Hi guys. Just a thought. Just tried out a Wild Magic Sorc and it is a loadful of fun. Of course there are a few things that will scare the hell out of me when rolling that percentile die (Fireball anyone?). So I was wondering, are there any ways to counter the "All hell breaks loose" moments of the Wild Magic Surge and are they within the boundaries of ruling? One example is that can you cast Counterspell on yourself when you're casting spells (like Fireball) that is a result of Wild Magic.
I'd say this is mostly a matter of what your DM would allow, but the example you give of using Counterspell to nullify the unwanted Fireball sounds very valid to me. As long as you still have your reaction and spell slots to cast Counterspell, I don't see why this shouldn't be possible :)
As for other very bad results... I go back to the beginning of my reply and say it's mostly a matter of your DM accepting your countermeasures.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
As a player, I think the surges make the feature entertaining and feel like circumventing it defeats the purpose of a wild magic sorc. As a DM, I respect a player's attempt to try anything and if they come up with a valid argument, it will work. With that said:
..."Immediately after you cast a sorcerer spell of 1st level or higher, the DM can have you roll a d20."...
That part is where I find the idea of counterspell to be a tough pill to swallow. It is being done during your turn, on your action, as a result of your action. The possibility of using a reaction or bonus action to stop the resulting surge doesn't seem to fit in the scenario.
I'm currently of a mind that the only way to make the OP's idea possible would be through the use of a homebrew item, or using a loose/modified definition of how/when the surges happen.
As a player, I think the surges make the feature entertaining and feel like circumventing it defeats the purpose of a wild magic sorc. As a DM, I respect a player's attempt to try anything and if they come up with a valid argument, it will work. With that said:
..."Immediately after you cast a sorcerer spell of 1st level or higher, the DM can have you roll a d20."...
That part is where I find the idea of counterspell to be a tough pill to swallow. It is being done during your turn, on your action, as a result of your action. The possibility of using a reaction or bonus action to stop the resulting surge doesn't seem to fit in the scenario.
I'm currently of a mind that the only way to make the OP's idea possible would be through the use of a homebrew item, or using a loose/modified definition of how/when the surges happen.
As I just now noticed this -> "* - which you take when you see a creature within 60 feet of you casting a spell" in relation to the "1 Reaction" casting time for Counterspell, I think you might be right. The creature casting the spells from the Surges is the sorcerer themselves, and therefore I agree it could be argued you cannot see yourself casting the spell as to allow for this to trigger the counterspell reaction.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
As a player, I think the surges make the feature entertaining and feel like circumventing it defeats the purpose of a wild magic sorc. As a DM, I respect a player's attempt to try anything and if they come up with a valid argument, it will work. With that said:
..."Immediately after you cast a sorcerer spell of 1st level or higher, the DM can have you roll a d20."...
That part is where I find the idea of counterspell to be a tough pill to swallow. It is being done during your turn, on your action, as a result of your action. The possibility of using a reaction or bonus action to stop the resulting surge doesn't seem to fit in the scenario.
I'm currently of a mind that the only way to make the OP's idea possible would be through the use of a homebrew item, or using a loose/modified definition of how/when the surges happen.
Counterspell is not a valid solution do to spellcasting restrictions. By the rules, you can only cast one real spell per turn. If some interaction or ability were to allow you to cast a second spell, that second spell must be a cantrip. So, if you cast a spell on your turn and had a Wild Magic Surge end up Fireballing you, you could not then cast Counterspell to save yourself as it is still your turn and Counterspell is not a cantrip.
Also, as a Wild Magic sorcerer, I’d argue that the table is supposed to represent magical power accidentally “slipping out”. Counterspell relies on somebody *casting* a spell which you can then counter, while the Wild Magic surges just happen. That’s my interpretations anyway
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?
If I cast a Fireball, and the enemy Wizard uses her Reaction to Counterspell. If I have my Reaction available, I can cast Counterspell to counter their Counterspell, to ensure that my Fireball goes off.
I think it should be valid to Counterspell a Wildsurge. Because it's blowing a lvl 3+ slot to try to "regain control" ontop of the initial spell lost in the casting. That is a huge cost the Sorcerer is paying for what would be a pretty epic looking moment.
You need to see the counter spell being enchanted. That’s why you can’t counter spell a sorcerer with subtle meta magic. Cause he doesn’t make any somatic or verbal hints so you don,t know when or what to counter. Wild magic is the same.
I would potentially allow the sorcerer to use the carefull meta magic when rolling the table but only before. At least the group gets auto half damage on that fireball. You might go through sorcerer points though.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Hi guys. Just a thought. Just tried out a Wild Magic Sorc and it is a loadful of fun. Of course there are a few things that will scare the hell out of me when rolling that percentile die (Fireball anyone?). So I was wondering, are there any ways to counter the "All hell breaks loose" moments of the Wild Magic Surge and are they within the boundaries of ruling? One example is that can you cast Counterspell on yourself when you're casting spells (like Fireball) that is a result of Wild Magic.
I'd say this is mostly a matter of what your DM would allow, but the example you give of using Counterspell to nullify the unwanted Fireball sounds very valid to me. As long as you still have your reaction and spell slots to cast Counterspell, I don't see why this shouldn't be possible :)
As for other very bad results... I go back to the beginning of my reply and say it's mostly a matter of your DM accepting your countermeasures.
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
As a player, I think the surges make the feature entertaining and feel like circumventing it defeats the purpose of a wild magic sorc. As a DM, I respect a player's attempt to try anything and if they come up with a valid argument, it will work. With that said:
..."Immediately after you cast a sorcerer spell of 1st level or higher, the DM can have you roll a d20."...
That part is where I find the idea of counterspell to be a tough pill to swallow. It is being done during your turn, on your action, as a result of your action. The possibility of using a reaction or bonus action to stop the resulting surge doesn't seem to fit in the scenario.
I'm currently of a mind that the only way to make the OP's idea possible would be through the use of a homebrew item, or using a loose/modified definition of how/when the surges happen.
The creature casting the spells from the Surges is the sorcerer themselves, and therefore I agree it could be argued you cannot see yourself casting the spell as to allow for this to trigger the counterspell reaction.
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Also, as a Wild Magic sorcerer, I’d argue that the table is supposed to represent magical power accidentally “slipping out”. Counterspell relies on somebody *casting* a spell which you can then counter, while the Wild Magic surges just happen. That’s my interpretations anyway
I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?
Sage Advice: https://twitter.com/jeremyecrawford/status/846866527022280704?lang=en
Sage Advice Compendium: https://media.wizards.com/2015/downloads/dnd/SA_Compendium_1.0.pdf
See: Can you also cast a reaction spell on your turn?
If I cast a Fireball, and the enemy Wizard uses her Reaction to Counterspell. If I have my Reaction available, I can cast Counterspell to counter their Counterspell, to ensure that my Fireball goes off.
I think it should be valid to Counterspell a Wildsurge. Because it's blowing a lvl 3+ slot to try to "regain control" ontop of the initial spell lost in the casting. That is a huge cost the Sorcerer is paying for what would be a pretty epic looking moment.
In a more DM lenient then RAW post: https://www.sageadvice.eu/2017/01/05/can-i-counterspell-myself/
You need to see the counter spell being enchanted. That’s why you can’t counter spell a sorcerer with subtle meta magic. Cause he doesn’t make any somatic or verbal hints so you don,t know when or what to counter. Wild magic is the same.
I would potentially allow the sorcerer to use the carefull meta magic when rolling the table but only before. At least the group gets auto half damage on that fireball. You might go through sorcerer points though.