I mean, it does disadvantage to one attack. For all those enemies which have more than one attack per round, you are spending your _round_ to stop only some of the enemy's attacks.
It is a Cantrip, but the point is, it takes up your action. Action economy is far more important than spell economy.
it gains more damage. it doesn't level with you. At 1d4 damage per attack (more dice at the approrpriate levels), it doesn't scale since pretty much everything gains more than 1d4 hp per level
You are overlooking the fact that vicious mockery is ridiculously fun for everyone at the table, assuming your mockeries are good enough. Google them, make up some. Have a list to fall back on and you will get your money's worth out of the spell.
You will usually have more attacks/actions than the opposing side (unless your DM really likes putting group of enemies as the opposition), so trading your action for their action is actually a net gain.
If it's several small enemies, they will likely not have multiattack, and you did a bit of damage and ruined an enemy's turn.
If it's a single big enemy, well, negating one attack will usually be appreciated by the target of said attack.
It's hard because it's an action that can be wasted just because the enemy rolled well on their saving throw, but see it as a martial character without extra attack who rolled low. You tried something, the god of dice wasn't with you in that instant, and your turn ended up being nothing.
It is a Cantrip, but the point is, it takes up your action. Action economy is far more important than spell economy.
For a long rest caster, this is only true for days with one or two encounters. After that, conserving your leveled spell slots becomes more important, especially at lower levels. Even at the mid-levels, a long adventuring day can be taxing for a full caster, so it's good to have a cantrip with a useful rider.
Now, if you're completely unsatisfied with Vicious Mockery, I'd recommend grabbing the Magic Initiate Feat at 4th or 8th level, because by then it'll definitely be losing some of its shine. It only works to disadvantage one enemy attack, and as you level up you'll face more enemies with multiple attacks. You don't want to waste Magical Secrets on a Cantrip, so the Magic Initiate Feat is the way to go, either Sorcerer or Warlock since they use your casting ability. (If you're human, play the bonus feat variant and take it 1st level.)
I mean, it does disadvantage to one attack. For all those enemies which have more than one attack per round, you are spending your _round_ to stop only some of the enemy's attacks.
Stopping some attacks still reduces the number of concentration checks needed. Helping the frontline cleric keep bless active is always a good tactic.
It's a fine lower level cantrip. At level 1, many enemies have only one attack, so doing them a bit of damage AND protecting you from their attack is a perfectly good use of your action.
As you get to higher levels, it becomes more situational. 2d4 at fifth level really isn't enough damage to care about - but it's still decent if you happen to be fighting a single big enemy with a low number of attacks. But in most cases it stops being useful and you should switch to other cantrips that do more (or start using low-level spell slots instead of cantrips, once you have enough to spare).
It takes up an action, but it helps prevent damage to members of your party, increasing survivability and decreasing the amount of resources you need to put into healing. Not bad for a cantrip you can use at will.
As compared to the option of trying to run up and stab a dragon with a rapier or something and praying you crit because it's the only way you'll beat its AC? I'd rather insult it to death.
It is also Verbal only; so you can use it in all sorts of situations where your hands are busy. (Tied up, hanging on a rope, etc.)
This is important. It might not always be handy in serious "minis and maps" battles, but it's a good subtle weapon that your character has handy at all times, whether you're carrying anything or not.
It depends on how your DM plays it, but since the spell actually specifies that the magic used is "subtle" and there's no visual effect described, then the spell can also be cast slyly without being obvious to anyone other than the target that anything is happening (other than just shouting insults at someone).
I'm with TexasDevin on this. Every time I've seen it used so far, it was hilarious. To me, that's a lot of worthy value.
If you're interested in only DPS and other mechanical stats, that's a different kind of game than what I prefer to play or watch. I couldn't sell or dissuade you on such criteria.
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Human. Male. Possibly. Don't be a divider. My characters' backgrounds are written like instruction manuals rather than stories. My opinion and preferences don't mean you're wrong. I am 99.7603% convinced that the digital dice are messing with me. I roll high when nobody's looking and low when anyone else can see.🎲 “It's a bit early to be thinking about an epitaph. No?” will be my epitaph.
It takes up an action, but it helps prevent damage to members of your party
It really doesn't.
round 1: you use your action for the round to stop some of the enemy's action - the enemy still does damage because you only affected one of his attacks
round 2: you do something actually useful, like suggestion. the enemy stops attacking
NOTE: if you had done on round 1what you did on round 2, THEN you'd be preventing damage.
Again, it comes down to action economy
Spending your action to inflict disadvantage on one of your enemy's attacks is comparable to True Strike, only worse
It takes up an action, but it helps prevent damage to members of your party
It really doesn't.
round 1: you use your action for the round to stop some of the enemy's action - the enemy still does damage because you only affected one of his attacks
round 2: you do something actually useful, like suggestion. the enemy stops attacking
NOTE: if you had done on round 1what you did on round 2, THEN you'd be preventing damage.
Again, it comes down to action economy
Spending your action to inflict disadvantage on one of your enemy's attacks is comparable to True Strike, only worse
Nobody said to use Vicious Mockery in place of something better if you have it available. Suggestion is a second level spell, but if you're out of spell slots then you have to make due. And Vicious Mockery STILL prevents damage, whether or not it prevents ALL damage was not the issue being discussed.
Suggestion is also concentration, which you can't cast if you're already concentrating on another spell. Heck, VM you can throw at a second enemy WHILE concentrating on suggestion on the first. 2 > 1.
And I also put forth that stopping _some_ of the enemy's attacks is objectively better than stopping _none_ of the attacks. Or, say, a swing and a miss with a melee weapon. Every tool has its place.
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I mean, it does disadvantage to one attack. For all those enemies which have more than one attack per round, you are spending your _round_ to stop only some of the enemy's attacks.
Don't forget Vicious Mockery:
That + disadvantage sounds pretty cool to me.
I haven't played a bard yet, but we have one in our group.
Plus it is a WIS save that a lot of enemies will have a harder time succeeding.
It is a Cantrip, but the point is, it takes up your action. Action economy is far more important than spell economy.
it gains more damage. it doesn't level with you. At 1d4 damage per attack (more dice at the approrpriate levels), it doesn't scale since pretty much everything gains more than 1d4 hp per level
You are overlooking the fact that vicious mockery is ridiculously fun for everyone at the table, assuming your mockeries are good enough. Google them, make up some. Have a list to fall back on and you will get your money's worth out of the spell.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
You will usually have more attacks/actions than the opposing side (unless your DM really likes putting group of enemies as the opposition), so trading your action for their action is actually a net gain.
If it's several small enemies, they will likely not have multiattack, and you did a bit of damage and ruined an enemy's turn.
If it's a single big enemy, well, negating one attack will usually be appreciated by the target of said attack.
It's hard because it's an action that can be wasted just because the enemy rolled well on their saving throw, but see it as a martial character without extra attack who rolled low. You tried something, the god of dice wasn't with you in that instant, and your turn ended up being nothing.
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For a long rest caster, this is only true for days with one or two encounters. After that, conserving your leveled spell slots becomes more important, especially at lower levels. Even at the mid-levels, a long adventuring day can be taxing for a full caster, so it's good to have a cantrip with a useful rider.
Now, if you're completely unsatisfied with Vicious Mockery, I'd recommend grabbing the Magic Initiate Feat at 4th or 8th level, because by then it'll definitely be losing some of its shine. It only works to disadvantage one enemy attack, and as you level up you'll face more enemies with multiple attacks. You don't want to waste Magical Secrets on a Cantrip, so the Magic Initiate Feat is the way to go, either Sorcerer or Warlock since they use your casting ability. (If you're human, play the bonus feat variant and take it 1st level.)
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Stopping some attacks still reduces the number of concentration checks needed. Helping the frontline cleric keep bless active is always a good tactic.
It is also Verbal only; so you can use it in all sorts of situations where your hands are busy. (Tied up, hanging on a rope, etc.)
It's a fine lower level cantrip. At level 1, many enemies have only one attack, so doing them a bit of damage AND protecting you from their attack is a perfectly good use of your action.
As you get to higher levels, it becomes more situational. 2d4 at fifth level really isn't enough damage to care about - but it's still decent if you happen to be fighting a single big enemy with a low number of attacks. But in most cases it stops being useful and you should switch to other cantrips that do more (or start using low-level spell slots instead of cantrips, once you have enough to spare).
"Sell me on Vicious Mockery."
$13.99 + tax. Will that be cash or credit?
Given enough time and the right circumstances, you can insult a dragon to death.
what more do you need to know?
Action economy is only important if you make it important. Use your actions on cool things that are fun and memorable. There's always next round.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
It takes up an action, but it helps prevent damage to members of your party, increasing survivability and decreasing the amount of resources you need to put into healing. Not bad for a cantrip you can use at will.
As compared to the option of trying to run up and stab a dragon with a rapier or something and praying you crit because it's the only way you'll beat its AC? I'd rather insult it to death.
This is important. It might not always be handy in serious "minis and maps" battles, but it's a good subtle weapon that your character has handy at all times, whether you're carrying anything or not.
It depends on how your DM plays it, but since the spell actually specifies that the magic used is "subtle" and there's no visual effect described, then the spell can also be cast slyly without being obvious to anyone other than the target that anything is happening (other than just shouting insults at someone).
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I'm with TexasDevin on this. Every time I've seen it used so far, it was hilarious. To me, that's a lot of worthy value.
If you're interested in only DPS and other mechanical stats, that's a different kind of game than what I prefer to play or watch. I couldn't sell or dissuade you on such criteria.
Human. Male. Possibly. Don't be a divider.
My characters' backgrounds are written like instruction manuals rather than stories. My opinion and preferences don't mean you're wrong.
I am 99.7603% convinced that the digital dice are messing with me. I roll high when nobody's looking and low when anyone else can see.🎲
“It's a bit early to be thinking about an epitaph. No?” will be my epitaph.
It takes up an action, but it helps prevent damage to members of your party
It really doesn't.
round 1: you use your action for the round to stop some of the enemy's action - the enemy still does damage because you only affected one of his attacks
round 2: you do something actually useful, like suggestion. the enemy stops attacking
NOTE: if you had done on round 1what you did on round 2, THEN you'd be preventing damage.
Again, it comes down to action economy
Spending your action to inflict disadvantage on one of your enemy's attacks is comparable to True Strike, only worse
That's a bad argument. There's no reason you can't do things which are cool things, fun, memorable, AND effective
Nobody said to use Vicious Mockery in place of something better if you have it available. Suggestion is a second level spell, but if you're out of spell slots then you have to make due. And Vicious Mockery STILL prevents damage, whether or not it prevents ALL damage was not the issue being discussed.
Suggestion is also concentration, which you can't cast if you're already concentrating on another spell. Heck, VM you can throw at a second enemy WHILE concentrating on suggestion on the first. 2 > 1.
And I also put forth that stopping _some_ of the enemy's attacks is objectively better than stopping _none_ of the attacks. Or, say, a swing and a miss with a melee weapon. Every tool has its place.