I know people will jump to Barbarian, and that was what first jumped out at me too....
But at the same time, I'm thinking a Bugbear Rogue would be a REALLY good idea for this. The max health anyone could POSSIBLY have would be 19 (20 constitution barbarian with Tough feat), and realistically most players would have total HP that would be WELL within range for a sneak attack with Bugbear to oneshot.
If you took a weapon with a 1d8 base damage, you could very well end up dropping even most Barbarian builds with a 2d8+1d6+4
Plus as a Rogue, you could possibly try and stay stealthed and avoid confrontations that would drain resources or health from just about any other class. Depending on the size of the group doing the battle royale, this could be really helpful.
Celestial Warlock variant human with spell sniper and perception feat from VH. you can shoot 240' you dont run out of ammo, see a target, walk away firing. If you get hurt, heal yourself, you can then rest as long as you have an uninterrupted hour and you have your heal spell back. Sleep is an issue, background criminal with stealth to make a hide to sleep in at night could prove useful if its not a one day and done affair.
Simic Hybrid or Triton mage. Find water source. dive, dive! Familiar scouts island as bird, wait till your almost last or you see an opportunity emerge magic missile (minimum damage 6 average damage 10 autohit and thats nearly anyone gone, the second shot is a guaranteed kill unless someone is uninjured and has racial maximum CON. Return to water and relearn spells after you sleep. Mmm eelskin spellbooks are great arent they!
Non adventurers league legal? Birdman or other first level flier, class irrelevant, perception skill preferred, drop rocks, roost in high terrain, interfere in others fights
BattleRoyale with survival elements and no provisions means rangers might be good options but stealth is necessary to hide whilst you recover from your wounds.
keep in mind that with guiding bolt you now give everyone advantage on attacking that person (if they survived, 4d6 damage is a lot at lvl 1 even against a barbarian since it doesn't have resistance to radiant damage) until someone takes the attack action on them before your next turn AND you have a range of 120 feet with this!!!
My understanding is that guiding bolt gives only the next single attack roll advantage. Is this not the case?
If I'm on top of a hill, I can see a good 500+ feet out. How's your barbarian account for 500 feet? Same with your Fighter...
Pretty well - they shoot you with their longbow or crossbow. Twice, if they are a fighter and use action surge.
Or perhaps they dodge and run towards you, screaming, waving their big axe above their head.
Or they hide. Barbarians and fighters can get proficiency in stealth after all.
At level 1, the winner going to be based on dice rolls rather than class features. Whoever rolls higher on the d20 wins. I think Barbarians get a better chance, since their foes have to hit them twice, but I don't know if I'd put money on any class.
At level 1, the winner going to be based on dice rolls rather than class features. Whoever rolls higher on the d20 wins. I think Barbarians get a better chance, since their foes have to hit them twice, but I don't know if I'd put money on any class.
Woah there. Only if the survivalists all start in LoS to each other. Otherwise the Triton magic missile launcher cares not for these things called dice rolls to hit. Also those that set traps with combinations of survival kit and natural features will kill people without making any to hit rolls of there own if successful. That being said my upbringing through second edition by my 'teachers' was a lesson in how to succeed automatically when possible. Flooding, smoking out a cave network, building trench and spiked swing traps. Planning the pre fight was as important as the fight. If you weren't scheming you werent trying to keep yourself alive.
At level 1, the winner going to be based on dice rolls rather than class features. Whoever rolls higher on the d20 wins. I think Barbarians get a better chance, since their foes have to hit them twice, but I don't know if I'd put money on any class.
Also those that set traps with combinations of survival kit and natural features will kill people without making any to hit rolls of there own if successful.
That's true. It's also more weight behind class being not of prime importance.
Perhaps the poll should be based on Background? Or Class + Background (since I think a Barbarian Outlander would have an advantage in a "sneak around and set traps" scenario)? Or at least any combination that gives Survival, Stealth and Perception.
Has anyone actually run a battle scenario? If so, how did it go? What were your starting positions?
Race is of primary importance - if you can breathe water and no one else can you can remain safe in area's denied to others, Or flight allowing disengaging by distance and roosting in area's others cant reach without you becoming aware of them.
A scenario I have seen similar to that was two players fighting to survive in a cave system (3rd edition) Both had pieces of a totem that if completed would portal one person out. The cave network was full of dangerous to deadly threats. In the end the loss came about because the mage cast invisibility on a green (black but poisonous not acidic) pudding and waited. The other player wandered into it as they hunted them.
If I'm on top of a hill, I can see a good 500+ feet out. How's your barbarian account for 500 feet? Same with your Fighter...
Pretty well - they shoot you with their longbow or crossbow. Twice, if they are a fighter and use action surge.
Or perhaps they dodge and run towards you, screaming, waving their big axe above their head.
Or they hide. Barbarians and fighters can get proficiency in stealth after all.
At level 1, the winner going to be based on dice rolls rather than class features. Whoever rolls higher on the d20 wins. I think Barbarians get a better chance, since their foes have to hit them twice, but I don't know if I'd put money on any class.
At level 1, the winner going to be based on dice rolls rather than class features. Whoever rolls higher on the d20 wins. I think Barbarians get a better chance, since their foes have to hit them twice, but I don't know if I'd put money on any class.
Woah there. Only if the survivalists all start in LoS to each other. Otherwise the Triton magic missile launcher cares not for these things called dice rolls to hit. Also those that set traps with combinations of survival kit and natural features will kill people without making any to hit rolls of there own if successful. That being said my upbringing through second edition by my 'teachers' was a lesson in how to succeed automatically when possible. Flooding, smoking out a cave network, building trench and spiked swing traps. Planning the pre fight was as important as the fight. If you weren't scheming you werent trying to keep yourself alive.
To help everyone with deciding/making thoughts as to who the winner would be I decided to break down each class so people know what to expect:
Barbarian- Very good. Has the highest health in the game. Moderate armor. High damage. Also has resistance to bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage. Barbarian also has ranged attacks with their javelins and hand axes.
Bard- Fine. Has average health. Average armor. Spell-wise you have access to [/spell]dissonant whispers[Tooltip Not Found]sleep[spell] which is also very good but ineffective against fey and you'll still have to try and kill them somehow. Best tactic would be to team up with someone (having the ability to heal works great as a political factor) to take some people out, use your spells defensively. Has a rapier but you really don't want to get in hand to hand combat. Also have daggers but those won't really do much...
Cleric- Very good. Has Average health. Has average to good armor. Spell-wise you'll have access to [/spell]guiding bolt[spell] which is a great political tool (makes the player look attractive as an attack option), you also have the ability to heal (another great political tool), you also have many good ranged damaging cantrips. Moving on to physical attacks you have decent damage out-put which still makes hand on hand combat a viable strategy against players as long as it's not against a class such as barbarian or fighter.
Druid- Fine. Has average health. Average armor. Spell-wise they have access to [/spell]goodberry[Tooltip Not Found]ice knife[spell]. This class will also need to team up if they plan on being successful.
Fighter- Very good. Has second highest health (tied with paladin). Has average to good armor depending on whether you plan to be ranged or melee. If you're ranged, you'll have the ability to increase your hits on other players. If you're melee, you can increase the damage out-put. Has a self-heal ability which can come in very handy.
Monk- Not very good. You have average health. Moderate armor. Your ranged attacks are very weak. In combat unarmed strike is definitely something, but is only relevant if you're fighting a weak player such as a wizard since your attacks are weak anyways.
Paladin- Good. Has the second highest health (tied with fighter). Moderate to good armor. Has the ability to heal which is great for politics or oneself. Good attack options, both ranged and melee (doesn't have the same kind of damage output as the fighter or barbarian though).
Ranger- Not very good. Has average health. Average armor. Doesn't do very well in melee unless they're up against a full caster. Ranged attacks are fine, but keep in mind you're using a long bow and need to have distance between you and the enemy.
Rogue- Not very good. Has average health. Average armor. Does well in melee combat only if you can activate sneak attack. Also has a short bow which is alright for some ranged attacks.
Sorcerer- Bad. Has the lowest health (tied with wizard). Has low armor. Spell-wise you'll have access to some good damaging ranged cantrips and 1st level spells + [/spell]sleep[Tooltip Not Found]shield[spell], however there is no heal. All this class will want to do is keep out of reach from everyone. Usually someone with 6-8 health are a 1/2 shot kill. You might be able to take out 1 person but you are not going to win.
Warlock- Not very good. Has average health. Average armor. Awesome if you choose the fiend as your other-worldly patron and can manage to finish of players multiple times to get the temporary hit points (but that's most likely won't be the case). Hard to do much when you can only cast 1 first level spell in which you only have access to damage or sleep (not ideal if you want to win). Damage cantrips are good.
Wizard- Not very good. Has lowest health (tied with sorcerer). Has low armor. Spell-wise you'll have access to [/spell]mage armor[spell] to raise your armor class to average which will leave you with one more spell. Damage spells and cantrips are good, but you'll want to try and not get hit vs trying to actually kill anybody.
Overall I'd say Barbarian, Cleric, and Fighter are the best options. The cleric is probably IMO the best for it's ability to heal others (great political tool) while also having high armor class so it's hard to hit. Has access to good damaging spells and melee options as well.
Being an Aarakocra or Triton are pretty good in this. You can take yourself out of reach (the Aarakocra will still be susceptible to ranged attacks however unless you fly super high).
keep in mind that with guiding bolt you now give everyone advantage on attacking that person (if they survived, 4d6 damage is a lot at lvl 1 even against a barbarian since it doesn't have resistance to radiant damage) until someone takes the attack action on them before your next turn AND you have a range of 120 feet with this!!!
My understanding is that guiding bolt gives only the next single attack roll advantage. Is this not the case?
That's what I meant when I said everyone has advantage on the person until someone takes the attack action before my next turn. Confusing wording I know :/
A Aarakocra ranger at level one could fly 50 feet per round and will most likely go first because of it's +2 to dex, if dex before racial bonus is 18, dex will be a 20 which is a +5 , which can be used for flying stealth and given a long bow with 20 arrows, padded armor (I think) it will get a ac of 19 and can pepper any class if it takes the +2 in bow.
Therefore Aarakocra,ranger will kill any class as long as it can hit enough times , the only class i think it can't hit is the cleric because of it's ac of 18 (20 with a shield)
A Aarakocra ranger at level one could fly 50 feet per round and will most likely go first because of it's +2 to dex, if dex before racial bonus is 18, dex will be a 20 which is a +5 , which can be used for flying stealth and given a long bow with 20 arrows, padded armor (I think) it will get a ac of 19 and can pepper any class if it takes the +2 in bow.
Therefore Aarakocra,ranger will kill any class as long as it can hit enough times , the only class i think it can't hit is the cleric because of it's ac of 18 (20 with a shield)
An Aarakocra with any type of ranged attack can do exactly as you described, it doesn't just have to be a Ranger.
Also remember these characters are level 1. The cleric wouldn't have access to blessing of the forge yet.
I also did my analysis using standard array since I thought that would probably be fairest and what a lot of DMs would probably prefer for something like this.
An issue with this format is that every player gets an average of 5 minutes of playtime every 1 hour, the rest of the time the player is off-screen and maybe even in another room. In addition there is no opportunity for roleplaying.
I think you should consider how to make this fun for the players :)
A twist on the same basis might be that there are 6-12 four man groups in a battle royale style scenario. The players are one of these groups and must work together against the npc groups to survive and win.
An issue with this format is that every player gets an average of 5 minutes of playtime every 1 hour, the rest of the time the player is off-screen and maybe even in another room. In addition there is no opportunity for roleplaying.
I think you should consider how to make this fun for the players :)
A twist on the same basis might be that there are 6-12 four man groups in a battle royale style scenario. The players are one of these groups and must work together against the npc groups to survive and win.
I think there was a pax event where they did something like that.
A Aarakocra ranger at level one could fly 50 feet per round and will most likely go first because of it's +2 to dex, if dex before racial bonus is 18, dex will be a 20 which is a +5 , which can be used for flying stealth and given a long bow with 20 arrows, padded armor (I think) it will get a ac of 19 and can pepper any class if it takes the +2 in bow.
Therefore Aarakocra,ranger will kill any class as long as it can hit enough times , the only class i think it can't hit is the cleric because of it's ac of 18 (20 with a shield)
it has 20 arrows. So, at some point, it may or may not run out of ammo.
flying. So, if its above me, there's trees and stuff in the way. that's cover. You're flying above me. I hold my shield directly above my head. that's basically full cover. There's a lot in your theory thats not being accounted for. This scenario, the winner will LITERALLY be the one with the best longterm survival/hiding plan, and is luckiest with the dice combined with that.
Charming a person, can be done. Now you have a tag team teammate. and it will last for the full hour, unless you make a new "companion" friend, that then hurts them.
there's literally infinite scenarios that can happen.
but the wood elf, that hides, and charms can be quite effective.
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I know people will jump to Barbarian, and that was what first jumped out at me too....
But at the same time, I'm thinking a Bugbear Rogue would be a REALLY good idea for this. The max health anyone could POSSIBLY have would be 19 (20 constitution barbarian with Tough feat), and realistically most players would have total HP that would be WELL within range for a sneak attack with Bugbear to oneshot.
If you took a weapon with a 1d8 base damage, you could very well end up dropping even most Barbarian builds with a 2d8+1d6+4
Plus as a Rogue, you could possibly try and stay stealthed and avoid confrontations that would drain resources or health from just about any other class. Depending on the size of the group doing the battle royale, this could be really helpful.
Celestial Warlock variant human with spell sniper and perception feat from VH. you can shoot 240' you dont run out of ammo, see a target, walk away firing. If you get hurt, heal yourself, you can then rest as long as you have an uninterrupted hour and you have your heal spell back. Sleep is an issue, background criminal with stealth to make a hide to sleep in at night could prove useful if its not a one day and done affair.
Simic Hybrid or Triton mage. Find water source. dive, dive! Familiar scouts island as bird, wait till your almost last or you see an opportunity emerge magic missile (minimum damage 6 average damage 10 autohit and thats nearly anyone gone, the second shot is a guaranteed kill unless someone is uninjured and has racial maximum CON. Return to water and relearn spells after you sleep. Mmm eelskin spellbooks are great arent they!
Non adventurers league legal? Birdman or other first level flier, class irrelevant, perception skill preferred, drop rocks, roost in high terrain, interfere in others fights
BattleRoyale with survival elements and no provisions means rangers might be good options but stealth is necessary to hide whilst you recover from your wounds.
My understanding is that guiding bolt gives only the next single attack roll advantage. Is this not the case?
"Not all those who wander are lost"
You’re correct, Guiding Bolt only affects one attack.
Professional computer geek
Pretty well - they shoot you with their longbow or crossbow. Twice, if they are a fighter and use action surge.
Or perhaps they dodge and run towards you, screaming, waving their big axe above their head.
Or they hide. Barbarians and fighters can get proficiency in stealth after all.
At level 1, the winner going to be based on dice rolls rather than class features. Whoever rolls higher on the d20 wins. I think Barbarians get a better chance, since their foes have to hit them twice, but I don't know if I'd put money on any class.
Woah there. Only if the survivalists all start in LoS to each other. Otherwise the Triton magic missile launcher cares not for these things called dice rolls to hit. Also those that set traps with combinations of survival kit and natural features will kill people without making any to hit rolls of there own if successful. That being said my upbringing through second edition by my 'teachers' was a lesson in how to succeed automatically when possible. Flooding, smoking out a cave network, building trench and spiked swing traps. Planning the pre fight was as important as the fight. If you weren't scheming you werent trying to keep yourself alive.
That's true. It's also more weight behind class being not of prime importance.
Perhaps the poll should be based on Background? Or Class + Background (since I think a Barbarian Outlander would have an advantage in a "sneak around and set traps" scenario)? Or at least any combination that gives Survival, Stealth and Perception.
Has anyone actually run a battle scenario? If so, how did it go? What were your starting positions?
Race is of primary importance - if you can breathe water and no one else can you can remain safe in area's denied to others, Or flight allowing disengaging by distance and roosting in area's others cant reach without you becoming aware of them.
A scenario I have seen similar to that was two players fighting to survive in a cave system (3rd edition) Both had pieces of a totem that if completed would portal one person out. The cave network was full of dangerous to deadly threats. In the end the loss came about because the mage cast invisibility on a green (black but poisonous not acidic) pudding and waited. The other player wandered into it as they hunted them.
I use my reaction to step 1 foot backwards.
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exactly!
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To help everyone with deciding/making thoughts as to who the winner would be I decided to break down each class so people know what to expect:
Barbarian- Very good. Has the highest health in the game. Moderate armor. High damage. Also has resistance to bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage. Barbarian also has ranged attacks with their javelins and hand axes.
Bard- Fine. Has average health. Average armor. Spell-wise you have access to [/spell]dissonant whispers[Tooltip Not Found]sleep[spell] which is also very good but ineffective against fey and you'll still have to try and kill them somehow. Best tactic would be to team up with someone (having the ability to heal works great as a political factor) to take some people out, use your spells defensively. Has a rapier but you really don't want to get in hand to hand combat. Also have daggers but those won't really do much...
Cleric- Very good. Has Average health. Has average to good armor. Spell-wise you'll have access to [/spell]guiding bolt[spell] which is a great political tool (makes the player look attractive as an attack option), you also have the ability to heal (another great political tool), you also have many good ranged damaging cantrips. Moving on to physical attacks you have decent damage out-put which still makes hand on hand combat a viable strategy against players as long as it's not against a class such as barbarian or fighter.
Druid- Fine. Has average health. Average armor. Spell-wise they have access to [/spell]goodberry[Tooltip Not Found]ice knife[spell]. This class will also need to team up if they plan on being successful.
Fighter- Very good. Has second highest health (tied with paladin). Has average to good armor depending on whether you plan to be ranged or melee. If you're ranged, you'll have the ability to increase your hits on other players. If you're melee, you can increase the damage out-put. Has a self-heal ability which can come in very handy.
Monk- Not very good. You have average health. Moderate armor. Your ranged attacks are very weak. In combat unarmed strike is definitely something, but is only relevant if you're fighting a weak player such as a wizard since your attacks are weak anyways.
Paladin- Good. Has the second highest health (tied with fighter). Moderate to good armor. Has the ability to heal which is great for politics or oneself. Good attack options, both ranged and melee (doesn't have the same kind of damage output as the fighter or barbarian though).
Ranger- Not very good. Has average health. Average armor. Doesn't do very well in melee unless they're up against a full caster. Ranged attacks are fine, but keep in mind you're using a long bow and need to have distance between you and the enemy.
Rogue- Not very good. Has average health. Average armor. Does well in melee combat only if you can activate sneak attack. Also has a short bow which is alright for some ranged attacks.
Sorcerer- Bad. Has the lowest health (tied with wizard). Has low armor. Spell-wise you'll have access to some good damaging ranged cantrips and 1st level spells + [/spell]sleep[Tooltip Not Found]shield[spell], however there is no heal. All this class will want to do is keep out of reach from everyone. Usually someone with 6-8 health are a 1/2 shot kill. You might be able to take out 1 person but you are not going to win.
Warlock- Not very good. Has average health. Average armor. Awesome if you choose the fiend as your other-worldly patron and can manage to finish of players multiple times to get the temporary hit points (but that's most likely won't be the case). Hard to do much when you can only cast 1 first level spell in which you only have access to damage or sleep (not ideal if you want to win). Damage cantrips are good.
Wizard- Not very good. Has lowest health (tied with sorcerer). Has low armor. Spell-wise you'll have access to [/spell]mage armor[spell] to raise your armor class to average which will leave you with one more spell. Damage spells and cantrips are good, but you'll want to try and not get hit vs trying to actually kill anybody.
Overall I'd say Barbarian, Cleric, and Fighter are the best options. The cleric is probably IMO the best for it's ability to heal others (great political tool) while also having high armor class so it's hard to hit. Has access to good damaging spells and melee options as well.
Being an Aarakocra or Triton are pretty good in this. You can take yourself out of reach (the Aarakocra will still be susceptible to ranged attacks however unless you fly super high).
That's what I meant when I said everyone has advantage on the person until someone takes the attack action before my next turn. Confusing wording I know :/
A Aarakocra ranger at level one could fly 50 feet per round and will most likely go first because of it's +2 to dex, if dex before racial bonus is 18, dex will be a 20 which is a +5 , which can be used for flying stealth and given a long bow with 20 arrows, padded armor (I think) it will get a ac of 19 and can pepper any class if it takes the +2 in bow.
Therefore Aarakocra,ranger will kill any class as long as it can hit enough times , the only class i think it can't hit is the cleric because of it's ac of 18 (20 with a shield)
Why does the cleric have an AC of 18?
I stole my pfp from this person: https://mobile.twitter.com/xelart1/status/1177312449575432193
21 with chain mail, shield, blessing of the forge, and shield of faith. If it's a variant human, it has advantage on concentration saving throws too.
Extended Signature! Yay! https://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/off-topic/adohands-kitchen/3153-extended-signature-thread?page=2#c21
Haven’t used this account in forever. Still a big fan of crawling claws.
An Aarakocra with any type of ranged attack can do exactly as you described, it doesn't just have to be a Ranger.
Also remember these characters are level 1. The cleric wouldn't have access to blessing of the forge yet.
I also did my analysis using standard array since I thought that would probably be fairest and what a lot of DMs would probably prefer for something like this.
An issue with this format is that every player gets an average of 5 minutes of playtime every 1 hour, the rest of the time the player is off-screen and maybe even in another room.
In addition there is no opportunity for roleplaying.
I think you should consider how to make this fun for the players :)
A twist on the same basis might be that there are 6-12 four man groups in a battle royale style scenario. The players are one of these groups and must work together against the npc groups to survive and win.
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I think there was a pax event where they did something like that.
it has 20 arrows. So, at some point, it may or may not run out of ammo.
flying. So, if its above me, there's trees and stuff in the way. that's cover. You're flying above me. I hold my shield directly above my head. that's basically full cover. There's a lot in your theory thats not being accounted for.
This scenario, the winner will LITERALLY be the one with the best longterm survival/hiding plan, and is luckiest with the dice combined with that.
A thing no one has mentioned... but is quite a possible scenario. https://roll20.net/compendium/dnd5e/Charm%20Person#content
Charming a person, can be done. Now you have a tag team teammate. and it will last for the full hour, unless you make a new "companion" friend, that then hurts them.
there's literally infinite scenarios that can happen.
but the wood elf, that hides, and charms can be quite effective.
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