The feats in the book explicitly say you can do this. Do you own Tasha's?
I loaned out my copy to a player. It's not that I don't believe you, it's just that every comparable feat from earlier sources doesn't allow it and I don't recall the specific wording. Would be a bit of a departure from older material, then.
Yeah, this is the new standard for the Tasha's Cauldron feats, they explicitly say you can use spell slots to cast the gained spell(s).
It's a shame they didn't retcon it into similar feats like Magic Initiate etc. but I expect most DM's would allow it since there's no obvious reason one should have it and another shouldn't.
I believe this was done on purpose. Every other spell gifting feat (including the racial ones) give you some kind of permanent or at-will bonus. Cantrips, proficiencies, etc.
Fey Touched and Shadow Touched have no at-will benefits. I believe they were given the spell slot clause to have them usable more often throughout the day as an issue of balance with the other spell feats.
I look at artificers initiate as my basis. It is almost identical to magic initiate, but trades a cantrip for a tool proficiency. This obvious downgrade is met with the addition of the spell slot clause. If they added the same clause to magic initiate they would be invalidating something seeing print in the same book.
Just my read on the situation. Don't think I'd change Magic Initiate if I was a DM.
The feats in the book explicitly say you can do this. Do you own Tasha's?
I loaned out my copy to a player. It's not that I don't believe you, it's just that every comparable feat from earlier sources doesn't allow it and I don't recall the specific wording. Would be a bit of a departure from older material, then.
Yeah, this is the new standard for the Tasha's Cauldron feats, they explicitly say you can use spell slots to cast the gained spell(s).
It's a shame they didn't retcon it into similar feats like Magic Initiate etc. but I expect most DM's would allow it since there's no obvious reason one should have it and another shouldn't.
Yeah its honestly a huge distinction as it gives Warlocks a way to get Inflict wounds at a warlock scaling level which IMO is really really good!
There are 9 compatible 1st-level spells, and of those, I think only 6 scale up with spell slots. (I don't have Acquisitions Incorporated so I can't comment on distort value.) And of the available options, color spray, inflict wounds, and ray of sickness are all tempting options for warlocks. And invisibility scales up to affect multiple targets, capping at 4 with a 5th-level slot at 9th level. Definitely a strong option, but I don't think Fey Touched should be discounted, either. Unfortunately, misty step doesn't scale upward, but there are a lot more 1st-level spells to choose from. Just some of the ones which scale upward are bane, bless, dissonant whispers, heroism, hunter's mark, and sleep.
I'm liking Fey Touched and Shadow Touched on ranger the more I think about it. I love the tools they have been given access to that allow for a more spellcaster vibe. Really helps break up the monotony of casting Hunter's Mark.
Fey Touched - Heroism, Gift of Alacrity, Tasha's Hideous Laughter, Bane, Sleep
Love it. Fey Touched seems like the better of the two. Misty Step is great and the 1st level spell choices are awesome. But I do like shadow touched for invisibility quite a bit.
I'm liking Fey Touched and Shadow Touched on ranger the more I think about it. I love the tools they have been given access to that allow for a more spellcaster vibe. Really helps break up the monotony of casting Hunter's Mark.
Fey Touched - Heroism, Gift of Alacrity, Tasha's Hideous Laughter, Bane, Sleep
Love it. Fey Touched seems like the better of the two. Misty Step is great and the 1st level spell choices are awesome. But I do like shadow touched for invisibility quite a bit.
Misty Step is pretty good universally I think so yeah Fey Touched will be good. Plus rangers (mostly PHB) are starved for spells known. The only issue I have is the competition. Its really good to max DEX and Sharpshooter is really hard to pass up so I am generally looking fairly late game or V. Human for Fey Touched.
I believe this was done on purpose. Every other spell gifting feat (including the racial ones) give you some kind of permanent or at-will bonus. Cantrips, proficiencies, etc.
Fey Touched and Shadow Touched are both half-feats, so in this case is the permanent bonus not the +1 to an ability score? Magic Initiate by comparison costs your entire ability score increase for two cantrips and a single spell you can only ever use at 1st level once per long rest, so I'd say Fey/Shadow Touched still comes out on top overall, I don't think making the behaviour consistent would unbalance it.
I think it's more just that they've realised that people find the way it works to be weird when you add it onto a spellcaster, and many probably played it the new way without realising they were doing it wrong; I made that mistake myself when I took Magic Initiate (Warlock) and grabbed Armor of Agathys until I realised that RAW I could only cast it for 5 temp HP no matter my level, so asked my DM if I could swap for Hex instead.
It won't be the first time that Wizards of the Coast have been weird about retconning things to be consistent.
The more feats they print the better VHuman gets. Oh well, not worth dwelling on.
I definitely agree on the ASI competition. Strength rangers are going to be pulled towards PAM as well. I'd be looking to pick one of these new spell feats up at level 1 or not at all.
Edit: LOL. Haravikk my mind just shut off the fact they boost stats too. OOPS. you are correct. they have a permanent bonus. I retract that argument.
BUT, I maintain my comparison to artificer's initiate. They have to force people to care about tools, no way they're going to errata Magic Initiate so that it completely overshadows another feat they just printed.
Looked up the spells here on DDB, they certainly outshine the older ones. I don’t mind feats being strong, but I do hope the power creep doesn’t keep ramping up.
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Both Fey and Shadow touched are great for classes with limited spells known in particular the Ranger and Sorcerer. On a human at 1st level they are both perfect because you can get a 2nd level spell before you could otherwise cast it and a 1st level spell. Long term it frees up spells known to take more higher level spells, or load up on the 1st level Ranger spells that scale well. Even taking them at 4th level will help free up those spells know slots. I would recommend either choosing Hunter's Mark for the Fey Touched feat or a regular utility spell like Detect Evil/Good that isn't on your list. HM because you were going to cast it anyway so now it's free and it frees up a spells known slot. Detect Evil/Good because you weren't going to get it otherwise and it is a useful spell you will use a lot if its free. Misty step meanwhile frees up the melee Ranger's mobility, so you don't get trapped in a swarm as often.
Favored Foe in my opinion makes HM slightly less mandatory. Its still useful, but depending on your build Favored Foe may work just fine for your 90% of your needs.
Both Fey and Shadow touched are great for classes with limited spells known in particular the Ranger and Sorcerer. On a human at 1st level they are both perfect because you can get a 2nd level spell before you could otherwise cast it and a 1st level spell. Long term it frees up spells known to take more higher level spells, or load up on the 1st level Ranger spells that scale well. Even taking them at 4th level will help free up those spells know slots. I would recommend either choosing Hunter's Mark for the Fey Touched feat or a regular utility spell like Detect Evil/Good that isn't on your list. HM because you were going to cast it anyway so now it's free and it frees up a spells known slot. Detect Evil/Good because you weren't going to get it otherwise and it is a useful spell you will use a lot if its free. Misty step meanwhile frees up the melee Ranger's mobility, so you don't get trapped in a swarm as often.
Favored Foe in my opinion makes HM slightly less mandatory. Its still useful, but depending on your build Favored Foe may work just fine for your 90% of your needs.
Yeah learning new spells is a huge versatility boost overall since there is so much that could possibly happen in DnD.
Its why the new sorcerers are so much more powerful. They know 11 more spells which is crazy!
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I believe this was done on purpose. Every other spell gifting feat (including the racial ones) give you some kind of permanent or at-will bonus. Cantrips, proficiencies, etc.
Fey Touched and Shadow Touched have no at-will benefits. I believe they were given the spell slot clause to have them usable more often throughout the day as an issue of balance with the other spell feats.
I look at artificers initiate as my basis. It is almost identical to magic initiate, but trades a cantrip for a tool proficiency. This obvious downgrade is met with the addition of the spell slot clause. If they added the same clause to magic initiate they would be invalidating something seeing print in the same book.
Just my read on the situation. Don't think I'd change Magic Initiate if I was a DM.
There are 9 compatible 1st-level spells, and of those, I think only 6 scale up with spell slots. (I don't have Acquisitions Incorporated so I can't comment on distort value.) And of the available options, color spray, inflict wounds, and ray of sickness are all tempting options for warlocks. And invisibility scales up to affect multiple targets, capping at 4 with a 5th-level slot at 9th level. Definitely a strong option, but I don't think Fey Touched should be discounted, either. Unfortunately, misty step doesn't scale upward, but there are a lot more 1st-level spells to choose from. Just some of the ones which scale upward are bane, bless, dissonant whispers, heroism, hunter's mark, and sleep.
Please take the warlock discussion to the warlock forum.
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I'm liking Fey Touched and Shadow Touched on ranger the more I think about it. I love the tools they have been given access to that allow for a more spellcaster vibe. Really helps break up the monotony of casting Hunter's Mark.
Fey Touched - Heroism, Gift of Alacrity, Tasha's Hideous Laughter, Bane, Sleep
Shadow Touched - False Life, Silent Image, Disguise Self
Love it. Fey Touched seems like the better of the two. Misty Step is great and the 1st level spell choices are awesome. But I do like shadow touched for invisibility quite a bit.
Misty Step is pretty good universally I think so yeah Fey Touched will be good. Plus rangers (mostly PHB) are starved for spells known. The only issue I have is the competition. Its really good to max DEX and Sharpshooter is really hard to pass up so I am generally looking fairly late game or V. Human for Fey Touched.
Fey Touched and Shadow Touched are both half-feats, so in this case is the permanent bonus not the +1 to an ability score? Magic Initiate by comparison costs your entire ability score increase for two cantrips and a single spell you can only ever use at 1st level once per long rest, so I'd say Fey/Shadow Touched still comes out on top overall, I don't think making the behaviour consistent would unbalance it.
I think it's more just that they've realised that people find the way it works to be weird when you add it onto a spellcaster, and many probably played it the new way without realising they were doing it wrong; I made that mistake myself when I took Magic Initiate (Warlock) and grabbed Armor of Agathys until I realised that RAW I could only cast it for 5 temp HP no matter my level, so asked my DM if I could swap for Hex instead.
It won't be the first time that Wizards of the Coast have been weird about retconning things to be consistent.
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The more feats they print the better VHuman gets. Oh well, not worth dwelling on.
I definitely agree on the ASI competition. Strength rangers are going to be pulled towards PAM as well. I'd be looking to pick one of these new spell feats up at level 1 or not at all.
Edit: LOL. Haravikk my mind just shut off the fact they boost stats too. OOPS. you are correct. they have a permanent bonus. I retract that argument.
BUT, I maintain my comparison to artificer's initiate. They have to force people to care about tools, no way they're going to errata Magic Initiate so that it completely overshadows another feat they just printed.
Looked up the spells here on DDB, they certainly outshine the older ones. I don’t mind feats being strong, but I do hope the power creep doesn’t keep ramping up.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
Both Fey and Shadow touched are great for classes with limited spells known in particular the Ranger and Sorcerer. On a human at 1st level they are both perfect because you can get a 2nd level spell before you could otherwise cast it and a 1st level spell. Long term it frees up spells known to take more higher level spells, or load up on the 1st level Ranger spells that scale well. Even taking them at 4th level will help free up those spells know slots. I would recommend either choosing Hunter's Mark for the Fey Touched feat or a regular utility spell like Detect Evil/Good that isn't on your list. HM because you were going to cast it anyway so now it's free and it frees up a spells known slot. Detect Evil/Good because you weren't going to get it otherwise and it is a useful spell you will use a lot if its free. Misty step meanwhile frees up the melee Ranger's mobility, so you don't get trapped in a swarm as often.
Favored Foe in my opinion makes HM slightly less mandatory. Its still useful, but depending on your build Favored Foe may work just fine for your 90% of your needs.
Yeah learning new spells is a huge versatility boost overall since there is so much that could possibly happen in DnD.
Its why the new sorcerers are so much more powerful. They know 11 more spells which is crazy!