This seems like the distinction between "arcane" and "divine" casting. There's different sources of magical power and each can access different spells. The difference between divine and arcane magic doesn't have another mechanical effect because the distinction is already mechanically represented by the different spell lists of different classes.
Honestly, I'd be interested in seeing a Necromancer class inspired by the Necromancer in Diablo. Obviously that would require a ton of tweaking... although parts of Diablo are inspired by games like D&D, the focus is entirely different. But something in that vein focused on controlling a horde of disposable minions sounds potentially pretty fun (even if it would end up being a nightmare for the DM to track)
I don't know anything about Diablo, but controlling a hoard of thousands on undead does not require any tweaking, just a lot of planning. I saw a YouTube video that calculated how many undead could be controlled RAW by a level 20 necromancer (I think it was dawnforgecast).
I think their point was more on the "disposable" part. Animate Dead doesn't really create "disposable" minions; you're expected to keep them around for some time, reasserting control periodically. Spells like Danse Macabre create "disposable" minions. Other types of spells like Diablo's Necromancer would be regular attack spells with a "undead minion" effect, like a spell that raises a small horde of undead bears that immediately charge and trample your target, then immediately decompose without sticking around.
As an aside, if we were to make a necromancer subclass that got access to most of, or the entire necromancy school of magic, which class would be the most appropriate to build it under? Or would you really be best served creating a whole new character class?
well lt could be a sub class of wizard (maybe also a subclass of cleric)
well lt could be a sub class of wizard (maybe also a subclass of cleric)
In this case, I built it as a subclass of warlock and incorporated several aspects of the pact of the Undying warlock, the School of Necromancy wizard, a little dab of Death Domain cleric, and a helping of original content as well. If you're curious, you can check out my draft in this thread.
Honestly, I'd be interested in seeing a Necromancer class inspired by the Necromancer in Diablo. Obviously that would require a ton of tweaking... although parts of Diablo are inspired by games like D&D, the focus is entirely different. But something in that vein focused on controlling a horde of disposable minions sounds potentially pretty fun (even if it would end up being a nightmare for the DM to track)
I don't know anything about Diablo, but controlling a hoard of thousands on undead does not require any tweaking, just a lot of planning. I saw a YouTube video that calculated how many undead could be controlled RAW by a level 20 necromancer (I think it was dawnforgecast).
I think their point was more on the "disposable" part. Animate Dead doesn't really create "disposable" minions; you're expected to keep them around for some time, reasserting control periodically. Spells like Danse Macabre create "disposable" minions. Other types of spells like Diablo's Necromancer would be regular attack spells with a "undead minion" effect, like a spell that raises a small horde of undead bears that immediately charge and trample your target, then immediately decompose without sticking around.
Don't forget a wall of undead, or grasping hands (though that might be from witch doctor, I don't remember, but thematically appropriate). I think there are spells that could mimic some of those spells with a simple "reskinning".
Honestly, I'd be interested in seeing a Necromancer class inspired by the Necromancer in Diablo. Obviously that would require a ton of tweaking... although parts of Diablo are inspired by games like D&D, the focus is entirely different. But something in that vein focused on controlling a horde of disposable minions sounds potentially pretty fun (even if it would end up being a nightmare for the DM to track)
I don't know anything about Diablo, but controlling a hoard of thousands on undead does not require any tweaking, just a lot of planning. I saw a YouTube video that calculated how many undead could be controlled RAW by a level 20 necromancer (I think it was dawnforgecast).
I think their point was more on the "disposable" part. Animate Dead doesn't really create "disposable" minions; you're expected to keep them around for some time, reasserting control periodically. Spells like Danse Macabre create "disposable" minions. Other types of spells like Diablo's Necromancer would be regular attack spells with a "undead minion" effect, like a spell that raises a small horde of undead bears that immediately charge and trample your target, then immediately decompose without sticking around.
Don't forget a wall of undead, or grasping hands (though that might be from witch doctor, I don't remember, but thematically appropriate). I think there are spells that could mimic some of those spells with a simple "reskinning".
Sorry to revive this dead thread (ironic,given the topic) but I have made a homebrew feat,and figured I should share it here,cause it as meant to address this idea. Feedback is obviously welcome (on the feats page,not here)
I'm with Tonio on this. You have to realize that the designers had a huge pile of legacy spells and 8 buckets to put them in. Some of the spells are no-brainers for their school, and other were kind of shoehorned in to bulk up an underrepresented school or didn't really fit anywhere else. The school spell lists themselves are much messier conceptually than actual builds such as the School of Necromancy wizard or the Death Domain cleric. There is a reason you guys have to turn to homebrew to do this.
Someone with all the necromancy spells are not a "master of life and death" because there are plenty of non-necromancy schools that support that concept, like most of the healing spells.
An unlimited amount once you get the spell Finger of Death.
A humanoid killed by this spell rises at the start of your next turn as a zombie that is permanently under your command, following your verbal orders to the best of its ability.
An unlimited amount once you get the spell Finger of Death.
A humanoid killed by this spell rises at the start of your next turn as a zombie that is permanently under your command, following your verbal orders to the best of its ability.
A theoretically unlimited amount. But given that Finger of Death is a level 7 spell, you can cast it at most twice per day, so that's a maximum of two permanent zombies per day. At that level, though, zombies won't last very long. =/
An unlimited amount once you get the spell Finger of Death.
A humanoid killed by this spell rises at the start of your next turn as a zombie that is permanently under your command, following your verbal orders to the best of its ability.
A theoretically unlimited amount. But given that Finger of Death is a level 7 spell, you can cast it at most twice per day, so that's a maximum of two permanent zombies per day. At that level, though, zombies won't last very long. =/
Four times if you're willing to upcast.
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This seems like the distinction between "arcane" and "divine" casting. There's different sources of magical power and each can access different spells. The difference between divine and arcane magic doesn't have another mechanical effect because the distinction is already mechanically represented by the different spell lists of different classes.
I think their point was more on the "disposable" part. Animate Dead doesn't really create "disposable" minions; you're expected to keep them around for some time, reasserting control periodically. Spells like Danse Macabre create "disposable" minions. Other types of spells like Diablo's Necromancer would be regular attack spells with a "undead minion" effect, like a spell that raises a small horde of undead bears that immediately charge and trample your target, then immediately decompose without sticking around.
well lt could be a sub class of wizard (maybe also a subclass of cleric)
In this case, I built it as a subclass of warlock and incorporated several aspects of the pact of the Undying warlock, the School of Necromancy wizard, a little dab of Death Domain cleric, and a helping of original content as well. If you're curious, you can check out my draft in this thread.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Don't forget a wall of undead, or grasping hands (though that might be from witch doctor, I don't remember, but thematically appropriate). I think there are spells that could mimic some of those spells with a simple "reskinning".
Wall of undead could easily be a reskin of Wall of Force, or Wall of Fire (depending on the rune, I guess?). The grasping hands is obviously a reskin of Evard's Black Tentacles. :D
Sorry to revive this dead thread (ironic,given the topic) but I have made a homebrew feat,and figured I should share it here,cause it as meant to address this idea. Feedback is obviously welcome (on the feats page,not here)
https://www.dndbeyond.com/feats/359911-scholarly-focus
I'm with Tonio on this. You have to realize that the designers had a huge pile of legacy spells and 8 buckets to put them in. Some of the spells are no-brainers for their school, and other were kind of shoehorned in to bulk up an underrepresented school or didn't really fit anywhere else. The school spell lists themselves are much messier conceptually than actual builds such as the School of Necromancy wizard or the Death Domain cleric. There is a reason you guys have to turn to homebrew to do this.
Someone with all the necromancy spells are not a "master of life and death" because there are plenty of non-necromancy schools that support that concept, like most of the healing spells.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
An unlimited amount once you get the spell Finger of Death.
A theoretically unlimited amount. But given that Finger of Death is a level 7 spell, you can cast it at most twice per day, so that's a maximum of two permanent zombies per day. At that level, though, zombies won't last very long. =/
Four times if you're willing to upcast.