There is something I wonder about, and that's "When a spell you cast..." in contrast to "When you cast a spell". While with the latter grammatical construct 'cast' is usually being interpreted as present tense, but with the former constellation, it could technically also be past tense (to cast - cast - cast). There is no 'casted' conjugation, as this is an irregular verb.
My question therefore is. Can it be that this can indeed seen as both present and past tense in regards to ruling?
Practical example:
Spellfire Adept: "Once per turn, when a spell you cast deals radiant damage..." in conjunction with the spell Holy Weapon: "As a bonus action on your turn you can dismiss this spell and cause... 4d8 radiant damage..." While it is a dismissal, and probably on a later turn, it still damage dealt by a spell that I cast (past tense).
Or Sunbeam: "You can create a new line of radiance as your action on any turn until the spell ends."
Technically speaking, any successive line of radiance on a later turn it is radiant damage dealt by a spell I cast, when 'cast' is interpreted as past tense.
There is something I wonder about, and that's "When a spell you cast...". While usually 'cast' is being interpreted as present tense in this constellation, it could technically also be past tense (to cast - cast - cast). There is no 'casted' conjugation, as this is an irregular verb.
My question therefore is. Can it be that this can indeed seen as both present and past tense in regards to ruling? [...]
Under my interpretation, the phrase "'When you cast..." (found in different feats or features) is resolved at the moment you cast the spell, so it uses the present tense.
A similar example is the Careful Spell Metamagic option. It should affect Saving Throws made when the spell is cast, not on later turns.
When you cast a spell that forces other creatures to make a saving throw, you can protect some of those creatures from the spell’s full force.
While not official ruling, this is from the Dev using Cloudkill as an example:
@quadhund Just my monthly ask about whether Careful Spell can be used with Cloudkill? @JeremyECrawford Careful Spell is used the turn you cast a spell and is intended to affect saving throws made that turn.
That would apply if "When you cast a spell...", and "When a spell you cast..." was seen as the exact same grammatical construct. If so, why not staying with "When you cast a spell" in all descriptions?
That would apply if "When you cast a spell...", and "When a spell you cast..." was seen as the exact same construct. If so, why not staying with "When you cast a spell" in all descriptions?
Because 5e is poorly templated, so they frequently use different constructions to mean the same thing. Natural language rules are the bane of clear meaning.
That would apply if "When you cast a spell...", and "When a spell you cast..." was seen as the exact same grammatical construct. If so, why not staying with "When you cast a spell" in all descriptions?
Because there is a grammatical distinction between the two phrases. "When you cast a spell" is a subordinate adverbial clause where the subject is you and the verb is cast. "When a spell you cast deals damage" is a subordinate adverbial clause where the subject is a spell that has the finite-verb clause "you cast" serving as an adjective modifying "spell" and the main verb is deals. Trying to compare the word "cast" in both situations makes no sense because they serve different grammatical functions. One is the main verb of an adverbial clause, and the other is the main verb of adjectival clause in an adverbial clause. That grammatical distinction makes it so that when a spell you cast and are concentrating on deals damage on subsequent turns has the extra effect whereas the other does not because you are not casting the spell that turn.
TLDR: comparing the tense of cast in these two clauses makes no sense because they serve as verbs in different types of clauses.
But that would mean you can very well use the benefit of i.E. Spellfire Adept on subsequent turns the spell endures, and not only at the very same turn it is cast.
But that would mean you can very well use the benefit of i.E. Spellfire Adept on subsequent turns the spell endures, and not only at the very same turn it is cast.
That is correct. Just like the celestial warlock's 6th level feature works on the second damage on searing smite.
There is something I wonder about, and that's "When a spell you cast..." in contrast to "When you cast a spell". While with the latter grammatical construct 'cast' is usually being interpreted as present tense, but with the former constellation, it could technically also be past tense (to cast - cast - cast). There is no 'casted' conjugation, as this is an irregular verb.
My question therefore is. Can it be that this can indeed seen as both present and past tense in regards to ruling?
Practical example:
Spellfire Adept: "Once per turn, when a spell you cast deals radiant damage..." in conjunction with the spell Holy Weapon: "As a bonus action on your turn you can dismiss this spell and cause... 4d8 radiant damage..." While it is a dismissal, and probably on a later turn, it still damage dealt by a spell that I cast (past tense).
Or Sunbeam: "You can create a new line of radiance as your action on any turn until the spell ends."
Technically speaking, any successive line of radiance on a later turn it is radiant damage dealt by a spell I cast, when 'cast' is interpreted as past tense.
I read "Once per turn, when a spell you cast deals radiant damage..." as present tense.
It can only be past tense. When the spell deals damage, you have already successfully cast it. Resolution happens after casting the spell.
I would read it as letting you use the feat every time you used Sunbeam to create a new line of radiance.
Under my interpretation, the phrase "'When you cast..." (found in different feats or features) is resolved at the moment you cast the spell, so it uses the present tense.
A similar example is the Careful Spell Metamagic option. It should affect Saving Throws made when the spell is cast, not on later turns.
While not official ruling, this is from the Dev using Cloudkill as an example:
That would apply if "When you cast a spell...", and "When a spell you cast..." was seen as the exact same grammatical construct. If so, why not staying with "When you cast a spell" in all descriptions?
Because 5e is poorly templated, so they frequently use different constructions to mean the same thing. Natural language rules are the bane of clear meaning.
Because there is a grammatical distinction between the two phrases. "When you cast a spell" is a subordinate adverbial clause where the subject is you and the verb is cast. "When a spell you cast deals damage" is a subordinate adverbial clause where the subject is a spell that has the finite-verb clause "you cast" serving as an adjective modifying "spell" and the main verb is deals. Trying to compare the word "cast" in both situations makes no sense because they serve different grammatical functions. One is the main verb of an adverbial clause, and the other is the main verb of adjectival clause in an adverbial clause. That grammatical distinction makes it so that when a spell you cast and are concentrating on deals damage on subsequent turns has the extra effect whereas the other does not because you are not casting the spell that turn.
TLDR: comparing the tense of cast in these two clauses makes no sense because they serve as verbs in different types of clauses.
But that would mean you can very well use the benefit of i.E. Spellfire Adept on subsequent turns the spell endures, and not only at the very same turn it is cast.
That is correct. Just like the celestial warlock's 6th level feature works on the second damage on searing smite.