I am greatly confused by everyone's hatred of twitch. Why are so many insulted by something as simple as a Twitch account, especially if you will only ever use it for D&DB? Personally never use twitch, except for watching something like 1 stream ever, but it does not bother me at all. What is the put-down that I am not understanding?
This thread is mostly people having a problem with people having a problem. Classic internet drama.
It's just Beta feedback, people don't like logging in with twitch for the same reason people don't like logging in with FB or Google to some place. They like separate worlds. It's not necessarily a deal breaker but the Devs asked what people think.
I agree with the majority who have taken the time to post here(which I have divined through the mysterious process of not reading what most others are posting). I don't particularly want to use an app that requires ANY type of credentials, of those, TWITCH doesn't interest me in the slightest.
My understanding of D&D Beyond is that the main functions of the app are 1) a cohesive rules, character and item compendium that will (hopefully) be updated with all the official material so that I don't need 3 books open in front of me, 2) tools for DMs to create scenarios, 3) character tracking, and maybe a few other helpful odds and ends. None of that should require me to log into a social media account. As a beta tester, its forgivable, as the devs need to accumulate and track feedback in some fashion, but as a standalone tool competing with the other assistant apps out there, I don't think many people will accept your terms.
I agree with the majority who have taken the time to post here(which I have divined through the mysterious process of not reading what most others are posting). I don't particularly want to use an app that requires ANY type of credentials, of those, TWITCH doesn't interest me in the slightest.
My understanding of D&D Beyond is that the main functions of the app are 1) a cohesive rules, character and item compendium that will (hopefully) be updated with all the official material so that I don't need 3 books open in front of me, 2) tools for DMs to create scenarios, 3) character tracking, and maybe a few other helpful odds and ends. None of that should require me to log into a social media account. As a beta tester, its forgivable, as the devs need to accumulate and track feedback in some fashion, but as a standalone tool competing with the other assistant apps out there, I don't think many people will accept your terms.
Yes that is a lot of what DnD beyond is, but it will also be a paid service with different levels of what is accessable per user. Things that are PHB, DMG, and MM that are not in the SRD are part of the IP. SRD material is open, and free which is why you can just download the PDF. Things in the books such as specific character names, and Beholders are part of the IP, you will have to pay for those (how much is still up in the air, if you have to pay for it if you already own it is still up in the air, we just don't know yet).
The account is how the system knows what you have paid for and what you have access to.
One possible benefit to using an Amazon account instead of Twitch: I could prove that I bought the hard copies of the books. If there were a way to link that verification so I wouldn't have to re-purchase content I already own, that would be ideal! It could be sort of like buying a game on Humble Bundle and verifying it on Steam.
This would be amazing. I would hate to buy the books again, and doing something like this would be ideal for all players.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Mountain Dwarf Fighter, from the Peaks of Winter Play by Post. I'm very proud of him. Thanks to VillainTheory for backstory inspiration.
One possible benefit to using an Amazon account instead of Twitch: I could prove that I bought the hard copies of the books. If there were a way to link that verification so I wouldn't have to re-purchase content I already own, that would be ideal! It could be sort of like buying a game on Humble Bundle and verifying it on Steam.
This would be amazing. I would hate to buy the books again, and doing something like this would be ideal for all players.
Not necessarily... I didn't buy my books through Amazon, so they wouldn't have a verified purchase capability on my purchases, so it would ultimately punish those who don't buy from Amazon...
I heard somewhere about an idea that all the books could come with codes so you could redeem them on DnD Beyond. That might work better, though then the people who had already bought books would have still have to pay...
A true ideal: If Beyond was free.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Mountain Dwarf Fighter, from the Peaks of Winter Play by Post. I'm very proud of him. Thanks to VillainTheory for backstory inspiration.
Just wanted to add to the list of users who do not use and have no interest in Twitch.
At bare minimum, can we get the button that lets you use Facebook to login to Twitch? Getting annoyed with the login screen here, I went to Twitch.tv and clicked the FB button. Having long since forgotten my twitch password, this was significantly easier than dealing with password recovery nonsense. If you guys feel the need to force everyone to use a login from your company, why not try something more universal than a site where people watch other people play video games?
One possible benefit to using an Amazon account instead of Twitch: I could prove that I bought the hard copies of the books. If there were a way to link that verification so I wouldn't have to re-purchase content I already own, that would be ideal! It could be sort of like buying a game on Humble Bundle and verifying it on Steam.
This would be amazing. I would hate to buy the books again, and doing something like this would be ideal for all players.
So far there's been nothing said about "buying" the books on DND Beyond, so I don't think you have to worry there. :)
All of the information we have so far is:
There will be a standard service, which will be free to use.
There will also be a subscription package, which gives additional content/tools.
No details really yet on what is in the subscription package.
It seems though that the standard service, at least in terms of the rule books, is simply the basic rules available online, while the subscription is either the PHB or it seems we might have the option to purchase just one class or feature of the PHB.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Mountain Dwarf Fighter, from the Peaks of Winter Play by Post. I'm very proud of him. Thanks to VillainTheory for backstory inspiration.
I heard somewhere about an idea that all the books could come with codes so you could redeem them on DnD Beyond. That might work better, though then the people who had already bought books would have still have to pay...
A true ideal: If Beyond was free.
One work-around would be to have only new books have this code system in place, making all previous content either free or available as one combo purchase of less than $5.
Digital content presumably wouldn't include *all* of the content of the books themselves, but it's really the only alternative to asking the players to repurchase their own books. I for one would rather hand-type that stuff as homebrew than pay anything remotely close to full PDF price for a book. The publishing industry gouges hard on PDF prices, and I'm not rebuying something that costs nothing to duplicate.
Agreed. I don't mind using Twitch for the beta, but if I'm actually going to buying aspects of this down the road, then I want it through a more convenient (and arguably more secure?) account like Amazon.
I've read through most of this thread and it seems to me that I'm in the minority here. I may not be the brightest knife in the crayon box, but I'm gonna weigh in on this non-issue anyway.
Let me spell this out as clearly as I can: We don't get to choose what goes into the final product.
Look, we may be able to voice our opinions on what should or shouldn't be done with D&D Beyond, but it's ultimately up to the dev team what everything will look like when it's all finished. After all, they are the people who are creating it and ultimately have to make money with it.
I'm not saying our opinions and feedback don't matter. However, Curse is by no means obligated to listen to us. I'm sorry guys, but the customer isn't always right.
I'm sure that my opinions here are gonna be unpopular ones, but that's simply how I sees it.
I've read through most of this thread and it seems to me that I'm in the minority here. I may not be the brightest knife in the crayon box, but I'm gonna weigh in on this non-issue anyway.
Let me spell this out as clearly as I can: We don't get to choose what goes into the final product.
Look, we may be able to voice our opinions on what should or shouldn't be done with D&D Beyond, but it's ultimately up to the dev team what everything will look like when it's all finished. After all, they are the people who are creating it and ultimately have to make money with it.
I'm not saying our opinions and feedback don't matter. However, Curse is by no means obligated to listen to us. I'm sorry guys, but the customer isn't always right.
I'm sure that my opinions here are gonna be unpopular ones, but that's simply how I sees it.
This is more or less my opinion as well. Curse is owned by Twitch, and DnD Beyond was made by Curse, so doesn't it make since for Curse to try to promote it's owner? It's not convenient for some, but Curse isn't just going to ignore this amazing promotion opportunity for Twitch, since SOOO many people are into D&D.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Mountain Dwarf Fighter, from the Peaks of Winter Play by Post. I'm very proud of him. Thanks to VillainTheory for backstory inspiration.
I've read through most of this thread and it seems to me that I'm in the minority here. I may not be the brightest knife in the crayon box, but I'm gonna weigh in on this non-issue anyway.
Let me spell this out as clearly as I can: We don't get to choose what goes into the final product.
Look, we may be able to voice our opinions on what should or shouldn't be done with D&D Beyond, but it's ultimately up to the dev team what everything will look like when it's all finished. After all, they are the people who are creating it and ultimately have to make money with it.
I'm not saying our opinions and feedback don't matter. However, Curse is by no means obligated to listen to us. I'm sorry guys, but the customer isn't always right.
I'm sure that my opinions here are gonna be unpopular ones, but that's simply how I sees it.
This is more or less my opinion as well. Curse is owned by Twitch, and DnD Beyond was made by Curse, so doesn't it make since for Curse to try to promote it's owner? It's not convenient for some, but Curse isn't just going to ignore this amazing promotion opportunity for Twitch, since SOOO many people are into D&D.
As beta testers though, it is our role to tell them that this is a bad way to handle this. As I mentioned, I had to go to twitch's website to use the facebook login system, which they could at least have included as an option here. They can try to hamfist Twitch into this project, but it's our job to warn them that this *will* drive away users who don't want a Twitch account or worse, already have one but don't want to deal with password recovery nonsense. My immediate response when seeing the Twitch logo was to assume that this wasn't a full-featured enough product to warrant its own login system, like it's just some side-feature of Twitch, a site that I feel the need to mute my computer before even visiting the homepage of because of all of its noisy content. Twitch has a reputation that does not bode well for a tabletop gaming audience.
As I mentioned, I had to go to twitch's website to use the facebook login system, which they could at least have included as an option here.
That strikes me as some really valuable feedback - it's about ease of use and actually I'd have thought it's fairly simple to add the functionality to DNDB to "create a new account using Facebook". Yes, it would still be a Twitch account in the background, but actually, it seems that obfuscating that it's a Twitch account would be just fine.
I already had a twitch account, so was really simple for me to just hit authorise.
I get that this is an issue for some and not for others. Let me add my 2 bits and see if it doesn't make any sense to those still shakey on their feelings for it. Here is how my team would address this system to our non Dev members and community.
We are using a multi-system account or what will be one (Twitch, Curse, Amazon, ETC). This save a lot on the server trash that daily goes through Databases and Web Service Servers. So that in turn makes the site a bit faster. It also makes it easier to integrate features to one site and "copy paste" them over to another without a complete rehaul of how they function. It allows easier access to Mobile and Desktop apps that will surely have some bit of Beyond integrated into them. The list goes on and on of how and why companies do something like this. Once they are a further bit along with the application I don't doubt that Beyond will have its own plugin to the account system that will not just be Twitch's linked in.
This also includes logins with Facebook, G+, etc. Whichever service you sign in with sends your details to some scripting on the back end and a new account at Beyond would be created. So no matter how the login system is used it is creating an account for the system that beyond uses. I know its a pain for a lot of people but its actually a blessing in disguise for a whole ton more Pros than Cons. Again I know some don't like it but sometimes, just sometimes, change is good.
---
As for users who do/do not want twitch. There are a lot more users out there who would be more keen to playing DnD because their twitch account is linked than some people realize. Same goes the opposite for DnD players to find a new platform to share their games and a way to reach out and connect their games with a following. This doesn't mean that post beta or during they adjust their login system some to allow multiple different options but it is way more than likely right now due to the Amazon/Curse merger their login system just isn't completed yet. Sometimes with a Web app you can just transfer login systems and tweak them a bit while in other times a complete rework is required. (Literally just finished one for the state of Florida and dear god it was a nightmare.)
I agree with the majority who have taken the time to post here(which I have divined through the mysterious process of not reading what most others are posting). I don't particularly want to use an app that requires ANY type of credentials, of those, TWITCH doesn't interest me in the slightest.
My understanding of D&D Beyond is that the main functions of the app are 1) a cohesive rules, character and item compendium that will (hopefully) be updated with all the official material so that I don't need 3 books open in front of me, 2) tools for DMs to create scenarios, 3) character tracking, and maybe a few other helpful odds and ends. None of that should require me to log into a social media account. As a beta tester, its forgivable, as the devs need to accumulate and track feedback in some fashion, but as a standalone tool competing with the other assistant apps out there, I don't think many people will accept your terms.
The account is how the system knows what you have paid for and what you have access to.
My Mountain Dwarf Fighter, from the Peaks of Winter Play by Post. I'm very proud of him. Thanks to VillainTheory for backstory inspiration.
http://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/d-d-beyond-general/play-by-post/1903-the-peaks-of-winters-hold?comment=13
I heard somewhere about an idea that all the books could come with codes so you could redeem them on DnD Beyond. That might work better, though then the people who had already bought books would have still have to pay...
A true ideal: If Beyond was free.
My Mountain Dwarf Fighter, from the Peaks of Winter Play by Post. I'm very proud of him. Thanks to VillainTheory for backstory inspiration.
http://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/d-d-beyond-general/play-by-post/1903-the-peaks-of-winters-hold?comment=13
Just wanted to add to the list of users who do not use and have no interest in Twitch.
At bare minimum, can we get the button that lets you use Facebook to login to Twitch? Getting annoyed with the login screen here, I went to Twitch.tv and clicked the FB button. Having long since forgotten my twitch password, this was significantly easier than dealing with password recovery nonsense. If you guys feel the need to force everyone to use a login from your company, why not try something more universal than a site where people watch other people play video games?
No details really yet on what is in the subscription package.
Pun-loving nerd | She/Her/Hers | Profile art by Becca Golins
If you need help with homebrew, please post on the homebrew forums, where multiple staff and moderators can read your post and help you!
"We got this, no problem! I'll take the twenty on the left - you guys handle the one on the right!"🔊
It seems though that the standard service, at least in terms of the rule books, is simply the basic rules available online, while the subscription is either the PHB or it seems we might have the option to purchase just one class or feature of the PHB.
My Mountain Dwarf Fighter, from the Peaks of Winter Play by Post. I'm very proud of him. Thanks to VillainTheory for backstory inspiration.
http://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/d-d-beyond-general/play-by-post/1903-the-peaks-of-winters-hold?comment=13
But would WotC really do that? Every new player to the game could get $100 worth of books for less than $5.
My Mountain Dwarf Fighter, from the Peaks of Winter Play by Post. I'm very proud of him. Thanks to VillainTheory for backstory inspiration.
http://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/d-d-beyond-general/play-by-post/1903-the-peaks-of-winters-hold?comment=13
Digital content presumably wouldn't include *all* of the content of the books themselves, but it's really the only alternative to asking the players to repurchase their own books. I for one would rather hand-type that stuff as homebrew than pay anything remotely close to full PDF price for a book. The publishing industry gouges hard on PDF prices, and I'm not rebuying something that costs nothing to duplicate.
Agreed. I don't mind using Twitch for the beta, but if I'm actually going to buying aspects of this down the road, then I want it through a more convenient (and arguably more secure?) account like Amazon.
I've read through most of this thread and it seems to me that I'm in the minority here. I may not be the brightest knife in the crayon box, but I'm gonna weigh in on this non-issue anyway.
Let me spell this out as clearly as I can: We don't get to choose what goes into the final product.
Look, we may be able to voice our opinions on what should or shouldn't be done with D&D Beyond, but it's ultimately up to the dev team what everything will look like when it's all finished. After all, they are the people who are creating it and ultimately have to make money with it.
I'm not saying our opinions and feedback don't matter. However, Curse is by no means obligated to listen to us. I'm sorry guys, but the customer isn't always right.
I'm sure that my opinions here are gonna be unpopular ones, but that's simply how I sees it.
My Mountain Dwarf Fighter, from the Peaks of Winter Play by Post. I'm very proud of him. Thanks to VillainTheory for backstory inspiration.
http://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/d-d-beyond-general/play-by-post/1903-the-peaks-of-winters-hold?comment=13
That strikes me as some really valuable feedback - it's about ease of use and actually I'd have thought it's fairly simple to add the functionality to DNDB to "create a new account using Facebook". Yes, it would still be a Twitch account in the background, but actually, it seems that obfuscating that it's a Twitch account would be just fine.
I already had a twitch account, so was really simple for me to just hit authorise.
Pun-loving nerd | She/Her/Hers | Profile art by Becca Golins
If you need help with homebrew, please post on the homebrew forums, where multiple staff and moderators can read your post and help you!
"We got this, no problem! I'll take the twenty on the left - you guys handle the one on the right!"🔊
All,
I get that this is an issue for some and not for others. Let me add my 2 bits and see if it doesn't make any sense to those still shakey on their feelings for it. Here is how my team would address this system to our non Dev members and community.
We are using a multi-system account or what will be one (Twitch, Curse, Amazon, ETC). This save a lot on the server trash that daily goes through Databases and Web Service Servers. So that in turn makes the site a bit faster. It also makes it easier to integrate features to one site and "copy paste" them over to another without a complete rehaul of how they function. It allows easier access to Mobile and Desktop apps that will surely have some bit of Beyond integrated into them. The list goes on and on of how and why companies do something like this. Once they are a further bit along with the application I don't doubt that Beyond will have its own plugin to the account system that will not just be Twitch's linked in.
This also includes logins with Facebook, G+, etc. Whichever service you sign in with sends your details to some scripting on the back end and a new account at Beyond would be created. So no matter how the login system is used it is creating an account for the system that beyond uses. I know its a pain for a lot of people but its actually a blessing in disguise for a whole ton more Pros than Cons. Again I know some don't like it but sometimes, just sometimes, change is good.
---
As for users who do/do not want twitch. There are a lot more users out there who would be more keen to playing DnD because their twitch account is linked than some people realize. Same goes the opposite for DnD players to find a new platform to share their games and a way to reach out and connect their games with a following. This doesn't mean that post beta or during they adjust their login system some to allow multiple different options but it is way more than likely right now due to the Amazon/Curse merger their login system just isn't completed yet. Sometimes with a Web app you can just transfer login systems and tweak them a bit while in other times a complete rework is required. (Literally just finished one for the state of Florida and dear god it was a nightmare.)