanical advantage by acquiring some rare and deadly poison.
100%. AL operates on rules as written based on sources allowed in the documents provided. Basically, the documents are what determines what's allowed and what's not, not whether WotC published the book themselves. It's why ToF and VGM can't be used anymore, because the most recent rules documents no longer list them (and in AL, the most recent rules and rulings always replace the older ones), even though they were allowed in the past.
Side note: I'm not actually sure why they called out variant skill checks and playing on a grid from the DMG. Both of those are actually in the PHB, so even then the DMG isn't required for those, unless the point is to say that the DMG provides a better explanation that can be used.
Both of you forgot to quote this part of the text:
A character can instead attempt to harvest poison from a poisonous creature, such as a snake, wyvern, or carrion crawler. The creature must be incapacitated or dead, and the harvesting requires 1d6 minutes followed by a DC 20 Intelligence (Nature) check. (Proficiency with the poisoner's kit applies to this check if the character doesn't have proficiency in Nature.) On a successful check, the character harvests enough poison for a single dose. On a failed check, the character is unable to extract any poison. If the character fails the check by 5 or more, the character is subjected to the creature's poison.
This is in the DMG so I guess that is why it is not applicable to AL?
We didn't forget. Each of us explicitly stated in the past a number of times that it doesn't matter if WotC printed it, the DMG isn't an AL legal source. Therefore, it doesn't matter what the DMG says. The various AL documents identify what sources, or sections of books or documents, are AL legal.
The DMG isn't listed in any of the documents as AL legal, except for the list of magic items, variant skills, and grids. That applies to everything. The Death Cleric, Oathbreaker Paladin, Eladrin, and Aasimar from the DMG are also not AL legal (without documentation or certs), nor are pistols or rifles. Poisons listed in the DMG can't be used in AL because the DMG isn't an AL legal source, nor are they listed in any of the AL documents as being AL legal.
Sources listed in the ALPG, ALDMG, and AL FAQ are the only ones that are AL legal for each campaign setting. Rules from sources not listed in one of those documents can't be used (without documentation or a cert). Not for players. Not for DMs.
You also can't cross streams. Even though Warforged are AL legal for Eberron characters, they aren't AL legal for Forgotten Realms, Ravenloft, or Dragonlance characters. The same goes for the SCAG, which is exclusive to the Forgotten Realms campaign.
Hello all.
Just wanted to make sure I understood the AL rules correctly on this.
My understanding is the only poison that can be bought is the basic one in the PHB.
Also my understand is that if you do use a kit to extract poison during a session you can only use that poison during that session. You cannot take it with you after the session is over and you cannot sell it?
So for example, you kill a Purple Wyrm. You extract 5 vials of poison. You can use those during that session/module only. It disappears after that module is done.
Thanks!
Hmmm...no one knows on this?
You know I can't find this on version 13 of the player's guide. Can you give me a page number?
No Gaming is Better than Bad Gaming.
I can't find it anywhere either...so if you find something please let me know. One of the reasons I am asking.
The AL channels on the D&D Discord server is the best place to get the most up to date info, but the ALPG is found here: https://dnd.wizards.com/adventurers-league
I'm familiar with those and have checked there...but still see nothing in regards to the original questions.
You asked where the ALPG v13 was. That's the question I was answering. The answer to your original question is that the DMG is not an AL legal source (being that it's not listed in the ALPG), thus you can't use anything from it unless you have a cert or specific documentation (such as a DM Quest). You can't harvest from monsters in AL at all as it's not a feature listed in an AL legal source.
Okay...so even within the same module you are playing you cannot harvest and use the poisons?
Correct
So then why bother with the poisoner kit or the feat? Seems silly you cannot at least use it in the session you are playing.
That would be up to you to decide but neither the Poisoner Feat nor the Poisoner's Kit grant any special ability to make poisons.
The poisoner feat explicitly states the poison you create and can use.
"You can prepare and deliver deadly poisons, granting you the following benefits:
The feat doesn't let you create any arbitrary poison, it specifically states that you create a poison that has a DC14 con save to inflict 2d8 poison damage and the poisoned condition. It also ignores resistance to poison damage but not immunity to either poison or the poisoned condition.
How the feat functions has nothing to do with AL - it is just how D&D 5e works.
Similarly, all a poisoner's kit does is:
"A poisoner's kit includes the vials, chemicals, and other equipment necessary for the creation of poisons. Proficiency with this kit lets you add your proficiency bonus to any ability checks you make to craft or use poisons."
The kit does not include any rules on making poison's themselves. These rules are either homebrew or are included in the DMG. Creating poisons is something that is campaign specific and in a home game would be up to the DM to implement if they wanted to allow it. However, AL is a shared campaign environment and the DMG is not a valid source for character creation or item purchase. In addition, the only optional rules used from the DMG are playing on a grid and skills with different abilities. The poison rules in the DMG are not a part of AL play. Basically, the folks who run AL decided that there was no need for anything but the basic poison in the PHB and that described in the Poisoner feat.
In terms of whether it is worth using for your character, that would be up to you to decide, but neither the kit nor the feat is going to provide any overwhelming mechanical advantage by acquiring some rare and deadly poison.
100%. AL operates on rules as written based on sources allowed in the documents provided. Basically, the documents are what determines what's allowed and what's not, not whether WotC published the book themselves. It's why ToF and VGM can't be used anymore, because the most recent rules documents no longer list them (and in AL, the most recent rules and rulings always replace the older ones), even though they were allowed in the past.
Side note: I'm not actually sure why they called out variant skill checks and playing on a grid from the DMG. Both of those are actually in the PHB, so even then the DMG isn't required for those, unless the point is to say that the DMG provides a better explanation that can be used.
Both of you forgot to quote this part of the text:
A character can instead attempt to harvest poison from a poisonous creature, such as a snake, wyvern, or carrion crawler. The creature must be incapacitated or dead, and the harvesting requires 1d6 minutes followed by a DC 20 Intelligence (Nature) check. (Proficiency with the poisoner's kit applies to this check if the character doesn't have proficiency in Nature.) On a successful check, the character harvests enough poison for a single dose. On a failed check, the character is unable to extract any poison. If the character fails the check by 5 or more, the character is subjected to the creature's poison.
This is in the DMG so I guess that is why it is not applicable to AL?
We didn't forget. Each of us explicitly stated in the past a number of times that it doesn't matter if WotC printed it, the DMG isn't an AL legal source. Therefore, it doesn't matter what the DMG says. The various AL documents identify what sources, or sections of books or documents, are AL legal.
The DMG isn't listed in any of the documents as AL legal, except for the list of magic items, variant skills, and grids. That applies to everything. The Death Cleric, Oathbreaker Paladin, Eladrin, and Aasimar from the DMG are also not AL legal (without documentation or certs), nor are pistols or rifles. Poisons listed in the DMG can't be used in AL because the DMG isn't an AL legal source, nor are they listed in any of the AL documents as being AL legal.
Sources listed in the ALPG, ALDMG, and AL FAQ are the only ones that are AL legal for each campaign setting. Rules from sources not listed in one of those documents can't be used (without documentation or a cert). Not for players. Not for DMs.
You also can't cross streams. Even though Warforged are AL legal for Eberron characters, they aren't AL legal for Forgotten Realms, Ravenloft, or Dragonlance characters. The same goes for the SCAG, which is exclusive to the Forgotten Realms campaign.
Okay I figured as much.
It's important to examine the most recent sources and official documents for any updates or modifications to the Adventurers League regulations because they may change over time.https://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/dungeons-dragons-discussion/d-d-adventurers-league/[url=https:/ktblogger.com].[/url]">[url=https://ktblogger.com].[/url]