Like the title says, I'm pretty disappointed that pre-order books aren't included in the Cyber Monday discount. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I could swear they have been in the past. I have the Legendary Bundle, so the only things I have left to purchase are pre-order books, and it's just a bummer they're not included. I want to give D&D Beyond my money! Let me give it to you! 

I'm right there with you.  I intended to make a purchase of a pre-order.  The fact that they excluded them will pretty much nix that idea.

Kobold Press has 20% off until Midnight.  They have a hard cover / PDF book I want too.  I guess I will just go there today.

Same here. Planned on pre-ordering a book but will just hold off I guess.

Pre-order discounts are one of the reasons DDB has been stingier with sales than they used to be.  Literally everybody waits until a sale, or tries to, during a book's pre-order cycle.  I have no doubt it messes with their projections or whatever the Money People term is for "how much did we bilk people for without having to provide a product first?", and losing out on some of the profit from the big burst of sales when a book first hits likely pissed them off.  Sales on older/existing material is meant to incentivize fence-sitters to get moving on products that aren't as active/profitable anymore, or entice newcomers into the service with deep cuts on the necessary books.  I know I've heard somewhere before that the DDB team hates giving away discounts on preorder books and considers it a huge problem.

So...short version, I guess: prepare to see the "doesn't apply to preorders" thing a lot, and to have to pay full-price-plus for all your sheet shinies they refuse to give you any way other than being a bad consumer and buying products months ahead of release with no guarantee you'll get what you paid for.

Blugh.

Quote from Yurei1453 >>

I know I've heard somewhere before that the DDB team hates giving away discounts on preorder books and considers it a huge problem.

 Pretty big statement there that I'm sure others would like sourced.  I know I would.

Unfortunately I don't have a ready source, any quotable links.  [REDACTED]  I could swear, however, that I've heard someone on the team talk about how discounts/sales working on preorder books is an issue for the business and something they've wanted to address.  May have been a Dev Update, response to a viewer question?  I don't know where the knowledge came from but I know I've heard it somewhere.

I'm sure the other problem they have are the people who pre-ordered outside of a sale feeling short-changed that people who waited got it cheaper.

This only pertains to two books correct? Strix and the Crit Role book?

I preordered Strixhaven a while back.  I wouldn't have been upset.  Especially if I could have gotten Netherdeep on sale.

I understand that some may be disappointed in "loosing out" by pre-ordering before a sale, but personally I don't think that should be the reason to preclude them from sales going forward.  It's no different than if you bought a traditionally priced book the day before a sale. It's the same amount of feel bad, and is the "cost of doing business" as a consumer.

If it's a business reason as mentioned above, that seems more reasonable. Unfortunate, but reasonable. 

Quote from Stormknight >>

The only real discussion that has been had on this previously, is around the number of people who have let us know that they were upset when we included pre-order books in sales, for books that they have already pre-ordered, which I feel is a totally reasonable perspective.

 For what it's worth, I really appreciate that you all included bundles in this year's sale and it prompted make my first purchase (Player's bundle). Thank you for listening to us on this!

Quote from Stormknight >>

The only real discussion that has been had on this previously, is around the number of people who have let us know that they were upset when we included pre-order books in sales, for books that they have already pre-ordered, which I feel is a totally reasonable perspective.

 Wouldn't someone feel the same way after buying a book that was already available for full price, only to find out they could have waited for a sale?

Count me among the number of people who are upset that the pre-order books were not included in the sale. I have waited for a sale like this to buy every pre-order book since I picked up the legendary bundle in January 2020. If they're not included in sales anymore I am not sure I'll ever buy a pre-order again.

Quote from Buzzardoftheages >>

Quote from Stormknight >>

The only real discussion that has been had on this previously, is around the number of people who have let us know that they were upset when we included pre-order books in sales, for books that they have already pre-ordered, which I feel is a totally reasonable perspective.

 Wouldn't someone feel the same way after buying a book that was already available for full price, only to find out they could have waited for a sale?

Count me among the number of people who are upset that the pre-order books were not included in the sale. I have waited for a sale like this to buy every pre-order book since I picked up the legendary bundle in January 2020. If they're not included in sales anymore I am not sure I'll ever buy a pre-order again.

I've always been of the opinion that there should be some sort of return for fronting money on an unreleased product.    Their is a big reason so many people are against pre-ordering games.   

I think your right though.   I think I'm probably done pre-ordering stuff.  It helps out the developer, but the person fronting the money doesn't get anything extra out of helping them out.  So why do it?  You can just buy it once it's released at the same cost, except you got to hang on to your money.

Sales are for people who weren't willing to pay full price. You don't know who those people are until the product has been available for full price. If you want to pay less, you wait for it.  

I get it, everyone wants to save money. But asking a business to give you a discount before the product is even out yet is kind of ridiculous as a business model and would be unheard of in most other industries. You might do this with base "onboarding" materials like the PHB just to get people playing, but this book is not that.

Quote from scatterbraind >>

Sales are for people who weren't willing to pay full price. You don't know who those people are until the product has been available for full price. If you want to pay less, you wait for it.  

I get it, everyone wants to save money. But asking a business to give you a discount before the product is even out yet is kind of ridiculous as a business model and would be unheard of in most other industries. You might do this with base "onboarding" materials like the PHB just to get people playing, but this book is not that.

 lol, asking your customer to pay for something MONTHS before even finished fits neatly into that same ridiculous state.

Sure, but it's a risk assumed by the customer which is totally different than slashing into your own profits. Personally I think pre-orders are not a good idea, but I don't object to the option being available if that's what people want.

Well for what it's worth, from my perspective, sales are the only real reason to pre-order digital content. And as far as DnD Beyond goes, the only book that I have not already purchased is a pre-order book... so this decision essentially excluded me from the Cyber Monday sale.

Does that mean I will cancel my account? No, not at all. But I'm also not going to rush to purchase pre-order content anymore if I have to purchase it at full price. I can just wait for a sale once it is released or, better yet, wait until I have had a chance to review the physical books (which I also purchase) in order to see if it is something I would want in digital format. I always saw these sales as an extra little reason to take a chance and support a service that I enjoy, even if I'm not certain how much use I will get out of the content. 

My impression is that DDB pre-orders basically sate some consumers' 'First!' thirst.  Especially with DDB you can claim to have access to the book hours before anyone can pick up their print copy, aside from all the YouTubers and the like who get advanced copies and have pretty much read the whole book out loud to the audience within 7-10 days of the actual release.  And the pre-orders get some exclusive dice and other aesthetics like frames for putting their money up ahead of everyone else.  I don't fault consumers for doing it, but it's not for me anymore (I think my last pre-order was Tasha's because I believe I was able to pre-order on sale, ahem, and I knew I'd probably want the whole book in to DDB so it seemed more efficient than homebrewing the whole thing). I buy the physical books, ironically my FLGS is closed on Tuesdays when books usually drop, so I'm actually not cracking open the cover till at least the next day.  I don't buy DDB adventures anymore, as I like working off paper.  For sourcebooks, after I read it, I decide whether it's worth plunking down the money to get the content "professionally" into my DDB account or make it a homebrew venture.  Like with Fizban's I'm more likely to go for now because it's much more crunch content while VRGtR is a lot more lore and DM coaching, so I bought the GothLines and have been homebrewing the backgrounds and magic and such as I need them (haven't done the classes yet).   

"First!" thirst gets into the whole "completionist" mindset I brought up in the other Cyber Monday thread.  I feel I'm playing great games without a trio of new dragonborn lineages and a pair of subclasses and new magic items and spells.  No one at my table is clamoring for them, either and frankly the one "new" thing I'm trying to get into my game is someone to play a shadow-stitched rogue (but that's preview content I got for some 3rd Party thing I kickstarted so will have to be homebrewed anyway, but it's cool, so I'll do it).  With the D&D market being what it is, there's no need to incentivise pre-sales.

Eh, I'm not sure I get the zeal to get books hours earlier. You still need prep time to run it and a session, so itgets you nowhere fast. Butnwhatever floats people's boats, I guess. If it makes them happy, then crack on.

Personally, unless I'm getting something good in return, I don't preorder since Mario Tennis Aces burned me (a tennis game that didn't let you play a set? Really?). As mentioned, you generally get a special set of dice and character sheer. However, they're not of particular interest to me. I prefer physical (or at least, PDF for sheets) anyway. The dice roller might have been useful for travelling...if they let me use it independently and not have to create a character and run a mock campaign to use it. As is, neither are particularly attractive. If they offered a discount or something on the other hand...

Most of the time, I won't preorder. The deal has to be good to tempt me to risk my money on an unknown product.