"Many races live in and around the Material Plane, yet their numbers pale in comparison to the innumerable host of demons residing the Infinite Layers of the Abyss. It comes as no surprise that some of these demons make their way into the Material Realm. Whether being summoned, ordered, or acting alone, demons will frequently take possession of another’s body. On exceptionally rare occasions, this intrusion leads to the creation of a mortal Abyssal."
I have been working on this custom class for D&D 5th Edition on and off for about a year now. Originally this began as a small project to satisfy my desire for a more demonic-oriented D&D class that had a darker and more direct relationship with a demonic entity and eventually it turned into this. I know that to a few it seems like a mutilated Warlock class, however, I feel like this is flavorfully and mechanically different enough to warrant its own class.
1 New Class: The Abyssal
5 New Subclasses:
Balor
Chasme
Glabrezu
Marilith
Shadow
13 New Spells
1 New Magic Item
7 New Weapons
5 new creature variants
It is my personal opinion that a new homebrew class, race, spell, etc, should be balanced to the best that it can be with existing content and fulfill a gap in the existing content, whether this is mechanically, flavorfully, or both. I believe that this class does just this and is within the realms of reasonable balance.
It's been play-tested a fair amount throughout this time by myself and friends, but I know it is not perfect. I've been procrastinating sharing this for a while, but I would very much appreciate any comments, constructive criticisms, and feedback anyone may have for this. I also welcome anyone to playtest this as they will. I'm very interested to see what others think of this class.
This really well done! It feels very well balanced and well thought out, but I do have a few questions and comments.
I would recommend saving throw proficiencies in Charisma and Wisdom as spellcasters are typically proficient in their spellcasting ability (This goes for multiclassing as well). Is the extended spell list for each demon like a warlock's patron's extended spell list? With Soul Points: Sacrifice, I would reword the first two sentences to be "You can take 1d8 damage and reduce the requisite soul points needed by one." Adding to the end "You can use this feature up to your Abyssal level, regaining all expended uses after a long rest." How can the madness be cured? Would remove curse, dispel evil and good, or banishment do anything? Would Abyssals be immune to the effects of the optional rules for the negative planes presented in the DMG?
"The relevant equation is: Knowledge = power = energy = matter = mass; a good bookshop is just a genteel Black Hole that knows how to read." - Terry Pratchett
I've been playing around with the saving throws quite a bit. This is what I keep going back to though. This class - which is really kind of a three-quarters spell caster - is fairly open to either being more of a spell blade than a caster, full caster, or really not using spells very often at all, and instead focusing more on the origin abilities. So, similar to the Ranger? The flavor here is that the character would need proficiency in Wisdom to survive the possession, and the proficiency in Constitution is something inherited from the demon, or maybe even the reason the demon chose to posses that character in the first place. However, the demonic spellcasting ability is typically Charisma, so this remains the spellcasting ability. (At one point the spellcasting ability was Wisdom.)
Yes, they are simply an expanded spell list. So would function exactly the same as the Warlock's Patron's extended spell list. I should probably add some text to clarify that...
The wording for the Sacrifice ability does need help. Thanks! I'll work your suggestions in as soon as I'm able.
The madness can really be an optional flavor/roleplaying feature, as I'm sure not everyone will want to play as a slightly mad character. However, I purposefully left the "cure" blank, as I felt this was something that would be better managed on an individual basis and more or less left to the discretion of the DM. This could be anything from a Calm Emotions spell for temporary relief, or a Lesser/Greater Restoration. But of course, I think Remove Curse or Dispel Evil And Good are definitely possible options as well. I can probably just say something like this somewhere. My intention was to be vague enough that the DM could reasonably come to their own conclusions and work it out with their player(s) on their own.
The Negative Planes is also something I left open to be up to DM discretion. Though I can simply state this somewhere to be clear I suppose?
I haven't really considered how the new spells fit within each existing class, but I suppose I can just assign them to the classes I personally feel they belong with. I'm open to any suggestions there as well of course.
I've been playing around with the saving throws quite a bit. This is what I keep going back to though. This class - which is really kind of a three-quarters spell caster - is fairly open to either being more of a spell blade than a caster, full caster, or really not using spells very often at all, and instead focusing more on the origin abilities. So, similar to the Ranger? The flavor here is that the character would need proficiency in Wisdom to survive the possession, and the proficiency in Constitution is something inherited from the demon, or maybe even the reason the demon chose to posses that character in the first place. However, the demonic spellcasting ability is typically Charisma, so this remains the spellcasting ability. (At one point the spellcasting ability was Wisdom.)
Every class gets, for balance, proficiency in one of Strength, Intelligence, or Charisma saving throws and one of Dexterity, Constitution, or Wisdom saving throws. For this class, I'd recommend Wisdom and Charisma.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
I didn't notice that trend nor consider it that way. I've tried the class out as Wisdom/Charisma as well and it was not bad. As I mentioned, I've been playing around with them for a while. I will probably settle on Wisdom and Charisma then. Thanks!
Thanks for the feedback guys! I've updated the class to take account for the suggested changes and some more data collected from playtests. I've also added the "pretty" pdf version to up top if anyone is interested in that.
I just gave this a quick one-over, and it seems a really solid class! Well done! Only one thing... The Balor expanded spell list reads "Balrog Expanded Spells" :P
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
I really like the look of this class, and am planning to have it be the base class of the elites of a group of demon worshippers, and have it be an option if any of my party members are interested. I’ve only got a couple gripes and they mainly come down to unclear wording, and while I could decide on an answer as the DM, I’d like your consideration as well when playtesting it.
How does the Marilith’s Fangs of the Snake feature work with multiclassing into a class that gives Extra Attack? For clarity, does walking through an illusion count as the 1 damage necessary to break it? If you are small enough to fit in the “5-foot cube” given in minor illusion, is creating a still image of yourself like that considered an illusion of yourself for Duplicitious Substitution to apply?
I might have more questions once my players start encountering the cult in earnest, but for now that’s it, and thanks for making a class like this.
Would you be interested in making another demon to choose from? I’m running a new character that is a descendent of my previous character who had the stone of Golorr which held an Aboleth. I’m wanting to use that monster for story purposes but I’m not very creative when it comes to writing actual level skills and what not.
This is a really cool idea, I've been trying to think of something along these lines for quite some time so I'm really glad you made this work out so well! You should send some of your ideas into wizards of the coast. I bet they would love to here some more of your works.
Hey, first off, congrats on the class! It is really well done and well balanced and I love the originality of it.
I don't know if I missed it in the document, but if you were to role for equipment instead of using the equipment you start with, what would the starting wealth be?
This is awesome and i love it! Has it been integrated into D&D beyond yet? What do i have to look up to get the class? I didn't find anything when i searched "the abyssal".
Apologies for not seeing the replies to this thread earlier. I'm glad people are getting use out of this and I appreciate all of the feedback and support for it! I'd love to hear how it was used and any stories y'all have from using this class in your campaigns. I've made a few small changes, so I'll update the PDF to the latest version soon.
For clarity, does walking through an illusion count as the 1 damage necessary to break it? If you are small enough to fit in the “5-foot cube” given in minor illusion, is creating a still image of yourself like that considered an illusion of yourself for Duplicitious Substitution to apply?
I left the 1 point of damage vague on purpose to be honest. I feel like it was too situational of a feature to be written in stone. For example, if a creature is just waving their hand through the illusion, it should just pass through like any other illusion, but actively running through it or throwing a punch at it would break it. Really, I just wanted to leave it up to DM interpretation. I suppose I can just clarify it with the rules that I use myself, which is: "A creature or object actively moving through the space of an illusion destroys the illusion."
As for Duplicitous Substitution, yes, I would consider any illusion of yourself created by you, regardless of how it was created, a possible target for that ability. Once again, I decided to leave this slightly open for DM interpretation.
Would you be interested in making another demon to choose from? I’m running a new character that is a descendent of my previous character who had the stone of Golorr which held an Aboleth. I’m wanting to use that monster for story purposes but I’m not very creative when it comes to writing actual level skills and what not.
I actually wanted to create a unique subclass for a few other demons, notably the Barlgure, Goristro, Nalfeshnee, and Yochlol demons. Since an Aboleth is an aberration, not a demon, I wouldn't include it as a subclass for this class. However, I think having a character "possessed" by the Aboleth trapped in a magical stone they are carrying is a fun idea. The Aboleth's Ensalve feature would lend itself pretty well to this idea. Talk about living vicariously through someone else. Haha
I don't know if I missed it in the document, but if you were to role for equipment instead of using the equipment you start with, what would the starting wealth be?
I actually never considered that, since I never use that feature myself. But if I were to assign a value, I'd probably go with 4d4 x 10 gp.
This is awesome and i love it! Has it been integrated into D&D beyond yet? What do i have to look up to get the class? I didn't find anything when i searched "the abyssal".
Thanks! This is just a completely homebrewed class, and D&D Beyond doesn't support homebrew classes yet, only custom Subclasses. (Not sure if they ever will?) So there's no way to use this with the character creator on this site very easily.
This is a really cool idea, I've been trying to think of something along these lines for quite some time so I'm really glad you made this work out so well! You should send some of your ideas into wizards of the coast. I bet they would love to here some more of your works.
I'm glad you like it! It was a lot of work, both for me and my friends who have helped me playtest it. I have no idea how I would do that, but I'm glad you think it's good enough to be sent to them.
"Many races live in and around the Material Plane, yet their numbers pale in comparison to the innumerable host of demons residing the Infinite Layers of the Abyss. It comes as no surprise that some of these demons make their way into the Material Realm. Whether being summoned, ordered, or acting alone, demons will frequently take possession of another’s body. On exceptionally rare occasions, this intrusion leads to the creation of a mortal Abyssal."
I have been working on this custom class for D&D 5th Edition on and off for about a year now. Originally this began as a small project to satisfy my desire for a more demonic-oriented D&D class that had a darker and more direct relationship with a demonic entity and eventually it turned into this. I know that to a few it seems like a mutilated Warlock class, however, I feel like this is flavorfully and mechanically different enough to warrant its own class.
It is my personal opinion that a new homebrew class, race, spell, etc, should be balanced to the best that it can be with existing content and fulfill a gap in the existing content, whether this is mechanically, flavorfully, or both. I believe that this class does just this and is within the realms of reasonable balance.
It's been play-tested a fair amount throughout this time by myself and friends, but I know it is not perfect. I've been procrastinating sharing this for a while, but I would very much appreciate any comments, constructive criticisms, and feedback anyone may have for this. I also welcome anyone to playtest this as they will. I'm very interested to see what others think of this class.
Abyssal Class 1.3 for D&D 5th Edition
Thanks for taking the time to look at this!
This really well done! It feels very well balanced and well thought out, but I do have a few questions and comments.
I would recommend saving throw proficiencies in Charisma and Wisdom as spellcasters are typically proficient in their spellcasting ability (This goes for multiclassing as well). Is the extended spell list for each demon like a warlock's patron's extended spell list? With Soul Points: Sacrifice, I would reword the first two sentences to be "You can take 1d8 damage and reduce the requisite soul points needed by one." Adding to the end "You can use this feature up to your Abyssal level, regaining all expended uses after a long rest." How can the madness be cured? Would remove curse, dispel evil and good, or banishment do anything? Would Abyssals be immune to the effects of the optional rules for the negative planes presented in the DMG?
Finally, what classes get the spells presented?
Tooltips | Snippet Code | How to Homebrew on D&D Beyond | Subclass Guide | Feature Roadmap
Astromancer's Homebrew Assembly
"The relevant equation is: Knowledge = power = energy = matter = mass; a good bookshop is just a genteel Black Hole that knows how to read." - Terry Pratchett
Thanks! I really appreciate the feedback!
I've been playing around with the saving throws quite a bit. This is what I keep going back to though. This class - which is really kind of a three-quarters spell caster - is fairly open to either being more of a spell blade than a caster, full caster, or really not using spells very often at all, and instead focusing more on the origin abilities. So, similar to the Ranger? The flavor here is that the character would need proficiency in Wisdom to survive the possession, and the proficiency in Constitution is something inherited from the demon, or maybe even the reason the demon chose to posses that character in the first place. However, the demonic spellcasting ability is typically Charisma, so this remains the spellcasting ability. (At one point the spellcasting ability was Wisdom.)
Yes, they are simply an expanded spell list. So would function exactly the same as the Warlock's Patron's extended spell list. I should probably add some text to clarify that...
The wording for the Sacrifice ability does need help. Thanks! I'll work your suggestions in as soon as I'm able.
The madness can really be an optional flavor/roleplaying feature, as I'm sure not everyone will want to play as a slightly mad character. However, I purposefully left the "cure" blank, as I felt this was something that would be better managed on an individual basis and more or less left to the discretion of the DM. This could be anything from a Calm Emotions spell for temporary relief, or a Lesser/Greater Restoration. But of course, I think Remove Curse or Dispel Evil And Good are definitely possible options as well. I can probably just say something like this somewhere. My intention was to be vague enough that the DM could reasonably come to their own conclusions and work it out with their player(s) on their own.
The Negative Planes is also something I left open to be up to DM discretion. Though I can simply state this somewhere to be clear I suppose?
I haven't really considered how the new spells fit within each existing class, but I suppose I can just assign them to the classes I personally feel they belong with. I'm open to any suggestions there as well of course.
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
Tooltips (Help/aid)
I didn't notice that trend nor consider it that way. I've tried the class out as Wisdom/Charisma as well and it was not bad. As I mentioned, I've been playing around with them for a while. I will probably settle on Wisdom and Charisma then. Thanks!
Thanks for the feedback guys! I've updated the class to take account for the suggested changes and some more data collected from playtests. I've also added the "pretty" pdf version to up top if anyone is interested in that.
I just gave this a quick one-over, and it seems a really solid class! Well done!
Only one thing... The Balor expanded spell list reads "Balrog Expanded Spells" :P
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Thanks for catching that! I've fixed it as well as a few other grammatical issues.
I really like the look of this class, and am planning to have it be the base class of the elites of a group of demon worshippers, and have it be an option if any of my party members are interested. I’ve only got a couple gripes and they mainly come down to unclear wording, and while I could decide on an answer as the DM, I’d like your consideration as well when playtesting it.
How does the Marilith’s Fangs of the Snake feature work with multiclassing into a class that gives Extra Attack? For clarity, does walking through an illusion count as the 1 damage necessary to break it? If you are small enough to fit in the “5-foot cube” given in minor illusion, is creating a still image of yourself like that considered an illusion of yourself for Duplicitious Substitution to apply?
I might have more questions once my players start encountering the cult in earnest, but for now that’s it, and thanks for making a class like this.
Would you be interested in making another demon to choose from? I’m running a new character that is a descendent of my previous character who had the stone of Golorr which held an Aboleth. I’m wanting to use that monster for story purposes but I’m not very creative when it comes to writing actual level skills and what not.
This is a really cool idea, I've been trying to think of something along these lines for quite some time so I'm really glad you made this work out so well! You should send some of your ideas into wizards of the coast. I bet they would love to here some more of your works.
Hey, first off, congrats on the class! It is really well done and well balanced and I love the originality of it.
I don't know if I missed it in the document, but if you were to role for equipment instead of using the equipment you start with, what would the starting wealth be?
This is awesome and i love it! Has it been integrated into D&D beyond yet? What do i have to look up to get the class? I didn't find anything when i searched "the abyssal".
Apologies for not seeing the replies to this thread earlier. I'm glad people are getting use out of this and I appreciate all of the feedback and support for it! I'd love to hear how it was used and any stories y'all have from using this class in your campaigns. I've made a few small changes, so I'll update the PDF to the latest version soon.
I actually updated the second part of Fangs of the Snake to be unusable during Extra Attacks.
I left the 1 point of damage vague on purpose to be honest. I feel like it was too situational of a feature to be written in stone. For example, if a creature is just waving their hand through the illusion, it should just pass through like any other illusion, but actively running through it or throwing a punch at it would break it. Really, I just wanted to leave it up to DM interpretation. I suppose I can just clarify it with the rules that I use myself, which is: "A creature or object actively moving through the space of an illusion destroys the illusion."
As for Duplicitous Substitution, yes, I would consider any illusion of yourself created by you, regardless of how it was created, a possible target for that ability. Once again, I decided to leave this slightly open for DM interpretation.
I actually wanted to create a unique subclass for a few other demons, notably the Barlgure, Goristro, Nalfeshnee, and Yochlol demons. Since an Aboleth is an aberration, not a demon, I wouldn't include it as a subclass for this class. However, I think having a character "possessed" by the Aboleth trapped in a magical stone they are carrying is a fun idea. The Aboleth's Ensalve feature would lend itself pretty well to this idea. Talk about living vicariously through someone else. Haha
I actually never considered that, since I never use that feature myself. But if I were to assign a value, I'd probably go with 4d4 x 10 gp.
Thanks! This is just a completely homebrewed class, and D&D Beyond doesn't support homebrew classes yet, only custom Subclasses. (Not sure if they ever will?) So there's no way to use this with the character creator on this site very easily.
I'm glad you like it! It was a lot of work, both for me and my friends who have helped me playtest it. I have no idea how I would do that, but I'm glad you think it's good enough to be sent to them.