If you have a character that took ritual caster as a feat, then multiclass into wizard, is the ritual caster feat provided as a class feature redundantOr do you replace it with another feat of your choice?
In some ways ritual caster and magic initiate can feel like “multiclass light” and I like that about them.
Your situation could be a perfect story transition too. Character starts out one way then you work the feat into the character’s story. As the magic influence grows, the character multiclasses. The feat becomes redundant.
At my table, I would let you choose a new feat in such a situation. But I would also ask you to come up with an explanation to work the new feat into the character’s story.
Well, an explanation: the character is a 10th-level Variant Human Eldritch Knight, and I did take the Magic Initiate (Wizard) and Ritual Caster (Wizard) feats, along with the Alert and War Caster feats.
Backstory: the character grew up on his family farm until he was a teen, at which time his aunt, who was a hedge wizard and a member of a local adventuring group, saw promise in her nephew and began to teach him her craft. After five years of apprenticeship, the aunt began taking him along when her crew handled the local troubles. One job went very badly and resulted in the character witnessing his aunt get shredded by a pack of ghouls. In the aftermath, one of the other group members, an ex-solder turned adventurer, took the character under his wing and began training the young man in martial combat as the character also continued his magical studies and took his aunt’s place in the group.
So, the character multiclassing a bit into wizard makes sense - he’s just focusing on his arcane skills more, lately. It would just suck to have “wasted” an ability score increase on Ritual Caster if I multiclass into wizard.
I would just like to say, awesome backstory for an eldritch knight. If I were the DM I would let you replace the feat if you could fit it into the story.
It's not really "wasted" it is additional spells known, which don't count against your Spells Known count for either class. It would require having two spell books though, one for Ritual Caster feat and one for Wizard class.
If you really wanted to change it, the problem becomes what to do with the Ritual Spells gained from the feat. DM would be in full rights to let you keep them or to have the Ritual Book from the Ritual Caster Feat destroyed, losing those spells, and you would only be able to recreate ritual spells you currently know through EK or Wizard spells known. If it came up at my table, I'd rule the latter, not as a punishment, but as fairness to the other players, else you are getting something "for free" while they are not.
I think that if they took ritual casting wizard, then take a level of wizard they would be able to copy those rituals into the wizard spellbook, there shouldn’t be any losing of spells. Swapping to another feat wouldn’t be “getting something for free”, it would be not having a wasted feat.
If the ritual casting had been a different class than wizard, it would be a very different scenario and I wouldn’t let it work.
If this were to happen during a game I was running, I would let it happen, but not let the feat be replaced until there was appropriate downtime.
I don't think it is wasted at all. A single level of wizard lets you cast first level ritual spells. The ritual caster feat lets you cast up to 5th level wizard ritual spells (assuming you are 10th level). A single level of wizard won't give you access to casting Leomund's Tiny Hut as a ritual since you can't even cast it until 5th level wizard so although it is redundant for 1st level rituals ... there are a lot of higher level rituals (water breathing, rary's telepathic bond, leomund's tiny hut and others) that the ritual caster (wizard) feat gives you access to that the single level in wizard does not.
P.S. An Eldritch knight doesn't have a spellbook and can't cast spells they know as rituals at all. So the ritual caster feat is the only route to high level rituals for this character unless they want to take many wizard levels. Also, since extra attack is enhanced at level 11, I would think it a better choice to save the wizard multiclass until level 12.
@ David42, I agree that another level of EK would be optimal for that extra attack. It was more of a role playing consideration, really. Also, thank you for pointing out that the wizard class feature isn’t the Ritual Caster (Wizard) feat; it’s similar, but it doesn’t provide the feat (I needed to read that feature more carefully).
After consideration, I think I’m just going to go with another level of EK and avoid the situation. 😛
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If you have a character that took ritual caster as a feat, then multiclass into wizard, is the ritual caster feat provided as a class feature redundantOr do you replace it with another feat of your choice?
I think RAW it would be redundant, but if you talk to your DM about it you might be able to work something out.
This is assuming that you took Ritual Caster (Wizard).
Thank you!!
In some ways ritual caster and magic initiate can feel like “multiclass light” and I like that about them.
Your situation could be a perfect story transition too. Character starts out one way then you work the feat into the character’s story. As the magic influence grows, the character multiclasses. The feat becomes redundant.
At my table, I would let you choose a new feat in such a situation. But I would also ask you to come up with an explanation to work the new feat into the character’s story.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Well, an explanation: the character is a 10th-level Variant Human Eldritch Knight, and I did take the Magic Initiate (Wizard) and Ritual Caster (Wizard) feats, along with the Alert and War Caster feats.
Backstory: the character grew up on his family farm until he was a teen, at which time his aunt, who was a hedge wizard and a member of a local adventuring group, saw promise in her nephew and began to teach him her craft. After five years of apprenticeship, the aunt began taking him along when her crew handled the local troubles. One job went very badly and resulted in the character witnessing his aunt get shredded by a pack of ghouls. In the aftermath, one of the other group members, an ex-solder turned adventurer, took the character under his wing and began training the young man in martial combat as the character also continued his magical studies and took his aunt’s place in the group.
So, the character multiclassing a bit into wizard makes sense - he’s just focusing on his arcane skills more, lately. It would just suck to have “wasted” an ability score increase on Ritual Caster if I multiclass into wizard.
I would just like to say, awesome backstory for an eldritch knight. If I were the DM I would let you replace the feat if you could fit it into the story.
IMO: story>RAW
It's not really "wasted" it is additional spells known, which don't count against your Spells Known count for either class. It would require having two spell books though, one for Ritual Caster feat and one for Wizard class.
If you really wanted to change it, the problem becomes what to do with the Ritual Spells gained from the feat. DM would be in full rights to let you keep them or to have the Ritual Book from the Ritual Caster Feat destroyed, losing those spells, and you would only be able to recreate ritual spells you currently know through EK or Wizard spells known. If it came up at my table, I'd rule the latter, not as a punishment, but as fairness to the other players, else you are getting something "for free" while they are not.
I think that if they took ritual casting wizard, then take a level of wizard they would be able to copy those rituals into the wizard spellbook, there shouldn’t be any losing of spells. Swapping to another feat wouldn’t be “getting something for free”, it would be not having a wasted feat.
If the ritual casting had been a different class than wizard, it would be a very different scenario and I wouldn’t let it work.
If this were to happen during a game I was running, I would let it happen, but not let the feat be replaced until there was appropriate downtime.
I don't think it is wasted at all. A single level of wizard lets you cast first level ritual spells. The ritual caster feat lets you cast up to 5th level wizard ritual spells (assuming you are 10th level). A single level of wizard won't give you access to casting Leomund's Tiny Hut as a ritual since you can't even cast it until 5th level wizard so although it is redundant for 1st level rituals ... there are a lot of higher level rituals (water breathing, rary's telepathic bond, leomund's tiny hut and others) that the ritual caster (wizard) feat gives you access to that the single level in wizard does not.
P.S. An Eldritch knight doesn't have a spellbook and can't cast spells they know as rituals at all. So the ritual caster feat is the only route to high level rituals for this character unless they want to take many wizard levels. Also, since extra attack is enhanced at level 11, I would think it a better choice to save the wizard multiclass until level 12.
@ David42, I agree that another level of EK would be optimal for that extra attack. It was more of a role playing consideration, really. Also, thank you for pointing out that the wizard class feature isn’t the Ritual Caster (Wizard) feat; it’s similar, but it doesn’t provide the feat (I needed to read that feature more carefully).
After consideration, I think I’m just going to go with another level of EK and avoid the situation. 😛