I would like to know if there are any or if there are plans to make adventures for levels 13-20. I am in a group that has run 4 of the above sources and gotten characters to levels 13-15 and we would like to continue those characters to higher levels and hopefully reach level 20. But, I have not seen any adventures that are designated for higher levels.
Nope cause WotC are allergic to high level modules, cause CR is a joke of an encounter design mechanic, so making High lvl encounters is a Pain in the Hat...
Too much work, too much balancing (they still botch balancing at lower leveled content...)
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"Normality is but an Illusion, Whats normal to the Spider, is only madness for the Fly"
On utub there are some videos of Tim Kask an old TSR employee who talks about the old days of D&D. One major thing he mentions is that most of the campaigns he played / DM'ed only went to 10th level then they would retire those characters and start again. Combat beyond 5th level starts too take hours of game time to resolve, beyond 10th level combat encounters can probably take a couple of sessions to resolve. So I can see WoTC's aversion too designing anything beyond 15th level. On the other hand, instead of playing a canned adventure, you can always design your own high level campaign. Not easy but I would think much more fun then trying to run someone else's crazy creation.
As others have mentioned CR becomes more of an art than a science in this range. But honestly by the time your group gets to this lvl range you should know what they can handle or not handle. You should just ignore CR and instead craft encounters based on your group rather than the system.
High level play should really be about handling world shaping problems instead of your typical city/kingdom focused actions. This doesn't necessarily need to be politics or kingdom building just bigger problems. In superhero terms low levels is green arrow high levels is Superman and epic level is green lantern.
On utub there are some videos of Tim Kask an old TSR employee who talks about the old days of D&D. One major thing he mentions is that most of the campaigns he played / DM'ed only went to 10th level then they would retire those characters and start again. Combat beyond 5th level starts too take hours of game time to resolve, beyond 10th level combat encounters can probably take a couple of sessions to resolve.
Yeah maybe in the days of 2nd to 4th Edition, but in 5th? come on, maybe when you still learn the rules, but if you play long enough and know what you doing, most encounters if they are strictly "wack the other first" with no puzzles, intricate schemes etc, it should be over under 5 rounds...
Heck even with my current group that nearly all of them are new to the game, it only take 45mn for an encounter because one of the guys loves to talk for 20min and never know whats he gonna do before his turn comes up, to invetiably end on shooting his X-bow anyways...
The longest figth i had in 5th till now was on a Post to play Discord, took 2 weeks to complet, but in game time it only took 24 rounds, and that was involving a flying Funeral ship, going through a Portal to the Shadow realm while one half of the party was on it fighting 2 Undead Commanders+12 Wraiths in a Phalanx formations and 3 Spectral griffons-ridders while taking Necrotic dmg every turn, while the other half was fighting Zombies and Skeletons in a room with 12ft tall Iron spikes that would randomly shoot Bolt of lightning every odd turns...
If it wasn't Play by Post, with one or more people taking a 2 day break between posts, it would have lasted 3 hours tops for an intense Boss fight.
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"Normality is but an Illusion, Whats normal to the Spider, is only madness for the Fly"
Combat beyond 5th level starts too take hours of game time to resolve, beyond 10th level combat encounters can probably take a couple of sessions to resolve. So I can see WoTC's aversion too designing anything beyond 15th level.
If they know the gameplay above 10th level is so bad, why don't they fix it? Or why not just have level 10 or 12 be the cap? If "hardly anyone plays past 12th level" and if WOTC isn't going to put out adventures above 12th level (for the most part, they haven't, and nearly all of their hardcover adventures end around there if not before), then why even have the higher levels? It's a waste of paper, text, hard drive space, and whatever else I'm not thinking of at the moment.
I mean why even bother making content for levels 13+, if nearly everyone from the designers down to the youngest players agrees that it's not worth playing above at that level?
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WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
It is kind of frustrating to keep hearing that there isn't a lot of high level content because it's unbalanced and messy, yet at the same time keep hearing excuses against trying to make high level content more balanced and less messy.
Feels like we're just in this loop of circular justification where it's too hard to design content because it's messy but it's not worth the effort to fix because there's no content/demand.. and there isn't any of that because what we have is such a mess.
I would like to know if there are any or if there are plans to make adventures for levels 13-20. I am in a group that has run 4 of the above sources and gotten characters to levels 13-15 and we would like to continue those characters to higher levels and hopefully reach level 20. But, I have not seen any adventures that are designated for higher levels.
Wolf
There are loads of adventure modules for high level adventures going as far back as Basic and 1e. Just chose one and make the necessary conversions if needed. The monsters are still the same.
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I would like to know if there are any or if there are plans to make adventures for levels 13-20. I am in a group that has run 4 of the above sources and gotten characters to levels 13-15 and we would like to continue those characters to higher levels and hopefully reach level 20. But, I have not seen any adventures that are designated for higher levels.
Wolf
The only one I am aware of is Dungeon of the Mad Mage.
Also, DDB is not WotC, so your question is best asked towards Wizards, who actually produces the content.
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Shadowed eye of halagar. (13-16)
SAUCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
There are several in the marketplace that top out at 15. You'd have to look on Drive thru or DM's Guild.
Mad Mage does in fact go to 20.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
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"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
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I wouldn't recommend Mad Mage, despite the fact that it goes to level 20. It felt kind of uncohesive and boring.
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Nope cause WotC are allergic to high level modules, cause CR is a joke of an encounter design mechanic, so making High lvl encounters is a Pain in the Hat...
Too much work, too much balancing (they still botch balancing at lower leveled content...)
"Normality is but an Illusion, Whats normal to the Spider, is only madness for the Fly"
Kain de Frostberg- Dark Knight - (Vengeance Pal3/ Hexblade 9), Port Mourn
Kain de Draakberg-Dark Knight lvl8-Avergreen(DitA)
On utub there are some videos of Tim Kask an old TSR employee who talks about the old days of D&D. One major thing he mentions is that most of the campaigns he played / DM'ed only went to 10th level then they would retire those characters and start again. Combat beyond 5th level starts too take hours of game time to resolve, beyond 10th level combat encounters can probably take a couple of sessions to resolve. So I can see WoTC's aversion too designing anything beyond 15th level. On the other hand, instead of playing a canned adventure, you can always design your own high level campaign. Not easy but I would think much more fun then trying to run someone else's crazy creation.
As others have mentioned CR becomes more of an art than a science in this range. But honestly by the time your group gets to this lvl range you should know what they can handle or not handle. You should just ignore CR and instead craft encounters based on your group rather than the system.
High level play should really be about handling world shaping problems instead of your typical city/kingdom focused actions. This doesn't necessarily need to be politics or kingdom building just bigger problems. In superhero terms low levels is green arrow high levels is Superman and epic level is green lantern.
Yeah maybe in the days of 2nd to 4th Edition, but in 5th? come on, maybe when you still learn the rules, but if you play long enough and know what you doing, most encounters if they are strictly "wack the other first" with no puzzles, intricate schemes etc, it should be over under 5 rounds...
Heck even with my current group that nearly all of them are new to the game, it only take 45mn for an encounter because one of the guys loves to talk for 20min and never know whats he gonna do before his turn comes up, to invetiably end on shooting his X-bow anyways...
The longest figth i had in 5th till now was on a Post to play Discord, took 2 weeks to complet, but in game time it only took 24 rounds, and that was involving a flying Funeral ship, going through a Portal to the Shadow realm while one half of the party was on it fighting 2 Undead Commanders+12 Wraiths in a Phalanx formations and 3 Spectral griffons-ridders while taking Necrotic dmg every turn, while the other half was fighting Zombies and Skeletons in a room with 12ft tall Iron spikes that would randomly shoot Bolt of lightning every odd turns...
If it wasn't Play by Post, with one or more people taking a 2 day break between posts, it would have lasted 3 hours tops for an intense Boss fight.
"Normality is but an Illusion, Whats normal to the Spider, is only madness for the Fly"
Kain de Frostberg- Dark Knight - (Vengeance Pal3/ Hexblade 9), Port Mourn
Kain de Draakberg-Dark Knight lvl8-Avergreen(DitA)
If they know the gameplay above 10th level is so bad, why don't they fix it? Or why not just have level 10 or 12 be the cap? If "hardly anyone plays past 12th level" and if WOTC isn't going to put out adventures above 12th level (for the most part, they haven't, and nearly all of their hardcover adventures end around there if not before), then why even have the higher levels? It's a waste of paper, text, hard drive space, and whatever else I'm not thinking of at the moment.
I mean why even bother making content for levels 13+, if nearly everyone from the designers down to the youngest players agrees that it's not worth playing above at that level?
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
It is kind of frustrating to keep hearing that there isn't a lot of high level content because it's unbalanced and messy, yet at the same time keep hearing excuses against trying to make high level content more balanced and less messy.
Feels like we're just in this loop of circular justification where it's too hard to design content because it's messy but it's not worth the effort to fix because there's no content/demand.. and there isn't any of that because what we have is such a mess.
I would go with dungeon of The mad mage or maybe Candlekeep mysteries for 13-17.
I would not suggest storm kings thunder if I were you. It's sort of boring and straight forward and there is a lot of plane boring travel.
There are loads of adventure modules for high level adventures going as far back as Basic and 1e. Just chose one and make the necessary conversions if needed. The monsters are still the same.