I will respond to your point about the rights, since it is the exact kind of misinformation I was talking about. Legal rights are complicated, and the LotR rights are more complicated than most. The Tolkien estate sold off the rights piecemeal over the course of decades, so they became a mismatched mess where film rights to different parts of Tolkien’s works ended up with different companies (not to mention game rights, rights to produce products, etc.).
The Tolkien family had literally nothing to do with “refusing” to give Amazon the rights to the totality of Tolkien’s work; they literally had no legal ability to do so since those rights already were in the hands of others.
This is, of course, something that has been discussed at length by legitimate sources; but misinformation (and some truly terrible legal analysis) spreads faster than reality.
Ok, it’s misinformation. But in all this post I really don’t see anything about how Amazon have the rights. They don’t have the rights. Their directors said so in an article I can post here. They said they couldn’t follow the lore cause they’re not allowed to. This is from the mouths of the directors: They cannot make a faithful adaptation. That’s not false news. That’s straight from the show itself.
Oh, and they also said they asked the Tolkien estate themselves, and the Tolkien estate refused. So…. Right.
They have the rights to the Appendix, and everything contained therein. They chose a part of the lore where there is a gap in the Silmarilion, Unfinished Tales, etc. specifically because they knew they could not obtain the legal rights (and “could not obtain” is a big difference from “refuse”).
And, again, they’re working with Tolkien’s family to flesh out the details. You’ll have to pardon me if I am willing to give the benefit of the doubt to Tolkien’s flesh and blood, instead of “3 million” folks on the interwebs who lack much in the way of actual data and who consistently demonstrate poor comprehension of the data that does exist.
But, hey, I am sure that the citizenry of Númenor would have given three million downvotes to Elendil tweeting “Maybe we should not trust this Ar-Pharazôn guy” also. Notoriously reliable the public is when it is engaging in wild speculation on scant information.
I will respond to your point about the rights, since it is the exact kind of misinformation I was talking about. Legal rights are complicated, and the LotR rights are more complicated than most. The Tolkien estate sold off the rights piecemeal over the course of decades, so they became a mismatched mess where film rights to different parts of Tolkien’s works ended up with different companies (not to mention game rights, rights to produce products, etc.).
The Tolkien family had literally nothing to do with “refusing” to give Amazon the rights to the totality of Tolkien’s work; they literally had no legal ability to do so since those rights already were in the hands of others.
This is, of course, something that has been discussed at length by legitimate sources; but misinformation (and some truly terrible legal analysis) spreads faster than reality.
Ok, it’s misinformation. But in all this post I really don’t see anything about how Amazon have the rights. They don’t have the rights. Their directors said so in an article I can post here. They said they couldn’t follow the lore cause they’re not allowed to. This is from the mouths of the directors: They cannot make a faithful adaptation. That’s not false news. That’s straight from the show itself.
Oh, and they also said they asked the Tolkien estate themselves, and the Tolkien estate refused. So…. Right.
They have the rights to the Appendix, and everything contained therein. They chose a part of the lore where there is a gap in the Silmarilion, Unfinished Tales, etc. specifically because they knew they could not obtain the legal rights (and “could not obtain” is a big difference from “refuse”).
And, again, they’re working with Tolkien’s family to flesh out the details. You’ll have to pardon me if I am willing to give the benefit of the doubt to Tolkien’s flesh and blood, instead of “3 million” folks on the interwebs who lack much in the way of actual data and who consistently demonstrate poor comprehension of the data that does exist.
But, hey, I am sure that the citizenry of Númenor would have given three million downvotes to Elendil tweeting “Maybe we should not trust this Ar-Pharazôn guy” also. Notoriously reliable the public is when it is engaging in wild speculation on scant information.
Right, I’m still not hearing the part where they have the rights and won’t have to make things up. Sure, the Tolkien family is with them on this (I haven’t seen any evidence of that, but anyway). The fact remains they don’t have the rights and will have to make most of it up. The fact remains that they paid a bunch of idiots who thought the orcs had a Ring and Sauron was an elf to pose as “superfans” in a review of their series, then promptly took that video down when the community exploded on them. Just speculation, but if you could get actual legitimate fans I figure you would use them in a video. Which makes me think they don’t have any, hence the fakes. That also proves they’re willing to fake and lie to prove their show is good, which makes me think it isn’t. It also makes me doubt the validity of all their claims that Tolkien experts love the show, since we only have their word on that. Or they simply bought the experts off, which is very in keeping with their behaviour.
Remind me why I should trust these guys again? And I’ll say it for the tenth time: They have no rights, and they’ve said they will have to make shit up. That will never change.
You keep saying “misinformation” and “false news”. But everything I have said (they have no rights, the majority of the community is against them, they’ve already lied and faked and even deleted dislikes on the trailer) has solid fact to back it up (Tolkien family stuff is an exception, tho I haven’t seen anything about it so I’ll have to take your word for it). You can call everyone bigots all you like, but you can’t argue with these facts. So where is all this false news exactly? Everything I have said has proof.
Question: Why does it matter if people don't like the show the trailer?
It’s all the info on the show, which is a lot more then the trailer. And it doesn’t matter; I’m angry cause it mutilates Tolkien lore. So it’s nice fans are standing up and saying they don’t like it is pretty cool. Like I said, who knows what the show will be. But it is a 100% guarantee that it will not be what Tolkien wrote, cause they don’t have the rights to it. I thought you disliked the movies cause they changed things? You’d think something that will have next to nothing canon in it would provoke a similar reaction, but eh.
You keep saying “misinformation” and “false news”. But everything I have said (they have no rights, the majority of the community is against them, they’ve already lied and faked and even deleted dislikes on the trailer) has solid fact to back it up (Tolkien family stuff is an exception, tho I haven’t seen anything about it so I’ll have to take your word for it). You can call everyone bigots all you like, but you can’t argue with these facts. So where is all this false news exactly? Everything I have said has proof.
There is a reason objections to relevance and hearsay exist in law - the statements might be “facts”, but they are useless as facts and thus muddy the waters of truth. Community consensus is a bad fact that doesn’t speak to the show’s actual quality. Expert opinions, like the scholars who have seen the first episode and praised its dedication to Tolkien are good and admissible facts. Posting about rights, in a manner that says the Tolkien family “refused” to grant the rights is a bad fact, since it ignores the fact that the Tolkien family might have wanted to give out the rights, but had their hands tied by one of the most notoriously legally quagmired Intellectual Properties in the field.
Quality of evidence matters, and the totality of actual quality evidence gives cause to ignore the ignorant masses and keep an open mind. That’s not to say it will be good or not, and it might be terrible - but prejudging based on bad evidence, especially when the good evidence is so overwhelmingly positive is silly.
You keep saying “misinformation” and “false news”. But everything I have said (they have no rights, the majority of the community is against them, they’ve already lied and faked and even deleted dislikes on the trailer) has solid fact to back it up (Tolkien family stuff is an exception, tho I haven’t seen anything about it so I’ll have to take your word for it). You can call everyone bigots all you like, but you can’t argue with these facts. So where is all this false news exactly? Everything I have said has proof.
There is a reason objections to relevance and hearsay exist in law - the statements might be “facts”, but they are useless as facts and thus muddy the waters of truth. Community consensus is a bad fact that doesn’t speak to the show’s actual quality. Expert opinions, like the scholars who have seen the first episode and praised its dedication to Tolkien are good and admissible facts. Posting about rights, in a manner that says the Tolkien family “refused” to grant the rights is a bad fact, since it ignores the fact that the Tolkien family might have wanted to give out the rights, but had their hands tied by one of the most notoriously legally quagmired Intellectual Properties in the field.
Quality of evidence matters, and the totality of actual quality evidence gives cause to ignore the ignorant masses and keep an open mind. That’s not to say it will be good or not, and it might be terrible - but prejudging based on bad evidence, especially when the good evidence is so overwhelmingly positive is silly.
Again, we have only word on that: The Tolkien experts were only quoted in an article, I don’t see any proof there. And again, AMAZON FAKED A FAN REVIEW. We have every reason to be suspicious about the Tolkien experts, and absolutely no reason to buy it. And sure, I missworded that. Sue me. There’s also a chance I could be right.
I couldn’t agree with you more. So where is this overwhelmingly positive evidence? Amazon have said they can’t follow the lore, all evidence we have seen is the opposite of promising, and they faked a positive review of the show. If it was really good, they wouldn’t have had to. One Ring.net are their biggest supporters: And they will ban anyone who speaks against the show. And are now surprised when they’re either ignored or attacked on everything they do. But hey, they’ve got 3 people on their side.
Oh, and ignorant masses, huh. I’ll take that as a compliment, given that I don’t need to resort to insults to back up my points.
Question: Why does it matter if people don't like the show the trailer?
It’s all the info on the show, which is a lot more then the trailer. And it doesn’t matter; I’m angry cause it mutilates Tolkien lore. So it’s nice fans are standing up and saying they don’t like it is pretty cool. Like I said, who knows what the show will be. But it is a 100% guarantee that it will not be what Tolkien wrote, cause they don’t have the rights to it. I thought you disliked the movies cause they changed things? You’d think something that will have next to nothing canon in it would provoke a similar reaction, but eh.
Just because people belive something doesn't mean that it is true
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Hi everyone! I'm working up the will to finalize my signature, so... I guess this will be the signature for now
Question: Why does it matter if people don't like the show the trailer?
It’s all the info on the show, which is a lot more then the trailer. And it doesn’t matter; I’m angry cause it mutilates Tolkien lore. So it’s nice fans are standing up and saying they don’t like it is pretty cool. Like I said, who knows what the show will be. But it is a 100% guarantee that it will not be what Tolkien wrote, cause they don’t have the rights to it. I thought you disliked the movies cause they changed things? You’d think something that will have next to nothing canon in it would provoke a similar reaction, but eh.
Just because people belive something doesn't mean that it is true
Believe what? You’re not making sense. They have said they can’t follow the lore. That’s not believing. That’s a fact.
*Shrugs.*. I’ve said my piece a number of times, including providing information about how involved the Tolkien family has been, how they do actually have a lot of the rights, and how folks who have seen the show’s beginning and have respectable pedigrees they will not risk just for Amazon’s sake.
So, I’ll leave it with one last point - I firmly consider myself in the “ignorant masses” club on this point; as should anyone who is not inside the production or is not privy to the preview. That isn’t an insult in the slightest, it’s a statement of reality - we the masses are the dictionary definition of ignorant, and, pending disavowal of said ignorance by the show’s release, should give some deference to those with actual knowledge.
Question: Why does it matter if people don't like the show the trailer?
It’s all the info on the show, which is a lot more then the trailer. And it doesn’t matter; I’m angry cause it mutilates Tolkien lore. So it’s nice fans are standing up and saying they don’t like it is pretty cool. Like I said, who knows what the show will be. But it is a 100% guarantee that it will not be what Tolkien wrote, cause they don’t have the rights to it. I thought you disliked the movies cause they changed things? You’d think something that will have next to nothing canon in it would provoke a similar reaction, but eh.
Just because people belive something doesn't mean that it is true
Believe what? You’re not making sense. They have said they can’t follow the lore. That’s not believing. That’s a fact.
That is opinion. And what about the people who have actually seen the show, would they have some important info?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Hi everyone! I'm working up the will to finalize my signature, so... I guess this will be the signature for now
I guess I should make one additional point, since you are just dead wrong about what the showrunners said. Here’s a quote:
“There’s a version of everything we need in the books we have the rights to. As long as we’re painting within those lines and not egregiously contradicting something we don’t have the rights to, there’s a lot of leeway and room to dramatize and tell some of the best stories that [Tolkien] ever came up with. We worked in conjunction with world-renowned Tolkien scholars and the Tolkien estate to make sure the way we connected the dots were Tolkienian and gelled with the experts’ and the estate’s understanding of the material.”
Or, to paraphrase: We had the rights to everything that is important because the Appendixes in Return of the King are amazing, and we worked with experts to make sure our story is in line with Tolkien’s lore.
Thatis the actual fact of what they said about the rights issue. It is a very different tune than whatever hearsay you are getting from the dedicated naysayers in whatever discord group you are in.
Again, no one is telling you to like the show once it comes out; just not to shoot from the hip and discount those actually involved just because you want to put your faith in the ignorant (again, not an insult - textbook definition of ignorance, insofar as they do not have any real, tangible knowledge). Not only will you have an opinion more grounded in useful, non hearsayevidence, you won’t be “that guy” who is trying to ruin people’s excitement for the show.
And maybe then you could have a real discussion on your thread for once - folks talking about what they want to see in the show, what they personally like or do not like about the aesthetics, etc. - instead of you going off on anyone who brings it up, simply because the hive mind told you to.
Circling away from that topic, and back to updating people on the new information about the show, in an interview released today, the show runner said they have all five season of the show - 50 hours of content - planned out, and even know exactly how to end it. That’s a pretty promising piece of data - so many shows nowadays do not know where they are going or how they are going to end, that the seem to lose their plot as showrunners struggle to come up with more material. Good to know that they are keeping relatively constrained with LotR and will not feel as much pressure to balloon the show into something it was not supposed to be.
The showrunner also discussed a letter written by Tolkien himself to his publisher, about how Tolkien wanted to create and leave behind a mythology others could work within and expand. The show runner went on to talk about how comforting he found that idea - that he was not truly owning a brand new creation from scratch, but rather acting as the steward for what Tolkien already created.
Circling away from that topic, and back to updating people on the new information about the show, in an interview released today, the show runner said they have all five season of the show - 50 hours of content - planned out, and even know exactly how to end it. That’s a pretty promising piece of data - so many shows nowadays do not know where they are going or how they are going to end, that the seem to lose their plot as showrunners struggle to come up with more material. Good to know that they are keeping relatively constrained with LotR and will not feel as much pressure to balloon the show into something it was not supposed to be.
The showrunner also discussed a letter written by Tolkien himself to his publisher, about how Tolkien wanted to create and leave behind a mythology others could work within and expand. The show runner went on to talk about how comforting he found that idea - that he was not truly owning a brand new creation from scratch, but rather acting as the steward for what Tolkien already created.
I guess I should make one additional point, since you are just dead wrong about what the showrunners said. Here’s a quote:
“There’s a version of everything we need in the books we have the rights to. As long as we’re painting within those lines and not egregiously contradicting something we don’t have the rights to, there’s a lot of leeway and room to dramatize and tell some of the best stories that [Tolkien] ever came up with. We worked in conjunction with world-renowned Tolkien scholars and the Tolkien estate to make sure the way we connected the dots were Tolkienian and gelled with the experts’ and the estate’s understanding of the material.”
Or, to paraphrase: We had the rights to everything that is important because the Appendixes in Return of the King are amazing, and we worked with experts to make sure our story is in line with Tolkien’s lore.
Thatis the actual fact of what they said about the rights issue. It is a very different tune than whatever hearsay you are getting from the dedicated naysayers in whatever discord group you are in.
Again, no one is telling you to like the show once it comes out; just not to shoot from the hip and discount those actually involved just because you want to put your faith in the ignorant (again, not an insult - textbook definition of ignorance, insofar as they do not have any real, tangible knowledge). Not only will you have an opinion more grounded in useful, non hearsayevidence, you won’t be “that guy” who is trying to ruin people’s excitement for the show.
And maybe then you could have a real discussion on your thread for once - folks talking about what they want to see in the show, what they personally like or do not like about the aesthetics, etc. - instead of you going off on anyone who brings it up, simply because the hive mind told you to.
No, I’m quite aware of exactly what the showrunners said. Given that all examples of the show we’ve seen are completely different from their statement, I really don’t care. Also, it’s not my stupid Discord group: What I’m saying is the gist of what’s happening on Facebook, Twitter and all other social media platforms of the Tolkien fandom. And there’s barely anyone arguing against them (besides One Ring.net).
Oh and yeah, all the Second Age stuff in the RotK appendices are enough to make a show out of. Totally.
And, ok… That was hugely insulting and passive-aggressive. I’m gonna resist the urge to kick you off the club over an insult cause that’s bad leadership, and just take a break for a couple days from this instead before I do something stupid like the aforementioned.
Calm down people! It's a TV show. Whether or not you agree with the premise or creation method is important, but not so much so as it is worth losing friends over. Everybody in this thread likes and/or loves Tolkien. Do we have to drive a pitiful line between us over some content created by some mega-studio with mega-dollars? Of course not.
The TV show has its goods and its bads, for everyone. Who's to say though that one person's good or bad is prevalent over another's? Even if the TV series is the most sorely lacking, wasteful, tedious experience in Tolkien History, its a TV show, not the end of the world. Can we please be kind to one another? None of us mean to hurt each other, but if we keep our indiscrete ways of throwing shame and shade we shall all be lost.
Calm down people! It's a TV show. Whether or not you agree with the premise or creation method is important, but not so much so as it is worth losing friends over. Everybody in this thread likes and/or loves Tolkien. Do we have to drive a pitiful line between us over some content created by some mega-studio with mega-dollars? Of course not.
The TV show has its goods and its bads, for everyone. Who's to say though that one person's good or bad is prevalent over another's? Even if the TV series is the most sorely lacking, wasteful, tedious experience in Tolkien History, its a TV show, not the end of the world. Can we please be kind to one another? None of us mean to hurt each other, but if we keep our indiscrete ways of throwing shame and shade we shall all be lost.
Calm down people! It's a TV show. Whether or not you agree with the premise or creation method is important, but not so much so as it is worth losing friends over. Everybody in this thread likes and/or loves Tolkien. Do we have to drive a pitiful line between us over some content created by some mega-studio with mega-dollars? Of course not.
The TV show has its goods and its bads, for everyone. Who's to say though that one person's good or bad is prevalent over another's? Even if the TV series is the most sorely lacking, wasteful, tedious experience in Tolkien History, its a TV show, not the end of the world. Can we please be kind to one another? None of us mean to hurt each other, but if we keep our indiscrete ways of throwing shame and shade we shall all be lost.
Yeah, you’re right. I should make you a mod lol.
They have the rights to the Appendix, and everything contained therein. They chose a part of the lore where there is a gap in the Silmarilion, Unfinished Tales, etc. specifically because they knew they could not obtain the legal rights (and “could not obtain” is a big difference from “refuse”).
And, again, they’re working with Tolkien’s family to flesh out the details. You’ll have to pardon me if I am willing to give the benefit of the doubt to Tolkien’s flesh and blood, instead of “3 million” folks on the interwebs who lack much in the way of actual data and who consistently demonstrate poor comprehension of the data that does exist.
But, hey, I am sure that the citizenry of Númenor would have given three million downvotes to Elendil tweeting “Maybe we should not trust this Ar-Pharazôn guy” also. Notoriously reliable the public is when it is engaging in wild speculation on scant information.
Right, I’m still not hearing the part where they have the rights and won’t have to make things up. Sure, the Tolkien family is with them on this (I haven’t seen any evidence of that, but anyway). The fact remains they don’t have the rights and will have to make most of it up. The fact remains that they paid a bunch of idiots who thought the orcs had a Ring and Sauron was an elf to pose as “superfans” in a review of their series, then promptly took that video down when the community exploded on them. Just speculation, but if you could get actual legitimate fans I figure you would use them in a video. Which makes me think they don’t have any, hence the fakes. That also proves they’re willing to fake and lie to prove their show is good, which makes me think it isn’t. It also makes me doubt the validity of all their claims that Tolkien experts love the show, since we only have their word on that. Or they simply bought the experts off, which is very in keeping with their behaviour.
Remind me why I should trust these guys again? And I’ll say it for the tenth time: They have no rights, and they’ve said they will have to make shit up. That will never change.
I'm the Valar (leader and creator) of The Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit/Anything Tolkien Cult!
Member of the Cult of Cats, High Elf of the Elven Guild, and Sauce Priest & Sauce Smith of the Supreme Court of Sauce.
If you want some casual roleplay/adventures in Middle Earth, check out The Wild's Edge Tavern, a LotR/Middle Earth tavern!
JOIN TIAMAT'S CONGA LINE!
Extended Sig
You keep saying “misinformation” and “false news”. But everything I have said (they have no rights, the majority of the community is against them, they’ve already lied and faked and even deleted dislikes on the trailer) has solid fact to back it up (Tolkien family stuff is an exception, tho I haven’t seen anything about it so I’ll have to take your word for it). You can call everyone bigots all you like, but you can’t argue with these facts. So where is all this false news exactly? Everything I have said has proof.
I'm the Valar (leader and creator) of The Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit/Anything Tolkien Cult!
Member of the Cult of Cats, High Elf of the Elven Guild, and Sauce Priest & Sauce Smith of the Supreme Court of Sauce.
If you want some casual roleplay/adventures in Middle Earth, check out The Wild's Edge Tavern, a LotR/Middle Earth tavern!
JOIN TIAMAT'S CONGA LINE!
Extended Sig
Question: Why does it matter if people don't like the
showthe trailer?Hi everyone! I'm working up the will to finalize my signature, so... I guess this will be the signature for now
It’s all the info on the show, which is a lot more then the trailer. And it doesn’t matter; I’m angry cause it mutilates Tolkien lore. So it’s nice fans are standing up and saying they don’t like it is pretty cool. Like I said, who knows what the show will be. But it is a 100% guarantee that it will not be what Tolkien wrote, cause they don’t have the rights to it. I thought you disliked the movies cause they changed things? You’d think something that will have next to nothing canon in it would provoke a similar reaction, but eh.
I'm the Valar (leader and creator) of The Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit/Anything Tolkien Cult!
Member of the Cult of Cats, High Elf of the Elven Guild, and Sauce Priest & Sauce Smith of the Supreme Court of Sauce.
If you want some casual roleplay/adventures in Middle Earth, check out The Wild's Edge Tavern, a LotR/Middle Earth tavern!
JOIN TIAMAT'S CONGA LINE!
Extended Sig
There is a reason objections to relevance and hearsay exist in law - the statements might be “facts”, but they are useless as facts and thus muddy the waters of truth. Community consensus is a bad fact that doesn’t speak to the show’s actual quality. Expert opinions, like the scholars who have seen the first episode and praised its dedication to Tolkien are good and admissible facts. Posting about rights, in a manner that says the Tolkien family “refused” to grant the rights is a bad fact, since it ignores the fact that the Tolkien family might have wanted to give out the rights, but had their hands tied by one of the most notoriously legally quagmired Intellectual Properties in the field.
Quality of evidence matters, and the totality of actual quality evidence gives cause to ignore the ignorant masses and keep an open mind. That’s not to say it will be good or not, and it might be terrible - but prejudging based on bad evidence, especially when the good evidence is so overwhelmingly positive is silly.
Again, we have only word on that: The Tolkien experts were only quoted in an article, I don’t see any proof there. And again, AMAZON FAKED A FAN REVIEW. We have every reason to be suspicious about the Tolkien experts, and absolutely no reason to buy it. And sure, I missworded that. Sue me. There’s also a chance I could be right.
I couldn’t agree with you more. So where is this overwhelmingly positive evidence? Amazon have said they can’t follow the lore, all evidence we have seen is the opposite of promising, and they faked a positive review of the show. If it was really good, they wouldn’t have had to. One Ring.net are their biggest supporters: And they will ban anyone who speaks against the show. And are now surprised when they’re either ignored or attacked on everything they do. But hey, they’ve got 3 people on their side.
Oh, and ignorant masses, huh. I’ll take that as a compliment, given that I don’t need to resort to insults to back up my points.
I'm the Valar (leader and creator) of The Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit/Anything Tolkien Cult!
Member of the Cult of Cats, High Elf of the Elven Guild, and Sauce Priest & Sauce Smith of the Supreme Court of Sauce.
If you want some casual roleplay/adventures in Middle Earth, check out The Wild's Edge Tavern, a LotR/Middle Earth tavern!
JOIN TIAMAT'S CONGA LINE!
Extended Sig
Just because people belive something doesn't mean that it is true
Hi everyone! I'm working up the will to finalize my signature, so... I guess this will be the signature for now
I’m just gonna leave this argument here. I’ve made my points, and when an argument resorts to insults that’s typically when I leave.
I'm the Valar (leader and creator) of The Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit/Anything Tolkien Cult!
Member of the Cult of Cats, High Elf of the Elven Guild, and Sauce Priest & Sauce Smith of the Supreme Court of Sauce.
If you want some casual roleplay/adventures in Middle Earth, check out The Wild's Edge Tavern, a LotR/Middle Earth tavern!
JOIN TIAMAT'S CONGA LINE!
Extended Sig
Believe what? You’re not making sense. They have said they can’t follow the lore. That’s not believing. That’s a fact.
I'm the Valar (leader and creator) of The Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit/Anything Tolkien Cult!
Member of the Cult of Cats, High Elf of the Elven Guild, and Sauce Priest & Sauce Smith of the Supreme Court of Sauce.
If you want some casual roleplay/adventures in Middle Earth, check out The Wild's Edge Tavern, a LotR/Middle Earth tavern!
JOIN TIAMAT'S CONGA LINE!
Extended Sig
*Shrugs.*. I’ve said my piece a number of times, including providing information about how involved the Tolkien family has been, how they do actually have a lot of the rights, and how folks who have seen the show’s beginning and have respectable pedigrees they will not risk just for Amazon’s sake.
So, I’ll leave it with one last point - I firmly consider myself in the “ignorant masses” club on this point; as should anyone who is not inside the production or is not privy to the preview. That isn’t an insult in the slightest, it’s a statement of reality - we the masses are the dictionary definition of ignorant, and, pending disavowal of said ignorance by the show’s release, should give some deference to those with actual knowledge.
That is opinion. And what about the people who have actually seen the show, would they have some important info?
Hi everyone! I'm working up the will to finalize my signature, so... I guess this will be the signature for now
I guess I should make one additional point, since you are just dead wrong about what the showrunners said. Here’s a quote:
“There’s a version of everything we need in the books we have the rights to. As long as we’re painting within those lines and not egregiously contradicting something we don’t have the rights to, there’s a lot of leeway and room to dramatize and tell some of the best stories that [Tolkien] ever came up with. We worked in conjunction with world-renowned Tolkien scholars and the Tolkien estate to make sure the way we connected the dots were Tolkienian and gelled with the experts’ and the estate’s understanding of the material.”
Or, to paraphrase: We had the rights to everything that is important because the Appendixes in Return of the King are amazing, and we worked with experts to make sure our story is in line with Tolkien’s lore.
That is the actual fact of what they said about the rights issue. It is a very different tune than whatever hearsay you are getting from the dedicated naysayers in whatever discord group you are in.
Again, no one is telling you to like the show once it comes out; just not to shoot from the hip and discount those actually involved just because you want to put your faith in the ignorant (again, not an insult - textbook definition of ignorance, insofar as they do not have any real, tangible knowledge). Not only will you have an opinion more grounded in useful, non hearsay evidence, you won’t be “that guy” who is trying to ruin people’s excitement for the show.
And maybe then you could have a real discussion on your thread for once - folks talking about what they want to see in the show, what they personally like or do not like about the aesthetics, etc. - instead of you going off on anyone who brings it up, simply because the hive mind told you to.
Circling away from that topic, and back to updating people on the new information about the show, in an interview released today, the show runner said they have all five season of the show - 50 hours of content - planned out, and even know exactly how to end it. That’s a pretty promising piece of data - so many shows nowadays do not know where they are going or how they are going to end, that the seem to lose their plot as showrunners struggle to come up with more material. Good to know that they are keeping relatively constrained with LotR and will not feel as much pressure to balloon the show into something it was not supposed to be.
The showrunner also discussed a letter written by Tolkien himself to his publisher, about how Tolkien wanted to create and leave behind a mythology others could work within and expand. The show runner went on to talk about how comforting he found that idea - that he was not truly owning a brand new creation from scratch, but rather acting as the steward for what Tolkien already created.
Link for the most recent article.
Thanks!
Hi everyone! I'm working up the will to finalize my signature, so... I guess this will be the signature for now
No, I’m quite aware of exactly what the showrunners said. Given that all examples of the show we’ve seen are completely different from their statement, I really don’t care. Also, it’s not my stupid Discord group: What I’m saying is the gist of what’s happening on Facebook, Twitter and all other social media platforms of the Tolkien fandom. And there’s barely anyone arguing against them (besides One Ring.net).
Oh and yeah, all the Second Age stuff in the RotK appendices are enough to make a show out of. Totally.
And, ok… That was hugely insulting and passive-aggressive. I’m gonna resist the urge to kick you off the club over an insult cause that’s bad leadership, and just take a break for a couple days from this instead before I do something stupid like the aforementioned.
I'm the Valar (leader and creator) of The Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit/Anything Tolkien Cult!
Member of the Cult of Cats, High Elf of the Elven Guild, and Sauce Priest & Sauce Smith of the Supreme Court of Sauce.
If you want some casual roleplay/adventures in Middle Earth, check out The Wild's Edge Tavern, a LotR/Middle Earth tavern!
JOIN TIAMAT'S CONGA LINE!
Extended Sig
Calm down people! It's a TV show. Whether or not you agree with the premise or creation method is important, but not so much so as it is worth losing friends over. Everybody in this thread likes and/or loves Tolkien. Do we have to drive a pitiful line between us over some content created by some mega-studio with mega-dollars? Of course not.
The TV show has its goods and its bads, for everyone. Who's to say though that one person's good or bad is prevalent over another's? Even if the TV series is the most sorely lacking, wasteful, tedious experience in Tolkien History, its a TV show, not the end of the world. Can we please be kind to one another? None of us mean to hurt each other, but if we keep our indiscrete ways of throwing shame and shade we shall all be lost.
Frequent Eladrin || They/Them, but accept all pronouns
Luz Noceda would like to remind you that you're worth loving!
Oh hey, it's a club now so I can join!
I am an average mathematics enjoyer.
>Extended Signature<
Agreed
Yeah, you’re right. I should make you a mod lol.
I'm the Valar (leader and creator) of The Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit/Anything Tolkien Cult!
Member of the Cult of Cats, High Elf of the Elven Guild, and Sauce Priest & Sauce Smith of the Supreme Court of Sauce.
If you want some casual roleplay/adventures in Middle Earth, check out The Wild's Edge Tavern, a LotR/Middle Earth tavern!
JOIN TIAMAT'S CONGA LINE!
Extended Sig