It holds the same amount and has the same weight as a bag of holding but the exterior of the item doesn't change. The mouth magically opens to the correct size for the bag of holding.
The dimensions/properties of a bag of holding are the end result of the infusion; therefore, the source bag, once infused, will take on those properties.
If your DM (or you, if that's you) doesn't think a given pouch or bag would suffice as a legal target for that infusion, simply tell them so and instruct them to find a more suitable one. Similarly, if they found a piece of rope and wanted to turn it into a rope of climbing, it would be up to you to determine if the rope they found was long enough. This is one of those 5e things where the game depends on the DM to fill in a key blank by making a judgment-based ruling.
In my opinion, any DM getting nit-picky over whether a bag/pouch is the 'right size' to be turned into a bag of holding would be getting a stern talking to after the fact. Life's too short, surely?
In my opinion, any DM getting nit-picky over whether a bag/pouch is the 'right size' to be turned into a bag of holding would be getting a stern talking to after the fact. Life's too short, surely?
Eh, depends how much hassle they make it. The dimensions of the magic item are fixed, so it’s reasonable to disallow attempts at some kind of cheese from using a differently sized one, but most characters are going to have a backpack or similar object on hand anyways, so it’s not going to be an obstacle in practice.
I'd say any bag, sack, or backpack from the equipment chapter is fair game. If you're trying to use, I dunno, a brownie's coinpurse or something then... I'd still have it work but it would grow to the appropriate size once infused.
If the DM doesn't want them having a bag of holding they should just ban the infusion directly instead of hemming and hawing over mundane container availability.
In my opinion, any DM getting nit-picky over whether a bag/pouch is the 'right size' to be turned into a bag of holding would be getting a stern talking to after the fact. Life's too short, surely?
Eh, depends how much hassle they make it. The dimensions of the magic item are fixed, so it’s reasonable to disallow attempts at some kind of cheese from using a differently sized one, but most characters are going to have a backpack or similar object on hand anyways, so it’s not going to be an obstacle in practice.
If the intent was to argue that they could turn a 50 pound potato sack into a bag of holding that would hold more than a coinpurse sized one, that can be easily explained away by having the mechanics of the bag work the same regardless of the appearance. the appearance is mostly fluff anyway
Why can they not buy the appropriate cloth/material to make a correct sized bag and why can they just not buy the correct sized bag?
But then again I have always thought 5e needed a few extra containers of holding instead of just one single bag. Why not a spell that allows any container to hold 5 times is normal weight and size?
Pouch of holding, small bag of holding ,medium bag of holding and a large bag of holding. Plus with a spell you could also make pockets of holding in your clothing.
Without this spell and others like it 5e created the need for an Artificer. (which I think is an unneeded class.)
In my opinion, any DM getting nit-picky over whether a bag/pouch is the 'right size' to be turned into a bag of holding would be getting a stern talking to after the fact. Life's too short, surely?
Eh, depends how much hassle they make it. The dimensions of the magic item are fixed, so it’s reasonable to disallow attempts at some kind of cheese from using a differently sized one, but most characters are going to have a backpack or similar object on hand anyways, so it’s not going to be an obstacle in practice.
If the intent was to argue that they could turn a 50 pound potato sack into a bag of holding that would hold more than a coinpurse sized one, that can be easily explained away by having the mechanics of the bag work the same regardless of the appearance. the appearance is mostly fluff anyway
Mostly, but it does have some static features, and I would be a little wary of someone lobbying to tweak one of those. I don’t care how the bag looks, but an attempt to get its weight down below 10 pounds, for instance, “because I used a smaller bag” would be a red flag for me.
Given that a sack costs 1 CP and should be available in ant town/hamlet/city I wouldn’t allow the use of a pouch to create an artificer’s bag of holding. I might allow its use to creat a pouch of holding that held up to some value between 5&50#. On the question of other containers of holding the one from earlier versions I’ve found most useful was the Belt of Many pouches. It had 10 pouches along its length each of which actually had 10 sub pouches and it would present the item you were thinking about to you when you reached into a pouch - as long as it was in one of the 10 sub pouches of the pouch you reached into. Encumbrance of the belt - 5#, encumbrance held - 50#. While we can’t create it (yet) in the home brewer it can be created by customizing a bag of holding on the sheet.
I am not the ref, but i am a regular user of D&D Beyond, so offered to seek guidance
We have just escaped a prison and between the entire party we have three daggers and a money pouch which has a mouth diameter of no more than 4inches rather than the required 24"
The infusion of the pouch would give two main benefits, the first being he has a focus to cast spells with, and secondly he has something he can store things in that we pick up on our fast escape.
The player is hoping to be able to hide the bag under his shirt around his neck so if we're recaptured there is a chance it won't be spotted, therefore allowing them to keep a spell focus. But if this is allowed the ref will be opening up the idea that any sized bag no matter how small, can be used for a bag of holding and can still place larger than expected itemss in it. i.e. Items that could fit in a 2ft diameter hole. But also be a handy dandy small hidden pouch.
Overall it's not about disallowing a smart idea to give a player their spell focus and a useful item, it's more about not setting a president that allows a small coin purse to be used to store full sets of plate mail.
I'm inclined to suggest the pouch either:
Grows to the size required to become a standard bag of holding
Allow the smaller purse sized bag but limit the mouth size of the bag, which stops larger items being placed within but still has the 500lb limit within.
Regarding the instance at hand, it’s an edge case; they are looking to exploit the setup for an advantage over the RAW item, so it falls to the DM to decide if they’ll allow it or not. I wouldn’t hard block turning the pouch into a Bag of Holding here, particularly since an Artificer in particular is fairly heavily nerfed without a focus. Just have to weigh what making it more readily concealable would do in this case.
Basically any pouch or sack can be made into a bag of holding, the magic takes care of the specifics and the end product is always a standard bag of holding.
Ok, you’re escaped from prison, on the run AND before you can infuse anything you have to take a long rest (. 8 hrs of which at least 6 are sleep) . As I said before - get a regular sack - have the rogue in the party just steal one as you run through some random shop or general store. Then either get out of town or find a really good place to hole up for those 8 hours so you aren’t found (you hope) and then just infuse the sack. It sounds like your real problem right now is getting to where you can take that long rest to be able to infuse anything.
Grows to the size required to become a standard bag of holding
Allow the smaller purse sized bag but limit the mouth size of the bag, which stops larger items being placed within but still has the 500lb limit within.
Option #1 is the cleanest. Don't set the precedent that there are countless permutations of an infusion depending on the starting item; either the infusion works or it doesn't, and if it works, the stats of the end product are as the book entry.
We have an artificer in our party and we are lacking any decent gear. He has picked up a small pouch and wants to turn it into a bag of holding.
I can't find any rules stipulating what object should be used by an Artificer to create a Bag of Holding. So do people think it would work?
Would it:
1 - Simply not work as it's not the correct sized bag?
2 - Magically changes the pouch to the size of the required bag, therefore giving him what he wants?
3 - Create a smaller bag of holding that still holds 500lb inside but the mouth of the pouch dictates what can fit in it?
It holds the same amount and has the same weight as a bag of holding but the exterior of the item doesn't change. The mouth magically opens to the correct size for the bag of holding.
The dimensions/properties of a bag of holding are the end result of the infusion; therefore, the source bag, once infused, will take on those properties.
If your DM (or you, if that's you) doesn't think a given pouch or bag would suffice as a legal target for that infusion, simply tell them so and instruct them to find a more suitable one. Similarly, if they found a piece of rope and wanted to turn it into a rope of climbing, it would be up to you to determine if the rope they found was long enough. This is one of those 5e things where the game depends on the DM to fill in a key blank by making a judgment-based ruling.
In my opinion, any DM getting nit-picky over whether a bag/pouch is the 'right size' to be turned into a bag of holding would be getting a stern talking to after the fact. Life's too short, surely?
Eh, depends how much hassle they make it. The dimensions of the magic item are fixed, so it’s reasonable to disallow attempts at some kind of cheese from using a differently sized one, but most characters are going to have a backpack or similar object on hand anyways, so it’s not going to be an obstacle in practice.
I'd say any bag, sack, or backpack from the equipment chapter is fair game. If you're trying to use, I dunno, a brownie's coinpurse or something then... I'd still have it work but it would grow to the appropriate size once infused.
If the DM doesn't want them having a bag of holding they should just ban the infusion directly instead of hemming and hawing over mundane container availability.
If the intent was to argue that they could turn a 50 pound potato sack into a bag of holding that would hold more than a coinpurse sized one, that can be easily explained away by having the mechanics of the bag work the same regardless of the appearance. the appearance is mostly fluff anyway
Why can they not buy the appropriate cloth/material to make a correct sized bag and why can they just not buy the correct sized bag?
But then again I have always thought 5e needed a few extra containers of holding instead of just one single bag. Why not a spell that allows any container to hold 5 times is normal weight and size?
Pouch of holding, small bag of holding ,medium bag of holding and a large bag of holding. Plus with a spell you could also make pockets of holding in your clothing.
Without this spell and others like it 5e created the need for an Artificer. (which I think is an unneeded class.)
Mostly, but it does have some static features, and I would be a little wary of someone lobbying to tweak one of those. I don’t care how the bag looks, but an attempt to get its weight down below 10 pounds, for instance, “because I used a smaller bag” would be a red flag for me.
Given that a sack costs 1 CP and should be available in ant town/hamlet/city I wouldn’t allow the use of a pouch to create an artificer’s bag of holding. I might allow its use to creat a pouch of holding that held up to some value between 5&50#. On the question of other containers of holding the one from earlier versions I’ve found most useful was the Belt of Many pouches. It had 10 pouches along its length each of which actually had 10 sub pouches and it would present the item you were thinking about to you when you reached into a pouch - as long as it was in one of the 10 sub pouches of the pouch you reached into. Encumbrance of the belt - 5#, encumbrance held - 50#. While we can’t create it (yet) in the home brewer it can be created by customizing a bag of holding on the sheet.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
So just to clarify some points:
Overall it's not about disallowing a smart idea to give a player their spell focus and a useful item, it's more about not setting a president that allows a small coin purse to be used to store full sets of plate mail.
I'm inclined to suggest the pouch either:
A bag of holding weighs 10 pounds. Even if it's based on a much smaller object, it's still going to be pretty tricky to conceal.
It weighs 15, I checked. 10 pounds was my example because it’s the upper limit of Mage Hand, which could open the door to all kinds of headaches
Regarding the instance at hand, it’s an edge case; they are looking to exploit the setup for an advantage over the RAW item, so it falls to the DM to decide if they’ll allow it or not. I wouldn’t hard block turning the pouch into a Bag of Holding here, particularly since an Artificer in particular is fairly heavily nerfed without a focus. Just have to weigh what making it more readily concealable would do in this case.
Basically any pouch or sack can be made into a bag of holding, the magic takes care of the specifics and the end product is always a standard bag of holding.
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Ok, you’re escaped from prison, on the run AND before you can infuse anything you have to take a long rest (. 8 hrs of which at least 6 are sleep) . As I said before - get a regular sack - have the rogue in the party just steal one as you run through some random shop or general store. Then either get out of town or find a really good place to hole up for those 8 hours so you aren’t found (you hope) and then just infuse the sack. It sounds like your real problem right now is getting to where you can take that long rest to be able to infuse anything.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
Option #1 is the cleanest. Don't set the precedent that there are countless permutations of an infusion depending on the starting item; either the infusion works or it doesn't, and if it works, the stats of the end product are as the book entry.
The character can always use his prison wallet.
For those who do not know do not worry.
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Thanks all, it's great having so many responses, it's really helped
I know what we're going for now.