Main Question: I find it difficult to get a quick Challenge Rating for a group when I want to use creatures of different levels.
For instance, a werewolf is a challenge rating of 3 but a single wolf is only 1/4 each. Calculating the medium & difficult challenges becomes a real math game at this point. I've found a couple of websites that do the math for me if I use all the same level CR creatures, but I like to mix & match for story purposes.
Will D&D beyond include an enhanced CR calculator based on group size and monsters selected?
I haven't seen if they have discussed an "Encounter generator" section for D&D Beyond as that would probably be a Phase 3 item. My ideal scenario would be:
Create an encounter page where step 1 is to enter the number of players and their levels (in case they differ). Step 2 start selecting monsters from the monster listing and have an ongoing tally that shows the XP earned and the challenge rating as monsters are added both in quantity and per their CR.
Roughyl, the CR is the equivalent level of thr monster.
For example, the werewolf has a CR of 3, which means that a single werewolf is normal challenge of party of 3rd level.
For a group of few monsters, you can add the CR of the single monster to calculate the equivalent CR. For Example, 4 wolves have an overall CR of 1. But this methos is an approximation. For more than 4 monsters the CR increases more than linearly.
The table in the DM Basci rules, is complex but accurate.
I'd expect an encounter management system in Phase 3, though at this point, there are very limited details on what content will be included in each phase.
The encounter building tables in the DMG build encounters differently - it's not done off straight CR, but on the XP values and then multipliers with more than 1 creature.
The encounter building tables in the DMG build encounters differently - it's not done off straight CR, but on the XP values and then multipliers with more than 1 creature.
Sure, but if you have six small creatures and one large one, the math gets all wonky compared to two or three single creatures. I find I tend to make the first few battles after leveling up "easy" until I get a good feel for how they are playing, and I'd like to get a little closer to difficult is all, especially when using monsters I've never used before. Of course, the players never do what I was planning anyway....
The encounter building tables in the DMG build encounters differently - it's not done off straight CR, but on the XP values and then multipliers with more than 1 creature.
...players never do what I was planning anyway....
Sacred words. My suggestion is use the table from DMG at first, then let the experience guide you.
That's a fun one, thanks for sharing! And it exactly depicts a "simplified" version of what I was describing: selection of monsters showing party XP and challenge level.
I really hope DNDB realizes how much use this would get, especially with new players. This would become the "go to" page for new players setting up an encounter and for experienced players it would quickly calculate the party XP which is nice. This kind of page would definitely take a lot of the intimidation out of being a first time DM, which might encourage even more people to attempt it.
The encounter building tables in the DMG build encounters differently - it's not done off straight CR, but on the XP values and then multipliers with more than 1 creature.
Yeah, but in the world of catch 22, below is how DNDB explains experience points. So in effect, the CR & XP are interchangeable if you look at the table.
Experience Points
The number of experience points (XP) a monster is worth is based on its challenge rating.
Monster challenges can be difficult. Essentially the math gets out of whack because 5 PCs make 5-10 attacks a round while the monster makes 1-2 attacks per round. A single monster therefore has 5 targets and can only hit one of them. While he has to take 5-10+ attacks. There is no easy way around this fact. Even five monsters are taking more hits than they can possibly dish out. An extra PC might not seem like much, but that is more damage the monster has to take.
Solo monsters are a nightmare in D&D.
So using XP is a great way to approx. how well your PCs will do. But because the game assumes something like six encounters in a day, you can make more challenging encounters that drain resources if you make fewer encounters.
Just make some easy encounters and see how well the PCs do and keep track of how much damage they do reach round. That should help you.
Its the days that you are only going to have 1-2 encounters that really make it tough to come up with encounters.
Biggest thing to watch out for is using monsters where their CR > the level of your lowest PC. While it is possible have CR monsters > character level, you have to pay attention to special features and how much damage the monster can do at one time.
Also if you notice your PCs end up using a lot of resources in one battle you might want to go easy on the in the next encounter(s) until they can recoup. However, sometimes you have to learn the hard way that you should have retreated.
I have been wondering this. You answered very well but I just want to be sure I am understanding. If I have a party of 6, 3rd level characters, a CR 3 monster is a good match? Does it vary depending on actually number of party members? I assume so. And even if a player is very skilled is there a limit you would suggest? Like a party of 6, 3rd level characters should not try to fight a monster with a CR of 6? Just hoping for an idea. Thanks.
I have been wondering this. You answered very well but I just want to be sure I am understanding. If I have a party of 6, 3rd level characters, a CR 3 monster is a good match? Does it vary depending on actually number of party members? I assume so. And even if a player is very skilled is there a limit you would suggest? Like a party of 6, 3rd level characters should not try to fight a monster with a CR of 6? Just hoping for an idea. Thanks.
I can guide you with the XP table.
For 6 characters of level 3 you have this difficulties:
(Easy 75 Medium 150 Hard 225 Deadly 400) x 6 = (Easy 450 Medium 900 Hard 1350 Deadly 2400)
A CR 3 monster, like a Basilisk, is 700 XP * 0.5 = 350 XP, so it is a very easy encounter
3 CR 3 monsters are (700 * 3) * 1.5 = 3150 XP, so a quite a deadly encounter.
A single CR 6 monster , like a Chimera, is 2300 XP * 0.5 = 1150, a nearly hard encounter.
2 CR 6 monster is 2300*2 = 4600 XP, a very deadly encounter.
Note: 0.5 and 1.5 are the XP modifiers for a 6 member party against a single monster and 3 monsters, respectively.
The monster would be a good match for a single PC. If you have more than one PC you need to add more of them to make the encounter a challenge.
The challenge xp table does fail in that it assumes you are going to have like six encounters in a day. If you are only having one, then you can potentially stretch the table.
The more PCs the harder the encounter has to be. You are pretty safe around 4-5 players to use the table.
Main Question: I find it difficult to get a quick Challenge Rating for a group when I want to use creatures of different levels.
For instance, a werewolf is a challenge rating of 3 but a single wolf is only 1/4 each. Calculating the medium & difficult challenges becomes a real math game at this point. I've found a couple of websites that do the math for me if I use all the same level CR creatures, but I like to mix & match for story purposes.
Will D&D beyond include an enhanced CR calculator based on group size and monsters selected?
I haven't seen if they have discussed an "Encounter generator" section for D&D Beyond as that would probably be a Phase 3 item. My ideal scenario would be:
Create an encounter page where step 1 is to enter the number of players and their levels (in case they differ). Step 2 start selecting monsters from the monster listing and have an ongoing tally that shows the XP earned and the challenge rating as monsters are added both in quantity and per their CR.
Thanks!
Roughyl, the CR is the equivalent level of thr monster.
For example, the werewolf has a CR of 3, which means that a single werewolf is normal challenge of party of 3rd level.
For a group of few monsters, you can add the CR of the single monster to calculate the equivalent CR. For Example, 4 wolves have an overall CR of 1. But this methos is an approximation. For more than 4 monsters the CR increases more than linearly.
The table in the DM Basci rules, is complex but accurate.
I'd expect an encounter management system in Phase 3, though at this point, there are very limited details on what content will be included in each phase.
Pun-loving nerd | She/Her/Hers | Profile art by Becca Golins
If you need help with homebrew, please post on the homebrew forums, where multiple staff and moderators can read your post and help you!
"We got this, no problem! I'll take the twenty on the left - you guys handle the one on the right!"🔊
The encounter building tables in the DMG build encounters differently - it's not done off straight CR, but on the XP values and then multipliers with more than 1 creature.
Site Rules & Guidelines || How to Tooltip || Contact Support || Changelog || Pricing FAQ || Homebrew FAQ
If you have questions/concerns, please Private Message me or another moderator.
Wary the wizard who focuses on homebrew, for he can create nightmares that you wouldn't even dream of
https://donjon.bin.sh/5e/calc/enc_size.html
This is a good reference to help build your encounters. What I do for my encounters however is use this http://donjon.bin.sh/5e/random/#type=encounter;n_pc=4;level=1;difficulty=any;environment=Underdark and write down a couple that I like for different difficulties and depending on how the party is doing just plug in a harder or easier encounter.
― Steven Erikson, Memories of Ice
Experience Points
The number of experience points (XP) a monster is worth is based on its challenge rating.
The complexity of these calculations increases if you're not dealing with a standard 4-person party. Increase the danger and multiply by 1.5, etc.
Chandelierianism: Not just for interns anymore.
Monster challenges can be difficult. Essentially the math gets out of whack because 5 PCs make 5-10 attacks a round while the monster makes 1-2 attacks per round. A single monster therefore has 5 targets and can only hit one of them. While he has to take 5-10+ attacks. There is no easy way around this fact. Even five monsters are taking more hits than they can possibly dish out. An extra PC might not seem like much, but that is more damage the monster has to take.
Solo monsters are a nightmare in D&D.
So using XP is a great way to approx. how well your PCs will do. But because the game assumes something like six encounters in a day, you can make more challenging encounters that drain resources if you make fewer encounters.
Just make some easy encounters and see how well the PCs do and keep track of how much damage they do reach round. That should help you.
Its the days that you are only going to have 1-2 encounters that really make it tough to come up with encounters.
Great suggestion - thanks for articulating what I've been vaguely feeling!
Chandelierianism: Not just for interns anymore.
Biggest thing to watch out for is using monsters where their CR > the level of your lowest PC. While it is possible have CR monsters > character level, you have to pay attention to special features and how much damage the monster can do at one time.
Also if you notice your PCs end up using a lot of resources in one battle you might want to go easy on the in the next encounter(s) until they can recoup. However, sometimes you have to learn the hard way that you should have retreated.
I have been wondering this. You answered very well but I just want to be sure I am understanding. If I have a party of 6, 3rd level characters, a CR 3 monster is a good match? Does it vary depending on actually number of party members? I assume so. And even if a player is very skilled is there a limit you would suggest? Like a party of 6, 3rd level characters should not try to fight a monster with a CR of 6? Just hoping for an idea. Thanks.
The monster would be a good match for a single PC. If you have more than one PC you need to add more of them to make the encounter a challenge.
The challenge xp table does fail in that it assumes you are going to have like six encounters in a day. If you are only having one, then you can potentially stretch the table.
The more PCs the harder the encounter has to be. You are pretty safe around 4-5 players to use the table.
Cool thanks.