As I outlined earlier, this is likely going to be an absolute disaster. It will allow hate to fester and grow and it will be the cause of pain for millennia.
People don't seem willing to accept that there was literally never going to be a "New, Improved and Secured 1.0a". With WotC's/Hasbro's current mindset, it wasn't remotely a real possibility
To their credit, the OGL Playtest Survey wasn't due to close for another week, and a report on the results not due until the 17th of next month. But with overwhelming opposition to key issues they did the right thing, didn't leave a brooding and angry community waiting for another three weeks, and walked back what was clearly an unpopular (and many would say unwise) course of action.
Yeah, a lot of trust has been lost. And there's probably a lot of damage that won't be undone by this, particularly that of third party publishers who have every right to remain skittish about future versions of D&D. And the community has been reminded once again to remain vigilant... which isn't so much a bad thing as just plain good advice. Let's hope these lessons aren't soon forgotten.
But for right now, this is a huge victory. Let's not lose sight of that.
People don't seem willing to accept that there was literally never going to be a "New, Improved and Secured 1.0a". With WotC's/Hasbro's current mindset, it wasn't remotely a real possibility
So people should suffer because compromising is "impossible" and isn't worth trying?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
BoringBard's long and tedious posts somehow manage to enrapture audiences. How? Because he used Charm Person, the #1 bard spell!
He/him pronouns. Call me Bard. PROUD NERD!
Ever wanted to talk about your parties' worst mistakes? Do so HERE. What's your favorite class, why? Share & explainHERE.
Or, they could point out that it's one of the risks of doing things "Open Source", and that they'll be taking all steps available to them to prevent the product from associating itself with DnD, preventing it from being carried in stores anywhere (by making sure everyone knows what it is), and watching like hawks for any other issues that may allow them to destroy that product in court.
[REDACTED]
I don’t think anyone will really get the traction to be some breakout success story publishing the dreck we’re worried about. I just expect some firebrand looking for something to rail against will dig one of those pieces up and make a lot of noise for a few weeks.
This is no victory, this is just evidence that WotC doesn’t give a 💩 about 5e anymore and they’re already dumping everything into 1DD which will in no way be covered under OGL1.0a.
Untouched means 1.0a will remain intact for D&D SRD 5.1 but D&D 6e will be released with no OGL or a very restrictive one. Wait and see.
While I expect that may happen, I am not going to persecute / punish DDB and WotC for crimes they have not yet committed. If they decide to be stupid in the future, that when I'll punish them.
Atm, I'll keep my DDB subscription ( I had renewed for a year just before this all blew up ), may go see the new movie, if it is good, keep looking at the OneDnD playtest stuff but doubt I'll buy after new books unless they are so good, they are must haves ( honestly last several books were getting me to stop preordering them due to poor quality. )
I am going to keep watching the ORC, will playtest Black Flag, whatever Matt Coleville creates, look at other game systems. Hasbro lost a lot of trust with this and they need to be on their best behavior for years to start earning that trust back.
People don't seem willing to accept that there was literally never going to be a "New, Improved and Secured 1.0a". With WotC's/Hasbro's current mindset, it wasn't remotely a real possibility
So people should suffer because compromising is "impossible" and isn't worth trying?
If something isn't going to happen, it isn't going to happen.
Or, they could point out that it's one of the risks of doing things "Open Source", and that they'll be taking all steps available to them to prevent the product from associating itself with DnD, preventing it from being carried in stores anywhere (by making sure everyone knows what it is), and watching like hawks for any other issues that may allow them to destroy that product in court.
[REDACTED]
I don’t think anyone will really get the traction to be some breakout success story publishing the dreck we’re worried about. I just expect some firebrand looking for something to rail against will dig one of those pieces up and make a lot of noise for a few weeks.
Clearly you are unaware that bigoted groups like the proud boys, etc. use online D&D as a recruiting method.
Or, they could point out that it's one of the risks of doing things "Open Source", and that they'll be taking all steps available to them to prevent the product from associating itself with DnD, preventing it from being carried in stores anywhere (by making sure everyone knows what it is), and watching like hawks for any other issues that may allow them to destroy that product in court.
[REDACTED]
I don’t think anyone will really get the traction to be some breakout success story publishing the dreck we’re worried about. I just expect some firebrand looking for something to rail against will dig one of those pieces up and make a lot of noise for a few weeks.
Clearly you are unaware that bigoted groups like the proud boys, etc. use online D&D as a recruiting method.
I mean, I’d never even been aware of their existence before they got arrested for the Capitol riot, so I’m not sure they qualify as breakout successes. It is extremely unfortunate that they use D&D as a recruiting tool, and that now very little can be done besides sitting back and watching.
Not that I mean to be "that guy"; but this isn't over. This is a "take a long rest, recharge spell slots, post a guard to make sure the red dragon isn't getting greedy and complacent and eyeing up the neighbouring kingdoms."
We've now seen what WOTC/Hasbro's higher up executives WANT to make happen; their "walled garden" model for D&D's future, the fact they got busted once because they pushed too far too quickly doesn't change that. So long as the same executive team is in place, that threat will only sleep like an elder god and not actually be defeated.
This is no victory, this is just evidence that WotC doesn’t give a 💩 about 5e anymore and they’re already dumping everything into 1DD which will in no way be covered under OGL1.0a.
But that's up to them. I mean, the win is that they're not going to touch OGL 1.0a, which was what the community was asking for.
And they have also included the SRD 5.1 in CC, which can no longer be reversed.
What they do with One D&D is up to them. And we'll see how it turns out. 4e was put in GSL and it was a flop. We'll see what happens with One D&D. If One D&D is released under a license whose terms are acceptable to publishers who publish third-party content, we will see third-party content. If they're not acceptable, hardly anyone will put out third-party content for One D&D. And the consumer will decide if it is worth buying that edition, or if he prefers to stick with 5e.
It is a victory. And a greater victory than anyone expected, dare I say.
I personally think that taking a chance that a few 'bad' books getting through by keeping the 3PP able and secure to produce content is worth the potential down the road. Will someone abuse it, hell yah... but at the same time, what any two people believe is hateful can be complete opposites and I honestly believe (including what I'm putting in this post) there is nothing that is ever said by anyone that doesn't find offense with someone else. Hell, even not saying something can be considered offensive, so it is a darned if you do, darned if you don't scenario. Personally, I'd rather err on the side of the ability to express oneself than live in constant fear of being 'cancelled'.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Benjamin Franklin
Or there will be a much more limiting OGL 2.0 with SRD 6.0.
But this is fine. The history will repeat itself again - if WotC wants to repeat 4E fiasco, then this is within their rights.
In the meantime most of us will enjoy 5E content, including the 3rd party content - which is now shielded with CC licence.
The current TPTB inside the WotC will drop out in a few years, there will be new managers - DnD 7E will emerge around 2030, with a community friendly OGL or ORC or CC license. Around 2040 there will be a new management imported from MS who will try new shenanigans, there will be a new outrage, etc...
Over the past 23 years of the OGL, which third party creators have attempted to publish white supremacist content based on Dungeons and Dragons?
It must have been a shit-ton, based on people's apprehensions, but Ernie Gygax is the only one of whom I have heard, apart from WotC's content for Curse of Strahd, Spelljammer, Tomb of Annihilation, etc.
(Yurei1543 quote) ..I'm really not looking forward to when someone inevitable decides to **** Around and Find Out. Kyle even said that We The Community are now D&D's only line of defense against hatefulness, discrimination, exclusionism, and bigotry. I worry for what that's going to mean in the future...
I understood 5e has been out since around 2014/15. What is the sudden change that has happened in 2023 that will open the doors to a slew of such content. I ask this as I understand a thing was going to change... and didn't change. So it's as it's always been right? So why would bad things suddenly start to happen if there's been no change?
I'm assuming I'm missing some piece of the puzzle that has suddenly changed things for the worst and hoping you (or anyone that knows) can enlighten me?
Or there will be a much more limiting OGL 2.0 with SRD 6.0.
But this is fine. The history will repeat itself again - if WotC wants to repeat 4E fiasco, then this is within their rights.
In the meantime most of us will enjoy 5E content, including the 3rd party content - which is now shielded with CC licence.
The current TPTB inside the WotC will drop out in a few years, there will be new managers - DnD 7E will emerge around 2030, with a community friendly OGL or ORC or CC license. Around 2040 there will be a new management imported from MS who will try new shenanigans, there will be a new outrage, etc...
Yah, why is it the even number editions always seem to blow up???
Under no circumstances will this material you are talking about going to be allowed on this site. So the only way that product will be available will be via 3rd party distributors like DM'sGuild or DTRPG, which ALREADY have morality clauses.
There are other websites out there that don't have morality clauses. Almost all of them don't, in fact.
And to suggest that someone will create said product, which has inherent significant start-up costs, then try to circumvent the distributors, well, that assumes someone is willing to create something and expect to lose significant money.
Read up on Ernest Gygax. I think you'd be surprised by the amount of people who publish things like this.
Lastly, ANYONE can simply avoid potential harm by NOT reading any 3rd party content.
What if they want to use third-party content in their campaign though? They shouldn't be denied that right just because of the rigidity of other people.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
BoringBard's long and tedious posts somehow manage to enrapture audiences. How? Because he used Charm Person, the #1 bard spell!
He/him pronouns. Call me Bard. PROUD NERD!
Ever wanted to talk about your parties' worst mistakes? Do so HERE. What's your favorite class, why? Share & explainHERE.
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..........
Sterling - V. Human Bard 3 (College of Art) - [Pic] - [Traits] - in Bards: Dragon Heist (w/ Mansion) - Jasper's [Pic] - Sterling's [Sigil]
Tooltips Post (2024 PHB updates) - incl. General Rules
>> New FOW threat & treasure tables: fow-advanced-threat-tables.pdf fow-advanced-treasure-table.pdf
To their credit, the OGL Playtest Survey wasn't due to close for another week, and a report on the results not due until the 17th of next month. But with overwhelming opposition to key issues they did the right thing, didn't leave a brooding and angry community waiting for another three weeks, and walked back what was clearly an unpopular (and many would say unwise) course of action.
Yeah, a lot of trust has been lost. And there's probably a lot of damage that won't be undone by this, particularly that of third party publishers who have every right to remain skittish about future versions of D&D. And the community has been reminded once again to remain vigilant... which isn't so much a bad thing as just plain good advice. Let's hope these lessons aren't soon forgotten.
But for right now, this is a huge victory. Let's not lose sight of that.
So people should suffer because compromising is "impossible" and isn't worth trying?
BoringBard's long and tedious posts somehow manage to enrapture audiences. How? Because he used Charm Person, the #1 bard spell!
He/him pronouns. Call me Bard. PROUD NERD!
Ever wanted to talk about your parties' worst mistakes? Do so HERE. What's your favorite class, why? Share & explain
HERE.I don’t think anyone will really get the traction to be some breakout success story publishing the dreck we’re worried about. I just expect some firebrand looking for something to rail against will dig one of those pieces up and make a lot of noise for a few weeks.
This is no victory, this is just evidence that WotC doesn’t give a 💩 about 5e anymore and they’re already dumping everything into 1DD which will in no way be covered under OGL1.0a.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
While I expect that may happen, I am not going to persecute / punish DDB and WotC for crimes they have not yet committed. If they decide to be stupid in the future, that when I'll punish them.
Atm, I'll keep my DDB subscription ( I had renewed for a year just before this all blew up ), may go see the new movie, if it is good, keep looking at the OneDnD playtest stuff but doubt I'll buy after new books unless they are so good, they are must haves ( honestly last several books were getting me to stop preordering them due to poor quality. )
I am going to keep watching the ORC, will playtest Black Flag, whatever Matt Coleville creates, look at other game systems. Hasbro lost a lot of trust with this and they need to be on their best behavior for years to start earning that trust back.
Thank you WotC and HASBRO for truly listening, and responding.
If something isn't going to happen, it isn't going to happen.
Sterling - V. Human Bard 3 (College of Art) - [Pic] - [Traits] - in Bards: Dragon Heist (w/ Mansion) - Jasper's [Pic] - Sterling's [Sigil]
Tooltips Post (2024 PHB updates) - incl. General Rules
>> New FOW threat & treasure tables: fow-advanced-threat-tables.pdf fow-advanced-treasure-table.pdf
Clearly you are unaware that bigoted groups like the proud boys, etc. use online D&D as a recruiting method.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
By then it’ll be too late.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Urrr... in what way would it be too late? It took what, three weeks to get wizards to back down this time? That's nothing-time for a new release.
I mean, I’d never even been aware of their existence before they got arrested for the Capitol riot, so I’m not sure they qualify as breakout successes. It is extremely unfortunate that they use D&D as a recruiting tool, and that now very little can be done besides sitting back and watching.
Not that I mean to be "that guy"; but this isn't over. This is a "take a long rest, recharge spell slots, post a guard to make sure the red dragon isn't getting greedy and complacent and eyeing up the neighbouring kingdoms."
We've now seen what WOTC/Hasbro's higher up executives WANT to make happen; their "walled garden" model for D&D's future, the fact they got busted once because they pushed too far too quickly doesn't change that. So long as the same executive team is in place, that threat will only sleep like an elder god and not actually be defeated.
But that's up to them. I mean, the win is that they're not going to touch OGL 1.0a, which was what the community was asking for.
And they have also included the SRD 5.1 in CC, which can no longer be reversed.
What they do with One D&D is up to them. And we'll see how it turns out. 4e was put in GSL and it was a flop. We'll see what happens with One D&D. If One D&D is released under a license whose terms are acceptable to publishers who publish third-party content, we will see third-party content. If they're not acceptable, hardly anyone will put out third-party content for One D&D. And the consumer will decide if it is worth buying that edition, or if he prefers to stick with 5e.
It is a victory. And a greater victory than anyone expected, dare I say.
I personally think that taking a chance that a few 'bad' books getting through by keeping the 3PP able and secure to produce content is worth the potential down the road. Will someone abuse it, hell yah... but at the same time, what any two people believe is hateful can be complete opposites and I honestly believe (including what I'm putting in this post) there is nothing that is ever said by anyone that doesn't find offense with someone else. Hell, even not saying something can be considered offensive, so it is a darned if you do, darned if you don't scenario. Personally, I'd rather err on the side of the ability to express oneself than live in constant fear of being 'cancelled'.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Benjamin Franklin
I think there will be no SRD 6.0.
Or there will be a much more limiting OGL 2.0 with SRD 6.0.
But this is fine. The history will repeat itself again - if WotC wants to repeat 4E fiasco, then this is within their rights.
In the meantime most of us will enjoy 5E content, including the 3rd party content - which is now shielded with CC licence.
The current TPTB inside the WotC will drop out in a few years, there will be new managers - DnD 7E will emerge around 2030, with a community friendly OGL or ORC or CC license. Around 2040 there will be a new management imported from MS who will try new shenanigans, there will be a new outrage, etc...
Over the past 23 years of the OGL, which third party creators have attempted to publish white supremacist content based on Dungeons and Dragons?
It must have been a shit-ton, based on people's apprehensions, but Ernie Gygax is the only one of whom I have heard, apart from WotC's content for Curse of Strahd, Spelljammer, Tomb of Annihilation, etc.
I understood 5e has been out since around 2014/15. What is the sudden change that has happened in 2023 that will open the doors to a slew of such content. I ask this as I understand a thing was going to change... and didn't change. So it's as it's always been right? So why would bad things suddenly start to happen if there's been no change?
I'm assuming I'm missing some piece of the puzzle that has suddenly changed things for the worst and hoping you (or anyone that knows) can enlighten me?
Yah, why is it the even number editions always seem to blow up???
There are other websites out there that don't have morality clauses. Almost all of them don't, in fact.
Read up on Ernest Gygax. I think you'd be surprised by the amount of people who publish things like this.
What if they want to use third-party content in their campaign though? They shouldn't be denied that right just because of the rigidity of other people.
BoringBard's long and tedious posts somehow manage to enrapture audiences. How? Because he used Charm Person, the #1 bard spell!
He/him pronouns. Call me Bard. PROUD NERD!
Ever wanted to talk about your parties' worst mistakes? Do so HERE. What's your favorite class, why? Share & explain
HERE.