Designer Insights from Unearthed Arcana: Villainous Options

LIke the flavor of the UA but this ain’t it

Does anyone know if these are just generic subclasses or are they suggesting a potential campaign setting? (You know, like when we got the Apocalyptic subclasses and everybody went ooh Dark Sun vibes aplenty!)

Thank you.

The fighter looks fun. I would switch the 7th-level feature's Con modifier for Str.

The paths are cool conceptually, but I would much rather you guys figure out how to integrate the Grim Hollow Transformations into the Character Builder, without homebrew finickiness

Yes, you are being preachy. Stop.

 Villanous Paths seem quite cool, tho I'll admit my monkey brain saw Undead Grasp and immeadiately went "eldritch blast feat :D" upon seeeing the "another cantrip of your choice" part lol.

I quite like the Hell Knight most out of the subclasses tbh, tho the other's are cool too. There's certainly probs with it but it's a really cool direction and I like all of the abilities. Pestilence Domain is probably my least fav, but it's still quite cool and I like Vermin Form

Quote from Luckyloomagu >>

At risk of embarrassing myself and being preachy, I must make a snap-judgement decision about something I noticed immediately -- The level 14 'Monstrous Appetite' feature of the titan druid should be re-flavored into any manner of damaging grapple, choosing between bludgeoning OR acid damage, leaving the swallow as a choice rather than as the base.

My reasoning for this is that this feature can quickly become uncomfortable at tables, for a variety of different reasons. Largely, however, I'm looking at this from a 'preventative measure' angle.

See, there's a lot of things in DND that can facilitate uncomfortable situations or topics, but there's always a pretty clear indication of someones intentions, a reliable stop-gap, or sometimes an option to flavor it alternatively. This feature, however, the way you'd want to play with it is also exactly aligned with how it can be used in uncomfortable or upsetting contexts. The material opens with a content warning, which already nudges towards the idea of 'talk before the game about what you'd be uncomfortable with' but the fact that it's purely acid damage combined with its name always comes with the territory of knowing what it's substituting for regardless of the flavor.

The other material in this release is full of different options for potentially uncomfortable topics -- such as the Pestilence Domain Cleric being able to have their plague be something more metaphysical than physical, or the Demonic Sorcerer having less revolting features. The Cleric subclass even has a gameplay feature which has multiple ways to flavor it to avoid discomfort.

The only reason it's an issue worth commenting on is due to it's presence as a gameplay mechanic. Somebody who wants the abilities of the Circle of the Titan Druid but who would be put-off by the flavor of this feature is going to be unable to get past that point, and somebody playing in a party with one will inevitably run into the topic due to it being one of the major features that they'll want to play around.

Hopefully I wrote this as... respectfully as I could be. That 'for a variety of different reasons' is doing a lot of heavy lifting here. Maybe others will see what I mean... Like, a lot of people are calling it 'the v*** subclass' already, lol...

 Yes, you are being preachy. Get over it and stop.

I had a player who wanted to become a Lich and I didn't have any idea on how to take that and make it happen. This at least gives a way forward.

Everything else looks really fun.

Holy shit, finally

Some Good ******* Food™

I gotta say, I don't understand this direction from WOTC, especially with regards to the Death Knight and Lich options. I don't really have a problem with "evil" characters. I've played one before. But, WOTC has clearly structured and designed DnD and its supplements from "PC's are good" and "heroic" standpoint. They've gone out of the way to make that clear in the past. The Death Domain cleric was only in the DMG for 2014 not the Player's Handbook for example. Making it clear that Drow and orcs are not "evil" any more. This whole things seems weird to me given all that. We have plenty of "evil" options within the classes so far. This seems unnecessary. 

I'm all for more character creation options. And I definitely don't have anything against people doing what they want at their own table. This seems like an odd turn for WOTC though and an opportunity for the less mature players to follow the "I want to slaughter everything because that's what my character would do" and generally be a menace in the game world and to the other players at the table. I would urge these options to be very carefully considered before being implemented. Especially if they make it into some kind of official manual. 

Then again, I guess its none of my business anyway. 

Quote from DedKnave >>

There is a lot in here that is just mechanically and objectively bad. Hell knight‘s 18th level feature is basically the no attunement uncommon magic item Hellfire Weapon with minor tweaks. Their ability applies to any creature reduced to 0 hp and takes 1d4 hours sent to a layer of the Nine Hells of choice vs only humanoids and sent to Avernus instantly. The Lich Feats mention nothing about raising undead and I/My players only need to have spellcasting or pact slots, so a fighter can take a 1 level dip with a spellcaster and 3 Lich feats by level 13 to become a Lich?

 

 It gets worse. You only need a race that can cast spells to meet the requirement of "spellcasting" so your Elves and your Tieflings and your Aasimar can all become liches too.

I like these, at least in concept.

The feat chains in Faerun were a precursor to the Death Knight and Lich chains here, and I think they're a good idea. Their weakness is trading the usual power options (GWM, Mage Slayer, Warcaster) for flavor. On the other hand these do do something, and you can get your character to lichdom at level 12 with just three feats.

It would be nice if Arcane Restoration went up to level 5 so it was of benefit to Warlocks, but Undead Grasp would combine quite nicely with Warlock's level 5 slots. Funnily enough, Arcane Restoration might be pretty good for Eldritch Knights, allowing them to recharge their Shield slots. The main weakness being that none of the Lich feats boost physical stats. That said, Fighter does have an extra feat at level 6, so could still take a martial feat before level 12, and they still have two feats and an Epic Boon after that.

Very interesting ideas.

I'm going to use this as inspiration to try to come up with ideas for the Spelljammer campaign setting. (Not the 5e science fiction Spelljammer, but the original fantasy-space setting that had factions like the Company of the Chalice that were full of paladins and knights who could fall and become Death Knights if things went wrong.)

It's great to see this UA has suggestions to tie these options into Greyhawk, Dragonlance and Forgotten Realms. I don't think that Dan Ayoub will be "fixing Spelljammer" any time soon, but I get the feeling that Greyhawk, Dragonlance and Forgotten Realms are probably in reasonably good hands.

I don't think I would allow players to play evil PCs myself, but I think that having a path for things like this creates a clear progress arc for an evil NPC and gives a GM ideas on how they can get information of the process to players, so that they can try to disrupt the various things that an NPC Death Knight or Lich might need to do to raise their power.

I have some questions about the Path to Death Knight/Lich feats.... When do you get to take any of the feats prior to ascending to your final form? Do you get an opportunity every level? And do you get to gain any of the feats you might have missed before Becoming?

Also: The Circle of Titan is pretty freaking cool but I think the damage dealt should increase every time you get a new size by at least one or two damage die. Only dealing the same damage when you have gained in size and strength seems a little underwhelming.

Absolutely. It should be at least another die of damage added for each increase in size.

"ABYSSAL MANIFESTATIONS
6 You grow a second head. (This has no impact
on your game statistics.)"

Boy I can't wait to start seeing some two headed PC's start popping up. Actually a little disappointed that it doesn't have much mechanical use though.
Not too thrilled with the spell list for it though, not that it doesn't make some sense, but it's all mostly stuff that Sorcerer gets already anyway.

Titan and villainous paths are amazing. The flavor of everything in this UA is incredible, but some options are probably a bit weaker than they should be. I do love the paths though, hope those get expended into a more regular mechanic, like maybe a path of the dragon to become a dragon (or at least a half dragon or something) or a path of the golem to become some kind of construct.

I am equally excited and dreading the day these player options become official. I can already imagine the Titan Druid chasing my BBEG around the map trying to eat them. 😭 

It would be much better if the Druid summoned the Titan instead of transforming into them. Turning into a Titan seems like a self-nerf, since neither the damage nor the defense compensate for abandoning your role as a caster. Even the spell list doesn't favor casting while transformed into that thing!

Regarding the Death Knight, I found the Hellfire Orb very out of place for the "class" fantasy. Sure, it's an ability listed on the monster's stat block, but when we're talking about Death Knights, a Hellfire Orb is the last thing we think of! Besides, the damage is too low to be competitive; it's like two or three free Fireballs per day at a level where it doesn't make much of a difference anymore.

Lich is Nice!

Fighter subclass makes a good dip, maybe the sorcerer too.  Mediocre beyond that though.  Pestilence is AWESOME, and good.  Titan is cool, but probably okay; maybe fix moon druid's attack scaling first though.  Feat chains are KILLER.  More of this