I realize that reliable wild surges is an oxymoron, but as written the likelihood of surge is largely up to DM fiat, which is not ideal for a core class feature. I propose the following changes to make it consistent between games. I think that there is no point in playing a wild mage if you rarely surge so I lean towards more surges.
1) You roll for a chance of wild surge (so 5% chance) every time you cast a spell. I would also include cantrips because I like surging, but I can see people limiting it to 1st level and higher.
2) Tides of Chaos recharges every time you surge. If the DM wants to periodically make the chance of surging 100% for the story they can, but I see that as less necessary with my changes.
Do people think this is a good change or are there problems I'm missing?
I agree with you on all points except one: cantrips should not trigger wild magic surges. If everytime you wild magic surge, you regain use of Tides of Chaos and you can surge 5% of the time when you cast a cantrip, it will get out of hand.
I also play with the rule when you use Tides of Chaos, you trigger a wild magic surge.
"The relevant equation is: Knowledge = power = energy = matter = mass; a good bookshop is just a genteel Black Hole that knows how to read." - Terry Pratchett
In our games a check for wild surge is made whenever a spell of 1st level or higher is made. If a character has used Tides of Chaos they can choose to force a surge to reset it when they next cast a spell of 1st level or higher.
There is a homebrew rule that the target for triggering a wild surge isn't 1 but rather twice the level of the spell: a 1st level spell is 10% chance, a 9th level spell is 90% -- the more powerful the magic you use the greater the risk of a surge. This results in more surges. We only use this if there is only 1 wild magic sorc. In another game we play everyone has at least 1 level of wild magic sorc (everyone, even the NPCs and commoners, it's awesome) so we stuck to the target 1 for playability.
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I would use spell level times 5% so 45% for level 9 spells.
I wouldn't mind wild magic surges for cantrips, but it might be too strong if it auto refreshes tides of chaos.
I like the idea of tides of chaos triggering a wild magic surge at DM descression (as long as the DM actually uses it).
I propose an alternate option of tides of chaos adding a compounding 5% chance of a surge with every spell cast (even cantrips) until it triggers and refreshes tides. For example, after using tides of chaos, you use a cantrip and it has a 5% chance to surge, but doesn't, next turn you cast a level 1 spell, and it has a 15% chance to surge (5% normal +10% from tides), still no surge, third turn, you cast a cantrip again 15% chance to surge, and so on until tides is refreshed one way or another.
I have a wild magic Sorc. They have a background related to evocation magic that ties into the world/story, so they don't surge on Evocation spells-- But they have to roll for a surge for any other leveled spell they cast of a different school. I know for sure if I as a DM had to decide when wild magic surges happened, they just wouldn't-- there's far too much else to keep in mind!
I have a wild magic Sorc. They have a background related to evocation magic that ties into the world/story, so they don't surge on Evocation spells-- But they have to roll for a surge for any other leveled spell they cast of a different school. I know for sure if I as a DM had to decide when wild magic surges happened, they just wouldn't-- there's far too much else to keep in mind!
Good news then. The DM decides if the Sorc rolls or not, so make sure you tell your players wild magic doesn't work before they pick it.
My DM and I (and I suspect anyone playing a wild mage) want surges to happen.
I have a wild magic Sorc. They have a background related to evocation magic that ties into the world/story, so they don't surge on Evocation spells-- But they have to roll for a surge for any other leveled spell they cast of a different school. I know for sure if I as a DM had to decide when wild magic surges happened, they just wouldn't-- there's far too much else to keep in mind!
Good news then. The DM decides if the Sorc rolls or not, so make sure you tell your players wild magic doesn't work before they pick it.
That's... Why we came up with a new way to do it? Which I describe in the post you quoted? Which is what the discussion is about? I am discussing my homebrew method of making the Wild Magic sorc less dependant on DM fiat.
Just make them roll as normal then. 5% chance per leveled spell is pretty low. And you can just let tides of chaos be a once per long rest ability.
Most of us on this thread are discussing how to get wild magic surges to happen more often, while still being random.
I don't think you're reading Mellie's posts properly. Or I'm not. I interpret what she is saying as: instead of the DM prompting the surge check (RAW), in Mellie's game she makes a check everytime she casts a spell of 1st level or higher that is not an Evocation spell (Homebrew Rule).
Your suggestion to roll as normal for each levelled spell (second suggestion) is something she is already doing, just with exception for Evocation spells for RP reasons. This makes surges happen more than relying on DM prompt because the DM will forget a lot due to having so much to track as it is. Making Tides of Chaos a once per day thing will also result in less surges occurring.
You say "most of us" as if to not include her, but she, too, is using a homebrew rule to make surges happen more often so your implication she is not is confusing me. Her way results in more surges than RAW. Even more confusing is that you say you're discussing surges happening more often yet suggest to stick to RAW and have DM's decide when it happen which for most games will almost never happen as most DMs will forget about it.
I apologise if I'm interpreting Mellie's posts incorrectly but if I am not, then your posts do not make sense.
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Just make them roll as normal then. 5% chance per leveled spell is pretty low. And you can just let tides of chaos be a once per long rest ability.
Most of us on this thread are discussing how to get wild magic surges to happen more often, while still being random.
I don't think you're reading Mellie's posts properly. Or I'm not. I interpret what she is saying as: instead of the DM prompting the surge check (RAW), in Mellie's game she makes a check everytime she casts a spell of 1st level or higher that is not an Evocation spell (Homebrew Rule).
Your suggestion to roll as normal for each levelled spell (second suggestion) is something she is already doing, just with exception for Evocation spells for RP reasons. This makes surges happen more than relying on DM prompt because the DM will forget a lot due to having so much to track as it is. Making Tides of Chaos a once per day thing will also result in less surges occurring.
You say "most of us" as if to not include her, but she, too, is using a homebrew rule to make surges happen more often so your implication she is not is confusing me. Her way results in more surges than RAW. Even more confusing is that you say you're discussing surges happening more often yet suggest to stick to RAW and have DM's decide when it happen which for most games will almost never happen as most DMs will forget about it.
I apologise if I'm interpreting Mellie's posts incorrectly but if I am not, then your posts do not make sense.
You're interpreting correctly! Thank you for posting-- I kept re-reading my post trying to figure out where it was going wrong.
I really like all suggestions here (MillieDM one is particularly interesting, given the actual RP reasoning), and my idea veered more towards making Surges happen based on the spell level in relation to the caster level. Meaning: you roll a wild magic surge every time you cast using one of your highest level slot, and from 5th level slot and up you always roll.
I am now tempted to leave a certain percentage of chance for lower than max/5th slots, but I am unsure on it.
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I realize that reliable wild surges is an oxymoron, but as written the likelihood of surge is largely up to DM fiat, which is not ideal for a core class feature. I propose the following changes to make it consistent between games. I think that there is no point in playing a wild mage if you rarely surge so I lean towards more surges.
1) You roll for a chance of wild surge (so 5% chance) every time you cast a spell. I would also include cantrips because I like surging, but I can see people limiting it to 1st level and higher.
2) Tides of Chaos recharges every time you surge. If the DM wants to periodically make the chance of surging 100% for the story they can, but I see that as less necessary with my changes.
Do people think this is a good change or are there problems I'm missing?
I agree with you on all points except one: cantrips should not trigger wild magic surges. If everytime you wild magic surge, you regain use of Tides of Chaos and you can surge 5% of the time when you cast a cantrip, it will get out of hand.
I also play with the rule when you use Tides of Chaos, you trigger a wild magic surge.
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"The relevant equation is: Knowledge = power = energy = matter = mass; a good bookshop is just a genteel Black Hole that knows how to read." - Terry Pratchett
In our games a check for wild surge is made whenever a spell of 1st level or higher is made. If a character has used Tides of Chaos they can choose to force a surge to reset it when they next cast a spell of 1st level or higher.
There is a homebrew rule that the target for triggering a wild surge isn't 1 but rather twice the level of the spell: a 1st level spell is 10% chance, a 9th level spell is 90% -- the more powerful the magic you use the greater the risk of a surge. This results in more surges. We only use this if there is only 1 wild magic sorc. In another game we play everyone has at least 1 level of wild magic sorc (everyone, even the NPCs and commoners, it's awesome) so we stuck to the target 1 for playability.
Click ✨ HERE ✨ For My Youtube Videos featuring Guides, Tips & Tricks for using D&D Beyond.
Need help with Homebrew? Check out ✨ this FAQ/Guide thread ✨ by IamSposta.
I would use spell level times 5% so 45% for level 9 spells.
I wouldn't mind wild magic surges for cantrips, but it might be too strong if it auto refreshes tides of chaos.
I like the idea of tides of chaos triggering a wild magic surge at DM descression (as long as the DM actually uses it).
I propose an alternate option of tides of chaos adding a compounding 5% chance of a surge with every spell cast (even cantrips) until it triggers and refreshes tides. For example, after using tides of chaos, you use a cantrip and it has a 5% chance to surge, but doesn't, next turn you cast a level 1 spell, and it has a 15% chance to surge (5% normal +10% from tides), still no surge, third turn, you cast a cantrip again 15% chance to surge, and so on until tides is refreshed one way or another.
I have a wild magic Sorc. They have a background related to evocation magic that ties into the world/story, so they don't surge on Evocation spells-- But they have to roll for a surge for any other leveled spell they cast of a different school. I know for sure if I as a DM had to decide when wild magic surges happened, they just wouldn't-- there's far too much else to keep in mind!
Good news then. The DM decides if the Sorc rolls or not, so make sure you tell your players wild magic doesn't work before they pick it.
My DM and I (and I suspect anyone playing a wild mage) want surges to happen.
That's... Why we came up with a new way to do it? Which I describe in the post you quoted? Which is what the discussion is about? I am discussing my homebrew method of making the Wild Magic sorc less dependant on DM fiat.
Just make them roll as normal then. 5% chance per leveled spell is pretty low. And you can just let tides of chaos be a once per long rest ability.
Most of us on this thread are discussing how to get wild magic surges to happen more often, while still being random.
I don't think you're reading Mellie's posts properly. Or I'm not. I interpret what she is saying as: instead of the DM prompting the surge check (RAW), in Mellie's game she makes a check everytime she casts a spell of 1st level or higher that is not an Evocation spell (Homebrew Rule).
Your suggestion to roll as normal for each levelled spell (second suggestion) is something she is already doing, just with exception for Evocation spells for RP reasons. This makes surges happen more than relying on DM prompt because the DM will forget a lot due to having so much to track as it is. Making Tides of Chaos a once per day thing will also result in less surges occurring.
You say "most of us" as if to not include her, but she, too, is using a homebrew rule to make surges happen more often so your implication she is not is confusing me. Her way results in more surges than RAW. Even more confusing is that you say you're discussing surges happening more often yet suggest to stick to RAW and have DM's decide when it happen which for most games will almost never happen as most DMs will forget about it.
I apologise if I'm interpreting Mellie's posts incorrectly but if I am not, then your posts do not make sense.
Click ✨ HERE ✨ For My Youtube Videos featuring Guides, Tips & Tricks for using D&D Beyond.
Need help with Homebrew? Check out ✨ this FAQ/Guide thread ✨ by IamSposta.
You're interpreting correctly! Thank you for posting-- I kept re-reading my post trying to figure out where it was going wrong.
I was thinking about this the other day.
I really like all suggestions here (MillieDM one is particularly interesting, given the actual RP reasoning), and my idea veered more towards making Surges happen based on the spell level in relation to the caster level. Meaning: you roll a wild magic surge every time you cast using one of your highest level slot, and from 5th level slot and up you always roll.
I am now tempted to leave a certain percentage of chance for lower than max/5th slots, but I am unsure on it.
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games