They didn't remove the restriction on knocking foes prone, they just worded it better so you don't have to go look up the shoving rules but ignore half of it. The new version specifies the target is pushed back 5 feet if they fail the save.
Apparently the jury is still out on this one. I'm seeing people interpreting "...you push it up to 5 feet away from you." as including pushing them straight down into the dirt at your feet. The fact that they removed the explicit prohibition against shoving someone prone seems to open this up to uncertainty.
"up to 5 feet away from you" means 0-5 feet away from you. "Away from you" and "down" are only the same thing if you're directly above someone, and no rule says being pushed towards the floor knocks you prone any more than being pushed against a wall causes damage.
Jeremy already said on Dragon+ that change was just editing. He explicitly said it's bad form to ask the reader to look up the shoving rules but ignore half of it, so instead of doing that he just listed how it works directly in the ability.
Here's the link to the Dragon+ episode I was talking about. The discussion on minotaurs starts about halfway through the video. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/261767858
I started a centaur, ranger, gloom stalker and found a few things I was concerned about. Some are rules exploits some are just things that don't feel right.
In no particular order:
1. Centaur climb (1 ' costs 4' more) and the feat athletics (climb doesn't cost extra movement)
- seems a little unbelievable considering the 40' base movement. Sidenote; gloomstalker's "rope use" spell... what can that be used for?
2. I took defensive as a fighting style, which made me think... centaur scale mail for example... is it the same weight and cost as regular stuff?
3.can centaur charge racial ability work with charger feat? Is the damage (2 x dice) + 5 + modifiers
4. (Gloomstalker) Disguise self... it says limbs anatomy etc gotta match. Can a centaur merely disguise as other centaur or can they cover a few quadropeds like deer moose horse etc. Is that benefit or limitation appropriate?
5. Lance (mounted) as a weapon seems like it would fit with this race... I realize there was an earlier RAW point but it seems weird especially considering it is not a heavy weapon and would not get the heavy benefit from great weapon master
- when do you use hooves? If you use hooves do you get a disadvantage from the lance you are holding or a missle weapon for that matter.
Mostly I like the centaur but I think a few wrinkles could be ironed out
In the original Waterborne Minotaur, it was stated that they were purposely made to not be a copy of the Goliath. Now, they're a copy of the Goliath, just with horns.
I'm definitely interested by both races, and want both to be official. Maybe just alter the minotaur to make it more unique, but hopefully they become offcial.
Apparently the jury is still out on this one. I'm seeing people interpreting "...you push it up to 5 feet away from you." as including pushing them straight down into the dirt at your feet. The fact that they removed the explicit prohibition against shoving someone prone seems to open this up to uncertainty.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
"up to 5 feet away from you" means 0-5 feet away from you. "Away from you" and "down" are only the same thing if you're directly above someone, and no rule says being pushed towards the floor knocks you prone any more than being pushed against a wall causes damage.
Jeremy already said on Dragon+ that change was just editing. He explicitly said it's bad form to ask the reader to look up the shoving rules but ignore half of it, so instead of doing that he just listed how it works directly in the ability.
Fair enough. Your position on the matter is pretty clear. Thanks for your insight.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Here's the link to the Dragon+ episode I was talking about. The discussion on minotaurs starts about halfway through the video. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/261767858
Here's an old tweet addressing what "away from you" means: "Vertical is only away if the creature is on top of you."
I started a centaur, ranger, gloom stalker and found a few things I was concerned about. Some are rules exploits some are just things that don't feel right.
In no particular order:
1. Centaur climb (1 ' costs 4' more) and the feat athletics (climb doesn't cost extra movement)
- seems a little unbelievable considering the 40' base movement. Sidenote; gloomstalker's "rope use" spell... what can that be used for?
2. I took defensive as a fighting style, which made me think... centaur scale mail for example... is it the same weight and cost as regular stuff?
3.can centaur charge racial ability work with charger feat? Is the damage (2 x dice) + 5 + modifiers
4. (Gloomstalker) Disguise self... it says limbs anatomy etc gotta match. Can a centaur merely disguise as other centaur or can they cover a few quadropeds like deer moose horse etc. Is that benefit or limitation appropriate?
5. Lance (mounted) as a weapon seems like it would fit with this race... I realize there was an earlier RAW point but it seems weird especially considering it is not a heavy weapon and would not get the heavy benefit from great weapon master
- when do you use hooves? If you use hooves do you get a disadvantage from the lance you are holding or a missle weapon for that matter.
Mostly I like the centaur but I think a few wrinkles could be ironed out
Jesus Saves!... Everyone else takes damage.
K I homebrewed a feat : Athlete, Centaur
Same as athlete but substitute climbing movement benefit for;
Works for me!
Jesus Saves!... Everyone else takes damage.
In the original Waterborne Minotaur, it was stated that they were purposely made to not be a copy of the Goliath. Now, they're a copy of the Goliath, just with horns.
I'm definitely interested by both races, and want both to be official. Maybe just alter the minotaur to make it more unique, but hopefully they become offcial.
Pico De Lolobardo; Aarakocra bard.
Tyto is family of owls like the Barn Owl.
Fair, but what if a Minotaur uses some of their move action to jump straight up, and head-butts downwards on the way back down?
(Not actually arguing by the way, just wanted to share an amusing mental image.)