So as I read the description in Xanathar's it's basically:
You get a single use +1/successful counter spell.
You can then use a surge when you cast an offensive damage spell and gain 1/2 your wizard level in damage... wah, wah
It seems -SUPER- underpowered for the effort required to gain charges. At level 6 when you get it that's +3 on an occasional spell!
So how to I "fix" it in a balanced way? To me POWER SURGE implies, well, power. This suggests either, more difficult to resist spells, spells that have a lower floor, or as in the case of the Fireball some large advantage for using it. (as per the recent article here)
Some suggestions I've read out there:
Return a spell slot of some size
Increase damage by 1 or 2 dice
Increase cantrip damage by some amount. (Wiz Level/2 + int bonus or something, making level 6 be +7/8 ish)
Increase cantrip damage by some amount. (+2 spell dice) thus making it closer to a "real" spell but not making huge spells massive.
Further increase AC
Push enemies within a 5 foot radius of the caster directly away 10 feet in addition to any spell damage (thus becoming a sudden release of power blasting them backward if they are close)
Any other ideas or thoughts?
Maybe I'm missing some awesome use-case for what otherwise I consider a wasted ability at level 6
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It seems -SUPER- underpowered for the effort required to gain charges. At level 6 when you get it that's +3 on an occasional spell!
So how to I "fix" it in a balanced way?
It is underpowered. Here's my take on it: that's deliberate. Everything else about War Magic is amazing. Wizards have 1 weakness: they're easy to kill. War Magic fixes that. Tactical Wit is great; wizards benefit a lot from getting the first strike in combat. Arcane Deflection's +4 to saving throws is huge. At 10th level Durable Magic gives you another +2 to AC and saves just for concentrating on spells. Deflecting Shroud lets you punish nearby creatures for trying to hit you or force a save on you.
You could take Power Surge out of the picture and War Magic would still be a really compelling subclass. Power Surge is mostly thematic, similar to a Ranger's Favored Enemy and Favored Terrain. The rest of the class has to be designed around the assumption that you might not get to use it, but it reinforces the idea that you're also adept at beating spellcasters, and it's a nice little bonus when you finally get to use it.
Well, I like to play mostly on the FUN aspect rather than the tactical balance, so long as it isn't a large discrepancy.
I had another thought. What if the effect was basically to gain a Sorcerer point, up to the same maximum? This is much like having a Fighter who can cast, etc.
Limits would need to be applied or there'd be no reason to be a sorcerer.
Limit ideas:
Can only use on cantrips
Can only use 1 effect (can't double up)
Can only use 1 SP for any given spell.
That gives some dynamism to them without necessarily making them OP. extra range on a single spell every now and then isn't going to make the Sorcerer of the party jealous and isn't really going to make the Wizard OP either.
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Cant you load up a rock with a bunch of cantrip enchantments like light, shape earth, etc, then dispell them? Each enchantment you have on your rock should give you a surge and you can hold up to 5 surges. So if you can fit 5 enchantments on your rock, then dispel them all, you should be powered up to your max level of surges, for the cost of one 3rd level spell slot.
It's lame and cheesy, but RAW, it would work I think.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Cant you load up a rock with a bunch of cantrip enchantments like light, shape earth, etc, then dispell them?
You could, but it's a waste of a slot. Even if you're a 20th level wizard with 20 INT, that's only 50 damage. A single Fireball will do 28 damage on average, so catching even just 2 creatures in 1 fireball is already a better use of the slot; plus the Fireball deals its damage all at once, while you can only use one Power Surge per spell. Plus, you get a free surge at the end of every rest.
Edit: After a re-read it seemed less than straightforward, so cleaning up the language
Well, I'm going with the Sorcerer method. Constructive criticism or unbelievable pandering appreciated :)
War Caster: Power Surge (Revised)
Starting at 6th level, you can store magical energy within yourself to later empower your spells. In its stored form, this energy is called a power surge.
You can store a maximum number of power surges equal to your Intelligence modifier (minimum of one). Whenever you finish a long rest, your number of power surges resets to one. Whenever you successfully end a spell with dispel magic or counterspell, you gain one power surge, as you steal magic from the spell you foiled. If you end a short rest with no power surges, you gain one power surge.
Once per turn, when you cast a spell you can modify the spell as per the Metamagic sorcerer class feature. PHB p.101-102
This means that at most the WarCaster could have up to 5 sorcerer points...and he'd have to be pretty active to get them, burning spell slots to get them. At lvl 20 a sorcerer gets 20 points, so I don't find 5 points, that are difficult to get, in any way competes with 20 free points.
Thoughts on balance? I mean, I'm cool with things being a little imbalanced, but I don't want the only viable option to become just such a build.
I believe that the war mage is powerful enough without a buff to the power surge ability; however, I decided to post how it could be made a lot more fun (and considerably more powerful).
When using this version, also consider:
- Setting the max stored power surges to 1.
- Requiring the foiled spell to have expended a spell slot to remove shenanigans with prestidigitation.
Starting at 6th level, you can store magical energy within yourself to later empower your damaging spells.
You can store a maximum number of power surges equal to your Intelligence modifier (minimum of one). Whenever you finish a long rest, your number of power surges resets to one. Whenever you successfully end a spell with Dispell Magic or Counterspell, you gain one power surge, as you steal magic from the spell you foiled. If you end a short rest with no power surges, you gain one power surge.
Once per turn when you expend a spell slot to cast a wizard spell, you can spend a power surge to treat the spell you cast as if it had been cast at a higher level. You must have spell slots (expended or otherwise) equal to the new level of the spell, and you cannot cast a spell of higher minimum level than the expended spell slot.
The maximum increase in level is equal to half of your proficiency bonus (rounded down).
So as I read the description in Xanathar's it's basically:
You get a single use +1/successful counter spell.
You can then use a surge when you cast an offensive damage spell and gain 1/2 your wizard level in damage... wah, wah
It seems -SUPER- underpowered for the effort required to gain charges. At level 6 when you get it that's +3 on an occasional spell!
So how to I "fix" it in a balanced way? To me POWER SURGE implies, well, power. This suggests either, more difficult to resist spells, spells that have a lower floor, or as in the case of the Fireball some large advantage for using it. (as per the recent article here)
Some suggestions I've read out there:
Push enemies within a 5 foot radius of the caster directly away 10 feet in addition to any spell damage (thus becoming a sudden release of power blasting them backward if they are close)
Any other ideas or thoughts?
Maybe I'm missing some awesome use-case for what otherwise I consider a wasted ability at level 6
Pushing people within a 5' radius away by 10' seems both thematic and not likely to be very abusable. A "surge" should be something that has force behind it and hit points are too abstract at high levels to be a very good representation of that unless you're talking a lot of hp. The benefits would be tactical and situational, since you're not always going to have a Web/Spike Growth/Evard's within 10.' These are all concentration spells and some cooperation with another caster would often be optimal to setup the more powerful effects.
Or perhaps the boost it gives you is to allow your next ranged attack cantrip to have the opportunity to knock a Large or smaller creature prone on a failed Strength save. Not everything should be about increasing attack hit die.
I've been thinking about this as well, and I was considering the following change.
War Caster: Power Surge
Starting at 6th level, you can store magical energy within yourself to later empower your damaging spells. In its stored form, this energy is called a power surge.
You can store a maximum number of power surges equal to your Intelligence modifier (minimum of one). Whenever you finish a long rest, your number of power surges resets to one. Whenever you successfully end a spell with dispel magic or counterspell, you gain one power surge, as you steal magic from the spell you foiled. If you end a short rest with no power surges, you gain one power surge.
Once per turn when you deal damage to a creature or object with a wizard spell, you can spend one power surge to deal extra force damage to that target. The extra damage equals half your wizard level. The affected creature has disadvantage against checks to maintain concentration as a result of this spell.
Pretty simple change that doesn't add any more damage to the spell, fits thematically with war wizard and the Power Surge feature, and isn't too powerful. If this seemed too strong, I'd say to straight up remove the recharge mechanic, just give 1/short rest, because as is it's not worth the effort to track/recharge it when you get it.
Holy thread resurrection batman, but id like to weigh in on this. I have refused to play a War Wizard in the past because Power Surge sucks so bad. Why would the original UA Power Surge not viable? I think it was pretty cool actually. IF to being a save spell is too much, change it to an attack spell instead or change it to just adding 1 additional damage dice instead of 2. Thoughts?
If i have power surge, will it active when I damage an enemy with my wizard cantrip spell?
Yes.
Once per turn when you deal damage to a creature or object with a wizard spell, you can spend one power surge to deal extra force damage to that target. The extra damage equals half your wizard level.
Cantrips are spells - and as long as they are on the Wizard spell list (in case you're multiclassing) you can get extra damage from Power Surge.
So as I read the description in Xanathar's it's basically:
You get a single use +1/successful counter spell.
You can then use a surge when you cast an offensive damage spell and gain 1/2 your wizard level in damage... wah, wah
It seems -SUPER- underpowered for the effort required to gain charges. At level 6 when you get it that's +3 on an occasional spell!
So how to I "fix" it in a balanced way? To me POWER SURGE implies, well, power. This suggests either, more difficult to resist spells, spells that have a lower floor, or as in the case of the Fireball some large advantage for using it. (as per the recent article here)
Some suggestions I've read out there:
Any other ideas or thoughts?
Maybe I'm missing some awesome use-case for what otherwise I consider a wasted ability at level 6
Playtesting Fugare Draconis, an epic tale of adventure, loss, and redemption
Hmm.
Well, I like to play mostly on the FUN aspect rather than the tactical balance, so long as it isn't a large discrepancy.
I had another thought. What if the effect was basically to gain a Sorcerer point, up to the same maximum? This is much like having a Fighter who can cast, etc.
Limits would need to be applied or there'd be no reason to be a sorcerer.
Limit ideas:
That gives some dynamism to them without necessarily making them OP. extra range on a single spell every now and then isn't going to make the Sorcerer of the party jealous and isn't really going to make the Wizard OP either.
Playtesting Fugare Draconis, an epic tale of adventure, loss, and redemption
Cant you load up a rock with a bunch of cantrip enchantments like light, shape earth, etc, then dispell them? Each enchantment you have on your rock should give you a surge and you can hold up to 5 surges. So if you can fit 5 enchantments on your rock, then dispel them all, you should be powered up to your max level of surges, for the cost of one 3rd level spell slot.
It's lame and cheesy, but RAW, it would work I think.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
Edit: After a re-read it seemed less than straightforward, so cleaning up the language
Well, I'm going with the Sorcerer method. Constructive criticism or unbelievable pandering appreciated :)
This means that at most the WarCaster could have up to 5 sorcerer points...and he'd have to be pretty active to get them, burning spell slots to get them. At lvl 20 a sorcerer gets 20 points, so I don't find 5 points, that are difficult to get, in any way competes with 20 free points.
Thoughts on balance? I mean, I'm cool with things being a little imbalanced, but I don't want the only viable option to become just such a build.
Playtesting Fugare Draconis, an epic tale of adventure, loss, and redemption
Also, anyone have any creative ideas on how I can put that feature on my mage, maybe with an item or something?
Playtesting Fugare Draconis, an epic tale of adventure, loss, and redemption
I believe that the war mage is powerful enough without a buff to the power surge ability; however, I decided to post how it could be made a lot more fun (and considerably more powerful).
When using this version, also consider:
- Setting the max stored power surges to 1.
- Requiring the foiled spell to have expended a spell slot to remove shenanigans with prestidigitation.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Starting at 6th level, you can store magical energy within yourself to later empower your damaging spells.
You can store a maximum number of power surges equal to your Intelligence modifier (minimum of one). Whenever you finish a long rest, your number of power surges resets to one. Whenever you successfully end a spell with Dispell Magic or Counterspell, you gain one power surge, as you steal magic from the spell you foiled. If you end a short rest with no power surges, you gain one power surge.
Once per turn when you expend a spell slot to cast a wizard spell, you can spend a power surge to treat the spell you cast as if it had been cast at a higher level. You must have spell slots (expended or otherwise) equal to the new level of the spell, and you cannot cast a spell of higher minimum level than the expended spell slot.
The maximum increase in level is equal to half of your proficiency bonus (rounded down).
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pushing people within a 5' radius away by 10' seems both thematic and not likely to be very abusable. A "surge" should be something that has force behind it and hit points are too abstract at high levels to be a very good representation of that unless you're talking a lot of hp. The benefits would be tactical and situational, since you're not always going to have a Web/Spike Growth/Evard's within 10.' These are all concentration spells and some cooperation with another caster would often be optimal to setup the more powerful effects.
Or perhaps the boost it gives you is to allow your next ranged attack cantrip to have the opportunity to knock a Large or smaller creature prone on a failed Strength save. Not everything should be about increasing attack hit die.
I've been thinking about this as well, and I was considering the following change.
Pretty simple change that doesn't add any more damage to the spell, fits thematically with war wizard and the Power Surge feature, and isn't too powerful.
If this seemed too strong, I'd say to straight up remove the recharge mechanic, just give 1/short rest, because as is it's not worth the effort to track/recharge it when you get it.
Holy thread resurrection batman, but id like to weigh in on this. I have refused to play a War Wizard in the past because Power Surge sucks so bad. Why would the original UA Power Surge not viable? I think it was pretty cool actually. IF to being a save spell is too much, change it to an attack spell instead or change it to just adding 1 additional damage dice instead of 2. Thoughts?
If i have power surge, will it active when I damage an enemy with my wizard cantrip spell?
Yes.
Cantrips are spells - and as long as they are on the Wizard spell list (in case you're multiclassing) you can get extra damage from Power Surge.
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