The rule doesn’t say anything about the ability of the small character to wield or use proficiency when attacking with the weapon. It simply gives them disadvantage.
"Heavy. Creatures that are Small or Tiny have disadvantage on attack rolls with heavy weapons. A heavy weapon's size and bulk make it too large for a Small or Tiny creature to use effectively."
From weapons proficiency section "Most warriors use martial weapons because these weapons put their fighting style and training to best use."
So it could be argued that the small PC's fighting style and training makes it possible for it to use the weapon.
A small character can use heavy weapons, just not very well. No matter how hard you train, trying to fight with a tree trunk is not going to be very effective.
Also, the DM call is more appropriate when there is a different interpretation or confusion over the rules. What you're talking about here is more of a house rule or homebrew since it fundamentally changes the base rules. A DM can certainly alter the rules at their table to allow weapon proficiency to affect advantage/disadvantage, but it is something that should be made clear to all players at the start of a campaign.
How does weapon proficiency play into this? For example a halfling with Bracers of Archery that grants him proficiency in both shortbow and longbow. But longbow is considered a heavy weapon. But how can he be proficient in it if he can't wield it?
Consider the mechanics. A level 1 human rogue, a level 1 human rogue with Bracers of Archery, a halfling rogue, and a halfling rogue with Bracers of Archery. For the sake of ease, all characters have a 16 dexterity giving a +3 attack bonus. The human without the bracers will roll a d20, add the +3 attack bonus and then roll 1d8 for a Longbow and add 3. With the bracers, the human rogue gets to add 5 to each roll (adding 2 to the attack roll because this rogue is proficient with the longbow now and gets to add their proficiency bonus and adding 2 to the damage roll because of the magic item). The halfling will be the same except that they will have to roll twice the attack roll twice and take the low roll.
You can think of this in the same vein as a person who has difficulty carrying an item because it is too big for them to carry alone even if the weight isn't too heavy for them, or a person that is riding a bike that isn't set up for their body type. They can be proficient with riding bikes, but it'll be difficult if the bike is too large or too small for their stature.
Started to create a Changeling Fighter and thought to myself, and now asking the rest of you, considering in the Changeling description it says, 'You can make yourself appear as a member of another race, though none of your game statistics change.' Would I be able to change into a Halfling and wield a greatsword as any normal medium/large size creature would?
Started to create a Changeling Fighter and thought to myself, and now asking the rest of you, considering in the Changeling description it says, 'You can make yourself appear as a member of another race, though none of your game statistics change.' Would I be able to change into a Halfling and wield a greatsword as any normal medium/large size creature would?
Yes since with Shapechanger you can also adjust your height and weight, but not so much that your size changes, thus remaining Medium size despite the other race appearance you make yourself appear as.
Not sure if this helps..but I find that when this comes up in game..if they fail a strength save..they can't use it. Or the items is scaled down to size for the character. That seems to be how the DM's I play with handle this. So my gnome gunslinger can pick that cannon up..doesn't lead to him not getting tossed across the room when he tries to shoulder fire the thing like Rambo.
Because I gave him a strength of 18..
what
Gnomes can be buff...
if it was a halfling you could totally name him Rambo Baggins, Bilbo's roided out cousin and the cousin Frodo doesnt talk about (like Bruno :D )
this is all great information! i am playing a halfling rogue currently and just picked up the bracers of archery. it does seem odd that i have proficiency in an item that is difficult for me to handle.
I do think it has everything to do with stature and nothing to do with strength though. my halfling has strength equal to a normal human who would have no disadvantage to wield the bow; deductively, the disadvantage is only because the SIZE is unwieldy. my solution to this if my DM is ok with it will be to have a “short-longbow” commissioned that has the draw-strength of a longbow in a shortbow size. yes it’s homebrew and it will obviously be more expensive for a custom item to be built, but should be within the realm of possibility. we’ll see what they say on Sunday! :)
I do think it has everything to do with stature and nothing to do with strength though. my halfling has strength equal to a normal human who would have no disadvantage to wield the bow; deductively, the disadvantage is only because the SIZE is unwieldy. my solution to this if my DM is ok with it will be to have a “short-longbow” commissioned that has the draw-strength of a longbow in a shortbow size. yes it’s homebrew and it will obviously be more expensive for a custom item to be built, but should be within the realm of possibility. we’ll see what they say on Sunday! :)
Exactly the heavy property is relative to a creature's size, not strength. In my GREYHAWM campaign the party found an Elvenbow, which was a longbow without the heavy property.
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The rule doesn’t say anything about the ability of the small character to wield or use proficiency when attacking with the weapon. It simply gives them disadvantage.
"Heavy. Creatures that are Small or Tiny have disadvantage on attack rolls with heavy weapons. A heavy weapon's size and bulk make it too large for a Small or Tiny creature to use effectively."
From weapons proficiency section "Most warriors use martial weapons because these weapons put their fighting style and training to best use."
So it could be argued that the small PC's fighting style and training makes it possible for it to use the weapon.
But either way it is a DM call.
No. It is pretty cut and dry. Disadvantage and proficiency are different.
A small character can use heavy weapons, just not very well. No matter how hard you train, trying to fight with a tree trunk is not going to be very effective.
Also, the DM call is more appropriate when there is a different interpretation or confusion over the rules. What you're talking about here is more of a house rule or homebrew since it fundamentally changes the base rules. A DM can certainly alter the rules at their table to allow weapon proficiency to affect advantage/disadvantage, but it is something that should be made clear to all players at the start of a campaign.
Consider the mechanics. A level 1 human rogue, a level 1 human rogue with Bracers of Archery, a halfling rogue, and a halfling rogue with Bracers of Archery. For the sake of ease, all characters have a 16 dexterity giving a +3 attack bonus. The human without the bracers will roll a d20, add the +3 attack bonus and then roll 1d8 for a Longbow and add 3. With the bracers, the human rogue gets to add 5 to each roll (adding 2 to the attack roll because this rogue is proficient with the longbow now and gets to add their proficiency bonus and adding 2 to the damage roll because of the magic item). The halfling will be the same except that they will have to roll twice the attack roll twice and take the low roll.
You can think of this in the same vein as a person who has difficulty carrying an item because it is too big for them to carry alone even if the weight isn't too heavy for them, or a person that is riding a bike that isn't set up for their body type. They can be proficient with riding bikes, but it'll be difficult if the bike is too large or too small for their stature.
There used to be a feat in 3.5 called Monkey Grip that would allow you to use weapons one size larger than you.
Started to create a Changeling Fighter and thought to myself, and now asking the rest of you, considering in the Changeling description it says, 'You can make yourself appear as a member of another race, though none of your game statistics change.'
Would I be able to change into a Halfling and wield a greatsword as any normal medium/large size creature would?
Yes since with Shapechanger you can also adjust your height and weight, but not so much that your size changes, thus remaining Medium size despite the other race appearance you make yourself appear as.
Dwarves are medium creatures
Love that you acknowledged this (6.5 years ago) as I am currently researching heavy weapons for gnomes as a... gnome barbarian! 😉
if it was a halfling you could totally name him Rambo Baggins, Bilbo's roided out cousin and the cousin Frodo doesnt talk about (like Bruno :D )
this is all great information! i am playing a halfling rogue currently and just picked up the bracers of archery. it does seem odd that i have proficiency in an item that is difficult for me to handle.
I do think it has everything to do with stature and nothing to do with strength though. my halfling has strength equal to a normal human who would have no disadvantage to wield the bow; deductively, the disadvantage is only because the SIZE is unwieldy. my solution to this if my DM is ok with it will be to have a “short-longbow” commissioned that has the draw-strength of a longbow in a shortbow size. yes it’s homebrew and it will obviously be more expensive for a custom item to be built, but should be within the realm of possibility. we’ll see what they say on Sunday! :)
Exactly the heavy property is relative to a creature's size, not strength. In my GREYHAWM campaign the party found an Elvenbow, which was a longbow without the heavy property.