You can do all the extra cool stuff and also push a creature with your bonus action as well.
and you get the +1 int which would be useful for an Arcane Trickster.
I was thinking something like pick pocketing in a tavern while out of the room using bonus action for sleight of hand and using action to look through familiar's eyes.
Also, would you get advantage with Sleight of Hand, since it's invisible? I mean if you were going to pick pocket someone while visible is a normal skill check, wouldn't an invisible hand from a distant get advantage?
Also, would you get advantage with Sleight of Hand, since it's invisible? I mean if you were going to pick pocket someone while visible is a normal skill check, wouldn't an invisible hand from a distant get advantage?
No. Mage Hand Legerdemain would tell you if that were the case.
A big part of pickpocketing is the target potentially noticing your touch; having an invisible hand doesn't help with that, and you usually pickpocket someone that's not paying attention to you anyways.
A big part of pickpocketing is the target potentially noticing your touch; having an invisible hand doesn't help with that, and you usually pickpocket someone that's not paying attention to you anyways.
Yeah but you still barely any risk because when he does feel it he still does not know what is happening.
If someone notices your pickpocket attempt it hardly matters whether they understand what's happening. They're not going to just stand there and watch a valuable item drift away. They'll likely yank it off your mage hand and now that they're on high alert you won't get anything off of them.
A big part of pickpocketing is the target potentially noticing your touch; having an invisible hand doesn't help with that, and you usually pickpocket someone that's not paying attention to you anyways.
Yeah but you still barely any risk because when he does feel it he still does not know what is happening.
Keep in mind that unless you're the only Arcane Trickster in the world, a typical well-to-do person will probably be aware that telekinetic pickpockets exist and figure out what's happening if you fail. The benefit is that you are not immediately implicated.
A big part of pickpocketing is the target potentially noticing your touch; having an invisible hand doesn't help with that, and you usually pickpocket someone that's not paying attention to you anyways.
Yeah but you still barely any risk because when he does feel it he still does not know what is happening.
Keep in mind that unless you're the only Arcane Trickster in the world, a typical well-to-do person will probably be aware that telekinetic pickpockets exist and figure out what's happening if you fail. The benefit is that you are not immediately implicated.
Even if you are the only Arcane Trickster in the world. Enough other magical shenanigans happen that they may still be on the look out and start looking for who to implicate.
As for the ability and the feat. it's heavily redundant and best done more for flavor than for the couple of extra bonuses you gain from it.
Tbh, the Mage Hand Legerdemain feature should have a few of these features inherently already, so I would always house rule it as such;
Casting it without Verbal component - what's the use of an invisible mage hand when literally everyone heard you cast it?
Casting it as a Bonus Action - no sane rogue will give up their entire round in combat to cast Mage Hand.
Moving it at your walking speed instead of 20' as a bonus action - no creature in game moves at 20'.
At level 14, using a bonus action to move it AND use it to distract someone - without it, it takes you 1 round to set up, and 1 round to execute... with a fair chance your target moves and you lose the setup
Without the above features, using Mage Hand as an arcane trickster is rather useless, IMO. The 1 minute duration means you have to cast and act in a very short period, so there is no "setting it up". Even increasing its duration to 10 minutes or 1 hour would still need the mage hand's speed to be increased, otherwise it will just lag behind or you will be walking very slowly (which can be suspicious too.) The result is that in social situations, people can clearly see you casting something right before something fishy happens. In combat situations, your mage hand will not add anything of value, because it's always lagging behind.
Doesn't the wording of mage hand spell say, "You can move the hand up to 30 feet each time you use it." Page 256 of PHB. So if you use it as part of your bonus action to distract someone, you can move it up to 30 feet with that same bonus action. I do agree that the arcane trickster should be allowed to cast it as a bonus action.
What do people think of this combination?
You can cast it without verbal or somatic
it's invisible and 60 ft range
You can do all the extra cool stuff and also push a creature with your bonus action as well.
and you get the +1 int which would be useful for an Arcane Trickster.
I was thinking something like pick pocketing in a tavern while out of the room using bonus action for sleight of hand and using action to look through familiar's eyes.
Also, would you get advantage with Sleight of Hand, since it's invisible? I mean if you were going to pick pocket someone while visible is a normal skill check, wouldn't an invisible hand from a distant get advantage?
It's a pretty good combination. The option to get +1 INT when taking the feat really helps make it useful even when you're not using Mage Hand.
No. Mage Hand Legerdemain would tell you if that were the case.
A big part of pickpocketing is the target potentially noticing your touch; having an invisible hand doesn't help with that, and you usually pickpocket someone that's not paying attention to you anyways.
Yeah but you still barely any risk because when he does feel it he still does not know what is happening.
If someone notices your pickpocket attempt it hardly matters whether they understand what's happening. They're not going to just stand there and watch a valuable item drift away. They'll likely yank it off your mage hand and now that they're on high alert you won't get anything off of them.
I thought the object pick pocketed would be invisible as well :
You can stow one object the hand is holding in a container worn or carried by another creature
maybe I'm reading too much into it.
A bit, yeah. Neither feature says whatever the hand holds becomes invisible. That's usually not how telekinesis is portrayed in pop culture either.
All that bullet point says is you can use the hand to plant items on another creature, much like you can use it to take items off of them.
Keep in mind that unless you're the only Arcane Trickster in the world, a typical well-to-do person will probably be aware that telekinetic pickpockets exist and figure out what's happening if you fail. The benefit is that you are not immediately implicated.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
Even if you are the only Arcane Trickster in the world. Enough other magical shenanigans happen that they may still be on the look out and start looking for who to implicate.
As for the ability and the feat. it's heavily redundant and best done more for flavor than for the couple of extra bonuses you gain from it.
Tbh, the Mage Hand Legerdemain feature should have a few of these features inherently already, so I would always house rule it as such;
Without the above features, using Mage Hand as an arcane trickster is rather useless, IMO. The 1 minute duration means you have to cast and act in a very short period, so there is no "setting it up". Even increasing its duration to 10 minutes or 1 hour would still need the mage hand's speed to be increased, otherwise it will just lag behind or you will be walking very slowly (which can be suspicious too.) The result is that in social situations, people can clearly see you casting something right before something fishy happens. In combat situations, your mage hand will not add anything of value, because it's always lagging behind.
Doesn't the wording of mage hand spell say, "You can move the hand up to 30 feet each time you use it." Page 256 of PHB. So if you use it as part of your bonus action to distract someone, you can move it up to 30 feet with that same bonus action. I do agree that the arcane trickster should be allowed to cast it as a bonus action.
You're right, I had overlooked that sentence. So then my only issue with it is the Verbal component and the full action casting time. :-)