So what makes it worth my while buying the MM for instance if all of the current searchable Monsters (which I'm assuming is the entirety of the Monster Manual) is present?
No, the current material is from the SRD, Basic Rules and Elemental Evil supplement (which has always been the free material available for the beta test).
Plus I'm assuming that purchasing the MM will mean getting all the text of the MM as well. All that flavour text about the creature's environment, behaviour, etc.
Yes, you will have all the text + you will unlock all the MM monsters for the search feature.
There are many items in the database that are not from the basic rules or SRD, but you cannot see their content or use them in the character builder until you've unlocked their source books.
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This is a tough one. I am a huge DnD fanboy from way back. I have been trying to help with the site. The pricing though... not a fan.
I am OK with the subscription model. I am not really pleased with having to re-purchase the same content again... at least at full price. A few months ago when I decided to get back into Dungeons and Dragons I purchased the Players Handbook and the Dungeon Masters Guide. Spent a total of $66.22 from Amazon to get these books. There are reasons why it is set up like this. Same reasons Roll 20, Fantasy Grounds, etc all charge similar fees. WoTC. I am not privy to any of the details but I assume they set the prices. I was hoping this would be different because it felt like it was going to be a part of the WoTC offerings.
Everyone points out it is an expensive hobby which is obviously true even without the addition of this site's paywall features. I will continue to use this site and help to contribute code whenever I come up with an idea (whether they use it or not, up to them. :) ) I cannot however afford to repurchase books I just purchased.
I was hoping the subscription model would be more akin to Netflix or Hulu. Ie:
$7.99 a month gives you access to all the content but with ads $11.99 a month gives you an ad-free experience
As for those who say "What is stopping people from just printing the entire books out..." Really? It took me seconds to find illegal copies of the books online. Be much easier to print these. The books here are not presented as single looong documents, they are presented in a database format, they are meant to be clicked through. If someone wants to go to the trouble of clicking on each spell, item, monster and print them all... more power to them.
As for adventures and content that is generated new. Have those as a separate fee. An adventure might be an extra $3.99 to rent it for a week or something along those lines. With other adventures listed as "Free for the month" so people can see some adventures as part of their subscription but if they want the "new releases" they can get pay a little extra and see them now.
People seem to be forgetting that D&D beyond is more than just a compendium of rules content like a book. It is a tool set as well. If all you wanted was the rules content, then just use the books you've already purchased. It is a separate product altogether. D&D Beyond is a tool and the rules content is not Curse's to just give away. The prices they offer are heavily discounted from the MSRP already and so are very reasonable. And I'll gladly pay for the content I need to use in the character builder, and possibly campaign manager.
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Silvva... the toolkit is what everyone is willing to pay for, no one wants Curse to not make money on this. No one wants to pay for the same content we already purchased we are very willing to pay for the toolkit. I also will gladly pay for the content to use the character builder as well... in face... been there did that. I am glad others are ok with this model, it just doesn't work for my purposes sadly. I will continue to support the site, but just with the 6 character limit (honestly that is plenty for me) and with the current content.
Sirdig: For the first week they are on sale for $19.99 then they pop back up to $29.99.
I am not attacking Curse nor WoTC. I hope this product does well. I enjoy it, but I personally cannot afford to rebuy content. This is the same reason why I passed on all the other services out there.
Someone correct if I am wrong, but this is what I am seeing from everything here.
There are three tiers of subscription.
I pay nothing (the free tier): I get access to everything I have right now, and I can make and store up to 6 characters and create homebrew materials.
I pay for the Hero tier monthly subscription: I get access to everything I have right now, and I can make and store an unlimited number of characters, and I can use other people’s homebrew materials published on DNDBeyond.
I pay for the Master tier monthly subscription: I get access to everything I have right now, I can make and store an unlimited number of characters, I can use other people’s homebrew materials published on DNDBeyond, and I can have a campaign that can support up to 12 free accounts plus an unlimited number of Hero/Master subscribed accounts. Any materials I have purchased can be shared with those in my campaign.
There is also a way to purchase digital materials.
If I want to own WOTC materials that have been digitally incorporated into DNDBeyond at launch, such as the Players Handbook or Curse of Strahd, then I can purchase them one time and have access from then on. Curse is also going to be selling portions of these items in case I only want certain portions of the rules, like backgrounds, certain spells, or certain monsters. If I have a Master subscription as well, then any material I purchase this way can be shared with accounts associated with my campaign.
So I could go on unsubscribed and just buy sourcebook materials as I see fit, homebrewing as much of the information as I like from those sourcebook materials for my personal use. (I can’t publish it for others on DNDBeyond because it’s WOTC’s IP.) Or I could subscribe and have all the characters I want that can use homebrew materials or sourcebook materials I purchase. Or I could subscribe at the highest level and share my materials with a number of other accounts.
DNDBeyond is an attempt to enhance D&D game play around the table - at least for now. It’s supplementary. I have gotten along thus far without it. (Full disclosure: Since March I have most certainly NOT gotten along without it. It has enhanced my planning as a DM and game play as I quickly look up things at the table. It most definitely HAS enhanced my game play.) I can use my books that I bought and character sheets I’ve made just fine. Or, since I’ve bought into the Fantasy Grounds or Roll20 environment and have digital access to the materials through those services, and if I ran my games through a virtual tabletop, maybe I don’t need to buy it all again in a different format.
As a side note regarding Fantasy Grounds and DNDBeyond… I consider myself fortunate. My gaming group is face-to-face. We’ve been playing together (some of us) since the early 80s. So I don’t really need a VTT. But I have tried to use Fantasy Grounds as a resource to enhance prep and game play for my group, and I gave up. Thus far, and for my purposes, DNDBeyond has proven so much easier to use. Your experiences and your needs may be different. Ultimately, choose the tool that works for you.
Unfortunately, while Microsoft goes through great pains to ensure backwards compatibility in Windows, the same cannot be said for Apple/iOS or Google/Android. If the app is not kept up-to-date, it will cease working in somewhere around 3-4 years as new versions of each mobile OS get released. In terms of iOS, the situation is a bit worse because the app will get pulled from the App Store if Curse doesn't keep their developer certificate up to date (they expire after a year, which means it'll be pulled from the store in a year should Curse go under -- to be real, this is very unlikely to occur as Curse is a big company).
Having a means of offline access that does not require a mobile app (such as gaining access to a PDF or epub version of the book) is therefore preferable so that the content remains accessible even if the app ceases to be maintained. I hope that something more permanent like that is in the works.
I currently have an app on my Samsung Galaxy S7 that hasn't received a single update since 2011 and is not likely to ever get one. The UI isn't quite as "pretty" as it was back then (the buttons on the top and bottom a little squished), but it works perfectly fine and can be still be downloaded from Google Play with no problems. I can't speak in regards to other apps, but this tells me an app can last at least 6 years without support and/or updates from the developer.
Digital sourcebooks (such as the Player's Handbook or Volo's Guide to Monsters) will be available for $29.99, while adventure modules (such as Curse of Strahd or Storm King's Thunder) will be available for $24.99.
For the first week after launch, the Player's Handbook, Dungeon Master's Guide, and Monster Manual will be on sale for $19.99 each!
I pay for the Master tier monthly subscription: I get access to everything I have right now, I can make and store an unlimited number of characters, I can use other people’s homebrew materials published on DNDBeyond, and I can have a campaign that can support up to 12 free accounts plus an unlimited number of Hero/Master subscribed accounts. Any materials I have purchased can be shared with those in my campaign.
This is almost right. With the free tool you can have a campaign (ore more than one) and any other users can connect to it. You can share with them any private Homebrew you have. I don't know if there's a limit to the number of campaigns you can have or the number of players who can connect to them.
The Master tier subscription allows you to share your purchased content with up to 12 free accounts (and unlimited hero/master accounts, I believe) that are connected to your campaign.
You were pretty close, but you do not need a subscription to have a campaign
I pay for the Master tier monthly subscription: I get access to everything I have right now, I can make and store an unlimited number of characters, I can use other people’s homebrew materials published on DNDBeyond, and I can have a campaign that can support up to 12 free accounts plus an unlimited number of Hero/Master subscribed accounts. Any materials I have purchased can be shared with those in my campaign.
This is almost right. With the free tool you can have a campaign (ore more than one) and any other users can connect to it. You can share with them any private Homebrew you have. I don't know if there's a limit to the number of campaigns you can have or the number of players who can connect to them.
The Master tier subscription allows you to share your purchased content with up to 12 free accounts (and unlimited hero/master accounts, I believe) that are connected to your campaign.
You were pretty close, but you do not need a subscription to have a campaign
More details on how this will work will be coming soon. From what I hear, it might be much more amazing than people think. ;)
I pay for the Master tier monthly subscription: I get access to everything I have right now, I can make and store an unlimited number of characters, I can use other people’s homebrew materials published on DNDBeyond, and I can have a campaign that can support up to 12 free accounts plus an unlimited number of Hero/Master subscribed accounts. Any materials I have purchased can be shared with those in my campaign.
This is almost right. With the free tool you can have a campaign (ore more than one) and any other users can connect to it. You can share with them any private Homebrew you have. I don't know if there's a limit to the number of campaigns you can have or the number of players who can connect to them.
The Master tier subscription allows you to share your purchased content with up to 12 free accounts (and unlimited hero/master accounts, I believe) that are connected to your campaign.
You were pretty close, but you do not need a subscription to have a campaign
Digital sourcebooks (such as the Player's Handbook or Volo's Guide to Monsters) will be available for $29.99, while adventure modules (such as Curse of Strahd or Storm King's Thunder) will be available for $24.99.
For the first week after launch, the Player's Handbook, Dungeon Master's Guide, and Monster Manual will be on sale for $19.99 each!
Third, these are all free in the a digital format that a lot of us want with a little Google searching..
Fourth, compare to Paizo who only charges an additional $9.99 for the PDF for their core rulebooks or even their latest offering.
Fifth, don't forget the subscription fee on top of this.
Subscription is NOT required.. I don't know how many times this has been posted..
and Amazon prices are NOT retail prices. Retail prices are whats printed on the book. Which, in this case is $49.95. $20 for the first week, and even $30 therafter is still a MASSIVE discount.
I think both sides of the argument (re: books) are mistakenly using the phrase "purchase books" as there is no digital books being offered for purchase at this stage.
Instead, the model is more akin to a DLC / Expansion model where you are paying a one-time fee to unlock access to content from these books within DNDBeyond's toolset (monster, spell, character builders, etc) and are not receiving a digital version of these books akin to a PDF, ePUB or HTML.
Keeping this in mind may help focus the discussion on whether the community feels $XX for accessing this content within the toolset matches with the subjective value it delivers which seems to be the hidden debate at play here where some feel the value matches the price while others do not.
Likely, once the full product is available and the full details are released and open for review for the Master Tier, Offline Mode, Twitch, etc we'll all be able get a better feel of what the actual product is and a better understanding of how everything works together. Until then, we're debating value of a product without being able to know in detail what that final product will be outside of bullet points and what we've seen in the Beta.
Looking forward to more detail being shared and having an opportunity to see how things work together!
Most people seem to be missing the point... People have payed for this already. In the form of hard cover books, Roll20, fantasy grounds.. It's been expensive already... Yes, yes.. new platform....same content. It's information I'm talking about. Same content without even the functionality of Roll20 as a VTT, (players where asking me for a board when we played I might add). So what, you get a few easier characters to roll up. Integration is a bit better... And yes, I do like what they have done so far. It's neat. But neat does not or will not open my pocket book to content that I own and can play free on other mediums. And from what I've been hearing, neither will a lot of others.
And I get you guys defending this are gun-ho...And that's fine and great. I'm not telling you not to buy this product, I'm cautioning what I'm hearing and it mirrors my own feelings of what's driving me away from this product.
Arguing with me on my point when I already stated this is an interesting and potentially awesome platform with potential, is kind of stupid. I'm telling you as a consumer what would make me invest in this. I want to invest in this... But I and many others will not pay for those books again on top of a subscription. Not when we have invested the same money or more for the EXACT SAME content. So those of you who want to just throw money blindly at them is fine. I'm saying they should add another level to their already ridiculous amount of money collection set-ups to make players like myself commit to this platform as well.You poeple can buy and do as you please, if this works for you that's great! But others are not you... Does that make sense?
This isn't rocket science. By actually agreeing with me and others with similar concerns you are helping yourselves, you actually increase the player base here. When that happens, the site grows larger and more revenue comes in through other means. Perhaps after a year I do want to invest more in a PROVEN product. People don't want to invest large sums of money into something they don't own or what they already own, or what they fear might be obsolete in a week. What people will do is pay 8 - 10 a month in subs though. They don't own the content, but have access to all the content. Netflix.
Buying into this also means that you more or less can only play with other people from D&D Beyond. So, you pay all this money and then can't find a group. what then? Or what if your players want to use roll 20 and you want to use this? So you buy the subscription... Now you have to buy the books in order to get the most out of your subscription.
Yes, you can play free... But do you want to play the same thief over and over with only 2 feats? probably not. That free stuff is to wet your whistle and get you hungry for more... It's human nature and good marketing strategy. It's also why you will pay 3 to 4 times the cost on micro transactions for weapons and classes. It's why a lot of other games are free :P They make bazillions on micro transactions. So I see why curse wants to do it. But.... This is a different beast. This isn't Dota. At least in dota I play for free. 100%. Not in any way shape or form is my game different from the guy who dropped 400 bucks. But they still make bazillions... why? Because I am not pushed on the sale. I do it when I am comfortable. When I am comfortable and confident, I put money down.
go the Netflix route.. I have no problem paying 8.99 to netflix each month and I can pretty much tell you the same would happen here. someone mentioned steam. Steam is a graveyard of wasted idea's and money thrown down the toilet on start up games and applications... So please, don't pretend every venture makes it out of the gates. Do I believe Curse and this will last a while... Sure... Will I still buy information I own...No.
But I would pay a sub to use the information and come and go as I please instead of a huge start up cost. And no, a lot of players are not in dedicated games... The bloody forum is filled with people looking for games. You don't have a person join your game and then tell them they owe you 76 cents for your sub. That is also ********.
So when - D&D BEYOND beyond, opens up next month (sponsored by Wizards) are we all then supposed to pay AGAIN for every book on top of another subscription? No.
Are other tactics to basically fill your screen with adds so you pretty much have to pay for a sub too? haha, that would be funny. "Ortik...You swing your mighty great axe! You cleave through flesh and bone and sinew..and...???..You chop off the head of a guy on a horse? no..no...he's on a boat..no..DAMN YOU OLD SPICE!!! DAMN YOU!!!!"
Great platform, looks polished. But with only promises of actual DM tools, paying for information I own already (and will not own if purchased here) on top of subs.... Hard sell guys.
Well, that is just how I feel...Others feel different and that is fine. I'm happy you like what is here, I'm happy you will purchase the content again. And this is a good site. The work is good. Anyone who has not already invested heavily with this type of content or new users will definitely benefit. But as for people like myself... Not so much. And that is fine too.
I'm arguing this much because I do believe this can be a good thing. If I didn't care, I wouldn't argue. But again. I'm just stating what might help push players on board with this. The end result is you agree, or don't agree.
The only way I could see a subscription method working to unlock all content is to remove offline accessibility to that content. Like netflix, you'd be required to access that content exclusively online.
I'm ok with that, but offline access has been one of the biggest selling points so far.
Which also fine. I'm not telling curse to scrap that platform that is offered already, if it works for people, roll with it. I'm saying add another layer for those that don't care. Or have the content already. You clearly have the data base online set up already. People seem confused by this... keep what's here and offered... but to get more people, offer different methods.
I use the books at home while in bed or on the couch. Or I have access to the internet... the intern t is free al it's everywhere you go now. PEople are almost never offline now.
I'm Not saying change what you have now... people are confused by this. Im saying add the option for those that don't care to have an offline option on top of what's here. When I am home, im online. Or since I own the content, I usually sit on the couch or in bed with the actual book.
Besides, the internet is everywhere now. People are almost always online. In a few years, whole cities will be planning to be online always. It's true. More and more banks are going online only. Which means cheap internet or free internet will have to be given to everyone.
Keep the current payment platform for those that want that, add subscription to one of us that have the content and don't care.
Most people seem to be missing the point... People have payed for this already. In the form of hard cover books, Roll20, fantasy grounds.. It's been expensive already... Yes, yes.. new platform....same content. It's information I'm talking about. Same content without even the functionality of Roll20 as a VTT, (players where asking me for a board when we played I might add). So what, you get a few easier characters to roll up. Integration is a bit better... And yes, I do like what they have done so far. It's neat. But neat does not or will not open my pocket book to content that I own and can play free on other mediums. And from what I've been hearing, neither will a lot of others.
And I get you guys defending this are gun-ho...And that's fine and great. I'm not telling you not to buy this product, I'm cautioning what I'm hearing and it mirrors my own feelings of what's driving me away from this product.
Arguing with me on my point when I already stated this is an interesting and potentially awesome platform with potential, is kind of stupid. I'm telling you as a consumer what would make me invest in this. I want to invest in this... But I and many others will not pay for those books again on top of a subscription. Not when we have invested the same money or more for the EXACT SAME content. So those of you who want to just throw money blindly at them is fine. I'm saying they should add another level to their already ridiculous amount of money collection set-ups to make players like myself commit to this platform as well.You poeple can buy and do as you please, if this works for you that's great! But others are not you... Does that make sense?
This isn't rocket science. By actually agreeing with me and others with similar concerns you are helping yourselves, you actually increase the player base here. When that happens, the site grows larger and more revenue comes in through other means. Perhaps after a year I do want to invest more in a PROVEN product. People don't want to invest large sums of money into something they don't own or what they already own, or what they fear might be obsolete in a week. What people will do is pay 8 - 10 a month in subs though. They don't own the content, but have access to all the content. Netflix.
Buying into this also means that you more or less can only play with other people from D&D Beyond. So, you pay all this money and then can't find a group. what then? Or what if your players want to use roll 20 and you want to use this? So you buy the subscription... Now you have to buy the books in order to get the most out of your subscription.
Yes, you can play free... But do you want to play the same thief over and over with only 2 feats? probably not. That free stuff is to wet your whistle and get you hungry for more... It's human nature and good marketing strategy. It's also why you will pay 3 to 4 times the cost on micro transactions for weapons and classes. It's why a lot of other games are free :P They make bazillions on micro transactions. So I see why curse wants to do it. But.... This is a different beast. This isn't Dota. At least in dota I play for free. 100%. Not in any way shape or form is my game different from the guy who dropped 400 bucks. But they still make bazillions... why? Because I am not pushed on the sale. I do it when I am comfortable. When I am comfortable and confident, I put money down.
go the Netflix route.. I have no problem paying 8.99 to netflix each month and I can pretty much tell you the same would happen here. someone mentioned steam. Steam is a graveyard of wasted idea's and money thrown down the toilet on start up games and applications... So please, don't pretend every venture makes it out of the gates. Do I believe Curse and this will last a while... Sure... Will I still buy information I own...No.
But I would pay a sub to use the information and come and go as I please instead of a huge start up cost. And no, a lot of players are not in dedicated games... The bloody forum is filled with people looking for games. You don't have a person join your game and then tell them they owe you 76 cents for your sub. That is also ********.
So when - D&D BEYOND beyond, opens up next month (sponsored by Wizards) are we all then supposed to pay AGAIN for every book on top of another subscription? No.
Are other tactics to basically fill your screen with adds so you pretty much have to pay for a sub too? haha, that would be funny. "Ortik...You swing your mighty great axe! You cleave through flesh and bone and sinew..and...???..You chop off the head of a guy on a horse? no..no...he's on a boat..no..DAMN YOU OLD SPICE!!! DAMN YOU!!!!"
Great platform, looks polished. But with only promises of actual DM tools, paying for information I own already (and will not own if purchased here) on top of subs.... Hard sell guys.
Well, that is just how I feel...Others feel different and that is fine. I'm happy you like what is here, I'm happy you will purchase the content again. And this is a good site. The work is good. Anyone who has not already invested heavily with this type of content or new users will definitely benefit. But as for people like myself... Not so much. And that is fine too.
I'm arguing this much because I do believe this can be a good thing. If I didn't care, I wouldn't argue. But again. I'm just stating what might help push players on board with this. The end result is you agree, or don't agree.
I get where you're coming from. For me personally, while I've used Roll20 for running a few one-shot games and will probably use it for an upcoming campaign with some friends out of state, I've yet to purchase any D&D content from the site. I don't run pre-published campaigns, and even if I did, I rarely use gridded maps. If I need a rules look-up, I've got the books in physical form while I play. To me, DnDBeyond is exactly what I want it to be - an easy character creator (even using SRD it's already saved me time when creating my few NPCs requiring stats). And I can easily have a tab open for quick rules reference while using R20. I've used R20 for years without ever paying a dime, and unless they were to go sub-only don't see myself ever paying for anything.
I like the purchase access to the larger compendium model we're looking at right now. One time payment, and the content is mine. That perfectly fits what I want from here.
At the same time, I would love to see a higher subscription for full access for those of you who would like it. Anything that gets more people on board is great. I'd hate to see such a thing take away the one-time purchase, though, and I could certainly see setting up to allow both being a pain. If it's at all possible for both a higher sub model and a purchase model to co-exist, great. If not, purchase is the better choice for me.
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There are many items in the database that are not from the basic rules or SRD, but you cannot see their content or use them in the character builder until you've unlocked their source books.
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This is a tough one. I am a huge DnD fanboy from way back. I have been trying to help with the site. The pricing though... not a fan.
I am OK with the subscription model. I am not really pleased with having to re-purchase the same content again... at least at full price. A few months ago when I decided to get back into Dungeons and Dragons I purchased the Players Handbook and the Dungeon Masters Guide. Spent a total of $66.22 from Amazon to get these books. There are reasons why it is set up like this. Same reasons Roll 20, Fantasy Grounds, etc all charge similar fees. WoTC. I am not privy to any of the details but I assume they set the prices. I was hoping this would be different because it felt like it was going to be a part of the WoTC offerings.
Everyone points out it is an expensive hobby which is obviously true even without the addition of this site's paywall features. I will continue to use this site and help to contribute code whenever I come up with an idea (whether they use it or not, up to them. :) ) I cannot however afford to repurchase books I just purchased.
I was hoping the subscription model would be more akin to Netflix or Hulu. Ie:
$7.99 a month gives you access to all the content but with ads
$11.99 a month gives you an ad-free experience
As for those who say "What is stopping people from just printing the entire books out..." Really? It took me seconds to find illegal copies of the books online. Be much easier to print these. The books here are not presented as single looong documents, they are presented in a database format, they are meant to be clicked through. If someone wants to go to the trouble of clicking on each spell, item, monster and print them all... more power to them.
As for adventures and content that is generated new. Have those as a separate fee. An adventure might be an extra $3.99 to rent it for a week or something along those lines. With other adventures listed as "Free for the month" so people can see some adventures as part of their subscription but if they want the "new releases" they can get pay a little extra and see them now.
Marav(Druid/Ranger) -Storm Kings ThunderDontontion(Rogue/Warlock) - Storm Kings Thunder
DM - Stormpoint Mountains :: A Critical Role Adventure ( Map of Trunau )
People seem to be forgetting that D&D beyond is more than just a compendium of rules content like a book. It is a tool set as well. If all you wanted was the rules content, then just use the books you've already purchased. It is a separate product altogether. D&D Beyond is a tool and the rules content is not Curse's to just give away. The prices they offer are heavily discounted from the MSRP already and so are very reasonable. And I'll gladly pay for the content I need to use in the character builder, and possibly campaign manager.
Feature Requests || Homebrew FAQ || Pricing FAQ || Hardcovers FAQ || Snippet Codes || Tooltips
DDB Guides & FAQs, Class Guides, Character Builds, Game Guides, Useful Websites, and WOTC Resources
Silvva... the toolkit is what everyone is willing to pay for, no one wants Curse to not make money on this. No one wants to pay for the same content we already purchased we are very willing to pay for the toolkit. I also will gladly pay for the content to use the character builder as well... in face... been there did that. I am glad others are ok with this model, it just doesn't work for my purposes sadly. I will continue to support the site, but just with the 6 character limit (honestly that is plenty for me) and with the current content.
Sirdig: For the first week they are on sale for $19.99 then they pop back up to $29.99.
I am not attacking Curse nor WoTC. I hope this product does well. I enjoy it, but I personally cannot afford to rebuy content. This is the same reason why I passed on all the other services out there.
Marav(Druid/Ranger) -Storm Kings ThunderDontontion(Rogue/Warlock) - Storm Kings Thunder
DM - Stormpoint Mountains :: A Critical Role Adventure ( Map of Trunau )
Someone correct if I am wrong, but this is what I am seeing from everything here.
There are three tiers of subscription.
There is also a way to purchase digital materials.
If I want to own WOTC materials that have been digitally incorporated into DNDBeyond at launch, such as the Players Handbook or Curse of Strahd, then I can purchase them one time and have access from then on. Curse is also going to be selling portions of these items in case I only want certain portions of the rules, like backgrounds, certain spells, or certain monsters. If I have a Master subscription as well, then any material I purchase this way can be shared with accounts associated with my campaign.
So I could go on unsubscribed and just buy sourcebook materials as I see fit, homebrewing as much of the information as I like from those sourcebook materials for my personal use. (I can’t publish it for others on DNDBeyond because it’s WOTC’s IP.) Or I could subscribe and have all the characters I want that can use homebrew materials or sourcebook materials I purchase. Or I could subscribe at the highest level and share my materials with a number of other accounts.
DNDBeyond is an attempt to enhance D&D game play around the table - at least for now. It’s supplementary. I have gotten along thus far without it. (Full disclosure: Since March I have most certainly NOT gotten along without it. It has enhanced my planning as a DM and game play as I quickly look up things at the table. It most definitely HAS enhanced my game play.) I can use my books that I bought and character sheets I’ve made just fine. Or, since I’ve bought into the Fantasy Grounds or Roll20 environment and have digital access to the materials through those services, and if I ran my games through a virtual tabletop, maybe I don’t need to buy it all again in a different format.
As a side note regarding Fantasy Grounds and DNDBeyond… I consider myself fortunate. My gaming group is face-to-face. We’ve been playing together (some of us) since the early 80s. So I don’t really need a VTT. But I have tried to use Fantasy Grounds as a resource to enhance prep and game play for my group, and I gave up. Thus far, and for my purposes, DNDBeyond has proven so much easier to use. Your experiences and your needs may be different. Ultimately, choose the tool that works for you.
Be careful what you Wish for... your DM may just give it to you!
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Just a reminder for the community:
On this forum, it is NOT allowed to talk about illegal PDF of official content.
Thank you for you collaboration.
I think both sides of the argument (re: books) are mistakenly using the phrase "purchase books" as there is no digital books being offered for purchase at this stage.
Instead, the model is more akin to a DLC / Expansion model where you are paying a one-time fee to unlock access to content from these books within DNDBeyond's toolset (monster, spell, character builders, etc) and are not receiving a digital version of these books akin to a PDF, ePUB or HTML.
Keeping this in mind may help focus the discussion on whether the community feels $XX for accessing this content within the toolset matches with the subjective value it delivers which seems to be the hidden debate at play here where some feel the value matches the price while others do not.
Likely, once the full product is available and the full details are released and open for review for the Master Tier, Offline Mode, Twitch, etc we'll all be able get a better feel of what the actual product is and a better understanding of how everything works together. Until then, we're debating value of a product without being able to know in detail what that final product will be outside of bullet points and what we've seen in the Beta.
Looking forward to more detail being shared and having an opportunity to see how things work together!
Most people seem to be missing the point... People have payed for this already. In the form of hard cover books, Roll20, fantasy grounds.. It's been expensive already... Yes, yes.. new platform....same content. It's information I'm talking about. Same content without even the functionality of Roll20 as a VTT, (players where asking me for a board when we played I might add). So what, you get a few easier characters to roll up. Integration is a bit better... And yes, I do like what they have done so far. It's neat. But neat does not or will not open my pocket book to content that I own and can play free on other mediums. And from what I've been hearing, neither will a lot of others.
And I get you guys defending this are gun-ho...And that's fine and great. I'm not telling you not to buy this product, I'm cautioning what I'm hearing and it mirrors my own feelings of what's driving me away from this product.
Arguing with me on my point when I already stated this is an interesting and potentially awesome platform with potential, is kind of stupid. I'm telling you as a consumer what would make me invest in this. I want to invest in this... But I and many others will not pay for those books again on top of a subscription. Not when we have invested the same money or more for the EXACT SAME content. So those of you who want to just throw money blindly at them is fine. I'm saying they should add another level to their already ridiculous amount of money collection set-ups to make players like myself commit to this platform as well.You poeple can buy and do as you please, if this works for you that's great! But others are not you... Does that make sense?
This isn't rocket science. By actually agreeing with me and others with similar concerns you are helping yourselves, you actually increase the player base here. When that happens, the site grows larger and more revenue comes in through other means. Perhaps after a year I do want to invest more in a PROVEN product. People don't want to invest large sums of money into something they don't own or what they already own, or what they fear might be obsolete in a week. What people will do is pay 8 - 10 a month in subs though. They don't own the content, but have access to all the content. Netflix.
Buying into this also means that you more or less can only play with other people from D&D Beyond. So, you pay all this money and then can't find a group. what then? Or what if your players want to use roll 20 and you want to use this? So you buy the subscription... Now you have to buy the books in order to get the most out of your subscription.
Yes, you can play free... But do you want to play the same thief over and over with only 2 feats? probably not. That free stuff is to wet your whistle and get you hungry for more... It's human nature and good marketing strategy. It's also why you will pay 3 to 4 times the cost on micro transactions for weapons and classes. It's why a lot of other games are free :P They make bazillions on micro transactions. So I see why curse wants to do it. But.... This is a different beast. This isn't Dota. At least in dota I play for free. 100%. Not in any way shape or form is my game different from the guy who dropped 400 bucks. But they still make bazillions... why? Because I am not pushed on the sale. I do it when I am comfortable. When I am comfortable and confident, I put money down.
go the Netflix route.. I have no problem paying 8.99 to netflix each month and I can pretty much tell you the same would happen here. someone mentioned steam. Steam is a graveyard of wasted idea's and money thrown down the toilet on start up games and applications... So please, don't pretend every venture makes it out of the gates. Do I believe Curse and this will last a while... Sure... Will I still buy information I own...No.
But I would pay a sub to use the information and come and go as I please instead of a huge start up cost. And no, a lot of players are not in dedicated games... The bloody forum is filled with people looking for games. You don't have a person join your game and then tell them they owe you 76 cents for your sub. That is also ********.
So when - D&D BEYOND beyond, opens up next month (sponsored by Wizards) are we all then supposed to pay AGAIN for every book on top of another subscription? No.
Are other tactics to basically fill your screen with adds so you pretty much have to pay for a sub too? haha, that would be funny. "Ortik...You swing your mighty great axe! You cleave through flesh and bone and sinew..and...???..You chop off the head of a guy on a horse? no..no...he's on a boat..no..DAMN YOU OLD SPICE!!! DAMN YOU!!!!"
Great platform, looks polished. But with only promises of actual DM tools, paying for information I own already (and will not own if purchased here) on top of subs.... Hard sell guys.
Well, that is just how I feel...Others feel different and that is fine. I'm happy you like what is here, I'm happy you will purchase the content again. And this is a good site. The work is good. Anyone who has not already invested heavily with this type of content or new users will definitely benefit. But as for people like myself... Not so much. And that is fine too.
I'm arguing this much because I do believe this can be a good thing. If I didn't care, I wouldn't argue. But again. I'm just stating what might help push players on board with this. The end result is you agree, or don't agree.
The only way I could see a subscription method working to unlock all content is to remove offline accessibility to that content. Like netflix, you'd be required to access that content exclusively online.
I'm ok with that, but offline access has been one of the biggest selling points so far.
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Which also fine. I'm not telling curse to scrap that platform that is offered already, if it works for people, roll with it. I'm saying add another layer for those that don't care. Or have the content already. You clearly have the data base online set up already. People seem confused by this... keep what's here and offered... but to get more people, offer different methods.
I use the books at home while in bed or on the couch. Or I have access to the internet... the intern t is free al it's everywhere you go now. PEople are almost never offline now.
I'm Not saying change what you have now... people are confused by this. Im saying add the option for those that don't care to have an offline option on top of what's here. When I am home, im online. Or since I own the content, I usually sit on the couch or in bed with the actual book.
Besides, the internet is everywhere now. People are almost always online. In a few years, whole cities will be planning to be online always. It's true. More and more banks are going online only. Which means cheap internet or free internet will have to be given to everyone.
Keep the current payment platform for those that want that, add subscription to one of us that have the content and don't care.
I like the purchase access to the larger compendium model we're looking at right now. One time payment, and the content is mine. That perfectly fits what I want from here.