"You imbue a weapon you touch with holy power. Until the spell ends, the weapon emits bright light in a 30-foot radius and dim light for an additional 30 feet. In addition, weapon attacks made with it deal an extra 2d8 radiant damage on a hit. If the weapon isn’t already a magic weapon, it becomes one for the duration.
As a bonus action on your turn, you can dismiss this spell and cause the weapon to emit a burst of radiance. Each creature of your choice that you can see within 30 feet of you must make a Constitution saving throw. On a failed save, a creature takes 4d8 radiant damage, and it is blinded for 1 minute. On a successful save, a creature takes half as much damage and isn’t blinded. At the end of each of its turns, a blinded creature can make a Constitution saving throw, ending the effect on itself on a success."
So you can imbue another characters weapon and if so could imbue an arrow with the spell and on your next turn as a bonus action cause the second effect to take place? Or imbue your own weapon if you were say a War Cleric as one of your actions and throw said weapon on next turn then as a bonus action use the burst of radiance effect?
An arrow is not a weapon, it is a piece of ammo for a weapon. However, you could probably do what you're thinking with a throwing weapon - the description does not say you have to be holding the weapon for its effects to occur. However, the effect does say "within 30 feet of you", not from the weapon, so I don't think this is RAI.
I fully expect to see errata for this one. It's very easy to adjust the wording to fit design intent, they'll either make it "While holding the weapon" or "within 30 feet of the weapon".
Personally, I'd make it burst-able to the weapon's location. There's something about a paladin's last, desperate action being to toss his last weapon, his trusted sword (yes, as an improvised thrown weapon :p ) and see it burst into brilliant light as it hits the Death Knight. Or something. I like the visual, and I don't think it breaks anything with Thrown weapons (as opposed to bows - the same thing at 600 ft becomes a little weird; artillery is best handled with catapults (or trebuchets)).
I have a different holy weapon question. Let’s say cast the spell and use it to attack in the first round. On the second round can a attack with the weapon and then use my bonus action to cause the weapon to emit the burst of radiance? That would be a nice feature. I think you can do it. Any input?
Sure you can. You can take your Action and use a Bonus Action in any order during your turn, and Holy Weapon doesn't mention any restrictions that contradict that general rule.
So, Bonus Action (cast Holy Weapon), then Attack action on your first turn, and Attack followed by Bonus Action (to dismiss Holy Weapon with a burst) during the second turn.
I think you could cast spiritual weapon with a bonus action since it requires no concentration and last a minute. On the next turn you cast Holy Weapon with a bonus action and that means you can’t do anything with the spirtiual weapon that turn but on the following turns you can use spiritual weapon on your weapon using concentration and then use bonus actions to attack with the spirtiual weapon.
Or you cast holy weapon first using your bonus action then on the next turn cast spirtiual weapon using your bonus action. I may never need that but for almost a minute your damage would be very stout.
Spiritual Weapon specifically states it creates a weapon. Holy Weapon only requires the object you imbue with the effect to be a weapon, which spiritual weapon is. HOWEVER, doing so is utterly pointless. The extra damage of Holy Weapon is only triggered on weapon attacks and although Spiritual Weapon is a weapon, it doesn't make weapon attacks: it makes spell attacks which are a different thing.
I know this is an old thread but why wouldn’t spiritual weapons use be considered a weapon attack? The fact that it makes spell attacks doesn’t change the fact that it is also a weapon.
Seems like a similar situation as to why a rogue can make use of its sneak attack feature while utilizing a sling and the magic stone cantrip.
It is also a weapon as you point out. But it is first and foremost a spell. And if it's a weapon attack, would it be a melee weapon attack? Modifiers for those are typically based on STR and that isn't as relevant in the situation of a free floating weapon that attacks on its own at your command.
I know this is an old thread but why wouldn’t spiritual weapons use be considered a weapon attack? The fact that it makes spell attacks doesn’t change the fact that it is also a weapon.
Seems like a similar situation as to why a rogue can make use of its sneak attack feature while utilizing a sling and the magic stone cantrip.
A weapon attack and a spell attack are different things and are game terms. The spiritual weapon, although a weapon, does not make weapon attacks - it makes spell attacks. Because of this it cannot add the extra damage of the Holy Weapon spell which only enhances the damage from weapon attacks.
Or to be more general: a weapon attack is the attack of some more physical origin. A spell attack is from magic. Since the Spiritual Weapon is not a physical thing - it is a construct of pure magic (which is why it cannot be considered an object) it only does spell attacks.
I know this is an old thread but why wouldn’t spiritual weapons use be considered a weapon attack? The fact that it makes spell attacks doesn’t change the fact that it is also a weapon.
Seems like a similar situation as to why a rogue can make use of its sneak attack feature while utilizing a sling and the magic stone cantrip.
A weapon attack and a spell attack are different things and are game terms. The spiritual weapon, although a weapon, does not make weapon attacks - it makes spell attacks. Because of this it cannot add the extra damage of the Holy Weapon spell which only enhances the damage from weapon attacks.
Or to be more general: a weapon attack is the attack of some more physical origin. A spell attack is from magic. Since the Spiritual Weapon is not a physical thing - it is a construct of pure magic (which is why it cannot be considered an object) it only does spell attacks.
Correct, yet I wouldn't place the point of significance on whether the spell conjures a physical item or not. Spells like Flame Blade and Shadow Blade both conjure weapons that are tangible, but function differently. Spiritual Weapon is closer to Flame Blade. While Flame Blade conjures a weapon that you have to manually wield, making use of the weapon still explicitly calls for you to make a spell attack, so it would not benefit from Holy Weapon. Shadow Blade, however, summons a weapon that you actually use as a weapon, so it can benefit from Holy Weapon.
An even simpler way of categorizing is what type of action does the spell require to make attacks with the weapon? If the spell explicitly calls for using your full action/bonus action to make an attack with the weapon, it's probably not going to combo with other stuff. If the weapon can be used (like a regular weapon) as part of you taking the Attack action, it's probably going to be able to combo with other things. At the end of the day, it always breaks down to what the spell says it does.
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You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
I know this is an old thread but why wouldn’t spiritual weapons use be considered a weapon attack? The fact that it makes spell attacks doesn’t change the fact that it is also a weapon.
Seems like a similar situation as to why a rogue can make use of its sneak attack feature while utilizing a sling and the magic stone cantrip.
A weapon attack and a spell attack are different things and are game terms. The spiritual weapon, although a weapon, does not make weapon attacks - it makes spell attacks. Because of this it cannot add the extra damage of the Holy Weapon spell which only enhances the damage from weapon attacks.
Or to be more general: a weapon attack is the attack of some more physical origin. A spell attack is from magic. Since the Spiritual Weapon is not a physical thing - it is a construct of pure magic (which is why it cannot be considered an object) it only does spell attacks.
Correct, yet I wouldn't place the point of significance on whether the spell conjures a physical item or not. Spells like Flame Blade and Shadow Blade both conjure weapons that are tangible, but function differently. Spiritual Weapon is closer to Flame Blade. While Flame Blade conjures a weapon that you have to manually wield, making use of the weapon still explicitly calls for you to make a spell attack, so it would not benefit from Holy Weapon. Shadow Blade, however, summons a weapon that you actually use as a weapon, so it can benefit from Holy Weapon.
An even simpler way of categorizing is what type of action does the spell require to make attacks with the weapon? If the spell explicitly calls for using your full action/bonus action to make an attack with the weapon, it's probably not going to combo with other stuff. If the weapon can be used (like a regular weapon) as part of you taking the Attack action, it's probably going to be able to combo with other things. At the end of the day, it always breaks down to what the spell says it does.
I only mentioned the physical thing in a generic thing to try and help people understand why the game has "weapon attack" and "spell attack" - and probably didn't do a good job.
Realistically, all that matters is what the spells say.
I think you could cast spiritual weapon with a bonus action since it requires no concentration and last a minute. On the next turn you cast Holy Weapon with a bonus action and that means you can’t do anything with the spirtiual weapon that turn but on the following turns you can use spiritual weapon on your weapon using concentration and then use bonus actions to attack with the spirtiual weapon.
Or you cast holy weapon first using your bonus action then on the next turn cast spirtiual weapon using your bonus action. I may never need that but for almost a minute your damage would be very stout.
I'd cast holy weapon first since spiritual weapon can attack the round it is summoned that way by round 2 you are attacking with both.
I think you could cast spiritual weapon with a bonus action since it requires no concentration and last a minute. On the next turn you cast Holy Weapon with a bonus action and that means you can’t do anything with the spirtiual weapon that turn but on the following turns you can use spiritual weapon on your weapon using concentration and then use bonus actions to attack with the spirtiual weapon.
Or you cast holy weapon first using your bonus action then on the next turn cast spirtiual weapon using your bonus action. I may never need that but for almost a minute your damage would be very stout.
My Way: Round 1:(Bonus Action) Cast holy weapon. (Action) weapon attack, weapon damage + 2d8 radiant. Round 2 :(Bonus Action) Cast Spiritual weapon, it make its attack 1d8+spell mod force damage. Then you attack with holy weapon, weapon Damage + 2d8 Radiant Your way: Round 1: (Bonus Action) Cast Spritual weapon it makes its 1d8+mod attack. You make a weapon attack or cast a cantrip (minus 2d8 radiant from holy weapon) Round 2: (Bonus Action) Cast Holy weapon: Spititual weapon sits and does nothing this round because you used your bonus action. Make attack with holy weapon or Cast Cantrip? Round 3: Now you finally get both spells hitting with full damage potential???? Think ill do it my way.
Probably a dumb question, but if you get hit while you have Holy Weapon in effect do you still have to role for concentration? Lol planning to take my celestial college of swords bard on this "Holy Warrior" story arc.
Probably a dumb question, but if you get hit while you have Holy Weapon in effect do you still have to role for concentration? Lol planning to take my celestial college of swords bard on this "Holy Warrior" story arc.
If you're the one concentrating on the spell, yes, you do, just like any other concentration spell. You'll need to make the save/concentration check each time you are hit. If you're in melee and plan to use Holy Weapon, either get somebody in the backline to cast it on your weapon or make sure you have proficiency or advantage in CON saves through something like the War Caster feat or the Warlock's Eldritch Mind invocation. If you can get both advantage and proficiency, even better!
Probably a dumb question, but if you get hit while you have Holy Weapon in effect do you still have to role for concentration? Lol planning to take my celestial college of swords bard on this "Holy Warrior" story arc.
Yes, you need to roll for concentration any time you take damage.
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My question is about Holy Weapon Spell:
"You imbue a weapon you touch with holy power. Until the spell ends, the weapon emits bright light in a 30-foot radius and dim light for an additional 30 feet. In addition, weapon attacks made with it deal an extra 2d8 radiant damage on a hit. If the weapon isn’t already a magic weapon, it becomes one for the duration.
As a bonus action on your turn, you can dismiss this spell and cause the weapon to emit a burst of radiance. Each creature of your choice that you can see within 30 feet of you must make a Constitution saving throw. On a failed save, a creature takes 4d8 radiant damage, and it is blinded for 1 minute. On a successful save, a creature takes half as much damage and isn’t blinded. At the end of each of its turns, a blinded creature can make a Constitution saving throw, ending the effect on itself on a success."
So you can imbue another characters weapon and if so could imbue an arrow with the spell and on your next turn as a bonus action cause the second effect to take place? Or imbue your own weapon if you were say a War Cleric as one of your actions and throw said weapon on next turn then as a bonus action use the burst of radiance effect?
An arrow is not a weapon, it is a piece of ammo for a weapon. However, you could probably do what you're thinking with a throwing weapon - the description does not say you have to be holding the weapon for its effects to occur. However, the effect does say "within 30 feet of you", not from the weapon, so I don't think this is RAI.
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in awhile.
Rat has it perfectly.
I fully expect to see errata for this one. It's very easy to adjust the wording to fit design intent, they'll either make it "While holding the weapon" or "within 30 feet of the weapon".
Personally, I'd make it burst-able to the weapon's location. There's something about a paladin's last, desperate action being to toss his last weapon, his trusted sword (yes, as an improvised thrown weapon :p ) and see it burst into brilliant light as it hits the Death Knight. Or something. I like the visual, and I don't think it breaks anything with Thrown weapons (as opposed to bows - the same thing at 600 ft becomes a little weird; artillery is best handled with catapults (or trebuchets)).
I have a different holy weapon question. Let’s say cast the spell and use it to attack in the first round. On the second round can a attack with the weapon and then use my bonus action to cause the weapon to emit the burst of radiance? That would be a nice feature. I think you can do it. Any input?
Sure you can. You can take your Action and use a Bonus Action in any order during your turn, and Holy Weapon doesn't mention any restrictions that contradict that general rule.
So, Bonus Action (cast Holy Weapon), then Attack action on your first turn, and Attack followed by Bonus Action (to dismiss Holy Weapon with a burst) during the second turn.
Thanks for input. Clerics need all the damage spells they can get. This is a solid one
I think you could cast spiritual weapon with a bonus action since it requires no concentration and last a minute. On the next turn you cast Holy Weapon with a bonus action and that means you can’t do anything with the spirtiual weapon that turn but on the following turns you can use spiritual weapon on your weapon using concentration and then use bonus actions to attack with the spirtiual weapon.
Or you cast holy weapon first using your bonus action then on the next turn cast spirtiual weapon using your bonus action. I may never need that but for almost a minute your damage would be very stout.
Can you cast Holy Weapon on a Spiritual Weapon?
Yes.
Spiritual Weapon specifically states it creates a weapon. Holy Weapon only requires the object you imbue with the effect to be a weapon, which spiritual weapon is. HOWEVER, doing so is utterly pointless. The extra damage of Holy Weapon is only triggered on weapon attacks and although Spiritual Weapon is a weapon, it doesn't make weapon attacks: it makes spell attacks which are a different thing.
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I know this is an old thread but why wouldn’t spiritual weapons use be considered a weapon attack? The fact that it makes spell attacks doesn’t change the fact that it is also a weapon.
Seems like a similar situation as to why a rogue can make use of its sneak attack feature while utilizing a sling and the magic stone cantrip.
It is also a weapon as you point out. But it is first and foremost a spell. And if it's a weapon attack, would it be a melee weapon attack? Modifiers for those are typically based on STR and that isn't as relevant in the situation of a free floating weapon that attacks on its own at your command.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
A weapon attack and a spell attack are different things and are game terms. The spiritual weapon, although a weapon, does not make weapon attacks - it makes spell attacks. Because of this it cannot add the extra damage of the Holy Weapon spell which only enhances the damage from weapon attacks.
Or to be more general: a weapon attack is the attack of some more physical origin. A spell attack is from magic. Since the Spiritual Weapon is not a physical thing - it is a construct of pure magic (which is why it cannot be considered an object) it only does spell attacks.
My Homebrew: Races | Subclasses | Backgrounds | Spells | Magic Items | Feats
Need help with Homebrew? Check out this FAQ/Guide thread by IamSposta
See My Youtube Videos for Tips & Tricks using D&D Beyond
Correct, yet I wouldn't place the point of significance on whether the spell conjures a physical item or not. Spells like Flame Blade and Shadow Blade both conjure weapons that are tangible, but function differently. Spiritual Weapon is closer to Flame Blade. While Flame Blade conjures a weapon that you have to manually wield, making use of the weapon still explicitly calls for you to make a spell attack, so it would not benefit from Holy Weapon. Shadow Blade, however, summons a weapon that you actually use as a weapon, so it can benefit from Holy Weapon.
An even simpler way of categorizing is what type of action does the spell require to make attacks with the weapon? If the spell explicitly calls for using your full action/bonus action to make an attack with the weapon, it's probably not going to combo with other stuff. If the weapon can be used (like a regular weapon) as part of you taking the Attack action, it's probably going to be able to combo with other things. At the end of the day, it always breaks down to what the spell says it does.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
I only mentioned the physical thing in a generic thing to try and help people understand why the game has "weapon attack" and "spell attack" - and probably didn't do a good job.
Realistically, all that matters is what the spells say.
I do have to admit it can be confusing.
My Homebrew: Races | Subclasses | Backgrounds | Spells | Magic Items | Feats
Need help with Homebrew? Check out this FAQ/Guide thread by IamSposta
See My Youtube Videos for Tips & Tricks using D&D Beyond
I'd probably do that in the reverse holy weapon then Spiritual weapon.
I'd cast holy weapon first since spiritual weapon can attack the round it is summoned that way by round 2 you are attacking with both.
My Way:
Round 1:(Bonus Action) Cast holy weapon. (Action) weapon attack, weapon damage + 2d8 radiant.
Round 2 :(Bonus Action) Cast Spiritual weapon, it make its attack 1d8+spell mod force damage. Then you attack with holy weapon, weapon Damage + 2d8 Radiant
Your way:
Round 1: (Bonus Action) Cast Spritual weapon it makes its 1d8+mod attack. You make a weapon attack or cast a cantrip (minus 2d8 radiant from holy weapon)
Round 2: (Bonus Action) Cast Holy weapon: Spititual weapon sits and does nothing this round because you used your bonus action. Make attack with holy weapon or Cast Cantrip?
Round 3: Now you finally get both spells hitting with full damage potential????
Think ill do it my way.
Probably a dumb question, but if you get hit while you have Holy Weapon in effect do you still have to role for concentration? Lol planning to take my celestial college of swords bard on this "Holy Warrior" story arc.
If you're the one concentrating on the spell, yes, you do, just like any other concentration spell. You'll need to make the save/concentration check each time you are hit. If you're in melee and plan to use Holy Weapon, either get somebody in the backline to cast it on your weapon or make sure you have proficiency or advantage in CON saves through something like the War Caster feat or the Warlock's Eldritch Mind invocation. If you can get both advantage and proficiency, even better!
Yes, you need to roll for concentration any time you take damage.
Helpful rewriter of Japanese->English translation and delver into software codebases (she/e/they)