Does anyone know why you can't add proficiency in vehicles? My group recently found a shipwrecked boat that they are repairing and are trying to learn to sail from fisherman but apparently they are doomed, on their character sheets anyway, to never be proficient.
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A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity - Robert Frost
click on the SKILLS* on the character sheet, below all of the standard proficiencies. This will allow you to add custom skills to the character sheet. :)
Vehicles are a tool proficiency, per page 154 of the PHB, not a skill proficiency. The only tool proficiency available beginning with the letter v is the Viol.
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A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity - Robert Frost
You misunderstand. “Vehicle proficiency” isn’t a separate proficiency like thieves’ tools proficiency. It refers to a class of proficiencies with (types of) vehicles, for which there could be many and varied types. These can be added as a custom proficiency. Examples might be “chariot proficiency”, “magical flying boat proficiency”, etc. etc.
Vehicle Proficiency. If you have proficiency with a certainkind of vehicle (land or water), you can add your proficiency bonus to any check you make to control that kind of vehicle in difficult circumstances.
Vehicles are not currently listed in the existing tool proficiencies under "Add New Proficiencies." You do have the ability to add custom tool or language proficiencies by selecting the corresponding value under Custom. Then you set a title for the tool or language.
I agree this is an oversight. If you take the Soldier background it shows you have proficiency with Vehicles (land) and Sailor and Pirate give proficiency with Vehicles (water).
But you can’t add these to other backgrounds in game except for doing a custom proficiency.
TCE might re-ignite this topic... I'm looking at the "proficiency swap" section. I'm currently a Githyanki.
One of my Gith proficiencies is Martial Prodigy which reads:
You are proficient with light and medium armor and with shortswords, longswords, and greatswords.
According to TCE, I can swap a simple weapon skill with a DIFFERENT simple weapon or a ***Tool***. Can I take proficiency with a SINGLE vehicle type (tool) (e.g., Sled since I'm playing icewindale)?
TCE might re-ignite this topic... I'm looking at the "proficiency swap" section. I'm currently a Githyanki.
One of my Gith proficiencies is Martial Prodigy which reads:
You are proficient with light and medium armor and with shortswords, longswords, and greatswords.
According to TCE, I can swap a simple weapon skill with a DIFFERENT simple weapon or a ***Tool***. Can I take proficiency with a SINGLE vehicle type (tool) (e.g., Sled since I'm playing icewindale)?
Okay, so this is how I run it in my games. As you stated above, your Gith has proficiency with Light and Medium Armor, Shortswords, Longswords, and Greatswords.
So, lets break this down. Light Armor includes all Armor in the Light category. Same with Medium Armor. However, Shortswords, Longswords, and Greatswords are specific weapons.
What does this mean for your question? In your case, Land Vehicles would be considered a group category, like Light Armor, Medium Armor, etc. So I would rule it as any Land Vehicle (listed in the PHB or other sourcebooks you use) would count and you'd be proficient with it. Chapter 5, under Mounts has a list of ground vehicles that I would say count as Land Vehicles, as they can be ridden.
As far as the Sled, it's useless on it's own. You'd need an animal to move it. So you're controlling the animal (Land Vehicle) to move the sled. You'd have proficiency.
TCE might re-ignite this topic... I'm looking at the "proficiency swap" section. I'm currently a Githyanki.
One of my Gith proficiencies is Martial Prodigy which reads:
You are proficient with light and medium armor and with shortswords, longswords, and greatswords.
According to TCE, I can swap a simple weapon skill with a DIFFERENT simple weapon or a ***Tool***. Can I take proficiency with a SINGLE vehicle type (tool) (e.g., Sled since I'm playing icewindale)?
Okay, so this is how I run it in my games. As you stated above, your Gith has proficiency with Light and Medium Armor, Shortswords, Longswords, and Greatswords.
So, lets break this down. Light Armor includes all Armor in the Light category. Same with Medium Armor. However, Shortswords, Longswords, and Greatswords are specific weapons.
What does this mean for your question? In your case, Land Vehicles would be considered a group category, like Light Armor, Medium Armor, etc. So I would rule it as any Land Vehicle (listed in the PHB or other sourcebooks you use) would count and you'd be proficient with it. Chapter 5, under Mounts has a list of ground vehicles that I would say count as Land Vehicles, as they can be ridden.
As far as the Sled, it's useless on it's own. You'd need an animal to move it. So you're controlling the animal (Land Vehicle) to move the sled. You'd have proficiency.
That's an interesting take. Thank you!
I agree with the comments you made RE: armors being a group proficiency and the weapons being single proficiencies.
I did notice in Chapter 5 (PHB pg 154) that Vehicle (land or water) are DEFO listed under tools so seems like I can swap them legitimately with TCE. You mention the sled prof being useless, but I must disagree. Why have a proficiency exist if it's got 0 use. I believe it means you know how to control the reins for the attached animals. Think of adventure movies with horse/carriage chases. The hero jumps on the carriage and the horses keep running. If he is a pro with the reins, he's a pro with any reins :D They do not need to like him and he doesn't need to charm them or anything. Obviously, that would be BENEFICIAL (I'd give Advantage as DM if you befriend the animal prior to riding on their cart/carriage/wagon/sled), but as we all know... tools ONLY get your prof bonus (no addition of stat bonus modifier like with attacks)".
So summary (via example): The Gith Bard who has proficiency in SLED gets one from a local for helping them out. Meeting up with the main group afterwards, they head out with supplies on the sled. They get chased by wolves. He gets to roll a d20 + PROF bonus! Should he or a druid or anyone else befriend them, he can then have advantage on any "driving/chase/obstacle avoidance" rolls. Reasonable? Trading shortsword PROF for Sled (and ONLY sled) PROF is not game breaking?
Tools are so variable in their usage that you really need to talk with your DM about it. In a lot of games, piloting a vehicle of any kind is so rare that just blanket land vehicle proficiency is roughly equal to something like carpentry. It really depends on your campaign.
tools ONLY get your prof bonus (no addition of stat bonus modifier like with attacks)
I don't think this is correct. Proficiency bonuses get added to ability checks, and ability checks all use the modifier of one of your abilities. There is a lot of leeway here, but a check for driving a sled would be 1d20 + [mod] + proficiency bonus, where mod is the modifier of whatever ability the DM determines you're using to control the sled.
Oh man you are a MILLION percent right. I just realized one of my friends is a jerk! LMAO (He must have made up this ruling when I was a newer player to 5e and I didn't know better). Now I feel bad for all the times I DM'ed ppl. Woooooops!!!
Pg 177 of PHB and I think 103 of DMG for anyone interested.
That's even better now though because my Gith can have prof in just sled (my DM wouldn't give ALL land vehicles I doubt) and then I also get a Strength roll prob! (Yes... I do have a strength based bard... YES bard, not Barb!). He's super flavourful on purpose (UA college of spirits). Lolololol Thanks for pointing that out dude!
Does anyone know why you can't add proficiency in vehicles? My group recently found a shipwrecked boat that they are repairing and are trying to learn to sail from fisherman but apparently they are doomed, on their character sheets anyway, to never be proficient.
A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity - Robert Frost
Hi there Seydlitz,
click on the SKILLS* on the character sheet, below all of the standard proficiencies. This will allow you to add custom skills to the character sheet. :)
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Vehicles are a tool proficiency, per page 154 of the PHB, not a skill proficiency. The only tool proficiency available beginning with the letter v is the Viol.
A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity - Robert Frost
You misunderstand. “Vehicle proficiency” isn’t a separate proficiency like thieves’ tools proficiency. It refers to a class of proficiencies with (types of) vehicles, for which there could be many and varied types. These can be added as a custom proficiency. Examples might be “chariot proficiency”, “magical flying boat proficiency”, etc. etc.
I know wagons are under land vehicles. Maybe there are water vehicles?
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Vehicles are not currently listed in the existing tool proficiencies under "Add New Proficiencies." You do have the ability to add custom tool or language proficiencies by selecting the corresponding value under Custom. Then you set a title for the tool or language.
I agree this is an oversight. If you take the Soldier background it shows you have proficiency with Vehicles (land) and Sailor and Pirate give proficiency with Vehicles (water).
But you can’t add these to other backgrounds in game except for doing a custom proficiency.
TCE might re-ignite this topic... I'm looking at the "proficiency swap" section. I'm currently a Githyanki.
One of my Gith proficiencies is Martial Prodigy which reads:
You are proficient with light and medium armor and with shortswords, longswords, and greatswords.
According to TCE, I can swap a simple weapon skill with a DIFFERENT simple weapon or a ***Tool***. Can I take proficiency with a SINGLE vehicle type (tool) (e.g., Sled since I'm playing icewindale)?
Okay, so this is how I run it in my games. As you stated above, your Gith has proficiency with Light and Medium Armor, Shortswords, Longswords, and Greatswords.
So, lets break this down. Light Armor includes all Armor in the Light category. Same with Medium Armor. However, Shortswords, Longswords, and Greatswords are specific weapons.
What does this mean for your question? In your case, Land Vehicles would be considered a group category, like Light Armor, Medium Armor, etc. So I would rule it as any Land Vehicle (listed in the PHB or other sourcebooks you use) would count and you'd be proficient with it. Chapter 5, under Mounts has a list of ground vehicles that I would say count as Land Vehicles, as they can be ridden.
As far as the Sled, it's useless on it's own. You'd need an animal to move it. So you're controlling the animal (Land Vehicle) to move the sled. You'd have proficiency.
That's an interesting take. Thank you!
I agree with the comments you made RE: armors being a group proficiency and the weapons being single proficiencies.
I did notice in Chapter 5 (PHB pg 154) that Vehicle (land or water) are DEFO listed under tools so seems like I can swap them legitimately with TCE. You mention the sled prof being useless, but I must disagree. Why have a proficiency exist if it's got 0 use. I believe it means you know how to control the reins for the attached animals. Think of adventure movies with horse/carriage chases. The hero jumps on the carriage and the horses keep running. If he is a pro with the reins, he's a pro with any reins :D They do not need to like him and he doesn't need to charm them or anything. Obviously, that would be BENEFICIAL (I'd give Advantage as DM if you befriend the animal prior to riding on their cart/carriage/wagon/sled), but as we all know... tools ONLY get your prof bonus (no addition of stat bonus modifier like with attacks)".
So summary (via example):
The Gith Bard who has proficiency in SLED gets one from a local for helping them out. Meeting up with the main group afterwards, they head out with supplies on the sled. They get chased by wolves. He gets to roll a d20 + PROF bonus! Should he or a druid or anyone else befriend them, he can then have advantage on any "driving/chase/obstacle avoidance" rolls.
Reasonable?
Trading shortsword PROF for Sled (and ONLY sled) PROF is not game breaking?
Tools are so variable in their usage that you really need to talk with your DM about it. In a lot of games, piloting a vehicle of any kind is so rare that just blanket land vehicle proficiency is roughly equal to something like carpentry. It really depends on your campaign.
I don't think this is correct. Proficiency bonuses get added to ability checks, and ability checks all use the modifier of one of your abilities. There is a lot of leeway here, but a check for driving a sled would be 1d20 + [mod] + proficiency bonus, where mod is the modifier of whatever ability the DM determines you're using to control the sled.
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Oh man you are a MILLION percent right. I just realized one of my friends is a jerk! LMAO (He must have made up this ruling when I was a newer player to 5e and I didn't know better). Now I feel bad for all the times I DM'ed ppl. Woooooops!!!
Pg 177 of PHB and I think 103 of DMG for anyone interested.
That's even better now though because my Gith can have prof in just sled (my DM wouldn't give ALL land vehicles I doubt) and then I also get a Strength roll prob! (Yes... I do have a strength based bard... YES bard, not Barb!). He's super flavourful on purpose (UA college of spirits). Lolololol Thanks for pointing that out dude!
I agree it's not game breaking. Trading a weapon prof for a tool would be fine by me. I believe you can do that in Tasha's as well.