I cant seem to get my players engaged, no matter the amount of time i put into preparing a session, or what i give them in game, they always seem to feel like they may have wasted their time. I try to be engaging, ill admit im trying to make combat more exciting, but when it comes to things like puzzles/ problem solving my players really dont care for it. If i dont put something directly in front of them and say "go here" they wont do anything. Any tips? Thank you for reading!
Get new players? Or perhaps try a different game. DnD isn't for everybody, as I'm sure many people can attest to. However, if you're convinced to play, then ask the players about the parts that they like the most in the game, and do that more. Some like hack and slash fighting, some like intrigue and roleplaying. It seems like your group is the former, which is okay!
Ask your players what they want. Tell them your frustrations and ask for their input. When they tell you, listen and take it as feedback.
All the preparation in the world doesn't help if it's not what they're interested in.
I agree with what he said. :D
5e D&D is built on the Three Pillars of Adventure. Not every Pillar has to be used equally, or at all for each group. As a Player, i would find the Tomb of the Nine Gods in Tomb of Annihilation not only amazingly tedious because of all the puzzles, riddles and "cleverness", I would HATE it because I, as a PLAYER, do not go in for that stuff. If Crossword puzzles fail to interest me, I am not going to enjoy that module. On the other hand the Hexcrawler portion or the lost city of Omu encounters would be right up my alley. You just have to figure out what your Players and YOU have in common and run with that.
In the one-on-one game I run, the Player LOATHES dungeon crawls. Her preferred Pillar is the Social one. But, for the advancement of the story she and her loyal band of followers had to journey to the tomb of a fabled Wizard-King and bargain with him for aid in defeating his newly arrisen Granddaughter (who was wrecking magical havoc on the Western Heartlands). By dint of roleplaying she convinced him to part with 4 potent magical items to aid them in there quest. I could have made it a classic level by level dungeon crawl, but I had to truncate a great deal of it by simple expository as I described how she descended through corridors and rooms. She had to make like 2 checks to bypass a trap but then it was go time in the Wizard-King's burial chamber.
Failing that, you might want to look at other games your Players might want to play. Shadowrun is cool, as is Mutants and Masterminds.
TL:DR Find out what everyone wants to play and play that. EVEN if it is not D&D.
Some players just don't know how to respond. How seasoned is your group. DnD can take years to master for some. Even longer for others. Cater to your party and if you don't know what that is ask. Use voices for your NPC's. Don't be shy just try. Improve some interesting NPC traits. Like forgetfullnes, laughs at his own jokes, etc. And if all else fails restart campaign as players are stuck in a dungeon and have lost their memories on how the got there and keep through weird crap at them until they go ohhhhh kkkkkk. At least they will remember something and come back wanting more. Some players just treat dnd as a hang out from other things and really don't focus. So pick their pockets, put something in their way. Move them. and they will move or quit playing. Time is valuable and im an old man. I don't have time to waste on new people who just wana hang out to occupy their time. You come to my table be prepared to have a ride of your life experience filled with laughs and good times. !
All really good advice. I'd add that I ask my players to come up with a trait about themselves that makes them who they are. For instance once a player chose that she was deaf in her left ear. I have no idea why she would choose that but it made for some funny, and often challenging moments for her character. Then I reward players for using the trait in rp. Like giving advantage in a check.
I try to leverage the motivation of both the players and the characters.
Player motivation will give you the style and theme. Style is the stuff like dungeon crawl, role-play, puzzles, tactical mini combat, theatre of the mind, strategic combat. Theme gives you setting and context. Do your players want high tension medieval zombipocalypse, Tolkienesque high fantasy heroes journey/quest, steampunk, horror, political intrigue, acid-trip-Alice-in-Wonderland, goofy or serious. All of this in any combination and rolled together with other ideas you have. Make sure you are all on the same page.
Character motivation will shape the story you tell together. It will provide the hooks to get the characters, and thus the players, interested in what you are doing. Character motivation only begins with their backstory. Enabling the players to shape the story through their characters is the only way to engage them. You must give a sense of consequence to their actions and always be on the lookout to let this drive the story.
I often see DM’s running the game they want, not the game the players want. While some players will let you take them on such a journey, if they aren’t on board it simply won’t work.
A bit philosophical and rambling, but please do give it some thought.
I often see DM’s running the game they want, not the game the players want. While some players will let you take them on such a journey, if they aren’t on board it simply won’t work.
Pardon the SNIP, but this is only partially true. Given the vast disparity in the duties, responsibilities and efforts put forth by Players compared to DMs, it is natural that the DMs game proclivities should have more weight. Even in this enlightened era of TTRPs there are still far far far FEWER people willing to be a reliable DM compared to the steady and growing stream of players.
I posit that when a DM running a game it MUST be the one the DM wants to run, and not one compromised on. I have done this, and been in games were such compromise occurred: in the end no one had fun. Now, since you are a good GM and want to provide entertainment to your Players, you should be aware of what they like and try to give them that enjoyment. If a player really wants a Superpowered Character and you really want to play D&D, then the DM crafts a BIG DAMN HEROES campaign where the PC likely has no starting stats below 12, has at least one stat at 18 (20 if racial bonus applies) and a smattering of scores in the 14-16 range. He then turns off the Attunement rules for Magical Items and lets the party go to town. Everyone wins without compromise.
There is also another dimension to this that bears mentioning: the Railroad vs. Sandbox dilemma. If you as a DM state to your Players you will be running Dungeon Heist, the Players CANNOT run off to Luskan. They cannot abandon the city in search of the Sun Elf's missing granddaughter. They HAVE to play through your adventure IN Waterdeep. If the Players had hesitation about or simply did not want to participate in the module adventure, then they should have spoken up at Session Zero when the DM said: "Hey Guys! I am a running this module."
I often see DM’s running the game they want, not the game the players want. While some players will let you take them on such a journey, if they aren’t on board it simply won’t work.
I posit that when a DM running a game it MUST be the one the DM wants to run, and not one compromised on.
Well this works in some parts it doesn't work. For instance, lets say you are running a game for 9 year olds. Do you do what ever you want or do you adjust to the party you have before you. Though i agree it must be to the DM's liking, that goes without saying, but if you are making your game to your own end, and not to the end of the players you beginning wrong. Everything else is arguing over semantics.
I often see DM’s running the game they want, not the game the players want. While some players will let you take them on such a journey, if they aren’t on board it simply won’t work.
I posit that when a DM running a game it MUST be the one the DM wants to run, and not one compromised on.
Well this works in some parts it doesn't work. For instance, lets say you are running a game for 9 year olds. Do you do what ever you want or do you adjust to the party you have before you. Though i agree it must be to the DM's liking, that goes without saying, but if you are making your game to your own end, and not to the end of the players you beginning wrong. Everything else is arguing over semantics.
Knowing the audience is a given. DMs are performers. Not everyone is into crafting impressions for NPCs or as comfortable with improvisation, but the question of a DM's enjoyment of the game can only be answered correctly if it is instead framed as "I don't know. Did you have fun?" If the answer is yes then the DM did indeed have fun. It is a curious little phenomenon, but true to our hobby. Now given that DMs are performers and must know their audience, they have to pitch the game they want to run in a way that could appeal to the players. I say this only because some players, like myself will never really enjoy a riddles and puzzles sort of adventure, so if the campaign leans heavily on them and if the Dm is wanting me to be all excited and role playing and noodling my way out of the DM's horrid riddle filled maze, then the DM is going to be disappointed in my performance as a player. Thus I did not have fun and neither did the DM. So in this we can agree...if the DM is crafting a game it should be tailored for the interests of the Players if the DM ever expects to have fun on his part.
Part of my more controversial stances lie in the few DMs vs. Many Many Many Many Players dynamic. As a very long time DM/GM/ST/G.O.D. I really do not see a problem with telling a group of players that this or that game is the one I will be running, that the following elements will be emphasized, and this how PCs will be developed. Show up at the appointed time and place with your kit together so we can have a Session Zero. If a Player had a problem with any off the things I mentioned then they can do one of two things: Find a different game run by a DM/GM/ST/GOD that is even remotely as good as I am or show up ready to play the game as I outlined. Now, I am a good DM, so when the Players talk about what they want to do *within* the game I have proposed I listen and ensure that I hit those elements at some point during the game sessions. After all I want to have fun too. Thinking way back to my prior post, if a Player really wants to play a Superhero RPG, I can accommodate him in my game. Just off the top my head an Assaimar (Scourge or Protector) Paladin with hefty stats so that any ASIs can be pumped into FEATs along with my understanding that the player *wants* to be a BIG DAMN HERO is all we need to come to an accord. What will not work is Players that decide to show up to my game with the intention of twisting it off the rails as a passive aggressive exercise because they wanted to play Feng Shui instead of 5e D&D.
BTW G.O.D. stands for my preferred method of address at the table: Game Operations Director. Hehe! Not really though, but I would be nice to put it on a T-Shirt.
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I cant seem to get my players engaged, no matter the amount of time i put into preparing a session, or what i give them in game, they always seem to feel like they may have wasted their time. I try to be engaging, ill admit im trying to make combat more exciting, but when it comes to things like puzzles/ problem solving my players really dont care for it. If i dont put something directly in front of them and say "go here" they wont do anything. Any tips? Thank you for reading!
Get new players? Or perhaps try a different game. DnD isn't for everybody, as I'm sure many people can attest to. However, if you're convinced to play, then ask the players about the parts that they like the most in the game, and do that more. Some like hack and slash fighting, some like intrigue and roleplaying. It seems like your group is the former, which is okay!
I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?
Ask your players what they want. Tell them your frustrations and ask for their input. When they tell you, listen and take it as feedback.
All the preparation in the world doesn't help if it's not what they're interested in.
I agree with what he said. :D
5e D&D is built on the Three Pillars of Adventure. Not every Pillar has to be used equally, or at all for each group. As a Player, i would find the Tomb of the Nine Gods in Tomb of Annihilation not only amazingly tedious because of all the puzzles, riddles and "cleverness", I would HATE it because I, as a PLAYER, do not go in for that stuff. If Crossword puzzles fail to interest me, I am not going to enjoy that module. On the other hand the Hexcrawler portion or the lost city of Omu encounters would be right up my alley. You just have to figure out what your Players and YOU have in common and run with that.
In the one-on-one game I run, the Player LOATHES dungeon crawls. Her preferred Pillar is the Social one. But, for the advancement of the story she and her loyal band of followers had to journey to the tomb of a fabled Wizard-King and bargain with him for aid in defeating his newly arrisen Granddaughter (who was wrecking magical havoc on the Western Heartlands). By dint of roleplaying she convinced him to part with 4 potent magical items to aid them in there quest. I could have made it a classic level by level dungeon crawl, but I had to truncate a great deal of it by simple expository as I described how she descended through corridors and rooms. She had to make like 2 checks to bypass a trap but then it was go time in the Wizard-King's burial chamber.
Failing that, you might want to look at other games your Players might want to play. Shadowrun is cool, as is Mutants and Masterminds.
TL:DR Find out what everyone wants to play and play that. EVEN if it is not D&D.
Some players just don't know how to respond. How seasoned is your group. DnD can take years to master for some. Even longer for others. Cater to your party and if you don't know what that is ask. Use voices for your NPC's. Don't be shy just try. Improve some interesting NPC traits. Like forgetfullnes, laughs at his own jokes, etc. And if all else fails restart campaign as players are stuck in a dungeon and have lost their memories on how the got there and keep through weird crap at them until they go ohhhhh kkkkkk. At least they will remember something and come back wanting more. Some players just treat dnd as a hang out from other things and really don't focus. So pick their pockets, put something in their way. Move them. and they will move or quit playing. Time is valuable and im an old man. I don't have time to waste on new people who just wana hang out to occupy their time. You come to my table be prepared to have a ride of your life experience filled with laughs and good times. !
All really good advice. I'd add that I ask my players to come up with a trait about themselves that makes them who they are. For instance once a player chose that she was deaf in her left ear. I have no idea why she would choose that but it made for some funny, and often challenging moments for her character. Then I reward players for using the trait in rp. Like giving advantage in a check.
That's what happens when you wear a helmet your whole life!
My house rules
I try to leverage the motivation of both the players and the characters.
Player motivation will give you the style and theme. Style is the stuff like dungeon crawl, role-play, puzzles, tactical mini combat, theatre of the mind, strategic combat. Theme gives you setting and context. Do your players want high tension medieval zombipocalypse, Tolkienesque high fantasy heroes journey/quest, steampunk, horror, political intrigue, acid-trip-Alice-in-Wonderland, goofy or serious. All of this in any combination and rolled together with other ideas you have. Make sure you are all on the same page.
Character motivation will shape the story you tell together. It will provide the hooks to get the characters, and thus the players, interested in what you are doing. Character motivation only begins with their backstory. Enabling the players to shape the story through their characters is the only way to engage them. You must give a sense of consequence to their actions and always be on the lookout to let this drive the story.
I often see DM’s running the game they want, not the game the players want. While some players will let you take them on such a journey, if they aren’t on board it simply won’t work.
A bit philosophical and rambling, but please do give it some thought.
Pardon the SNIP, but this is only partially true. Given the vast disparity in the duties, responsibilities and efforts put forth by Players compared to DMs, it is natural that the DMs game proclivities should have more weight. Even in this enlightened era of TTRPs there are still far far far FEWER people willing to be a reliable DM compared to the steady and growing stream of players.
I posit that when a DM running a game it MUST be the one the DM wants to run, and not one compromised on. I have done this, and been in games were such compromise occurred: in the end no one had fun. Now, since you are a good GM and want to provide entertainment to your Players, you should be aware of what they like and try to give them that enjoyment. If a player really wants a Superpowered Character and you really want to play D&D, then the DM crafts a BIG DAMN HEROES campaign where the PC likely has no starting stats below 12, has at least one stat at 18 (20 if racial bonus applies) and a smattering of scores in the 14-16 range. He then turns off the Attunement rules for Magical Items and lets the party go to town. Everyone wins without compromise.
There is also another dimension to this that bears mentioning: the Railroad vs. Sandbox dilemma. If you as a DM state to your Players you will be running Dungeon Heist, the Players CANNOT run off to Luskan. They cannot abandon the city in search of the Sun Elf's missing granddaughter. They HAVE to play through your adventure IN Waterdeep. If the Players had hesitation about or simply did not want to participate in the module adventure, then they should have spoken up at Session Zero when the DM said: "Hey Guys! I am a running this module."
Well this works in some parts it doesn't work. For instance, lets say you are running a game for 9 year olds. Do you do what ever you want or do you adjust to the party you have before you. Though i agree it must be to the DM's liking, that goes without saying, but if you are making your game to your own end, and not to the end of the players you beginning wrong. Everything else is arguing over semantics.
Knowing the audience is a given. DMs are performers. Not everyone is into crafting impressions for NPCs or as comfortable with improvisation, but the question of a DM's enjoyment of the game can only be answered correctly if it is instead framed as "I don't know. Did you have fun?" If the answer is yes then the DM did indeed have fun. It is a curious little phenomenon, but true to our hobby. Now given that DMs are performers and must know their audience, they have to pitch the game they want to run in a way that could appeal to the players. I say this only because some players, like myself will never really enjoy a riddles and puzzles sort of adventure, so if the campaign leans heavily on them and if the Dm is wanting me to be all excited and role playing and noodling my way out of the DM's horrid riddle filled maze, then the DM is going to be disappointed in my performance as a player. Thus I did not have fun and neither did the DM. So in this we can agree...if the DM is crafting a game it should be tailored for the interests of the Players if the DM ever expects to have fun on his part.
Part of my more controversial stances lie in the few DMs vs. Many Many Many Many Players dynamic. As a very long time DM/GM/ST/G.O.D. I really do not see a problem with telling a group of players that this or that game is the one I will be running, that the following elements will be emphasized, and this how PCs will be developed. Show up at the appointed time and place with your kit together so we can have a Session Zero. If a Player had a problem with any off the things I mentioned then they can do one of two things: Find a different game run by a DM/GM/ST/GOD that is even remotely as good as I am or show up ready to play the game as I outlined. Now, I am a good DM, so when the Players talk about what they want to do *within* the game I have proposed I listen and ensure that I hit those elements at some point during the game sessions. After all I want to have fun too. Thinking way back to my prior post, if a Player really wants to play a Superhero RPG, I can accommodate him in my game. Just off the top my head an Assaimar (Scourge or Protector) Paladin with hefty stats so that any ASIs can be pumped into FEATs along with my understanding that the player *wants* to be a BIG DAMN HERO is all we need to come to an accord. What will not work is Players that decide to show up to my game with the intention of twisting it off the rails as a passive aggressive exercise because they wanted to play Feng Shui instead of 5e D&D.
BTW G.O.D. stands for my preferred method of address at the table: Game Operations Director. Hehe! Not really though, but I would be nice to put it on a T-Shirt.