I was wondering if the School of Evocation, wizard level 10 ability Empowered Evocation damage bonus benefits cantrips. Just reading it I would have assumed so, but then I started thinking well perhaps cantrips aren’t really considered ‘spells’? I became more uncertain after reading the errata that states Overchannel cannot benefit cantrips (https://media.wizards.com/2016/downloads/DND/PH-Errata.pdf), as to me, the wording of both abilities appears similar.
I welcome any thoughts on the matter, and if this has been referenced somewhere else please let me know.
Empowered Evocation applies to any Evocation spell that has a damage roll - cantrips included. You only add the INT modifier once though, not once per die. So a 10th level wizard casting Fire Bolt would roll 2d10+INT mod. Fireball would be 8d6+INT mod.
The errata about not applying to Cantrips only applies to the 14th level ability Overchannel.
That is what I initially thought (and hoped). For some reason I thought because they both talked about lower level evocation spells, when one singled out cantrips the other did as well. I am relived this is not the case.
One could think of it similar to adding a ability modifier to a weapon hit or Agonizing Blast.
Here is a case where you should not try to interpret the intent of the rules.
It says one time — that means one spell per day or per long rest. It doesn’t mean every spell you cast or they would have said for every spell cast. See?
Next, spells aren’t cantrips. This is a thing. You can not beef cantrips with this power. It’s fine the way it is without augmenting. Let’s say you have a 20 intelligence. That’s adds +5 damage per long rest. Make it count. Put that +5 damage on a magic missile or on a disintegrate spell. Not per every spell. Not overpowered.
Here is a case where you should not try to interpret the intent of the rules.
It says one time — that means one spell per day or per long rest. It doesn’t mean every spell you cast or they would have said for every spell cast. See?
What rule are you referring to here?
Empowered Evocation applies to one damage roll each time you cast an evocation spell. There is no mention of only allowing this ability to be used once per any form of rest.
The "one damage roll" is present for those spells which allow more than one damage roll - this ability would only allow the extra damage on ONE of those rolls.
Here is a case where you should not try to interpret the intent of the rules.
It says one time — that means one spell per day or per long rest. It doesn’t mean every spell you cast or they would have said for every spell cast. See?
Next, spells aren’t cantrips. This is a thing. You can not beef cantrips with this power. It’s fine the way it is without augmenting. Let’s say you have a 20 intelligence. That’s adds +5 damage per long rest. Make it count. Put that +5 damage on a magic missile or on a disintegrate spell. Not per every spell. Not overpowered.
Welcome to the forums. But wow, it's pretty impressive to necro a threat that is almost four years old to make not one, but two incorrect statements.
Beginning at 10th level, you can add your Intelligence modifier to one damage roll of any wizard evocation spell you cast.
This sentence places no limit on the number of times you can use this feature or when it resets--only that you can empower one damage roll on a given spell.
Cantrips are spells. Level 0 spells are cantrips. Evocation cantrips that involve a damage roll are fair game for empowered evocation.
Cantrips
A cantrip is a spell that can be cast at will, without using a spell slot and without being prepared in advance. Repeated practice has fixed the spell in the caster's mind and infused the caster with the magic needed to produce the effect over and over. A cantrip's spell level is 0.
So can you use it 2 times per turn? ie i have a ba evocation spell, arcane hand or crown of stars and then action cast IE fireball, do i get to add the damage to both spells?
It isn't limited in amount of times. So however many times you can cast an evocation spell that is however many times you can use the feature.
The one thing that might be an issues is that it says "of any wizard evocation spell you cast" so it isn't clear if it can only happen when you cast the spell or if you would also be allowed to use it for those continual activations that spells like Arcane Hand or Crown of Stars give you. IMO you probably should but check with your DM.
So can you use it 2 times per turn? ie i have a ba evocation spell, arcane hand or crown of stars and then action cast IE fireball, do i get to add the damage to both spells?
In this case, no. If you cast any spell as a Bonus Action (cantrip or leveled) the only other spell you can cast on that turn is a cantrip with a casting time of 1 action. So no fireball as an action. Firebolt? Yes. And yes it applies to both spells
no, the dm ruled that i could only use it once, and i was fine with it but ruled the dragon born sorcerer could use their +5 every fire spell, so turn 1 cast crown, ba fire it,
turn 2 ba crown it hits plus 5, then action cone of cold for max damage of 69 on fail plus the 4d12+5? that is what im asking, on the ba and the action spell,
In this case, no. If you cast any spell as a Bonus Action (cantrip or leveled) the only other spell you can cast on that turn is a cantrip with a casting time of 1 action. So no fireball as an action. Firebolt? Yes. And yes it applies to both spells
He isn't casting a BA spell though. Both Arcane Hand and Crown of Stars are cast with an action but have an effect that can be activated on later turns with a bonus action. So Fireball is very much still an option.
In this case, no. If you cast any spell as a Bonus Action (cantrip or leveled) the only other spell you can cast on that turn is a cantrip with a casting time of 1 action. So no fireball as an action. Firebolt? Yes. And yes it applies to both spells
He isn't casting a BA spell though. Both Arcane Hand and Crown of Stars are cast with an action but have an effect that can be activated on later turns with a bonus action. So Fireball is very much still an option.
That was my bad, misread when they were saying. Thanks for the correction.
Correct. You only get to apply the modifier to a single damage roll in the entirety of the spell, so for instance if you cast Melf's Acid Arrow, you could apply the modifier to either the initial damage or the follow up damage on the end of the target's turn, and if you used something like Melf's Minute Meteors you would only apply the modifier to a single meteor across the entire duration. Interestingly, if you either used a damaging Evocation with a Bonus Action casting time or used the Quicken Spell Metamagic, it appears you could apply the modifier twice in a turn by using either two casts of an Evocation cantrip or a leveled Evocation spell and an Evocation cantrip.
I was wondering if the School of Evocation, wizard level 10 ability Empowered Evocation damage bonus benefits cantrips. Just reading it I would have assumed so, but then I started thinking well perhaps cantrips aren’t really considered ‘spells’? I became more uncertain after reading the errata that states Overchannel cannot benefit cantrips (https://media.wizards.com/2016/downloads/DND/PH-Errata.pdf), as to me, the wording of both abilities appears similar.
I welcome any thoughts on the matter, and if this has been referenced somewhere else please let me know.
Thank you.
Empowered Evocation applies to any Evocation spell that has a damage roll - cantrips included. You only add the INT modifier once though, not once per die. So a 10th level wizard casting Fire Bolt would roll 2d10+INT mod. Fireball would be 8d6+INT mod.
The errata about not applying to Cantrips only applies to the 14th level ability Overchannel.
Site Rules & Guidelines || How to Tooltip || Contact Support || Changelog || Pricing FAQ || Homebrew FAQ
If you have questions/concerns, please Private Message me or another moderator.
Wary the wizard who focuses on homebrew, for he can create nightmares that you wouldn't even dream of
That is what I initially thought (and hoped). For some reason I thought because they both talked about lower level evocation spells, when one singled out cantrips the other did as well. I am relived this is not the case.
One could think of it similar to adding a ability modifier to a weapon hit or Agonizing Blast.
Here is a case where you should not try to interpret the intent of the rules.
It says one time — that means one spell per day or per long rest. It doesn’t mean every spell you cast or they would have said for every spell cast. See?
Next, spells aren’t cantrips. This is a thing. You can not beef cantrips with this power. It’s fine the way it is without augmenting. Let’s say you have a 20 intelligence. That’s adds +5 damage per long rest. Make it count. Put that +5 damage on a magic missile or on a disintegrate spell. Not per every spell. Not overpowered.
What rule are you referring to here?
Empowered Evocation applies to one damage roll each time you cast an evocation spell. There is no mention of only allowing this ability to be used once per any form of rest.
The "one damage roll" is present for those spells which allow more than one damage roll - this ability would only allow the extra damage on ONE of those rolls.
Welcome to the forums. But wow, it's pretty impressive to necro a threat that is almost four years old to make not one, but two incorrect statements.
(emphasis mine)
"Not all those who wander are lost"
So can you use it 2 times per turn? ie i have a ba evocation spell, arcane hand or crown of stars and then action cast IE fireball, do i get to add the damage to both spells?
It isn't limited in amount of times. So however many times you can cast an evocation spell that is however many times you can use the feature.
The one thing that might be an issues is that it says "of any wizard evocation spell you cast" so it isn't clear if it can only happen when you cast the spell or if you would also be allowed to use it for those continual activations that spells like Arcane Hand or Crown of Stars give you. IMO you probably should but check with your DM.
In this case, no. If you cast any spell as a Bonus Action (cantrip or leveled) the only other spell you can cast on that turn is a cantrip with a casting time of 1 action. So no fireball as an action. Firebolt? Yes. And yes it applies to both spells
no, the dm ruled that i could only use it once, and i was fine with it but ruled the dragon born sorcerer could use their +5 every fire spell, so turn 1 cast crown, ba fire it,
turn 2 ba crown it hits plus 5, then action cone of cold for max damage of 69 on fail plus the 4d12+5? that is what im asking, on the ba and the action spell,
He isn't casting a BA spell though. Both Arcane Hand and Crown of Stars are cast with an action but have an effect that can be activated on later turns with a bonus action. So Fireball is very much still an option.
That was my bad, misread when they were saying. Thanks for the correction.
New Question. It does say you only get it for one damage roll per CAST. Doesn't that mean multi-turn spells only get it on the first turn?
Correct. You only get to apply the modifier to a single damage roll in the entirety of the spell, so for instance if you cast Melf's Acid Arrow, you could apply the modifier to either the initial damage or the follow up damage on the end of the target's turn, and if you used something like Melf's Minute Meteors you would only apply the modifier to a single meteor across the entire duration. Interestingly, if you either used a damaging Evocation with a Bonus Action casting time or used the Quicken Spell Metamagic, it appears you could apply the modifier twice in a turn by using either two casts of an Evocation cantrip or a leveled Evocation spell and an Evocation cantrip.
Doesn't have to be the first turn though. Only once yes, but the player gets to choose which time.