I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I'll agree with you only one can copy the scroll. However, this brings me to another question -- can the wizards copy each other's spellbooks? I mean, if you found a spellbook from another wizard, you can conceivable copy it to yours, correct? Couldn't they "share" their books with each other (provided they have the time/funds to do so)?
I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I'll agree with you only one can copy the scroll. However, this brings me to another question -- can the wizards copy each other's spellbooks? I mean, if you found a spellbook from another wizard, you can conceivable copy it to yours, correct? Couldn't they "share" their books with each other (provided they have the time/funds to do so)?
I guess that is possible, yes. Unless the spellbook of the wizard is weirdly coded...
I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I'll agree with you only one can copy the scroll. However, this brings me to another question -- can the wizards copy each other's spellbooks? I mean, if you found a spellbook from another wizard, you can conceivable copy it to yours, correct? Couldn't they "share" their books with each other (provided they have the time/funds to do so)?
I guess that is possible, yes. Unless the spellbook of the wizard is weirdly coded...
yeah this prompted me to do some searching, open up the PHB, and browse the internet. I guess wizards sharing spellbooks is a thing, some DM's allow it, some don't. There isn't an explicit rule (that I see) that defines if it is allowed or not.
On that note, I would tell the players that only one of them can copy the scroll. I wouldn't tell them that they can share spellbooks, only because that is something I would want them to come up with on their own. If they asked if they could just copy each others spellbooks, I wouldn't give a flat yes or no, I'd say you can try (while allowing it) -- this way their characters made that discovery. The only problem I see potentially occurring is the obvious planning around that by those two wizards for every time they level from now on. It's not really a problem at all, it's just the characters optimizing themselves, but is something to think about if that would bother you.
I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I'll agree with you only one can copy the scroll. However, this brings me to another question -- can the wizards copy each other's spellbooks? I mean, if you found a spellbook from another wizard, you can conceivable copy it to yours, correct? Couldn't they "share" their books with each other (provided they have the time/funds to do so)?
I guess that is possible, yes. Unless the spellbook of the wizard is weirdly coded...
yeah this prompted me to do some searching, open up the PHB, and browse the internet. I guess wizards sharing spellbooks is a thing, some DM's allow it, some don't. There isn't an explicit rule (that I see) that defines if it is allowed or not.
On that note, I would tell the players that only one of them can copy the scroll. I wouldn't tell them that they can share spellbooks, only because that is something I would want them to come up with on their own. If they asked if they could just copy each others spellbooks, I wouldn't give a flat yes or no, I'd say you can try (while allowing it) -- this way their characters made that discovery. The only problem I see potentially occurring is the obvious planning around that by those two wizards for every time they level from now on. It's not really a problem at all, it's just the characters optimizing themselves, but is something to think about if that would bother you.
oh, that's an interesting angle. I don't think it would occur to them to cooperate at that level, though. They spend most sessions bickering over who does/gets what. I'll tell you what, though, there's gonna be a tussle over that Fireball scroll they found this week.
I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I'll agree with you only one can copy the scroll. However, this brings me to another question -- can the wizards copy each other's spellbooks? I mean, if you found a spellbook from another wizard, you can conceivable copy it to yours, correct? Couldn't they "share" their books with each other (provided they have the time/funds to do so)?
I guess that is possible, yes. Unless the spellbook of the wizard is weirdly coded...
yeah this prompted me to do some searching, open up the PHB, and browse the internet. I guess wizards sharing spellbooks is a thing, some DM's allow it, some don't. There isn't an explicit rule (that I see) that defines if it is allowed or not.
On that note, I would tell the players that only one of them can copy the scroll. I wouldn't tell them that they can share spellbooks, only because that is something I would want them to come up with on their own. If they asked if they could just copy each others spellbooks, I wouldn't give a flat yes or no, I'd say you can try (while allowing it) -- this way their characters made that discovery. The only problem I see potentially occurring is the obvious planning around that by those two wizards for every time they level from now on. It's not really a problem at all, it's just the characters optimizing themselves, but is something to think about if that would bother you.
oh, that's an interesting angle. I don't think it would occur to them to cooperate at that level, though. They spend most sessions bickering over who does/gets what. I'll tell you what, though, there's gonna be a tussle over that Fireball scroll they found this week.
That's all just my opinion, you might want to tell them only one of them can attempt to copy the scroll, but they can share the spellbooks. Just remember, per Spell Scroll there is still the chance of failure when copying from the scroll. You might want to do this when copying from each other's spellbooks (instead of obviously the book/spell being destroyed, they just lose the materials/costs spent on the failed attempt)
I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I'll agree with you only one can copy the scroll. However, this brings me to another question -- can the wizards copy each other's spellbooks? I mean, if you found a spellbook from another wizard, you can conceivable copy it to yours, correct? Couldn't they "share" their books with each other (provided they have the time/funds to do so)?
I guess that is possible, yes. Unless the spellbook of the wizard is weirdly coded...
yeah this prompted me to do some searching, open up the PHB, and browse the internet. I guess wizards sharing spellbooks is a thing, some DM's allow it, some don't. There isn't an explicit rule (that I see) that defines if it is allowed or not.
On that note, I would tell the players that only one of them can copy the scroll. I wouldn't tell them that they can share spellbooks, only because that is something I would want them to come up with on their own. If they asked if they could just copy each others spellbooks, I wouldn't give a flat yes or no, I'd say you can try (while allowing it) -- this way their characters made that discovery. The only problem I see potentially occurring is the obvious planning around that by those two wizards for every time they level from now on. It's not really a problem at all, it's just the characters optimizing themselves, but is something to think about if that would bother you.
oh, that's an interesting angle. I don't think it would occur to them to cooperate at that level, though. They spend most sessions bickering over who does/gets what. I'll tell you what, though, there's gonna be a tussle over that Fireball scroll they found this week.
That's all just my opinion, you might want to tell them only one of them can attempt to copy the scroll, but they can share the spellbooks. Just remember, per Spell Scroll there is still the chance of failure when copying from the scroll. You might want to do this when copying from each other's spellbooks (instead of obviously the book/spell being destroyed, they just lose the materials/costs spent on the failed attempt)
I'm not sure I want to just give that to them, as I'm not an optimizer kind of guy*. If they figure it out, or think to ask, then I'd consider it, but I don't want to just give away a means to basically double their spells known. Even with the material cost and time components, you're going to have successes, and they'll just end up with a frillion spells known. I may put a condition on it, or something. Perhaps something like, "once per level, you have one try to copy a spell out of your co-wizard's spellbook." That way they still get a bonus as a reward for being clever, but it also doesn't just become the GameGenie for spells.
*Disclaimer: I have no issues with the Optimizer play style, it's just not my cup of tea.
I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I'll agree with you only one can copy the scroll. However, this brings me to another question -- can the wizards copy each other's spellbooks? I mean, if you found a spellbook from another wizard, you can conceivable copy it to yours, correct? Couldn't they "share" their books with each other (provided they have the time/funds to do so)?
I guess that is possible, yes. Unless the spellbook of the wizard is weirdly coded...
Isn't that taken into account in the Player's Handbook?
According to the sidebar on "Your Spellbook," copying a spell into your spellbook involves "deciphering the unique system of notation used by the wizard who wrote it."
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Kerrigan, gold dragonborn pact of the chain fiend warlock (8)/favored soul sorcerer (3): Survived Strahd Roland Crowe, stout halfling pirate (7): off working other angles while the party fights giants Alekhine Dorvanellyn, eladrin bladesinger (7): Fighting giants
I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I'll agree with you only one can copy the scroll. However, this brings me to another question -- can the wizards copy each other's spellbooks? I mean, if you found a spellbook from another wizard, you can conceivable copy it to yours, correct? Couldn't they "share" their books with each other (provided they have the time/funds to do so)?
I guess that is possible, yes. Unless the spellbook of the wizard is weirdly coded...
Isn't that taken into account in the Player's Handbook?
According to the sidebar on "Your Spellbook," copying a spell into your spellbook involves "deciphering the unique system of notation used by the wizard who wrote it."
Yes, but it doesn't clearly say "from another wizard's spellbook", but I think it is intended.
I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I'll agree with you only one can copy the scroll. However, this brings me to another question -- can the wizards copy each other's spellbooks? I mean, if you found a spellbook from another wizard, you can conceivable copy it to yours, correct? Couldn't they "share" their books with each other (provided they have the time/funds to do so)?
I guess that is possible, yes. Unless the spellbook of the wizard is weirdly coded...
Isn't that taken into account in the Player's Handbook?
According to the sidebar on "Your Spellbook," copying a spell into your spellbook involves "deciphering the unique system of notation used by the wizard who wrote it."
Maybe filcat is getting at the idea of coding it in a way beyond just a particular wizard's idiosyncrasies? I think we're in a gray area here that's bordering on homebrew. You could really add a whole little side system of spellbook management. If you want to code your spellbook in a secure way, maybe it costs you more time or resources to learn a spell since you also have to encode it. People trying to copy your spellbook might have to roll an Arcana check with a high-ish DC, or maybe even impose disadvantage on them. The DC could also be set taking into account the copier's wizard level, the level of the spell that they are copying, and maybe languages known. If you have the spellbook of a dragonborn wizard, and the spellbook is written in draconic, but you don't speak draconic...
Yeah, watch out for that rabbit hole. You could fall in deep. ;)
I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
I'll agree with you only one can copy the scroll. However, this brings me to another question -- can the wizards copy each other's spellbooks? I mean, if you found a spellbook from another wizard, you can conceivable copy it to yours, correct? Couldn't they "share" their books with each other (provided they have the time/funds to do so)?
I guess that is possible, yes. Unless the spellbook of the wizard is weirdly coded...
Isn't that taken into account in the Player's Handbook?
According to the sidebar on "Your Spellbook," copying a spell into your spellbook involves "deciphering the unique system of notation used by the wizard who wrote it."
There's nothing specific on copying from another spellbook, the problem with the "deciphering the unique system of notation" is that in contrast to a Spell Scroll the spellbook doesn't disappear after an attempt (failed or successful). That being said, with enough time you would be able to eventually decipher the book, unless there was some sort of limitation put on it (i.e. you can only try once per day).
"A wizard spell on a spell scroll can be copied just as spells in spellbooks can be copied. When a spell is copied from a spell scroll, the copier must succeed on an Intelligence (Arcana) check with a DC equal to 10 + the spell's level. If the check succeeds, the spell is successfully copied. Whether the check succeeds or fails, the spell scroll is destroyed"
remember that a wizard's spellbook is just a list of spells that he can chose from (5e right?), he still has to use his slots to cast them and slots don't increase from adding spells to a spellbook... by limiting the amount of spells they receive from scrolls and spellbooks you are unfairly hampering them, it is way more fun to allow them to acquire spells than to prevent them access to spells... try to flood the game with scrolls and fat spellbooks, watch the fun that ensues
I don't recall a specific limit on the number of spells a wizard can have in his spell book. Multiple volumes would of course allow for more spells. In previous editions when loss of spell books meant a good chance of losing the spells with them (possibly for good) wizards would often make "traveling spell books" with a selection of spells that they could take with them on adventures. This would allow them to prepare spells from that selection and if the traveling book was lost or destroyed they still had their main sell books at home to recopy the spells from.
Trading spells with other wizards was a popular way to expand your spell selection. As long as you could get the other wizard to trade with you.
I don't see any reason why there couldn't or wouldn't be themed spell books. Fire spells, or spells taught me by Bored Flack, or whatever theme the wizard who wrote them wanted.
Here is another spin, what if the wizard wanted to put that scroll spell, (or a spell from his/her book) onto a new scroll. Therefore duplicating the scroll. How does that work?
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I have a feeling I know the answer to this question, but some guys in my party are really pushing so I figured I'd make sure and ask. The party I'm DMing for has two wizards. In the case of finding a spell scroll, can both wizards copy it into their respective spellbook? My instinct says no, since the rules state that the writing fades from the scroll after one use. I figure copying the spell equals a use. They make an interesting argument though, in that they are both evocation wizards so they could work together to learn the spell. I'm not inclined to bend on this one, but it's at least a decent in-game reason.
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
Yes I agree. It is stated in the spell scroll's description. Whether the wizard succeeds or fails to copy the spell, the scroll is destroyed.
How do you get a one-armed goblin out of a tree?
Wave!
How do you get a one-armed goblin out of a tree?
Wave!
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
How do you get a one-armed goblin out of a tree?
Wave!
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
Kerrigan, gold dragonborn pact of the chain fiend warlock (8)/favored soul sorcerer (3): Survived Strahd
Roland Crowe, stout halfling pirate (7): off working other angles while the party fights giants
Alekhine Dorvanellyn, eladrin bladesinger (7): Fighting giants
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
How do you get a one-armed goblin out of a tree?
Wave!
How do you get a one-armed goblin out of a tree?
Wave!
"A wizard spell on a spell scroll can be copied just as spells in spellbooks can be copied. When a spell is copied from a spell scroll, the copier must succeed on an Intelligence (Arcana) check with a DC equal to 10 + the spell's level. If the check succeeds, the spell is successfully copied. Whether the check succeeds or fails, the spell scroll is destroyed"
From the spell scroll description...
remember that a wizard's spellbook is just a list of spells that he can chose from (5e right?), he still has to use his slots to cast them and slots don't increase from adding spells to a spellbook... by limiting the amount of spells they receive from scrolls and spellbooks you are unfairly hampering them, it is way more fun to allow them to acquire spells than to prevent them access to spells... try to flood the game with scrolls and fat spellbooks, watch the fun that ensues
how many spells can you put in a spellbook and are there special spellbooks ie pyromancers spellbook shadowspellbook
I don't recall a specific limit on the number of spells a wizard can have in his spell book. Multiple volumes would of course allow for more spells. In previous editions when loss of spell books meant a good chance of losing the spells with them (possibly for good) wizards would often make "traveling spell books" with a selection of spells that they could take with them on adventures. This would allow them to prepare spells from that selection and if the traveling book was lost or destroyed they still had their main sell books at home to recopy the spells from.
Trading spells with other wizards was a popular way to expand your spell selection. As long as you could get the other wizard to trade with you.
I don't see any reason why there couldn't or wouldn't be themed spell books. Fire spells, or spells taught me by Bored Flack, or whatever theme the wizard who wrote them wanted.
Here is another spin, what if the wizard wanted to put that scroll spell, (or a spell from his/her book) onto a new scroll. Therefore duplicating the scroll. How does that work?