According to all known laws of aviation, there is no way a bee should be able to fly. Its wings are too small to get its fat little body off the ground. The bee, of course, flies anyway because bees don't care what humans think is impossible.
It highly depends on the level of your characters and how you play things. One of the hardest dungeons I've ever played in my decades of D&D was a kobold warren. They are only challenge rating 1/8 and easy kills in the open, but they are known for constricted passageways, tons of traps, and ranged attacks from behind cover with overwhelming numbers, so even a mid level party can get wiped out if the kobolds are playing to their strengths.
Drow War Party. Back in the day they all had magic armor, magic weapons, spell resistance, natural spells, poison weapons...oh wait, they still kind of have that.
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"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
The hardest encounter I ever had was a vampire spawn with a party of 3 level 1 characters. We did not win. We barely made it out alive. 2 unconscious characters and 1 at half health, threw an NPC at it as foder, locked the door, and fled.
Older editions were more deadly than 5e, so I've lost multiple characters to Owlbears, oozes and slimes have kicked my butt and I've run like a coward from rust monsters, but in terms of boss fights the most memorable were the intelligent manipulators. The ones that prepare the battlefield with traps, spells, minions, etc. and dominate the barbarian on the first round. Vampire, mind flayer, and rakshasa make good choices. You can also use any of the PC races and give them a few more levels than the PCs.
As a DM the deadliest encounters I've run most recently were
1) Pack of 10 Goblins attacking a group of lvl 5 characters from range and altitude. Duck and cover tactics with their bows made the players really struggle to figure out how to gain advantage of the situation.
2) Pack of 7 Dust Mephits against a group of lvl 6 characters. The mephits would summon a new mephit just before death, effectively making it 14 in total. The breath attack, plus mobility, made them hard to hit and the area was confined so that mobility advantage was a huge problem.
As a player the deadliest encounter I had was a group of lvl 6 players who accidentally upset a Deva and their pet Golem.
As a rule, players have a lot more to help them win in the average combat all the way up to Deadly tier combats. The trick to make a combat memorable, and not a simple fight of attrition, is to implement more than just "Swing sword, cast spell".
Give the environment a thorough once over, terrain can really impede players and create dangers. The goblins had height advantage and terraces they could use to create cover. The Mephits had altitude and choke points to harass the group. I had a challenge that the players fell in love with, combat was an option, but the entire map they were on is what stood out: everything was trying to kill them. A lava flow was bearing down on them, there were fire giants tossing boulders at them, and a titan that was waking from his slumber. They loved it, I think they only rolled a dozen combat rolls the entire time, but it's one of the most memorable events the players had.
Secondly, monsters are just as afraid of death as the rest of us: Use their brains! Have them run, have them hide, have them use the world around them just like you would as a player. A goblin with a horn to announce enemies is more dangerous than a goblin with a short sword. A kobold using a net trap in a narrow hallway is more dangerous than 3 of his buddies poking at you with spears. That beholder may have his eyes on you, but those eyes are no match to a trio of basilisks being lead by a Medusa in a ruins where the basilisks have tunnels to sneak up on the players.
In a flat room with no obstacles and full resources, the player should win almost every time. Toss in a few elements that the players can't control, the tide changes quickly.
The deadliest single threat I have faced as a player was in a Pathfinder game. The DM had a dragon riding shadow knight / necromancer, who rode a young black dragon. We had some pretty powerful stuff at our disposal for the level we were at, 6 party members, and several NPCs helping out.
We ended up bringing the dragon to 0, but then the rider used a spell to revive the dragon and bring it back up in health, and it retreated. I bet there is a lot the DM plans to do with this in the future (since we havent been able to play that campaign much), but the idea of a rider that benefits a dragon (and vice versa) is something that I think was really cool.
Honestly though DND is flexible enough you can make just about anything a fun bossfight. Imagine an Owlbear or something so powerful it was a CR 20. Or a Beholder. Or a literal army of beefed up Drow or Kobolds with special powers. Really just whatever you put your mind to.
Oh and lets not forget the legend of Y'gathok, the ceaseless hunger.
In a Dark Sun campaign. The first random encounter in our desert journey was 2d20 giant lizards. The DM rolled 20 and they chewed through our party like a buzz saw. My Half Giant Gladiator never saw round 3.
Another hard encounter was in a more normal campaign. Just a mid level cleric with a couple lackeys. It was then that our party realized the goodness that is Spirit Guardians. If the evil cleric can get behind a couple of meat shields for long enough he can really ruin a PC's day. Once they do get through then just Word of Recall and live to plague the party another day.
Kobolds. 200 kobolds. They needed a nat 20 to hit so the DM just figured 10 javelins hit us each round. We had recently taken out a 1st edition ancient red dragon in 3 rounds so we were a little over confident and our DM thought we needed to have a lesson in humility.
our DM decided it would be fun to sick an abominable Yeti and regular Yeti on us when our party was full of level 2's and 3's, does that count as a hard fight? it was pure luck that our paladin was a silver dragonborn who was taking half damage from the breath attack but if it wasn't for the fact that our DM conveniently forgot that if you take damage equal to double you're life total you get insta-killed our lvl 2 rogue would no longer be around. there may have been 7 of us but no one but me had magic items which was a bracers of archery.
Borrow from the past. A mirror of opposition creates duplicates of those witnessing its terrible glory, they are violently opposed to their original copies and will attempt to kill them. The argument is that nothing is as dangerous to the players as themselves.
Black Dragon possessed by a custom undead against a level 6 party. We managed to spring a trap and hold the black dragon in a magic circle but as soon as we killed the Black Dragon, things went sour. The Sorcerer in our party had an unknown backstory and didn't bother to tell us she was married to the black dragon's human form pre-possession. So as soon as he died, the DM had her role a wisdom save and she ended up going insane and turning against us. At this moment, the custom ghost rose from the body as well and summoned a Chain Devil. We thought the black dragon was the real boss battle....we were wrong lol. The only reason we survived is because my lizardfolk Druid "grappled" with the semi corporeal form of the custom undead while using enhance ability on himself to have advantage on the possession saving throws. Combine that with our Fighter secretly having taken a level of Paladin in our last level up and was able to smite the Chain Devil and we barely managed to survive.
The Epic Level Handbook had creatures called devastation vermin. Specifically, the devastation beetle. It's a ludicrously overtuned monster that nearly caused a TPK within its first turn.
Wasnt that one of the 'cant fly cant hurt you' and has the bumf text about laying waste to a 200 mile area territory? I remember a discussion about that being easy to hunt as it marks its territory and can be seen from way way up high. The equivalent of the 5th ed Tarrasque, deadly, unless your hunting it rather than it hunting you.
Just had an encounter finish with a group being torn apart by a pack of skulks (MToF) Those little devils are horrible unless you can guess the area and throw an AoE down. The threat represented by them is harshly escalated by numbers or having them waiting for a party to rest / follow them and attack the back ranks when they are engaged with another hostile.
I just needed some ideas for what kind of monsters i could put in my campeign as final bosses. Any ideas?
It highly depends on the level of your characters and how you play things. One of the hardest dungeons I've ever played in my decades of D&D was a kobold warren. They are only challenge rating 1/8 and easy kills in the open, but they are known for constricted passageways, tons of traps, and ranged attacks from behind cover with overwhelming numbers, so even a mid level party can get wiped out if the kobolds are playing to their strengths.
Drow War Party. Back in the day they all had magic armor, magic weapons, spell resistance, natural spells, poison weapons...oh wait, they still kind of have that.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
The hardest encounter I ever had was a vampire spawn with a party of 3 level 1 characters. We did not win. We barely made it out alive. 2 unconscious characters and 1 at half health, threw an NPC at it as foder, locked the door, and fled.
Older editions were more deadly than 5e, so I've lost multiple characters to Owlbears, oozes and slimes have kicked my butt and I've run like a coward from rust monsters, but in terms of boss fights the most memorable were the intelligent manipulators. The ones that prepare the battlefield with traps, spells, minions, etc. and dominate the barbarian on the first round. Vampire, mind flayer, and rakshasa make good choices. You can also use any of the PC races and give them a few more levels than the PCs.
Beholder hands down. Their anti-magic ray combined with their minions and a lair full of well planned ambush points makes them brutal!
Professional computer geek
As a DM the deadliest encounters I've run most recently were
1) Pack of 10 Goblins attacking a group of lvl 5 characters from range and altitude. Duck and cover tactics with their bows made the players really struggle to figure out how to gain advantage of the situation.
2) Pack of 7 Dust Mephits against a group of lvl 6 characters. The mephits would summon a new mephit just before death, effectively making it 14 in total. The breath attack, plus mobility, made them hard to hit and the area was confined so that mobility advantage was a huge problem.
As a player the deadliest encounter I had was a group of lvl 6 players who accidentally upset a Deva and their pet Golem.
As a rule, players have a lot more to help them win in the average combat all the way up to Deadly tier combats. The trick to make a combat memorable, and not a simple fight of attrition, is to implement more than just "Swing sword, cast spell".
Give the environment a thorough once over, terrain can really impede players and create dangers. The goblins had height advantage and terraces they could use to create cover. The Mephits had altitude and choke points to harass the group. I had a challenge that the players fell in love with, combat was an option, but the entire map they were on is what stood out: everything was trying to kill them. A lava flow was bearing down on them, there were fire giants tossing boulders at them, and a titan that was waking from his slumber. They loved it, I think they only rolled a dozen combat rolls the entire time, but it's one of the most memorable events the players had.
Secondly, monsters are just as afraid of death as the rest of us: Use their brains! Have them run, have them hide, have them use the world around them just like you would as a player. A goblin with a horn to announce enemies is more dangerous than a goblin with a short sword. A kobold using a net trap in a narrow hallway is more dangerous than 3 of his buddies poking at you with spears. That beholder may have his eyes on you, but those eyes are no match to a trio of basilisks being lead by a Medusa in a ruins where the basilisks have tunnels to sneak up on the players.
In a flat room with no obstacles and full resources, the player should win almost every time. Toss in a few elements that the players can't control, the tide changes quickly.
The deadliest single threat I have faced as a player was in a Pathfinder game. The DM had a dragon riding shadow knight / necromancer, who rode a young black dragon. We had some pretty powerful stuff at our disposal for the level we were at, 6 party members, and several NPCs helping out.
We ended up bringing the dragon to 0, but then the rider used a spell to revive the dragon and bring it back up in health, and it retreated. I bet there is a lot the DM plans to do with this in the future (since we havent been able to play that campaign much), but the idea of a rider that benefits a dragon (and vice versa) is something that I think was really cool.
Honestly though DND is flexible enough you can make just about anything a fun bossfight. Imagine an Owlbear or something so powerful it was a CR 20. Or a Beholder. Or a literal army of beefed up Drow or Kobolds with special powers. Really just whatever you put your mind to.
Oh and lets not forget the legend of Y'gathok, the ceaseless hunger.
Atropol, in an epic level campaign. Our party of 23rd level characters had to retreat, and we barely escaped alive.
DICE FALL, EVERYONE ROCKS!
In a Dark Sun campaign. The first random encounter in our desert journey was 2d20 giant lizards. The DM rolled 20 and they chewed through our party like a buzz saw. My Half Giant Gladiator never saw round 3.
Another hard encounter was in a more normal campaign. Just a mid level cleric with a couple lackeys. It was then that our party realized the goodness that is Spirit Guardians. If the evil cleric can get behind a couple of meat shields for long enough he can really ruin a PC's day. Once they do get through then just Word of Recall and live to plague the party another day.
Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
Kobolds. 200 kobolds. They needed a nat 20 to hit so the DM just figured 10 javelins hit us each round. We had recently taken out a 1st edition ancient red dragon in 3 rounds so we were a little over confident and our DM thought we needed to have a lesson in humility.
our DM decided it would be fun to sick an abominable Yeti and regular Yeti on us when our party was full of level 2's and 3's, does that count as a hard fight? it was pure luck that our paladin was a silver dragonborn who was taking half damage from the breath attack but if it wasn't for the fact that our DM conveniently forgot that if you take damage equal to double you're life total you get insta-killed our lvl 2 rogue would no longer be around. there may have been 7 of us but no one but me had magic items which was a bracers of archery.
isn't the level cap 20?
In 5E, yes. This was in 3.5E epic level game.
DICE FALL, EVERYONE ROCKS!
Borrow from the past. A mirror of opposition creates duplicates of those witnessing its terrible glory, they are violently opposed to their original copies and will attempt to kill them. The argument is that nothing is as dangerous to the players as themselves.
Black Dragon possessed by a custom undead against a level 6 party. We managed to spring a trap and hold the black dragon in a magic circle but as soon as we killed the Black Dragon, things went sour. The Sorcerer in our party had an unknown backstory and didn't bother to tell us she was married to the black dragon's human form pre-possession. So as soon as he died, the DM had her role a wisdom save and she ended up going insane and turning against us. At this moment, the custom ghost rose from the body as well and summoned a Chain Devil. We thought the black dragon was the real boss battle....we were wrong lol. The only reason we survived is because my lizardfolk Druid "grappled" with the semi corporeal form of the custom undead while using enhance ability on himself to have advantage on the possession saving throws. Combine that with our Fighter secretly having taken a level of Paladin in our last level up and was able to smite the Chain Devil and we barely managed to survive.
Daaaamn that sounds awesome! I hope it was fun as fun to play as I can imagine it!
The Epic Level Handbook had creatures called devastation vermin. Specifically, the devastation beetle. It's a ludicrously overtuned monster that nearly caused a TPK within its first turn.
We ran.
"The Epic Level Handbook wasn't that bad, guys.
Guys, pls."
Wasnt that one of the 'cant fly cant hurt you' and has the bumf text about laying waste to a 200 mile area territory? I remember a discussion about that being easy to hunt as it marks its territory and can be seen from way way up high. The equivalent of the 5th ed Tarrasque, deadly, unless your hunting it rather than it hunting you.
Just had an encounter finish with a group being torn apart by a pack of skulks (MToF) Those little devils are horrible unless you can guess the area and throw an AoE down. The threat represented by them is harshly escalated by numbers or having them waiting for a party to rest / follow them and attack the back ranks when they are engaged with another hostile.