No one has really missed or forgotten any of that. Its just that personal experience has shown that such things have issues and complications.
1) A lot of that utility starts going away at higher levels. Sure, you can trip enemies, but at level 4 or so, we start seeing the paladins, fighters and barbarians with Shield Mastery tripping as well, plus doing more damage. We see rogues climbing just as fast as a spider, if not faster, then landing sneak attacks. We see wizards falling back onto tier 3 and higher spells that require Concentration, and not buffing teammates; those level 3 spell slots are important for things like fireballs, counters, and fly spells, so even Dragon's Breath won't scale well.
2) An... interesting tactic, though limiting in that you're using up a Wild Shape, quite likely losing both it, and any Concentration spell you might have, at this point. Is it worth taking the subclass just for a bit of tanking ability?
3) I wouldn't call it powerful as much as a necessity. It also limits the above and below points you try to make here - either you save the slots for healing, or you cast spells. You cannot do both.
4) And this is... problematic on a few levels. As I noted above in 2), your Entangle and Faerie Fire are Concentration spells, and very likely to be lost if you go into combat with Wild Shape while they're up. More importantly, however, I feel compelled to point out that most people aren't power gamers or combat munchkins. They're not going to sit back and pick out the most optimal combat option - the majority of people who play Moon Druid are doing so because they want to be a shapeshifting beast who wades into combat. There's just something about being a werewolf (or weretiger, or whatever) that's appealing as a character. That's the important thing to a lot of people, and telling them that you should play as a spell caster when its not what they want to do is counter productive. Hanging back and Concentrating is not what many people signed up for.
I mean, the Moon Druid is pretty much designed to NOT function as a spell caster at the same time as a shapeshifted beast. Thanks to the so-called CoDzilla of 3e, great steps were taken to limit "sorcery" class melee ability so they didn't outshine Fighters or other "sword" classes. That's why we only have two shifts per short rest, and why we have spell slot-based regeneration. So that you don't just shift out, then shift back to replenish all your HP at whim, and you can't function as both a caster and front line warrior at the same time. Trying to play both ends up with the Wild Shape suffering, just becoming a "back up" in favor of other things.
EDIT - that last bit, well the entire thing, is mostly my experiences. Your mileage may vary.
Well when a druid get focus fire at because its the scary easy to hit target your form will drop in 2 rounds. Get Gud m8? IDK, but there's things that can help prevent this (burning spells lots for d8 heals, other party healers, the fact that these are basically temp HP, other players in your party doing things in combat). but if your DM has seen your character being OP, maybe that's the reason he's targeting you? IDK, all games are different but this is not a problem I've encountered Well you can rest every fight no because alot of time ... well time matters. If you're not getting short rests talk to your DM, or just start taking more short rests? They're part of the game. Lots of classes suck if people ignore short rests. The game would also suck if you ignored advantage rules, or action types or other elements of the game that are important for balance. Well you are still Denied of important essential half of your class. that is the spell caster Until level 18. that means if you ever want to ever cast a class need to de-change and spent a use. if you want to just enter a small space or to reconasanse you have to expend one use. of only 2 uses, This feels like complaining that when a paladin uses their spell slots for smites, they not longer have the spell slot available to cast a spell, so we should give them more spell slots. Again, YMMV, but there's nothing inherently imbalanced about the number of Wild Shapes. And you're not "denied" it, you just do different things at different times. Cast spells before combat and maintain your concentration. Hell, if you're a moon druid, you can cast the spell and wild shape on the same turn.
Its just unreasonable to get a Huge power up from only 2 the entirety of an adventure and get 30. I have played in a high intense game. the druid get dropped alot. I played tome of annihilation the druid was the first to die *though part of it because of multiple shitty rolls* . I played in an epic campaign as a druid even after level 20 they died and got brought back by a spell . So you're saying a druid with unlimited wild shapes got killed, and this is proof that druids need more wild shapes? Also, you're saying that a character died in ToA, and this is proof of something other than ToA being an extremely difficult module design.
Personally, I do find that Wild Shape for the Moon Druid is rather stunted, but that's more of a function of crappy animal form options in the MM than anything else. For example - bears are pretty much the only official Beast option that gives you more than one attack naturally for most of your adventuring career. So, for the majority of your shapeshifting career, you'll be some variation of bear. Pretty much anything else is an open invitation to be ignored. Bears are awesome at low levels, admittedly, but by level 4, they're only middling, and behind the curve everywhere else. And they're the best option until you get elemental forms. And the elemental forms are the best shape until -maybe- level 18 or so. That's a long time with your primary style of play not growing in ability. This is a valid point if you're trying to be a damage dealer. However, that's only one aspect of the Wild Shape's combat abilities. Several creatures are able to induce status effects (grappled, bound, etc) which help control combat, many flight which can change the scope of combat(when you gain access to them), and all of them come with a HUGE pool of temp HP to add to the party total. Each table is different, but there's a point to be made that a Druid wild shaping into a Giant Toad is harder to take down than any other character of Equal Level during Tier One because they're SUCH a huge sack of HP (the Druid would have 62 HP plus their Con mod X4 at level 4, on average).
Short rest recharge classes / subclasses are VERY dependent upon the GM. Warlock, the Monk, the Moon Druid, various Fighters... they all play vastly different if you cannot count on having short rests. As such, you'll have different experiences depending on the table. Which is very annoying - I would certainly never recommend the moon druid at my game! Its simply a terrible, terrible option. This seems like something to be established at Session 0. If you're playing "theater of the mind" style combat, Monks stop being fun because mobility is such a huge part of their combat presence. If you can't count on 2+ short rests/day then many classes suddenly start to suck. You can always try to take a short rest, but there might be risks involved. If your DM hates short rests for some reason, this needs to be addressed. But, like I said above, short rests are supposed to be a part of the game. The DMG ( laid out in DMG 267-268) gives "fast play" Short/Long rest options if you feel that taking an hour doesn't make sense. These rules exist for people who want an heroic/action packed adventuring day but also don't want to completely take a dump on short rest dependent classes.
TL;DR- If you're not taking short rests, you're not playing the same game that WotC intended you to play, and its your own fault if the game suffers.
4) More importantly, however, I feel compelled to point out that most people aren't power gamers or combat munchkins. They're not going to sit back and pick out the most optimal combat option - the majority of people who play Moon Druid are doing so because they want to be a shapeshifting beast who wades into combat. There's just something about being a werewolf (or weretiger, or whatever) that's appealing as a character. That's the important thing to a lot of people, and telling them that you should play as a spell caster when its not what they want to do is counter productive. Hanging back and Concentrating is not what many people signed up for.
So why is the path of least resistance to beat the moon druid into something it isn't through homerules instead of figuring out a way to play a werewolf?
This is a valid point if you're trying to be a damage dealer. However, that's only one aspect of the Wild Shape's combat abilities. Several creatures are able to induce status effects (grappled, bound, etc) which help control combat, many flight which can change the scope of combat(when you gain access to them), and all of them come with a HUGE pool of temp HP to add to the party total. Each table is different, but there's a point to be made that a Druid wild shaping into a Giant Toad is harder to take down than any other character of Equal Level during Tier One because they're SUCH a huge sack of HP (the Druid would have 62 HP plus their Con mod X4 at level 4, on average).
There are some animals with the Charge features, admittedly, and I've personally found them too difficult to use in combat (having to run 20+ feet to attack per turn is a troublesome ability, imho) so I tend to forget about it. And I don't believe Wild Shape takes into account your proficency, keeping the Save DCs on the low side for most of these forms. So I suppose these are possibilities, but ones that really don't scale well in the long term, I've found. I guess this is another YMMV.
This seems like something to be established at Session 0. If you're playing "theater of the mind" style combat, Monks stop being fun because mobility is such a huge part of their combat presence. If you can't count on 2+ short rests/day then many classes suddenly start to suck. You can always try to take a short rest, but there might be risks involved. If your DM hates short rests for some reason, this needs to be addressed. But, like I said above, short rests are supposed to be a part of the game. The DMG ( laid out in DMG 267-268) gives "fast play" Short/Long rest options if you feel that taking an hour doesn't make sense. These rules exist for people who want an heroic/action packed adventuring day but also don't want to completely take a dump on short rest dependent classes.
Ish? The DM shouldn't have to sit down and plot out when rests happen, they're just involved in writing an interesting story. Its not like you have to "hate" short rests here to have issues - like, take a look at the front page, where one of the writers talks about Labrynths versus Gauntlets, and mixing them. A gauntlet-style dungeon is going to naturally be combat heavy, not necessarily with chances to rest, simply by nature of the story. Or we're in a sustained story. Meanwhile, if the DM comes up with a series of Gladatorial games (something I've seen more than once), then you'll likely get lots of short rests in succession.
This isn't a question of deciding that there's not going to be short rests, but just going with how stories work out. Even published, official WotC adventures. Heck, Lost Mines, the very first series of encounters against the goblins? There's up to nine encounters in that first cave alone. Stopping for short rests in the caves every two fights is very likely a bit much, so the pacing is a bit staggered, depending if you can make a safe spot or not.
So why is the path of least resistance to beat the moon druid into something it isn't through homerules instead of figuring out a way to play a werewolf?
Not quite following what you're saying here. This sentence doesn't make sense to me.
This seems like something to be established at Session 0. If you're playing "theater of the mind" style combat, Monks stop being fun because mobility is such a huge part of their combat presence. If you can't count on 2+ short rests/day then many classes suddenly start to suck. You can always try to take a short rest, but there might be risks involved. If your DM hates short rests for some reason, this needs to be addressed. But, like I said above, short rests are supposed to be a part of the game. The DMG ( laid out in DMG 267-268) gives "fast play" Short/Long rest options if you feel that taking an hour doesn't make sense. These rules exist for people who want an heroic/action packed adventuring day but also don't want to completely take a dump on short rest dependent classes.
Ish? The DM shouldn't have to sit down and plot out when rests happen, they're just involved in writing an interesting story. Its not like you have to "hate" short rests here to have issues - like, take a look at the front page, where one of the writers talks about Labrynths versus Gauntlets, and mixing them. A gauntlet-style dungeon is going to naturally be combat heavy, not necessarily with chances to rest, simply by nature of the story. Or we're in a sustained story. Meanwhile, if the DM comes up with a series of Gladatorial games (something I've seen more than once), then you'll likely get lots of short rests in succession.
This isn't a question of deciding that there's not going to be short rests, but just going with how stories work out. Even published, official WotC adventures. Heck, Lost Mines, the very first series of encounters against the goblins? There's up to nine encounters in that first cave alone. Stopping for short rests in the caves every two fights is very likely a bit much, so the pacing is a bit staggered, depending if you can make a safe spot or not. Part of being a DM is making sure the players are having fun. Part of having fun in a class is being able to use its features properly. Part of many classes (like the ones you mentioned in an early post) being able to be used properly is having access to short rests. At the same time, there are story situations where resource deprivation is part of what heightens drama/excitement. But as a DM, you're the one setting the pace of things. During our session 0, our DM established his preferred pace of play (2ish short rests and a long rest per day, with exceptions. Retreat should always be considered if you encounter overwhelming odds).
If I had a Moon druid player who was unhappy with his class, but who was never taking short rests, my first suggestion would be "Tell everyone in the party to chill out and slow things down" not "We need to home rule this thing". "Guys, if you want me to be able to turn into a tank-frog again next time those goblins come at us, set up a defensive perimeter while I recover. I can provide spell support for now, but I'm spent until the spirits regain their focus". Maybe this works? Maybe it doesn't depending on the story but that's what you'd have to do to get the most out of the class.
Druids aren't as good without short rests. This isn't a bug, it's a feature. It's also not a flaw, it's a balance choice. Do what you want at your table, but there's nothing inherently flawed in the numbers available for the druid. Most of the complaints in this thread just seem like someone trying to play a druid like a cleric, which is like playing a warlock like a wizard. You're going to be pissed and feel under powered because you're using your tools improperly.
So why is the path of least resistance to beat the moon druid into something it isn't through homerules instead of figuring out a way to play a werewolf?
Not quite following what you're saying here. This sentence doesn't make sense to me. If you(a random player, not you specifically) want to play a werewolf, why aren't you just playing a werewolf? Why are you trying to make a druid, which isn't a werewolf, something you feel more closely resembles the spirit of a werewolf? Work on homebrewing a class that's solely about shapechanging, or play as a monster who's able to gain character levels if you want to play that way. Just get rid of all the druid spell casting entirely in exchange for broader morphing and more morphs per *interval of your choice*
No one has really missed or forgotten any of that. Its just that personal experience has shown that such things have issues and complications.
1) A lot of that utility starts going away at higher levels. Sure, you can trip enemies, but at level 4 or so, we start seeing the paladins, fighters and barbarians with Shield Mastery tripping as well, plus doing more damage. We see rogues climbing just as fast as a spider, if not faster, then landing sneak attacks. We see wizards falling back onto tier 3 and higher spells that require Concentration, and not buffing teammates; those level 3 spell slots are important for things like fireballs, counters, and fly spells, so even Dragon's Breath won't scale well.
Fair enough. Much of the utility starts to drop off or become redundant for higher CR beasts. I haven't played at these levels yet so I can't speak to party synergy, either. I've always expected that at higher levels I would be spending more time in caster form and being very selective about when to jump into wild-shape.
2) An... interesting tactic, though limiting in that you're using up a Wild Shape, quite likely losing both it, and any Concentration spell you might have, at this point. Is it worth taking the subclass just for a bit of tanking ability?
How is it wasted? Once I've gone into wild-shape, I do wild shape things. Also Concentration is an issue for any caster class that has a melee oriented subclass. Moon druids have it nice in the sense that we only have a single stat that we really need to keep high in order to be effective which leaves us free to take feats like [feat] warcaster [/feat] and [feat] resilience [/resilience]. Granted the nature of wild-shape makes one or both of these feats almost a necessity (It would have been nice if wild-shape gave some sort of concentration boost), but we're pretty free to pick them up.
3) I wouldn't call it powerful as much as a necessity. It also limits the above and below points you try to make here - either you save the slots for healing, or you cast spells. You cannot do both.
I'm not sure how it limits you. It gives you the option of survivability over damage, which is sometimes all you need so that other members of your party can utilize their resources to burn down the enemy rather than utilize their resources to try and keep another PC alive.
4) And this is... problematic on a few levels. As I noted above in 2), your Entangle and Faerie Fire are Concentration spells, and very likely to be lost if you go into combat with Wild Shape while they're up. More importantly, however, I feel compelled to point out that most people aren't power gamers or combat munchkins. They're not going to sit back and pick out the most optimal combat option - the majority of people who play Moon Druid are doing so because they want to be a shapeshifting beast who wades into combat. There's just something about being a werewolf (or weretiger, or whatever) that's appealing as a character. That's the important thing to a lot of people, and telling them that you should play as a spell caster when its not what they want to do is counter productive. Hanging back and Concentrating is not what many people signed up for.
I mean, the Moon Druid is pretty much designed to NOT function as a spell caster at the same time as a shapeshifted beast. Thanks to the so-called CoDzilla of 3e, great steps were taken to limit "sorcery" class melee ability so they didn't outshine Fighters or other "sword" classes. That's why we only have two shifts per short rest, and why we have spell slot-based regeneration. So that you don't just shift out, then shift back to replenish all your HP at whim, and you can't function as both a caster and front line warrior at the same time. Trying to play both ends up with the Wild Shape suffering, just becoming a "back up" in favor of other things.
EDIT - that last bit, well the entire thing, is mostly my experiences. Your mileage may vary.
So yeah this. I'm with CBMoate here. This style of play seems to be an unreasonable expectation of the class. Moon druids get full spell progression. The idea that these spells weren't integral to the class seems naive. It sounds like these an lycanthropic fighter is what you're looking for. Not a class that is primarily a caster with some interesting melee capabilities.
When I first decided to pick up the class I did so because I saw the best all rounder in the game. If a rogue were to go scouting, I'd be there with him. Maybe not as good as him, but he wouldn't be alone. If my party needed to nuke the heck out of a horde of goblins, I can help out there. Maybe not as good as the wizard or the sorcerer, but I'd be helping. If we got into a pinch and needed another tank, I could do that. If things went south and our healer goes down I can pop off a spell and get him back up doing what he's supposed to do.
Now I do think there could be a couple improvements. As I said before, I wouldn't mind one more wild shape per short rest at higher levels (at or around the time we get access to elemental shapes), but I don't think it's a necessary. I also agree with you that it would be nice if the developers of the game remembered that moon druids get a fair amount of class features from monster manuals. That said I don't feel like the class needs a major overhaul, and while it could be improved a bit, the class and subclass as a whole are pretty fun to play with the right mindset.
Only the amount of time in wildshape increase with the level. Consider that wildshape gives you a boost of hit points, physical stats and other skills, allowing the druid to deal with a great number of situations. Moreover the druid is primarily a spellcasting class. IN my opinion, the wildshape it is fine as it is.
So I recognize this is homebrew but my DM and I figured out a system to help with the Wild Shape system because as it currently sits the Moon Druid in particular may be reluctant to use a wild shape for more utility purposes because he/she is having to save those more for combat. Works like this:
You can change forms and even revert to human form within the same WildShape casting with the following limitations:
1- Holding the WildShape magic while reverting to human form requires concentration. If you revert to human form due to taking damage over the HP of the wild shape form, concentration is automatically lost and the wild shape magic is spent.
2- Shifting form or reverting to human forms costs 1 hr of Wild Shape time.
3- Damage carries over to the next non-human form. Example- you (moon druid) wild shape into a Giant Eagle (26 HP) to scout in the air above an enemy fortress and take a crossbow bolt to the wing for 12 damage. You then fly away back to your party and revert to human form to give them a description of the fotress but hold onto the wild shape energy. Your party is going to attack the weaker of the 2 gates while your allied army attacks the main gate as a distraction. You use your remaining Wild Shape time to change into a Sabre-Tooth Tiger for the assault. Normally a Sabre-Tooth Tiger starts with 52 HP but you will start with 40 HP because the damage from the Giant Eagle carries over in the same usage of wild shape.
So for example at Level 4 with 2 hrs of Wild Shape time, you could turn into a spider to crawl under a barred door, revert back to human form and open the door while holding shape and then turn into a Brown Bear for the actual attack once your party is past the barred door.
Fog Cloud instead of darkness can be useful because no one who doesn’t have blind sense can see through fog cloud. Many warlock’s can see through darkness.
Regarding the challenge communicating with the rest of the party while the druid is wildshaped, I have two main thoughts:
One, that challenge provides a great roleplaying opportunity that I think should be embraced. Figure out how to communicate non-verbally (IC; obviously you'd verbally describe your actions OOC). For example, in a past game my druid was maintaining his lion wildshape after a skirmish when we encountered a sphinx (ironically). She asked us the classic sphinx riddle, which I knew the answer to but I couldn't say it, what with being a lion and all. So I used my claw to scratch M-A-N into the dirt.
Two, if what you're trying to communicate absolutely cannot be communicated non-verbally, then one of the other casters in the party (assuming you have more than one) can cast sending on you; it's a two-way message, so you can use that to impart your information, which the caster can then share with the rest of the party. It's up to you/your party to decide whether it's better to "waste" a wildshape reverting to human form and just normally talking, or have the caster "waste" a spell slot so you can maintain your form.
Fog Cloud instead of darkness can be useful because no one who doesn’t have blind sense can see through fog cloud. Many warlock’s can see through darkness.
Blindsight allows you to see through normal darkness and fog cloud.
Blindsense (14th level rogue feature) just gives you location. It doesn’t give you sight so you would still have disadvantage for unseen target.
Rangers eventually get Feral Senses, which allow them to hit invisible targets without disadvantage. It’s largely overlooked, however, as, apparently, no one ever levels a Ranger up to 18.
My char died in a campaign, pissed off. I decided to make a virtually unkillable character. I made a lizardman druid 4(Circle of the moon) barb 3(totem of the bear) and oh man. He is tough. Even with two uses of wild shape, the campaign I am in has a lot of travel time, so I get them back easily. I take all the punishment. I have more effective health than some dragons. It's terrifying how strong it is. The only problem is damage dealing. But with a wizard and a fighter, they got that covered. This gets even more terrifying when you remember, buffs. Wizard usually casts haste on me so I get even more defense and can attack more. Or I can do nasty stuff like grappling the enemy with 3 attempts and then shove and pin on the ground, letting people whale on it with advantage. If it where any more uses I would call it broken, at least in the game I play in.
We house rules the time increments as combat and non combat time.
You wildshape to creature A.
Non combat, any time youre not actively making any ability checks, combat checks, hunting, sneaking, ect, just hanging about doesn't count. You can freely shift in and out of form A, but the form is locked. If you need to swap to some other beast, that is form B.
Combat/active use time is tracked. If you want to hang about in your animal forms. Laze about the wagon, camp, city as a cat in the sun... All fine and dandy.
Also, if you're in wild shape, there's nothing that says you can't short rest to regain your used wildshape while in a previously cast form. You don't have to come out of your form to rest.
If you have a home base, base camp ect, your druid can create his own grove, we also allow the druid to wildshape freely what ever shape however many times in his own personal grove, another friendly druids grove, "Emerald Enclave" lands Or special awakened forest, jungle, ect areas that the dm allows he druid to visit in down time.
No need for special magic items that break game/class mechanics, when a dm can create areas with boons. Form alliances that provide your character with benefits. You won't always be there, but it's nice to have something special for your character without another attunement magic item.
I always thought a good feat for Wildshape would be to give a use back if the form is ended at its full maximum hit points. I’ve always wanted to play a shapeshifter class that could pop in and out of shapes on the fly for fun, and there really isn’t a way to achieve that without something home brewed.
I wonder if some of the problem is I how WE think of wildshape? It’s not really meant for combat at medium to high levels Although since most fights last only 3-5 rounds it’s usually survivable. I suspect (and have found with my Druid characters) that after a point somewhere between L5 &L8 they are better combatants in humAn form with their weapons and spells than they are as front line tanks in wildshape. Wildshape is much better used at medium to higher levels for the oft forgotten exploration/scouting arm. Being able to move around in the wilderness as a creature rather than a humanoid is going to give you lots more info on who and what is around you as well as keeping you on track and in the right direction. If you have to fight in wildshape you can but your missing the other half of your skill set (spells) and that should be your clue to switch back. Even in a dungeon or the underdark this holds true. Which would you prefer to have scouting ahead of you - a rogue with 60’ dark vision that everyone else out there will be able to see with their dark vision or a at flapping around at the top of the passages that everyone will ignore but whose sonar can tell you how many, where they are, how armed/armored and what pits and many types of traps might be present? At low levels wildshape is a useful combat move because no one has great AC and HP, as you progress your AC, HP and abilities should be progressing faster than the Wildshape creatures CRs and what you do with wildshape should be changing to suit. Keep in mind that yes it’s 2 wildshape per rest but you should be taking 2+rests each day before camping and taking your long rest so that is actually 6+ wildshape each day which should be plenty.
The versatility of wild shape is definitely its main feature and draw, but because it is a feature specific to the Druid class, there are few options to make a build around the shapeshifting itself. Druids are made to be somewhat jacks of all roles: Healing and support spells as well as offensive ones, ability to tank or be sneaky, etc. The closest you get to a shapeshifter focus is moon druid, which gives you higher CR ratings, but still relies on the spell caster part of the druid, both to buff your wild form, and use slots to heal in wild form. The class remains a full caster class with wild shape as a supporting feature rather than the star. I would like to someday see WotC create a class that centers on shapeshifting itself as the key ability. But as far as uses go, it is really dependent on the DM for how many short rests you can get, just as it would if you were a warlock.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
No one has really missed or forgotten any of that. Its just that personal experience has shown that such things have issues and complications.
1) A lot of that utility starts going away at higher levels. Sure, you can trip enemies, but at level 4 or so, we start seeing the paladins, fighters and barbarians with Shield Mastery tripping as well, plus doing more damage. We see rogues climbing just as fast as a spider, if not faster, then landing sneak attacks. We see wizards falling back onto tier 3 and higher spells that require Concentration, and not buffing teammates; those level 3 spell slots are important for things like fireballs, counters, and fly spells, so even Dragon's Breath won't scale well.
2) An... interesting tactic, though limiting in that you're using up a Wild Shape, quite likely losing both it, and any Concentration spell you might have, at this point. Is it worth taking the subclass just for a bit of tanking ability?
3) I wouldn't call it powerful as much as a necessity. It also limits the above and below points you try to make here - either you save the slots for healing, or you cast spells. You cannot do both.
4) And this is... problematic on a few levels. As I noted above in 2), your Entangle and Faerie Fire are Concentration spells, and very likely to be lost if you go into combat with Wild Shape while they're up. More importantly, however, I feel compelled to point out that most people aren't power gamers or combat munchkins. They're not going to sit back and pick out the most optimal combat option - the majority of people who play Moon Druid are doing so because they want to be a shapeshifting beast who wades into combat. There's just something about being a werewolf (or weretiger, or whatever) that's appealing as a character. That's the important thing to a lot of people, and telling them that you should play as a spell caster when its not what they want to do is counter productive. Hanging back and Concentrating is not what many people signed up for.
I mean, the Moon Druid is pretty much designed to NOT function as a spell caster at the same time as a shapeshifted beast. Thanks to the so-called CoDzilla of 3e, great steps were taken to limit "sorcery" class melee ability so they didn't outshine Fighters or other "sword" classes. That's why we only have two shifts per short rest, and why we have spell slot-based regeneration. So that you don't just shift out, then shift back to replenish all your HP at whim, and you can't function as both a caster and front line warrior at the same time. Trying to play both ends up with the Wild Shape suffering, just becoming a "back up" in favor of other things.
EDIT - that last bit, well the entire thing, is mostly my experiences. Your mileage may vary.
Bold Added
TL;DR- If you're not taking short rests, you're not playing the same game that WotC intended you to play, and its your own fault if the game suffers.
Fair enough. Much of the utility starts to drop off or become redundant for higher CR beasts. I haven't played at these levels yet so I can't speak to party synergy, either. I've always expected that at higher levels I would be spending more time in caster form and being very selective about when to jump into wild-shape.
How is it wasted? Once I've gone into wild-shape, I do wild shape things. Also Concentration is an issue for any caster class that has a melee oriented subclass. Moon druids have it nice in the sense that we only have a single stat that we really need to keep high in order to be effective which leaves us free to take feats like [feat] warcaster [/feat] and [feat] resilience [/resilience]. Granted the nature of wild-shape makes one or both of these feats almost a necessity (It would have been nice if wild-shape gave some sort of concentration boost), but we're pretty free to pick them up.
I'm not sure how it limits you. It gives you the option of survivability over damage, which is sometimes all you need so that other members of your party can utilize their resources to burn down the enemy rather than utilize their resources to try and keep another PC alive.
So I recognize this is homebrew but my DM and I figured out a system to help with the Wild Shape system because as it currently sits the Moon Druid in particular may be reluctant to use a wild shape for more utility purposes because he/she is having to save those more for combat. Works like this:
You can change forms and even revert to human form within the same WildShape casting with the following limitations:
1- Holding the WildShape magic while reverting to human form requires concentration. If you revert to human form due to taking damage over the HP of the wild shape form, concentration is automatically lost and the wild shape magic is spent.
2- Shifting form or reverting to human forms costs 1 hr of Wild Shape time.
3- Damage carries over to the next non-human form. Example- you (moon druid) wild shape into a Giant Eagle (26 HP) to scout in the air above an enemy fortress and take a crossbow bolt to the wing for 12 damage. You then fly away back to your party and revert to human form to give them a description of the fotress but hold onto the wild shape energy. Your party is going to attack the weaker of the 2 gates while your allied army attacks the main gate as a distraction. You use your remaining Wild Shape time to change into a Sabre-Tooth Tiger for the assault. Normally a Sabre-Tooth Tiger starts with 52 HP but you will start with 40 HP because the damage from the Giant Eagle carries over in the same usage of wild shape.
So for example at Level 4 with 2 hrs of Wild Shape time, you could turn into a spider to crawl under a barred door, revert back to human form and open the door while holding shape and then turn into a Brown Bear for the actual attack once your party is past the barred door.
Hope this helps.
Fog Cloud instead of darkness can be useful because no one who doesn’t have blind sense can see through fog cloud. Many warlock’s can see through darkness.
Professional computer geek
Regarding the challenge communicating with the rest of the party while the druid is wildshaped, I have two main thoughts:
One, that challenge provides a great roleplaying opportunity that I think should be embraced. Figure out how to communicate non-verbally (IC; obviously you'd verbally describe your actions OOC). For example, in a past game my druid was maintaining his lion wildshape after a skirmish when we encountered a sphinx (ironically). She asked us the classic sphinx riddle, which I knew the answer to but I couldn't say it, what with being a lion and all. So I used my claw to scratch M-A-N into the dirt.
Two, if what you're trying to communicate absolutely cannot be communicated non-verbally, then one of the other casters in the party (assuming you have more than one) can cast sending on you; it's a two-way message, so you can use that to impart your information, which the caster can then share with the rest of the party. It's up to you/your party to decide whether it's better to "waste" a wildshape reverting to human form and just normally talking, or have the caster "waste" a spell slot so you can maintain your form.
"We're the perfect combination of expendable and unkillable!"
Blindsight allows you to see through normal darkness and fog cloud.
Blindsense (14th level rogue feature) just gives you location. It doesn’t give you sight so you would still have disadvantage for unseen target.
Rangers eventually get Feral Senses, which allow them to hit invisible targets without disadvantage. It’s largely overlooked, however, as, apparently, no one ever levels a Ranger up to 18.
I can see your problem. But consider this;
My char died in a campaign, pissed off. I decided to make a virtually unkillable character. I made a lizardman druid 4(Circle of the moon) barb 3(totem of the bear) and oh man. He is tough. Even with two uses of wild shape, the campaign I am in has a lot of travel time, so I get them back easily. I take all the punishment. I have more effective health than some dragons. It's terrifying how strong it is. The only problem is damage dealing. But with a wizard and a fighter, they got that covered. This gets even more terrifying when you remember, buffs. Wizard usually casts haste on me so I get even more defense and can attack more. Or I can do nasty stuff like grappling the enemy with 3 attempts and then shove and pin on the ground, letting people whale on it with advantage. If it where any more uses I would call it broken, at least in the game I play in.
We house rules the time increments as combat and non combat time.
You wildshape to creature A.
Non combat, any time youre not actively making any ability checks, combat checks, hunting, sneaking, ect, just hanging about doesn't count. You can freely shift in and out of form A, but the form is locked. If you need to swap to some other beast, that is form B.
Combat/active use time is tracked. If you want to hang about in your animal forms. Laze about the wagon, camp, city as a cat in the sun... All fine and dandy.
Also, if you're in wild shape, there's nothing that says you can't short rest to regain your used wildshape while in a previously cast form. You don't have to come out of your form to rest.
If you have a home base, base camp ect, your druid can create his own grove, we also allow the druid to wildshape freely what ever shape however many times in his own personal grove, another friendly druids grove, "Emerald Enclave" lands Or special awakened forest, jungle, ect areas that the dm allows he druid to visit in down time.
No need for special magic items that break game/class mechanics, when a dm can create areas with boons. Form alliances that provide your character with benefits. You won't always be there, but it's nice to have something special for your character without another attunement magic item.
I always thought a good feat for Wildshape would be to give a use back if the form is ended at its full maximum hit points. I’ve always wanted to play a shapeshifter class that could pop in and out of shapes on the fly for fun, and there really isn’t a way to achieve that without something home brewed.
I wonder if some of the problem is I how WE think of wildshape? It’s not really meant for combat at medium to high levels Although since most fights last only 3-5 rounds it’s usually survivable. I suspect (and have found with my Druid characters) that after a point somewhere between L5 &L8 they are better combatants in humAn form with their weapons and spells than they are as front line tanks in wildshape. Wildshape is much better used at medium to higher levels for the oft forgotten exploration/scouting arm. Being able to move around in the wilderness as a creature rather than a humanoid is going to give you lots more info on who and what is around you as well as keeping you on track and in the right direction. If you have to fight in wildshape you can but your missing the other half of your skill set (spells) and that should be your clue to switch back. Even in a dungeon or the underdark this holds true. Which would you prefer to have scouting ahead of you - a rogue with 60’ dark vision that everyone else out there will be able to see with their dark vision or a at flapping around at the top of the passages that everyone will ignore but whose sonar can tell you how many, where they are, how armed/armored and what pits and many types of traps might be present?
At low levels wildshape is a useful combat move because no one has great AC and HP, as you progress your AC, HP and abilities should be progressing faster than the Wildshape creatures CRs and what you do with wildshape should be changing to suit. Keep in mind that yes it’s 2 wildshape per rest but you should be taking 2+rests each day before camping and taking your long rest so that is actually 6+ wildshape each day which should be plenty.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
The versatility of wild shape is definitely its main feature and draw, but because it is a feature specific to the Druid class, there are few options to make a build around the shapeshifting itself. Druids are made to be somewhat jacks of all roles: Healing and support spells as well as offensive ones, ability to tank or be sneaky, etc. The closest you get to a shapeshifter focus is moon druid, which gives you higher CR ratings, but still relies on the spell caster part of the druid, both to buff your wild form, and use slots to heal in wild form. The class remains a full caster class with wild shape as a supporting feature rather than the star. I would like to someday see WotC create a class that centers on shapeshifting itself as the key ability. But as far as uses go, it is really dependent on the DM for how many short rests you can get, just as it would if you were a warlock.