When reading through the PHB i found this fun loophole in simulacrum.
Requirements: The ability to cast wish through spell slots or Mystic Arcanum
Process: Cast wish to duplicate the effect of simulacrum. On your next turn, your simulacrum will cast wish to duplicate the effect of simulacrum and then runs off to join battle. Next round, your simulacrum's simulacrum casts wish to duplicate the effect of simulacrum and then runs off to join battle.
When the simulacrum appears it mirrors you exactly, including in that it does not still have a 9th level slot available to cast Wish, since you just used yours up.
If you cast Wish to make a Simulacrum it will start having expended a 9th level spell slot because "the illusion uses all the statistics of the creature it duplicates". If you've expended a 9th to make it - then it has an expended 9th too.
What if, you cast Simulacrum on yourself to create one with a 9th lvl spell slot (SimA). Then then you cast Wish to cast Simulacrum on SimA (so not using yourself as the template). Then the newest Simulacrum (SimB) casts wish using SimA as the template to create SimC. SimC does the same as SimB to continue this process to use SimA as the template while SimA does not use any spell slots.
This process continues and as Wish doesn't use any time or components... you could do this relatively instantly?
What if, you cast Simulacrum on yourself to create one with a 9th lvl spell slot (SimA). Then then you cast Wish to cast Simulacrum on SimA (so not using yourself as the template). Then the newest Simulacrum (SimB) casts wish using SimA as the template to create SimC. SimC does the same as SimB to continue this process to use SimA as the template while SimA does not use any spell slots.
This process continues and as Wish doesn't use any time or components... you could do this relatively instantly?
”You shape an illusory duplicate of one *beast or humanoid* that is within range for the entire casting time of the spell. The duplicate is a creature, partially real and formed from ice or snow, and it can take actions and otherwise be affected as a normal creature. It appears to be the same as the original, but it has half the creature's hit point maximum and is formed without any equipment. Otherwise, the illusion uses all the statistics of the creature it duplicates, except that it is a *construct*.“
What if, you cast Simulacrum on yourself to create one with a 9th lvl spell slot (SimA). Then then you cast Wish to cast Simulacrum on SimA (so not using yourself as the template). Then the newest Simulacrum (SimB) casts wish using SimA as the template to create SimC. SimC does the same as SimB to continue this process to use SimA as the template while SimA does not use any spell slots.
This process continues and as Wish doesn't use any time or components... you could do this relatively instantly?
”You shape an illusory duplicate of one *beast or humanoid* that is within range for the entire casting time of the spell. The duplicate is a creature, partially real and formed from ice or snow, and it can take actions and otherwise be affected as a normal creature. It appears to be the same as the original, but it has half the creature's hit point maximum and is formed without any equipment. Otherwise, the illusion uses all the statistics of the creature it duplicates, except that it is a *construct*.“
Oooo i think you are right. Well then how about this.
You cast Simulacrum on yourself creating SimA. Then SimA casts Wish to cast Simulacrum on you to create SimB which should still have a 9th level spell since you didn't cast Wish. Rinse and repeat.
That could work. But then any sensible DM wouldn't allow it because it's just taking the piss. Reading the very last sentence of the Simulacrum spell makes it very clear that the intent is that you should only have 1 at a time.
That could work. But then any sensible DM wouldn't allow it because it's just taking the piss. Reading the very last sentence of the Simulacrum spell makes it very clear that the intent is that you should only have 1 at a time.
Oh yea i agree. Heck if it were me I'd say Simulacrums Casting Wish shares the original casters "uses" of wish therefore could potentially fail and never be able to cast Wish again (for the original caster of simulacrum).
Yeah the OP way doesn't work...what would work (I think) is that the PC, having both 7th and 9th level slots, casts the spell using the normal method, and then instructs the sim to cast the spell using wish and targeting the PC. Each Sim would have the 9th level slot to wish the next sim into existence, and each sim would only be casting the spell once. However, the process could only exist as long as you were present to be the target, and each sim would be lacking both a 9th level slot (spending it to create the next sim, so only the last would retain it) and a 7th level slot (no sim would have it as you spent it to create the first sim).
The challenge is that only the original duplicate would be subject to your direct control via commands, and each subsequent sim would only be subject to the preceding sim, so organizing them would be a challenge as it is basically a game of telephone to get them to act in any semblance of order. eventually the time it would take for orders to transmit down would make the creation process slower and slower until you were waiting minutes, then hours, then days, then weeks, then months, then years for a new duplicate to be created.
The command would have to be something like "cast wish to duplicate simulacrum targeting [PC], or if you can't tell your simulacrum to do this exact command as i have just said it" that is the only way to communicate down the line that would result in the last one actually casting the spell on you.
That could work. But then any sensible DM wouldn't allow it because it's just taking the piss. Reading the very last sentence of the Simulacrum spell makes it very clear that the intent is that you should only have 1 at a time.
Oh yea i agree. Heck if it were me I'd say Simulacrums Casting Wish shares the original casters "uses" of wish therefore could potentially fail and never be able to cast Wish again (on the original caster of simulacrum).
That's too harsh. What I would do is when SimA casts Simulacrum on you - SimB appears - but SimA gets destroyed. Only 1 at a time.
That could work. But then any sensible DM wouldn't allow it because it's just taking the piss. Reading the very last sentence of the Simulacrum spell makes it very clear that the intent is that you should only have 1 at a time.
Oh yea i agree. Heck if it were me I'd say Simulacrums Casting Wish shares the original casters "uses" of wish therefore could potentially fail and never be able to cast Wish again (on the original caster of simulacrum).
That's too harsh. What I would do is when SimA casts Simulacrum on you - SimB appears - but SimA gets destroyed. Only 1 at a time.
That's fair and straight to the point. I always make things complicated (as you saw my thought process lol xP)
That could work. But then any sensible DM wouldn't allow it because it's just taking the piss. Reading the very last sentence of the Simulacrum spell makes it very clear that the intent is that you should only have 1 at a time.
Oh yea i agree. Heck if it were me I'd say Simulacrums Casting Wish shares the original casters "uses" of wish therefore could potentially fail and never be able to cast Wish again (for the original caster of simulacrum).
I would be fine with that since casting wish to produce any level 8 or lower spell has 0 risk of going wrong.
And fun fact: mystic arcanum are not spell slots. Genie warlock simulacrum can recover their wish castings by resting.
When reading through the PHB i found this fun loophole in simulacrum.
Requirements: The ability to cast wish through spell slots or Mystic Arcanum
Process: Cast wish to duplicate the effect of simulacrum. On your next turn, your simulacrum will cast wish to duplicate the effect of simulacrum and then runs off to join battle. Next round, your simulacrum's simulacrum casts wish to duplicate the effect of simulacrum and then runs off to join battle.
You can probably see where this is going.
This isn't news. The only part that's remotely news is that Genielocks are relatively new, so doing the trick with nothing but Wish is new. As I'm sure this thread discussed, the old way required casting simulacrum on yourself and then having the simulacrum cast wish on you, so you needed rubies provided by true polymorph. Genielocks can do it with nothing but Wish, since simulacra don't recover slots but do recover mystic arcana.
The other "infinite spells" trick you're bound to discover if you haven't already is glyph of warding + a portable extradimensional space, like demiplane.
That could work. But then any sensible DM wouldn't allow it because it's just taking the piss. Reading the very last sentence of the Simulacrum spell makes it very clear that the intent is that you should only have 1 at a time.
Oh yea i agree. Heck if it were me I'd say Simulacrums Casting Wish shares the original casters "uses" of wish therefore could potentially fail and never be able to cast Wish again (on the original caster of simulacrum).
That's too harsh. What I would do is when SimA casts Simulacrum on you - SimB appears - but SimA gets destroyed. Only 1 at a time.
I'd go even harsher, personally. The implications with splitting your essence too many times isn't something to casually play around with. I'd suggest the built in-auto destruction of an already created simulacrum was a safety feature baked into the spell and then ask the player if they're certain they want to bypass it.
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I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
I'd go even harsher, personally. The implications with splitting your essence too many times isn't something to casually play around with. I'd suggest the built in-auto destruction of an already created simulacrum was a safety feature baked into the spell and then ask the player if they're certain they want to bypass it.
Absolutely agree with this. Creating an infinite personal army of clone snowman wizards is the exclusive domain of a supervillain. It's right up there with the obsessive pursuit of immortality on the list of things that are so magically irresponsible that they are inevitably going to end in universe-bending disaster. If the DM lets you get away with something like this for any more than a single simulacrum of a simulacrum, then it is only because they have a bigger and more deadly comeuppance planned for you in the very near future.
Question on the Moon card fr9m deck of many things. If you pull it with a sorcerer and then cast wish to make a simulacrum would the simulacrum now have the 2 wishes from the moon card?
Question on the Moon card fr9m deck of many things. If you pull it with a sorcerer and then cast wish to make a simulacrum would the simulacrum now have the 2 wishes from the moon card?
Doesn't matter what we say, either your DM thinks this is fun an Rule of Cools it, or your DM thinks this is game breaking and says no.
Arriving late to the party, but I would either say you cloud only have 1 copy (like above). Or start a new adventure, in which SimA gets destroyed, and all the other Simulacrums go rogue, because the PC cant command them anymore.
(Also back to the Wish method, I think if you cast wish this many times, at least 1 God will interfear)
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When reading through the PHB i found this fun loophole in simulacrum.
Requirements: The ability to cast wish through spell slots or Mystic Arcanum
Process: Cast wish to duplicate the effect of simulacrum. On your next turn, your simulacrum will cast wish to duplicate the effect of simulacrum and then runs off to join battle. Next round, your simulacrum's simulacrum casts wish to duplicate the effect of simulacrum and then runs off to join battle.
You can probably see where this is going.
i can roll nat 1s on command
my homebrew thingies
Magic Items - Monsters - Subclasses
When the simulacrum appears it mirrors you exactly, including in that it does not still have a 9th level slot available to cast Wish, since you just used yours up.
If you cast Wish to make a Simulacrum it will start having expended a 9th level spell slot because "the illusion uses all the statistics of the creature it duplicates". If you've expended a 9th to make it - then it has an expended 9th too.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
What if, you cast Simulacrum on yourself to create one with a 9th lvl spell slot (SimA). Then then you cast Wish to cast Simulacrum on SimA (so not using yourself as the template). Then the newest Simulacrum (SimB) casts wish using SimA as the template to create SimC. SimC does the same as SimB to continue this process to use SimA as the template while SimA does not use any spell slots.
This process continues and as Wish doesn't use any time or components... you could do this relatively instantly?
”You shape an illusory duplicate of one *beast or humanoid* that is within range for the entire casting time of the spell. The duplicate is a creature, partially real and formed from ice or snow, and it can take actions and otherwise be affected as a normal creature. It appears to be the same as the original, but it has half the creature's hit point maximum and is formed without any equipment. Otherwise, the illusion uses all the statistics of the creature it duplicates, except that it is a *construct*.“
Oooo i think you are right. Well then how about this.
You cast Simulacrum on yourself creating SimA. Then SimA casts Wish to cast Simulacrum on you to create SimB which should still have a 9th level spell since you didn't cast Wish. Rinse and repeat.
That could work. But then any sensible DM wouldn't allow it because it's just taking the piss. Reading the very last sentence of the Simulacrum spell makes it very clear that the intent is that you should only have 1 at a time.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
Oh yea i agree. Heck if it were me I'd say Simulacrums Casting Wish shares the original casters "uses" of wish therefore could potentially fail and never be able to cast Wish again (for the original caster of simulacrum).
Yeah the OP way doesn't work...what would work (I think) is that the PC, having both 7th and 9th level slots, casts the spell using the normal method, and then instructs the sim to cast the spell using wish and targeting the PC. Each Sim would have the 9th level slot to wish the next sim into existence, and each sim would only be casting the spell once. However, the process could only exist as long as you were present to be the target, and each sim would be lacking both a 9th level slot (spending it to create the next sim, so only the last would retain it) and a 7th level slot (no sim would have it as you spent it to create the first sim).
The challenge is that only the original duplicate would be subject to your direct control via commands, and each subsequent sim would only be subject to the preceding sim, so organizing them would be a challenge as it is basically a game of telephone to get them to act in any semblance of order. eventually the time it would take for orders to transmit down would make the creation process slower and slower until you were waiting minutes, then hours, then days, then weeks, then months, then years for a new duplicate to be created.
The command would have to be something like "cast wish to duplicate simulacrum targeting [PC], or if you can't tell your simulacrum to do this exact command as i have just said it" that is the only way to communicate down the line that would result in the last one actually casting the spell on you.
That's too harsh. What I would do is when SimA casts Simulacrum on you - SimB appears - but SimA gets destroyed. Only 1 at a time.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
That's fair and straight to the point. I always make things complicated (as you saw my thought process lol xP)
I would be fine with that since casting wish to produce any level 8 or lower spell has 0 risk of going wrong.
And fun fact: mystic arcanum are not spell slots. Genie warlock simulacrum can recover their wish castings by resting.
This isn't news. The only part that's remotely news is that Genielocks are relatively new, so doing the trick with nothing but Wish is new. As I'm sure this thread discussed, the old way required casting simulacrum on yourself and then having the simulacrum cast wish on you, so you needed rubies provided by true polymorph. Genielocks can do it with nothing but Wish, since simulacra don't recover slots but do recover mystic arcana.
The other "infinite spells" trick you're bound to discover if you haven't already is glyph of warding + a portable extradimensional space, like demiplane.
I'd go even harsher, personally. The implications with splitting your essence too many times isn't something to casually play around with. I'd suggest the built in-auto destruction of an already created simulacrum was a safety feature baked into the spell and then ask the player if they're certain they want to bypass it.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Absolutely agree with this. Creating an infinite personal army of clone snowman wizards is the exclusive domain of a supervillain. It's right up there with the obsessive pursuit of immortality on the list of things that are so magically irresponsible that they are inevitably going to end in universe-bending disaster. If the DM lets you get away with something like this for any more than a single simulacrum of a simulacrum, then it is only because they have a bigger and more deadly comeuppance planned for you in the very near future.
Question on the Moon card fr9m deck of many things. If you pull it with a sorcerer and then cast wish to make a simulacrum would the simulacrum now have the 2 wishes from the moon card?
Doesn't matter what we say, either your DM thinks this is fun an Rule of Cools it, or your DM thinks this is game breaking and says no.
Arriving late to the party, but I would either say you cloud only have 1 copy (like above). Or start a new adventure, in which SimA gets destroyed, and all the other Simulacrums go rogue, because the PC cant command them anymore.
(Also back to the Wish method, I think if you cast wish this many times, at least 1 God will interfear)