If they put the spells and features spread out through the various Adventure books into the "PHB2" a long with the revised Ranger class and some Variant class abilities and stuff, it would make it more appealing.
Sorry to break it to you, they're never making a PHB 2.0
They tried that in 4e, and people hate 4e, so I doubt that there will ever be a PHB 2
They had one in 3.5 as well. Pathfinder even released a completely revised ranger in one of their books because they had screwed it up as well. People will buy it, if they put enough into it.
But I was simply calling the PHB with a revised Ranger class a "PHB2" and suggesting that if it added a few more things, it would be better received than just have it change the Ranger and nothing else.
If they put the spells and features spread out through the various Adventure books into the "PHB2" a long with the revised Ranger class and some Variant class abilities and stuff, it would make it more appealing.
Sorry to break it to you, they're never making a PHB 2.0
They tried that in 4e, and people hate 4e, so I doubt that there will ever be a PHB 2
They had one in 3.5 as well. Pathfinder even released a completely revised ranger in one of their books because they had screwed it up as well. People will buy it, if they put enough into it.
But I was simply calling the PHB with a revised Ranger class a "PHB2" and suggesting that if it added a few more things, it would be better received than just have it change the Ranger and nothing else.
Sorry, Unchained revised the Barbarian, Monk, Rogue and Summoner, not Ranger. My bad.
I’m telling you, it’ll be in Xanathar’s 2. That’s the closest we’ll get.
I agree, there won't be a book called a PHB2, but a rose by any other name and all that jazz. If you took the Races from Volo's and Subclasses from Xanathar's you would have a PHB2. Take the Monsters from Volo's and Mordenkeinen's and put them in a single book and you would have a Monsters Manual 2. All they are doing is dividing the information and calling it by another name.
I’m telling you, it’ll be in Xanathar’s 2. That’s the closest we’ll get.
I agree, there won't be a book called a PHB2, but a rose by any other name and all that jazz. If you took the Races from Volo's and Subclasses from Xanathar's you would have a PHB2. Take the Monsters from Volo's and Mordenkeinen's and put them in a single book and you would have a Monsters Manual 2. All they are doing is dividing the information and calling it by another name.
Exactly. That’s how they make money. If they called it a “PHB 2” people wold ***** and complain that now they need another book to play. If they call it Xanathar’s 2, people will line up to give them money.
The first run of the Variant Ranger abilities are good. I am excited to see either a revised UA for further testing or see them published (the sooner the better).
I like the changes, but I wish that Wizards would get over their fear of invalidating the PHB, and admit that they made a mistake, and just remake the class.
Amen to that. They could put out a small supplement that only contains the new Ranger (for those who already have a PHB) and then the next version of the PHB could contain the new version (for new players and AL legality, although I don't really care much about that last bit).
They tried that, they even gave it out for free with an apology. It was called The Revised Ranger. It was a little overtuned, and so many people hated it so hard they pulled the plug.
I still use the Revised Ranger. I don't see what's wrong with it, it is WAAAYYY better than the PHB ranger.
is it really all that better? like yes they made beast master a little more well rounded, less exiting but more likely you can give it a decent build than before, gave combat bonuses to favoured enemy (a mistake i think), made natural explorer work in every terrain while also making it very much stronk, a little too much stronk, made hide in plain sight easier to pull of but it now debuffs perception checks instead of buffing stealth, and now foe slayer works on everything
If they put the spells and features spread out through the various Adventure books into the "PHB2" a long with the revised Ranger class and some Variant class abilities and stuff, it would make it more appealing.
Sorry to break it to you, they're never making a PHB 2.0
They tried that in 4e, and people hate 4e, so I doubt that there will ever be a PHB 2
why do you all think they are going to release an sourcebook called "X sourcebook 2" or "X sourcebook 2.0"? if we are to get something, it will most likely come with come fancy name like "xanatars lost notes to everything else" or "otto's guide to the odd", most non core sourcebooks that are not setting supplements have some kind of framing device as the research notes of some entity like xanatar, mordekinen, or volo and elminister, and i dont think wizards of the coast are so boring as to call it something as simple and stupid as that, if there is to be an new sourcebook it will have
if i were to guess at what the next sourcebook will be, maybe it will be the research notes/ adventure diary of an old elf or silver dragon adventurer that has beriended many people and been in many diffrent advenutruing parties, containing notes on previously setting dependent classes, a bunch of the new UA subclasses they happen to have met members of, a bunch of monsters and spells that can only be found in official wizards of the coast modules like hellwasps, hollyphants and galder's tower, as well as a few monsters we have never seen before perhaps, something new and original
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i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
Revised ranger was also highly problematic since it was extremely frontloaded, where ranger is already very good today. What the class needs is the following:
1. Better abilities after level 5 2. Broaden the scope of their defining abilities. Favored enemy and favored terrain are inherritly bad design (either very good or very weak) and I suspect they are there solely as a tribute to older times.
The revised ranger would be a mandatory 1-3 level dip for all non-casters.
why do you all think they are going to release an sourcebook called "X sourcebook 2" or "X sourcebook 2.0"? if we are to get something, it will most likely come with come fancy name like "xanatars lost notes to everything else" or "otto's guide to the odd", most non core sourcebooks that are not setting supplements have some kind of framing device as the research notes of some entity like xanatar, mordekinen, or volo and elminister, and i dont think wizards of the coast are so boring as to call it something as simple and stupid as that, if there is to be an new sourcebook it will have
if i were to guess at what the next sourcebook will be, maybe it will be the research notes/ adventure diary of an old elf or silver dragon adventurer that has beriended many people and been in many diffrent advenutruing parties, containing notes on previously setting dependent classes, a bunch of the new UA subclasses they happen to have met members of, a bunch of monsters and spells that can only be found in official wizards of the coast modules like hellwasps, hollyphants and galder's tower, as well as a few monsters we have never seen before perhaps, something new and original
In previous editions (3.5 and 4e I think) they actually did release PHB 2, and people hated it. That’s why we are all saying that the next one will be something like “Xanathar’s Guide to Everything Else” or something, we are all just calling it “Xanathar’s 2” as a shorthand reference.
why do you all think they are going to release an sourcebook called "X sourcebook 2" or "X sourcebook 2.0"? if we are to get something, it will most likely come with come fancy name like "xanatars lost notes to everything else" or "otto's guide to the odd", most non core sourcebooks that are not setting supplements have some kind of framing device as the research notes of some entity like xanatar, mordekinen, or volo and elminister, and i dont think wizards of the coast are so boring as to call it something as simple and stupid as that, if there is to be an new sourcebook it will have
if i were to guess at what the next sourcebook will be, maybe it will be the research notes/ adventure diary of an old elf or silver dragon adventurer that has beriended many people and been in many diffrent advenutruing parties, containing notes on previously setting dependent classes, a bunch of the new UA subclasses they happen to have met members of, a bunch of monsters and spells that can only be found in official wizards of the coast modules like hellwasps, hollyphants and galder's tower, as well as a few monsters we have never seen before perhaps, something new and original
In previous editions (3.5 and 4e I think) they actually did release PHB 2, and people hated it. That’s why we are all saying that the next one will be something like “Xanathar’s Guide to Everything Else” or something, we are all just calling it “Xanathar’s 2” as a shorthand reference.
i know players handbook: the sequel existed back in the day but what i dont understand is that if everyone thought it was bad why did they do it and why did wizards not listen and repeat the mistake again in 4th edition. twice?
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i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
I honestly don't remember any backlash from the phb2 during 3.5. It was just another book in a loooong line of books. I can't speak for 4e though, I went to Pathfinder at that time that also had a loooong line of books.
it was no more required than anything from the Complete series or Races of series
why do you all think they are going to release an sourcebook called "X sourcebook 2" or "X sourcebook 2.0"? if we are to get something, it will most likely come with come fancy name like "xanatars lost notes to everything else" or "otto's guide to the odd", most non core sourcebooks that are not setting supplements have some kind of framing device as the research notes of some entity like xanatar, mordekinen, or volo and elminister, and i dont think wizards of the coast are so boring as to call it something as simple and stupid as that, if there is to be an new sourcebook it will have
if i were to guess at what the next sourcebook will be, maybe it will be the research notes/ adventure diary of an old elf or silver dragon adventurer that has beriended many people and been in many diffrent advenutruing parties, containing notes on previously setting dependent classes, a bunch of the new UA subclasses they happen to have met members of, a bunch of monsters and spells that can only be found in official wizards of the coast modules like hellwasps, hollyphants and galder's tower, as well as a few monsters we have never seen before perhaps, something new and original
In previous editions (3.5 and 4e I think) they actually did release PHB 2, and people hated it. That’s why we are all saying that the next one will be something like “Xanathar’s Guide to Everything Else” or something, we are all just calling it “Xanathar’s 2” as a shorthand reference.
i know players handbook: the sequel existed back in the day but what i dont understand is that if everyone thought it was bad why did they do it and why did wizards not listen and repeat the mistake again in 4th edition. twice?
I'm agreeing with Sposta here, they're not literally going to name Xanathar's 2.0 "Xanathar's 2.0" it will probably be a planescape book (but we've discussed this in other threads), and will definitely not be called Xanathar's 2.0
Wizards of the Coast is never going to release a Players Handbook 2, they don't want to create another book that everyone has to get (though XGtE should be a core rulebook).
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I like the changes, but I wish that Wizards would get over their fear of invalidating the PHB, and admit that they made a mistake, and just remake the class.
Amen to that. They could put out a small supplement that only contains the new Ranger (for those who already have a PHB) and then the next version of the PHB could contain the new version (for new players and AL legality, although I don't really care much about that last bit).
They tried that, they even gave it out for free with an apology. It was called The Revised Ranger. It was a little overtuned, and so many people hated it so hard they pulled the plug.
I still use the Revised Ranger. I don't see what's wrong with it, it is WAAAYYY better than the PHB ranger.
is it really all that better? like yes they made beast master a little more well rounded, less exiting but more likely you can give it a decent build than before, gave combat bonuses to favoured enemy (a mistake i think), made natural explorer work in every terrain while also making it very much stronk, a little too much stronk, made hide in plain sight easier to pull of but it now debuffs perception checks instead of buffing stealth, and now foe slayer works on everything
The ability that let you detect your favored enemies within 3 miles? Great ability, basically functioned as a Divine Sense on steroids. It might have been too powerful, but that is the thing I think Rangers should have access to. They had more buffs based on their favored enemy, they were great at travelling anywhere (which rangers should have), and they made the beast master better.
I personally use it still over the normal ranger.
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Yeah, it’ll be “Xanathar’s Guide to Everything Else” or “Xanathar’s Guide to the Plains” or something like that. And the “Core Books for D&D” have always, are now, and forever will be 3 books: the PHB, the DMG, and the MM. Period. If they ever try to change that again like they did with the “2s,” people will lose their bananas all over again. Most people get burned once, they don’t touch the stove again, WotC got burned that way twice. If they make that mistake again I will be shocked.
why do you all think they are going to release an sourcebook called "X sourcebook 2" or "X sourcebook 2.0"? if we are to get something, it will most likely come with come fancy name like "xanatars lost notes to everything else" or "otto's guide to the odd", most non core sourcebooks that are not setting supplements have some kind of framing device as the research notes of some entity like xanatar, mordekinen, or volo and elminister, and i dont think wizards of the coast are so boring as to call it something as simple and stupid as that, if there is to be an new sourcebook it will have
if i were to guess at what the next sourcebook will be, maybe it will be the research notes/ adventure diary of an old elf or silver dragon adventurer that has beriended many people and been in many diffrent advenutruing parties, containing notes on previously setting dependent classes, a bunch of the new UA subclasses they happen to have met members of, a bunch of monsters and spells that can only be found in official wizards of the coast modules like hellwasps, hollyphants and galder's tower, as well as a few monsters we have never seen before perhaps, something new and original
In previous editions (3.5 and 4e I think) they actually did release PHB 2, and people hated it. That’s why we are all saying that the next one will be something like “Xanathar’s Guide to Everything Else” or something, we are all just calling it “Xanathar’s 2” as a shorthand reference.
i know players handbook: the sequel existed back in the day but what i dont understand is that if everyone thought it was bad why did they do it and why did wizards not listen and repeat the mistake again in 4th edition. twice?
I'm agreeing with Sposta here, they're not literally going to name Xanathar's 2.0 "Xanathar's 2.0" it will probably be a planescape book (but we've discussed this in other threads), and will definitely not be called Xanathar's 2.0
Wizards of the Coast is never going to release a Players Handbook 2, they don't want to create another book that everyone has to get (though XGtE should be a core rulebook).
i would not call xanatars guide to everything a core rulebook and i would not call most of it in any way nessesary, other than maybe downtime and a few of the extra rules they introduced
even if they created an PHB 2, all it would do is re-release the rules of PHB 1 and add a small handful of races and maybe even classes, you would not "need" to buy it like you need to buy the players handbook and the monster manual to play the game
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i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
why do you all think they are going to release an sourcebook called "X sourcebook 2" or "X sourcebook 2.0"? if we are to get something, it will most likely come with come fancy name like "xanatars lost notes to everything else" or "otto's guide to the odd", most non core sourcebooks that are not setting supplements have some kind of framing device as the research notes of some entity like xanatar, mordekinen, or volo and elminister, and i dont think wizards of the coast are so boring as to call it something as simple and stupid as that, if there is to be an new sourcebook it will have
if i were to guess at what the next sourcebook will be, maybe it will be the research notes/ adventure diary of an old elf or silver dragon adventurer that has beriended many people and been in many diffrent advenutruing parties, containing notes on previously setting dependent classes, a bunch of the new UA subclasses they happen to have met members of, a bunch of monsters and spells that can only be found in official wizards of the coast modules like hellwasps, hollyphants and galder's tower, as well as a few monsters we have never seen before perhaps, something new and original
In previous editions (3.5 and 4e I think) they actually did release PHB 2, and people hated it. That’s why we are all saying that the next one will be something like “Xanathar’s Guide to Everything Else” or something, we are all just calling it “Xanathar’s 2” as a shorthand reference.
i know players handbook: the sequel existed back in the day but what i dont understand is that if everyone thought it was bad why did they do it and why did wizards not listen and repeat the mistake again in 4th edition. twice?
I'm agreeing with Sposta here, they're not literally going to name Xanathar's 2.0 "Xanathar's 2.0" it will probably be a planescape book (but we've discussed this in other threads), and will definitely not be called Xanathar's 2.0
Wizards of the Coast is never going to release a Players Handbook 2, they don't want to create another book that everyone has to get (though XGtE should be a core rulebook).
i would not call xanatars guide to everything a core rulebook and i would not call most of it in any way nessesary, other than maybe downtime and a few of the extra rules they introduced
even if they created an PHB 2, all it would do is re-release the rules of PHB 1 and add a small handful of races and maybe even classes, you would not "need" to buy it like you need to buy the players handbook and the monster manual to play the game
Yeah, why would they do that though?
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I honestly don't remember any backlash from the phb2 during 3.5. It was just another book in a loooong line of books. I can't speak for 4e though, I went to Pathfinder at that time that also had a loooong line of books.
it was no more required than anything from the Complete series or Races of series
You’re right, most of the backlash came from the old heads who went from at least a decade (possibly up to 2) of OD&D, some of whom switched to AD&D in the early ‘90s, many though did not. Then in the late ‘90s TSR stopped supporting OD&D and only supported AD&D so they had to get used to AD&D, or just keep playing an unsupported game. About 3ish years after TSR stopped supporting OD&D 3.0 happened and then all of a sudden to 3.5 in under half a decade, with rumors of 4e coming right around the corner. It was too much. You think those editions had looooong lines of books? 2e has a looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong Line of books. Luckily for me I jumped from OD&D to AD&D right in the beginning, so for me it wasn’t that bad. But still, I bailed on D&D and MtG from the early/mid 2000s until the last couple of years because of how frustrated I was with WotC. I still only rarely play Magic, and don’t buy any new cards anymore.
Well, I wish it was official.
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They had one in 3.5 as well. Pathfinder even released a completely revised ranger in one of their books because they had screwed it up as well. People will buy it, if they put enough into it.
But I was simply calling the PHB with a revised Ranger class a "PHB2" and suggesting that if it added a few more things, it would be better received than just have it change the Ranger and nothing else.
She/Her College Student Player and Dungeon Master
I’m telling you, it’ll be in Xanathar’s 2. That’s the closest we’ll get.
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Sorry, Unchained revised the Barbarian, Monk, Rogue and Summoner, not Ranger. My bad.
She/Her College Student Player and Dungeon Master
I agree, there won't be a book called a PHB2, but a rose by any other name and all that jazz. If you took the Races from Volo's and Subclasses from Xanathar's you would have a PHB2. Take the Monsters from Volo's and Mordenkeinen's and put them in a single book and you would have a Monsters Manual 2. All they are doing is dividing the information and calling it by another name.
She/Her College Student Player and Dungeon Master
Exactly. That’s how they make money. If they called it a “PHB 2” people wold ***** and complain that now they need another book to play. If they call it Xanathar’s 2, people will line up to give them money.
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Now that we are on the same page...
The first run of the Variant Ranger abilities are good. I am excited to see either a revised UA for further testing or see them published (the sooner the better).
She/Her College Student Player and Dungeon Master
Yeah, they're not making a PHB or DMB or MM 2, because then people would complain.
They split it up so everyone can buy one of their books and get some use out of it (barely anything for players in Mordenkainen's)
A revised ranger won't be coming as a full class, but they will attempt to fix it through the class feature variants.
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is it really all that better? like yes they made beast master a little more well rounded, less exiting but more likely you can give it a decent build than before, gave combat bonuses to favoured enemy (a mistake i think), made natural explorer work in every terrain while also making it very much stronk, a little too much stronk, made hide in plain sight easier to pull of but it now debuffs perception checks instead of buffing stealth, and now foe slayer works on everything
why do you all think they are going to release an sourcebook called "X sourcebook 2" or "X sourcebook 2.0"? if we are to get something, it will most likely come with come fancy name like "xanatars lost notes to everything else" or "otto's guide to the odd", most non core sourcebooks that are not setting supplements have some kind of framing device as the research notes of some entity like xanatar, mordekinen, or volo and elminister, and i dont think wizards of the coast are so boring as to call it something as simple and stupid as that, if there is to be an new sourcebook it will have
if i were to guess at what the next sourcebook will be, maybe it will be the research notes/ adventure diary of an old elf or silver dragon adventurer that has beriended many people and been in many diffrent advenutruing parties, containing notes on previously setting dependent classes, a bunch of the new UA subclasses they happen to have met members of, a bunch of monsters and spells that can only be found in official wizards of the coast modules like hellwasps, hollyphants and galder's tower, as well as a few monsters we have never seen before perhaps, something new and original
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
Revised ranger was also highly problematic since it was extremely frontloaded, where ranger is already very good today. What the class needs is the following:
1. Better abilities after level 5
2. Broaden the scope of their defining abilities. Favored enemy and favored terrain are inherritly bad design (either very good or very weak) and I suspect they are there solely as a tribute to older times.
The revised ranger would be a mandatory 1-3 level dip for all non-casters.
Yes, I agree. The Variant Ranger is far more balanced (and interesting?) than the Revised was.
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In previous editions (3.5 and 4e I think) they actually did release PHB 2, and people hated it. That’s why we are all saying that the next one will be something like “Xanathar’s Guide to Everything Else” or something, we are all just calling it “Xanathar’s 2” as a shorthand reference.
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i know players handbook: the sequel existed back in the day but what i dont understand is that if everyone thought it was bad why did they do it and why did wizards not listen and repeat the mistake again in 4th edition. twice?
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
I honestly don't remember any backlash from the phb2 during 3.5. It was just another book in a loooong line of books. I can't speak for 4e though, I went to Pathfinder at that time that also had a loooong line of books.
it was no more required than anything from the Complete series or Races of series
She/Her College Student Player and Dungeon Master
I'm agreeing with Sposta here, they're not literally going to name Xanathar's 2.0 "Xanathar's 2.0" it will probably be a planescape book (but we've discussed this in other threads), and will definitely not be called Xanathar's 2.0
Wizards of the Coast is never going to release a Players Handbook 2, they don't want to create another book that everyone has to get (though XGtE should be a core rulebook).
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
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The ability that let you detect your favored enemies within 3 miles? Great ability, basically functioned as a Divine Sense on steroids. It might have been too powerful, but that is the thing I think Rangers should have access to. They had more buffs based on their favored enemy, they were great at travelling anywhere (which rangers should have), and they made the beast master better.
I personally use it still over the normal ranger.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
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Yeah, it’ll be “Xanathar’s Guide to Everything Else” or “Xanathar’s Guide to the Plains” or something like that. And the “Core Books for D&D” have always, are now, and forever will be 3 books: the PHB, the DMG, and the MM. Period. If they ever try to change that again like they did with the “2s,” people will lose their bananas all over again. Most people get burned once, they don’t touch the stove again, WotC got burned that way twice. If they make that mistake again I will be shocked.
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i would not call xanatars guide to everything a core rulebook and i would not call most of it in any way nessesary, other than maybe downtime and a few of the extra rules they introduced
even if they created an PHB 2, all it would do is re-release the rules of PHB 1 and add a small handful of races and maybe even classes, you would not "need" to buy it like you need to buy the players handbook and the monster manual to play the game
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
Yeah, why would they do that though?
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
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You’re right, most of the backlash came from the old heads who went from at least a decade (possibly up to 2) of OD&D, some of whom switched to AD&D in the early ‘90s, many though did not. Then in the late ‘90s TSR stopped supporting OD&D and only supported AD&D so they had to get used to AD&D, or just keep playing an unsupported game. About 3ish years after TSR stopped supporting OD&D 3.0 happened and then all of a sudden to 3.5 in under half a decade, with rumors of 4e coming right around the corner. It was too much. You think those editions had looooong lines of books? 2e has a looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong Line of books. Luckily for me I jumped from OD&D to AD&D right in the beginning, so for me it wasn’t that bad. But still, I bailed on D&D and MtG from the early/mid 2000s until the last couple of years because of how frustrated I was with WotC. I still only rarely play Magic, and don’t buy any new cards anymore.
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