My one single hope in the face of the majority of the feedback given here so far is that the DDB team ignore it all. People love to react emotionally without putting any real depth of thought into their own opinions. Give it a month or two and I bet 90% of the people complaining will have actually used the sheet and either gotten used to it or even started liking it.
They should ignore the hyperbole, but note the actual issues being raised. In particular, the split between "Actions" and "Combat" is unhelpful--they belong on the same page--and AC as well as hit points should be an always-visible stat. And it would be nice to have all our spells and slots in a single scrolling list.
(What I do not understand is how anyone could think the old mobile site was a wonderful thing. Swipe-swipe-swipe-swipe-swipe across a bunch of tiles... and then tap through a bunch of collapsibles if you're trying to look up details of something. Even in its current state, I have a much easier time finding what I want on the new site, phone or desktop.)
My one single hope in the face of the majority of the feedback given here so far is that the DDB team ignore it all. People love to react emotionally without putting any real depth of thought into their own opinions. Give it a month or two and I bet 90% of the people complaining will have actually used the sheet and either gotten used to it or even started liking it.
The remaining 10% are the ones who just like to complain, irrespective of evidence, logic or reason.
I have given all my feedback as an avid user. DnD Beyond is the ONLY character sheet I have brought to any games I have played this year. I am heavily invested in this application being a success. I use my phone and my iPad exclusively to play, I use my desktop to manage my characters. I am absolutely serious in my feedback and not just hating on the change. There is a reason companies like Apple and Microsoft have taken a u-turn from skeuomorphic design for UIs. its broken. it does not work. and this "improved" interface is a massive downgrade in usability. I am not a hater. I actually care about this app, the site, and it's future. I realize that the money I have put in here isn't going to WoTC, my books are only licensed here. I am all in here. I don't have physical copies of anything. when I say its broken, it is broken for me.
What skeuomorphism? The only skeuomorphic elements I can see are the "hovering" buttons, and that's bog-standard material design. Everything else is flat.
They should ignore the hyperbole, but note the actual issues being raised. In particular, the split between "Actions" and "Combat" is unhelpful--they belong on the same page--and AC as well as hit points should be an always-visible stat. And it would be nice to have all our spells and slots in a single scrolling list.
(What I do not understand is how anyone could think the old mobile site was a wonderful thing. Swipe-swipe-swipe-swipe-swipe across a bunch of tiles... and then tap through a bunch of collapsibles if you're trying to look up details of something. Even in its current state, I have a much easier time finding what I want on the new site, phone or desktop.)
there was a lot of swiping, but it was usable, and it made some logical sense.
Now looking at it on my laptop, and one thing that stood out right off was the Inspiration block but more specifically the ghosted text. It's not the easiest to read. Ideally, the box should be sized comparable to the Proficiency box so that the word INSPIRATION is displayed without the ghosted effect.
The HP Management sidebar, the amount healed really doesn't need to go beyond max hp or temp max hp (whichever is highest) since overhealing isn't a thing. Otherwise the boxes don't make a whole lot of sense. If you reduce hit point then increase them without saving, healing doesn't go up until you hit your hp max which is basically when it isn't needed. Also, automatic death doesn't occur if you receive enough damage to trigger it.
Locking the sidebar really shouldn't be allowed with overlay as it cuts off part of the sheet's information. It really should only be available when in Fixed mode. Another thing with the sidebar options is they should've switch sides when you move the bar from the right to the left, they should stay in the same order (overlay/fixed are the left 2 buttons and Align Left / Align Right are the right 2 buttons. It makes sense for the Open / Close and Lock / Unlock buttons to change sides but the mode and align buttons are fine to stay in a fixed order. Basically I tried to move it back to the right and ended up changing the mode to fixed instead. Granted I would eventually get use to it, but it's an unnecessary learning curve.
With the active conditions, It would be easier to discern at a glance if instead of being comma delimited they were listed in 2 columns. A little more white space would go a long way there. I pity the poor adventurer who ends up getting hit with all conditions (completely an unlikely scenario) there isn't enough room for them all - it only displays up to 8 conditions. The eight condition gets a comma at the end of it so it looks like there's more but it doesn't display more. Just a thing to consider but a minor issue in the grand scheme.
The XP bar doesn't highlight the amount gained like it did in the old sheet. Pretty sure that should still be there otherwise why have the bar there?
Manage Levels and Manage Experience could be merged into a single Progression Management sidebar as there's no need for the Manage Levels page since it can be managed from the Manage Experience sidebar. Granted you'd have to edit your character to select your new level's abilities and spells but that'd be one less menu item / page load. Also, Short Rest, Long Rest, and Shareable Link don't really need to be in the dropdown menu since they're at the top of the page now. They're still needed for mobile view, but not for desktop view. The fewer menu options available the happier users will be! You could move Export Sheet out of the menu and have it beside Share at the top as well. Change Frame / Backdrop / Theme / Portrait could all go under a single sidebar with a clickable header to move between them, maybe as "Edit Sheet".
This is a long post, so I'll leave it at this. Keep up the great work and can't wait to see where we go from here :D
Ignoring the bugs that are prevalent in any live software release the new changes seem to be great overall. I am sure lots of little things will improve over time.
The one big thing that irks me is the way the UI communicates data to me and what it seems to tell me is important. When you look at a character sheet and statistics a lot of stuff is there to "Show your working" so when the DM says "How did you roll a 26 when your modifier should only be +4?" you can show them how you get your final modifier. Lots of this is still useful to know but is often only needed as a one off and should not take up most of our attention on a screen.
With this in mind I personally think the very important stuff like AC, Initiative, walking speeds etc should be the focus at the top of the sheets with stats, skills and saves all stacked on the left, similar to character sheets we are all familiar with. Secondly I would embrace your modular section design and treat the two boxes of data like a planes treats an MDF (multi function display) and simply give us all the options and let us pick what we want in there. I would even expand this to the proficiency, walking speed + other boxes at the top, let us click on walking speed and change that to display say, spell DC, dark vision range or passive perception.
I am pretty bad a describing things so here is a mock up of what I imagine, I am thinking of this from the perspective of a programmer and am trying to stick to ideas I think might be easy to implement but effective:
https://imgur.com/a/sit8bGF My apologies for making such a hack job of your lovely webpage but my paint.net skills are not that good.
This design would also be easy to translate into swipe-able boxes on mobile as well as having the skill/stat data come in on a left-to-right swipe or tap the title to select the section from a menu.
Overall despite the feedback I am really happy with the update overall and feel it is an improvement on the old design and hope we as a community can constructively help you continue to improve this great product!
I liked the old way.... but loving the new way. It does take some time to get used to new sheet. I think the only thing im not a fan of is the way we put xp in to sheet. This is the same as old sheet. I was hoping for a quicker and easier way. But with that sai... im embracing the new sheet. Great job guys... worth the wait.
The spells tab is my only positive takeaway from this update. The fact I can see exactly what is needed to cast and what it does based on what level I cast it is huge. However, the layout is god awful. As others have said, the mobile site is tedious to use, and designed it seems to be used on an itty bitty screen. Desktop mode doesnt work, and the clean and cut old layout is cartoony and plain ugly now. I vote on a roll back, at least until the mobile site is updated.
Also, Sorc points being hidden in the actions tab, and having to scroll down to access them is the worst design choice I've seen. I did a test turn, it took me maybe 4-6 seconds to cast a spell before the update and use some sorc points. Now, it takes between 15-20 seconds, having to switch tabs and scroll. Then, if I need to adjust my HP, I have to switch tabs AGAIN. If I need to see my skills, I have to switch tabs AGAIN! I will be using a physical sheet for my game tomorrow, and switch back when its fixed or rolled back, or at LEAST optional.
Right now, the class features section feels a bit cramped. I think dividing it into passive abilities and active ones that recharge on short/long rests would be more useful for actual play. I'm just not a fan of scrolling through which subclass I chose when I just want to check the box because I used a rage. Also, at the moment you cannot delete custom attacks, the button clicks but the attack doesn't disappear. Last thing, the SCAG melee cantrips use the spell attack bonus for the to hit bonus, not the melee attack stat, may want to switch those. You might have to have an option to choose what weapon you are making the attack with, but it is only for two cantrips, so not the biggest deal. That being said, I really like the new feel of the design. so great work, keep it up.
What skeuomorphism? The only skeuomorphic elements I can see are the "hovering" buttons, and that's bog-standard material design. Everything else is flat.
you should check the definition of skeuomorphic.
A skeuomorph is a derivative object that retains ornamental design cues (attributes) from structures that are inherent to the original.
Blinging out a web page to look like a paper character sheet with an 80s glam band flare.... thats skeuomorphic.
Well I guess I'll stop using D&D Beyond then. The whole point of why I liked it was because it looked totally different to the Character Sheet. Now I have too much information on my screen and it is information overload. Poor UXD if you ask me. Fail D&D Beyond.
I had mention not being able to see the xp progress in the xp bar. It's because it's the same color as a lot of the darker themes, or close enough to make it not noticeable. The progress should be a contrasting color to the overall bar, such as gray bar with white progress.
Another idea, for class features move all features that have Uses boxes to the top. Making the text collapsible by clicking the header would also be nice so we don't have to see the text for obvious things (Such as the definition of Druidic) . Also, move the Uses boxes to the top of the sidebar, just under the header. Since I'm looking at my Druid right now, I'll use it as an example:
It would be nice to have tool tips with conditions. You can turn them on but have to leave the charater sheet to look them up. It would be nice for new players to see what the conditions do without having to look them up.
Not being able to include my Pact of the Tome cantrips has been listed repeatedly in this thread. This is my biggest issues as well. I can add them in the notes section, like I did with my Book of Ancient Secrets, but it is inconvenient to not have them on the listing of spells.
The good news is this will be added very soon - it's at the top of our list.
Just checking in before I finally go to sleep (it's been a long - but good - day).
We appreciate all the feedback here and I will be pouring through it through the weekend and next week. I'm glad to see such a positive reaction to something the team has worked so hard to deliver. For those sharing criticism and concerns over the new format, be assured that we will be taking all of it into consideration as we make continual improvements over time.
Not being able to include my Pact of the Tome cantrips has been listed repeatedly in this thread. This is my biggest issues as well. I can add them in the notes section, like I did with my Book of Ancient Secrets, but it is inconvenient to not have them on the listing of spells.
The good news is this will be added very soon - it's at the top of our list.
Cantrips are and always were workng as intended. The rituals are the missing part.
Just played a 4 hr. game using the new character sheet on iPad. So many clicks and screen changes! In combat, I had to go to the combat screen to see my options and modifiers, and then back and forth to the main screen to take damage and healing - what a pain!
Also, adding equipment w/o having to exit the character sheet and go back through the builder would be great!
The Actions tab was very useful for one of our newer players, especially because she was a spell caster. It really helped her think ahead as her turn was approaching.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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They should ignore the hyperbole, but note the actual issues being raised. In particular, the split between "Actions" and "Combat" is unhelpful--they belong on the same page--and AC as well as hit points should be an always-visible stat. And it would be nice to have all our spells and slots in a single scrolling list.
(What I do not understand is how anyone could think the old mobile site was a wonderful thing. Swipe-swipe-swipe-swipe-swipe across a bunch of tiles... and then tap through a bunch of collapsibles if you're trying to look up details of something. Even in its current state, I have a much easier time finding what I want on the new site, phone or desktop.)
What skeuomorphism? The only skeuomorphic elements I can see are the "hovering" buttons, and that's bog-standard material design. Everything else is flat.
there was a lot of swiping, but it was usable, and it made some logical sense.
Claw attack stats in the "Actions" panels is incorrect. Looks correct everywhere else.
Monk Ki abilities that are bonus actions show up under main actions, shouldn't they be under bonus actions?
Now looking at it on my laptop, and one thing that stood out right off was the Inspiration block but more specifically the ghosted text. It's not the easiest to read.
Ideally, the box should be sized comparable to the Proficiency box so that the word INSPIRATION is displayed without the ghosted effect.
The HP Management sidebar, the amount healed really doesn't need to go beyond max hp or temp max hp (whichever is highest) since overhealing isn't a thing.
Otherwise the boxes don't make a whole lot of sense. If you reduce hit point then increase them without saving, healing doesn't go up until you hit your hp max which is basically when it isn't needed. Also, automatic death doesn't occur if you receive enough damage to trigger it.
Locking the sidebar really shouldn't be allowed with overlay as it cuts off part of the sheet's information. It really should only be available when in Fixed mode. Another thing with the sidebar options is they should've switch sides when you move the bar from the right to the left, they should stay in the same order (overlay/fixed are the left 2 buttons and Align Left / Align Right are the right 2 buttons. It makes sense for the Open / Close and Lock / Unlock buttons to change sides but the mode and align buttons are fine to stay in a fixed order. Basically I tried to move it back to the right and ended up changing the mode to fixed instead. Granted I would eventually get use to it, but it's an unnecessary learning curve.
With the active conditions, It would be easier to discern at a glance if instead of being comma delimited they were listed in 2 columns. A little more white space would go a long way there. I pity the poor adventurer who ends up getting hit with all conditions (completely an unlikely scenario) there isn't enough room for them all - it only displays up to 8 conditions. The eight condition gets a comma at the end of it so it looks like there's more but it doesn't display more. Just a thing to consider but a minor issue in the grand scheme.
The XP bar doesn't highlight the amount gained like it did in the old sheet. Pretty sure that should still be there otherwise why have the bar there?
Manage Levels and Manage Experience could be merged into a single Progression Management sidebar as there's no need for the Manage Levels page since it can be managed from the Manage Experience sidebar. Granted you'd have to edit your character to select your new level's abilities and spells but that'd be one less menu item / page load. Also, Short Rest, Long Rest, and Shareable Link don't really need to be in the dropdown menu since they're at the top of the page now. They're still needed for mobile view, but not for desktop view. The fewer menu options available the happier users will be! You could move Export Sheet out of the menu and have it beside Share at the top as well. Change Frame / Backdrop / Theme / Portrait could all go under a single sidebar with a clickable header to move between them, maybe as "Edit Sheet".
This is a long post, so I'll leave it at this. Keep up the great work and can't wait to see where we go from here :D
Ignoring the bugs that are prevalent in any live software release the new changes seem to be great overall. I am sure lots of little things will improve over time.
The one big thing that irks me is the way the UI communicates data to me and what it seems to tell me is important. When you look at a character sheet and statistics a lot of stuff is there to "Show your working" so when the DM says "How did you roll a 26 when your modifier should only be +4?" you can show them how you get your final modifier. Lots of this is still useful to know but is often only needed as a one off and should not take up most of our attention on a screen.
With this in mind I personally think the very important stuff like AC, Initiative, walking speeds etc should be the focus at the top of the sheets with stats, skills and saves all stacked on the left, similar to character sheets we are all familiar with. Secondly I would embrace your modular section design and treat the two boxes of data like a planes treats an MDF (multi function display) and simply give us all the options and let us pick what we want in there. I would even expand this to the proficiency, walking speed + other boxes at the top, let us click on walking speed and change that to display say, spell DC, dark vision range or passive perception.
I am pretty bad a describing things so here is a mock up of what I imagine, I am thinking of this from the perspective of a programmer and am trying to stick to ideas I think might be easy to implement but effective:
https://imgur.com/a/sit8bGF
My apologies for making such a hack job of your lovely webpage but my paint.net skills are not that good.
This design would also be easy to translate into swipe-able boxes on mobile as well as having the skill/stat data come in on a left-to-right swipe or tap the title to select the section from a menu.
Overall despite the feedback I am really happy with the update overall and feel it is an improvement on the old design and hope we as a community can constructively help you continue to improve this great product!
I liked the old way.... but loving the new way. It does take some time to get used to new sheet. I think the only thing im not a fan of is the way we put xp in to sheet. This is the same as old sheet. I was hoping for a quicker and easier way. But with that sai... im embracing the new sheet. Great job guys... worth the wait.
The spells tab is my only positive takeaway from this update. The fact I can see exactly what is needed to cast and what it does based on what level I cast it is huge. However, the layout is god awful. As others have said, the mobile site is tedious to use, and designed it seems to be used on an itty bitty screen. Desktop mode doesnt work, and the clean and cut old layout is cartoony and plain ugly now. I vote on a roll back, at least until the mobile site is updated.
Also, Sorc points being hidden in the actions tab, and having to scroll down to access them is the worst design choice I've seen. I did a test turn, it took me maybe 4-6 seconds to cast a spell before the update and use some sorc points. Now, it takes between 15-20 seconds, having to switch tabs and scroll. Then, if I need to adjust my HP, I have to switch tabs AGAIN. If I need to see my skills, I have to switch tabs AGAIN! I will be using a physical sheet for my game tomorrow, and switch back when its fixed or rolled back, or at LEAST optional.
Right now, the class features section feels a bit cramped. I think dividing it into passive abilities and active ones that recharge on short/long rests would be more useful for actual play. I'm just not a fan of scrolling through which subclass I chose when I just want to check the box because I used a rage. Also, at the moment you cannot delete custom attacks, the button clicks but the attack doesn't disappear. Last thing, the SCAG melee cantrips use the spell attack bonus for the to hit bonus, not the melee attack stat, may want to switch those. You might have to have an option to choose what weapon you are making the attack with, but it is only for two cantrips, so not the biggest deal. That being said, I really like the new feel of the design. so great work, keep it up.
you should check the definition of skeuomorphic.
A skeuomorph is a derivative object that retains ornamental design cues (attributes) from structures that are inherent to the original.
Blinging out a web page to look like a paper character sheet with an 80s glam band flare.... thats skeuomorphic.
How do I switch back to the old interface? I hate this new one and it looks ugly on my iPad and iPhone...
u cant.
Well I guess I'll stop using D&D Beyond then. The whole point of why I liked it was because it looked totally different to the Character Sheet. Now I have too much information on my screen and it is information overload. Poor UXD if you ask me. Fail D&D Beyond.
I had mention not being able to see the xp progress in the xp bar. It's because it's the same color as a lot of the darker themes, or close enough to make it not noticeable. The progress should be a contrasting color to the overall bar, such as gray bar with white progress.
Another idea, for class features move all features that have Uses boxes to the top. Making the text collapsible by clicking the header would also be nice so we don't have to see the text for obvious things (Such as the definition of Druidic) . Also, move the Uses boxes to the top of the sidebar, just under the header. Since I'm looking at my Druid right now, I'll use it as an example:
Druid
[ ] Wild Shape 1 Action
Uses: [ ] [ ] / Short Rest
Starting at 2nd level...
It would be nice to have tool tips with conditions. You can turn them on but have to leave the charater sheet to look them up. It would be nice for new players to see what the conditions do without having to look them up.
Overal very nice.
The good news is this will be added very soon - it's at the top of our list.
Just checking in before I finally go to sleep (it's been a long - but good - day).
We appreciate all the feedback here and I will be pouring through it through the weekend and next week. I'm glad to see such a positive reaction to something the team has worked so hard to deliver. For those sharing criticism and concerns over the new format, be assured that we will be taking all of it into consideration as we make continual improvements over time.
Thanks!
Suggestion: allow a bit more room rather than still having iframe equivalents within the sheet.... like this, created by just overriding some CSS
Full height right side. and Full width Features & Traits below it
Playtesting Fugare Draconis, an epic tale of adventure, loss, and redemption
Cantrips are and always were workng as intended. The rituals are the missing part.
Just played a 4 hr. game using the new character sheet on iPad. So many clicks and screen changes! In combat, I had to go to the combat screen to see my options and modifiers, and then back and forth to the main screen to take damage and healing - what a pain!
Also, adding equipment w/o having to exit the character sheet and go back through the builder would be great!
The Actions tab was very useful for one of our newer players, especially because she was a spell caster. It really helped her think ahead as her turn was approaching.