(1) From my reading of Flaming Sphere (see description below), it's impossible to do any damage when you cast the spell using an Action. Damage doesn't occur until you use a Bonus Action to ram the sphere into a creature OR when a creature ends its turn within 5 feet of the sphere. That is, you cannot ram the sphere into a creature upon casting the spell. When cast, the sphere simply appears in an unoccupied space. Damage doesn't happen until you start using your Bonus Actions to move and then ram the sphere into creatures OR until creatures end their turns within 5 ft of the sphere. Is this a correct understanding of how the spell works???
(2) The spell has a range of 60 ft. Let's say you position the sphere 60 ft away from your position. Can you then use your Bonus Action to move the sphere 30 ft further away (so 90 ft total from your position)? Or does the sphere have to stay within 60 ft of your position to stay active???
(3) Does Flaming Sphere work with the Radiant Soul feature (see description below) that Celestial Warlocks get at Level 6? If it's true that Flaming Sphere does no damage when first cast, then it seems as though Radiant Soul would NOT work with Flaming Sphere, right???
Flaming Sphere (2nd-level conjuration spell; casting time: 1 action; range: 60 ft; duration: concentration, up to 1 minute) = "A 5-foot-diameter sphere of fire appears in an unoccupied space of your choice within range and lasts for the duration. Any creature that ends its turn within 5 feet of the sphere must make a Dexterity saving throw. The creature takes 2d6 fire damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one. As a bonus action, you can move the sphere up to 30 feet. If you ram the sphere into a creature, that creature must make the saving throw against the sphere’s damage, and the sphere stops moving this turn. When you move the sphere, you can direct it over barriers up to 5 feet tall and jump it across pits up to 10 feet wide. The sphere ignites flammable objects not being worn or carried, and it sheds bright light in a 20-foot radius and dim light for an additional 20 feet." (PHB, p. 242)
Radiant Soul = "Starting at 6th level, your link to the Celestial allows you to serve as a conduit for radiant energy. You have resistance to radiant damage, and when you cast a spell that deals radiant or fire damage, you add your Charisma modifier to one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets." (XGtE, p. 55)
2) The range determines where you can make the sphere first appear. Nothing says you lose control of it, or the spell ends, if it later leaves that range.
3) By the wording of Radiant Soul, no, it wouldn’t work. But I would allow it to at my table. Since we’re in house rule territory now, I’d probably allow it for the bonus action every turn and never for the damage on other creatures’ turns.
Radiant Soul. Starting at 6th level, your link to the Celestial allows you to serve as a conduit for radiant energy. You have resistance to radiant damage, and when you cast a spell that deals radiant or fire damage, you add your Charisma modifier to one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets.
Technically speaking, Flaming Sphere is “a spell that deals fire damage.“ RAW, I see no reason that the caster could not add their Cha mod to the damage the sphere does against one creature over the course of the spell’s entire duration. Radiant Soul never specifies that the extra damage has to be done at the same time the spell is cast. But it does specify “one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets.” So I don’t think it’s a houserule to allow it once, but it is definitely against RAW to allow it every round. I would rule the same way if it were Dragon’s Breath with Fire as the chosen damage type too for example.
Radiant Soul. Starting at 6th level, your link to the Celestial allows you to serve as a conduit for radiant energy. You have resistance to radiant damage, and when you cast a spell that deals radiant or fire damage, you add your Charisma modifier to one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets.
Technically speaking, Flaming Sphere is “a spell that deals fire damage.“ RAW, I see no reason that the caster could not add their Cha mod to the damage the sphere does against one creature over the course of the spell’s entire duration. Radiant Soul never specifies that the extra damage has to be done at the same time the spell is cast. But it does specify “one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets.” So I don’t think it’s a houserule to allow it once, but it is definitely against RAW to allow it every round. I would rule the same way if it were Dragon’s Breath with Fire as the chosen damage type too for example.
The reason I feel strict RAW precludes the feature from working is that it DOES specify the damage needs to be done at the same time the spell is cast. The trigger is “when you cast a spell,” not “when you deal damage with a spell.” A bonus action you take after casting a spell is very much not when you cast that spell.
I think this is an instance where either the language is accidentally more precise than the designers intended or it was written under the assumption that all spells do damage when they’re cast and not later. I don’t think it’s actually intended that spells like flaming sphere (and maybe even dragon’s breath, though it would shock me a lot less if excluding that one were intended) be excluded. But the feature very much does specify the timing.
Even just changing the language to “If” instead of “when” would open it up to allow it to work as you say. Taking it as such would be a very easy houserule and wouldn’t break anything, I think.
Radiant Soul. Starting at 6th level, your link to the Celestial allows you to serve as a conduit for radiant energy. You have resistance to radiant damage, and when you cast a spell that deals radiant or fire damage, you add your Charisma modifier to one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets.
Technically speaking, Flaming Sphere is “a spell that deals fire damage.“ RAW, I see no reason that the caster could not add their Cha mod to the damage the sphere does against one creature over the course of the spell’s entire duration. Radiant Soul never specifies that the extra damage has to be done at the same time the spell is cast. But it does specify “one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets.” So I don’t think it’s a houserule to allow it once, but it is definitely against RAW to allow it every round. I would rule the same way if it were Dragon’s Breath with Fire as the chosen damage type too for example.
The reason I feel strict RAW precludes the feature from working is that it DOES specify the damage needs to be done at the same time the spell is cast. The trigger is “when you cast a spell,” not “when you deal damage with a spell.” A bonus action you take after casting a spell is very much not when you cast that spell.
I think this is an instance where either the language is accidentally more precise than the designers intended or it was written under the assumption that all spells do damage when they’re cast and not later. I don’t think it’s actually intended that spells like flaming sphere (and maybe even dragon’s breath, though it would shock me a lot less if excluding that one were intended) be excluded. But the feature very much does specify the timing.
Even just changing the language to “If” instead of “when” would open it up to allow it to work as you say. Taking it as such would be a very easy houserule and wouldn’t break anything, I think.
I get what you’re saying, but I think this might be an instance where the language is simultaneously both “more precise than the designers intended” and less precise than intended.
I assume that your interpretation of the phrasing “when you cast a spell that deals radiant fire damage, you add your Charisma modifier to one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets” requires that the damage roll must already exists for the bonus to be applied, and therefore must have been generated when the spell is cast so that it can receive that bonus. That is a more than reasonable way to interpret that statement as RAW. I will not argue against that.
However, I interpret it that the bonus is generated when the spell is cast, and that it then exists on its own, simply awaiting the triggering damage roll so it can be applied. So while the generation of the bonus is triggered at casting, its application is triggered by the damage roll. I personally don’t see anything that explicitly requires both the generation of the bonus and its application to be concurrent. Make sense?
So my interpretation is not so much an issue of “if” vs “when,” and more along the lines of:
Sposta’s interpretation of Radiant Soul. Starting at 6th level, your link to the Celestial allows you to serve as a conduit for radiant energy. You have resistance to radiant damage, and you add your Charisma modifier to one damage roll against a single target for spells you cast that deal radiant or fire damage.
I’m definitely not on board with Radiant Soul working with Flaming Sphere. It’s a massive damage increase and therefore I would rule as written, and it only works on spells you are currently casting, not something you’re concentrating on. I love higher level combat and this needlessly ramps up low level spells. (IMO of course, YMMV)
From the replies so far (along with everything else I've read online), it appears there's no consensus on how Radiant Soul (Celestial Warlock feature) and Flaming Sphere interact with each other. Some people say Radiant Soul cannot be used with Flaming Sphere. Others say it can be used, but only 1 time to 1 target. Others say it can be used during the spell's duration (1 minute concentration) ... so 1 target per bonus action. So I guess it's ultimately up to the DM to make the final decision for the table. Nonetheless, it would be really nice to know what the designers intended when they wrote the Radiant Soul feature. Depending on the interpretation, it could either be a very powerful ability (that works with several of the spells added to the Celestial Warlock spell list) or just a so-so ability (with very limited applicability).
I think radiant soul not working with flaming sphere or sickening radiance is absolutley nonsense.
If that's the case then the feature legit solely exists:
1.) To make Sacred Flame slightly less useless on the off chance you are fighting something with low dexterity, and didn't wanna take eldritch blast. (2d8+5) On my current character.
2.) Give a minor damage boost to Guiding Bolt, a spell that will not need said bonus half the time mind you.
(7d6+5) (14d6+5 on a crit) on my current character.
3.) Make tome warlocks who took Firebolt happy. (2d10+5) (4d10+5 on a crit)
4.) Make your Hellish Rebuke, which would either be doing 3d10 if you are a tiefling using your racial spell, or be doing 5d10 damage by this point in the game if you are using spell slots, slightly more effective on a successful save at either (3d10+5) or (5d10+5) on my current character.
What fire and radiant spells do warlocks get that aren't from this classes ESL/bonus cantrips/pact of the tome?
Create Bonfire (Same Problem as Sacred Flame)
Green Flame Blade (Good for extra melee damage but you are likely gonna be blasting anyway)
Hellish Rebuke (Good for telling people to back off, if they have low dex, or at least don't have Evasion)
Spirit Shroud (Get a minor buff to your weapon damage for a minute, 2d8 max for warlocks)
Sickening Radiance (4d10 radiant damage and one of the most terrifying status effects if you keep your concentration save and your enemies keep failing their con saves? Sounds great.)
Wall of Light (Protect yourself or blast 6 light beams)
Investiture of Flame (MA Slot) (reject nature, become fire bender)
Crown of Stars (MA Slot) (throw glowing comets at people and shine bright)
Nonetheless, it would be really nice to know what the designers intended when they wrote the Radiant Soul feature. Depending on the interpretation, it could either be a very powerful ability (that works with several of the spells added to the Celestial Warlock spell list) or just a so-so ability (with very limited applicability).
I agree. I'd love for that to clarified somewhere. Likewise with the following subclass features:
All of them deal with a variant of a bonus to "one roll of a spell" but differ on what kind of roll (damage and/or healing) and other specific requirements.
I will note that Empowered Evocation lacks "when you cast a spell" to its wording but all the other ones include it. I don't know if that's particularly relevant to their design intent or just that they were less verbose when designing Wizard subclass features.
Radiant Soul can only add damage to a spell's targets. Flaming Sphere only has one target, which is a point in space, and that target takes no damage. By definition, it won't apply.
Likewise, a sorcerer can use flaming sphere to damage a creature behind total cover relative to the sorcerer. At no point does the spell itself or the sphere that's been summoned target anything other than that initial targeting of the point where the summoning happens, and total cover interferes with targeting.
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(1) From my reading of Flaming Sphere (see description below), it's impossible to do any damage when you cast the spell using an Action. Damage doesn't occur until you use a Bonus Action to ram the sphere into a creature OR when a creature ends its turn within 5 feet of the sphere. That is, you cannot ram the sphere into a creature upon casting the spell. When cast, the sphere simply appears in an unoccupied space. Damage doesn't happen until you start using your Bonus Actions to move and then ram the sphere into creatures OR until creatures end their turns within 5 ft of the sphere. Is this a correct understanding of how the spell works???
(2) The spell has a range of 60 ft. Let's say you position the sphere 60 ft away from your position. Can you then use your Bonus Action to move the sphere 30 ft further away (so 90 ft total from your position)? Or does the sphere have to stay within 60 ft of your position to stay active???
(3) Does Flaming Sphere work with the Radiant Soul feature (see description below) that Celestial Warlocks get at Level 6? If it's true that Flaming Sphere does no damage when first cast, then it seems as though Radiant Soul would NOT work with Flaming Sphere, right???
Flaming Sphere (2nd-level conjuration spell; casting time: 1 action; range: 60 ft; duration: concentration, up to 1 minute) = "A 5-foot-diameter sphere of fire appears in an unoccupied space of your choice within range and lasts for the duration. Any creature that ends its turn within 5 feet of the sphere must make a Dexterity saving throw. The creature takes 2d6 fire damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one. As a bonus action, you can move the sphere up to 30 feet. If you ram the sphere into a creature, that creature must make the saving throw against the sphere’s damage, and the sphere stops moving this turn. When you move the sphere, you can direct it over barriers up to 5 feet tall and jump it across pits up to 10 feet wide. The sphere ignites flammable objects not being worn or carried, and it sheds bright light in a 20-foot radius and dim light for an additional 20 feet." (PHB, p. 242)
Radiant Soul = "Starting at 6th level, your link to the Celestial allows you to serve as a conduit for radiant energy. You have resistance to radiant damage, and when you cast a spell that deals radiant or fire damage, you add your Charisma modifier to one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets." (XGtE, p. 55)
1) Yes, that’s correct.
2) The range determines where you can make the sphere first appear. Nothing says you lose control of it, or the spell ends, if it later leaves that range.
3) By the wording of Radiant Soul, no, it wouldn’t work. But I would allow it to at my table. Since we’re in house rule territory now, I’d probably allow it for the bonus action every turn and never for the damage on other creatures’ turns.
SagaTympana,
I think I disagree with you on #3.
Radiant Soul. Starting at 6th level, your link to the Celestial allows you to serve as a conduit for radiant energy. You have resistance to radiant damage, and when you cast a spell that deals radiant or fire damage, you add your Charisma modifier to one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets.
Technically speaking, Flaming Sphere is “a spell that deals fire damage.“ RAW, I see no reason that the caster could not add their Cha mod to the damage the sphere does against one creature over the course of the spell’s entire duration. Radiant Soul never specifies that the extra damage has to be done at the same time the spell is cast. But it does specify “one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets.” So I don’t think it’s a houserule to allow it once, but it is definitely against RAW to allow it every round. I would rule the same way if it were Dragon’s Breath with Fire as the chosen damage type too for example.
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The reason I feel strict RAW precludes the feature from working is that it DOES specify the damage needs to be done at the same time the spell is cast. The trigger is “when you cast a spell,” not “when you deal damage with a spell.” A bonus action you take after casting a spell is very much not when you cast that spell.
I think this is an instance where either the language is accidentally more precise than the designers intended or it was written under the assumption that all spells do damage when they’re cast and not later. I don’t think it’s actually intended that spells like flaming sphere (and maybe even dragon’s breath, though it would shock me a lot less if excluding that one were intended) be excluded. But the feature very much does specify the timing.
Even just changing the language to “If” instead of “when” would open it up to allow it to work as you say. Taking it as such would be a very easy houserule and wouldn’t break anything, I think.
I get what you’re saying, but I think this might be an instance where the language is simultaneously both “more precise than the designers intended” and less precise than intended.
I assume that your interpretation of the phrasing “when you cast a spell that deals radiant fire damage, you add your Charisma modifier to one radiant or fire damage roll of that spell against one of its targets” requires that the damage roll must already exists for the bonus to be applied, and therefore must have been generated when the spell is cast so that it can receive that bonus. That is a more than reasonable way to interpret that statement as RAW. I will not argue against that.
However, I interpret it that the bonus is generated when the spell is cast, and that it then exists on its own, simply awaiting the triggering damage roll so it can be applied. So while the generation of the bonus is triggered at casting, its application is triggered by the damage roll. I personally don’t see anything that explicitly requires both the generation of the bonus and its application to be concurrent. Make sense?
So my interpretation is not so much an issue of “if” vs “when,” and more along the lines of:
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I’m definitely not on board with Radiant Soul working with Flaming Sphere. It’s a massive damage increase and therefore I would rule as written, and it only works on spells you are currently casting, not something you’re concentrating on. I love higher level combat and this needlessly ramps up low level spells. (IMO of course, YMMV)
From the replies so far (along with everything else I've read online), it appears there's no consensus on how Radiant Soul (Celestial Warlock feature) and Flaming Sphere interact with each other. Some people say Radiant Soul cannot be used with Flaming Sphere. Others say it can be used, but only 1 time to 1 target. Others say it can be used during the spell's duration (1 minute concentration) ... so 1 target per bonus action. So I guess it's ultimately up to the DM to make the final decision for the table. Nonetheless, it would be really nice to know what the designers intended when they wrote the Radiant Soul feature. Depending on the interpretation, it could either be a very powerful ability (that works with several of the spells added to the Celestial Warlock spell list) or just a so-so ability (with very limited applicability).
I think radiant soul not working with flaming sphere or sickening radiance is absolutley nonsense.
If that's the case then the feature legit solely exists:
1.) To make Sacred Flame slightly less useless on the off chance you are fighting something with low dexterity, and didn't wanna take eldritch blast. (2d8+5) On my current character.
2.) Give a minor damage boost to Guiding Bolt, a spell that will not need said bonus half the time mind you.
(7d6+5) (14d6+5 on a crit) on my current character.
3.) Make tome warlocks who took Firebolt happy. (2d10+5) (4d10+5 on a crit)
4.) Make your Hellish Rebuke, which would either be doing 3d10 if you are a tiefling using your racial spell, or be doing 5d10 damage by this point in the game if you are using spell slots, slightly more effective on a successful save at either (3d10+5) or (5d10+5) on my current character.
What fire and radiant spells do warlocks get that aren't from this classes ESL/bonus cantrips/pact of the tome?
Create Bonfire (Same Problem as Sacred Flame)
Green Flame Blade (Good for extra melee damage but you are likely gonna be blasting anyway)
Hellish Rebuke (Good for telling people to back off, if they have low dex, or at least don't have Evasion)
Spirit Shroud (Get a minor buff to your weapon damage for a minute, 2d8 max for warlocks)
Sickening Radiance (4d10 radiant damage and one of the most terrifying status effects if you keep your concentration save and your enemies keep failing their con saves? Sounds great.)
Wall of Light (Protect yourself or blast 6 light beams)
Investiture of Flame (MA Slot) (reject nature, become fire bender)
Crown of Stars (MA Slot) (throw glowing comets at people and shine bright)
I like opossums
I agree. I'd love for that to clarified somewhere.
Likewise with the following subclass features:
Empowered Evocation (Evocation Wizard)
Elemental Affinity (Draconic Sorceror)
Enhanced Bond (Wildfire Druid)
Arcane Firearm (Artillerist Artificer)
Alchemical Savant (Alchemist Artificer)
All of them deal with a variant of a bonus to "one roll of a spell" but differ on what kind of roll (damage and/or healing) and other specific requirements.
I will note that Empowered Evocation lacks "when you cast a spell" to its wording but all the other ones include it. I don't know if that's particularly relevant to their design intent or just that they were less verbose when designing Wizard subclass features.
Radiant Soul can only add damage to a spell's targets. Flaming Sphere only has one target, which is a point in space, and that target takes no damage. By definition, it won't apply.
Likewise, a sorcerer can use flaming sphere to damage a creature behind total cover relative to the sorcerer. At no point does the spell itself or the sphere that's been summoned target anything other than that initial targeting of the point where the summoning happens, and total cover interferes with targeting.