Is there any way to perform the Smite Spells with an unarmed attack?
OR
Is there a way to make an unarmed strike count as a melee weapon attack?
I was playing around with a Paladin/Monk idea, but all of the spite spells specify they need a melee weapon attack. I don't want to take a monk weapon either, so I'm hoping there's something I'm missing that lets me do it with an unarmed strike.
Thank you very much! I tried searching but didn't have any luck.
Your username name makes me think you'll appreciate that I was working on a build to imitate Scar from FullMetal Alchemist as an Oathbreaker Paladin/Monk.
I always pictured him more as a full metal panic kinda guy. Or Full Metal Jacket... how many Full Metals are there?
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"Where words fail, swords prevail. Where blood is spilled, my cup is filled" -Cartaphilus
"I have found the answer to the meaning of life. You ask me what the answer is? You already know what the answer to life is. You fear it more than the strike of a viper, the ravages of disease, the ire of a lover. The answer is always death. But death is a gentle mistress with a sweet embrace, and you owe her a debt of restitution. Life is not a gift, it is a loan."
Divine Smite and Smite spells other than Wrathful Smite are intended to be used with a melee weapon: they all reference your weapon in some way (e.g. "your weapon rings with thunder"). Unarmed strikes are melee weapon attacks, but they're not weapons.
That said, it doesn't break much for your DM to let you use those abilities without a weapon; that requirement is mainly there for story reasons (Paladins traditionally use melee weapons in combat.)
I always pictured him more as a full metal panic kinda guy. Or Full Metal Jacket... how many Full Metals are there?
It's Full Metal Jacket, I'm old.
When I was in high school I decided I should have a more "masculine" online name, because teenage boys are teenage boys, and changed it from "Fluffy-Bunny-Boots" to "Full-Metal-Bunny". That was back in the 90s, so before Full Metal Panic or Full Metal Alchemist.
Divine Smite and Smite spells other than Wrathful Smite are intended to be used with a melee weapon: they all reference your weapon in some way (e.g. "your weapon rings with thunder"). Unarmed strikes are melee weapon attacks, but they're not weapons.
That said, it doesn't break much for your DM to let you use those abilities without a weapon; that requirement is mainly there for story reasons (Paladins traditionally use melee weapons in combat.)
Don't forget that Banishing Smite works with ranged weapons as well as melee.
Can a paladin use Divine Smite when they hit using an unarmed strike? No. Divine Smite isn’t intended to work with unarmed strikes. Divine Smite does work with a melee weapon attack, and an unarmed strike can be used to make such an attack. But the text of Divine Smite also refers to the “weapon’s damage,” and an unarmed strike isn’t a weapon. If a DM decides to override this rule, no imbalance is created. Tying Divine Smite to weapons was a thematic choice on our part—paladins being traditionally associated with weapons. It was not a game balance choice.
I mean can´t u give the Paladin "Brass-Knuckles" or a "Knuckel-Duster"? And i tried to give it a cool name like "The-Brass-Knuckles-of-Glorious-Hitting" to make them sound more edgy. But my english skills and my lazienes hexed my post.
A DM I have had this discussion with a player and eventually told him he can only smite with his bare handed attacks if he has the ability to use it as a fighting style, meaning he needs to have the "Tavern Brawler Feat", "Unarmed Fighting" Fighting Style, "Martial Arts", or have a natural weapon for his character's hands. He can't just use his normal Unarmed Strike's straight 1+STR damage.
It honestly makes the most sense to us, since it then means you're actually proficient with fighting without a weapon and not just throwing haymakers, and you have to earn having the ability to do so. We're toying with the idea that there are consequences to having radiant energy being channeled through your bare hands, but any good paladin should already be wearing gauntlets as well.
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"I don't give a rat's f***ing ass how big it is, it can still bleed and I'm not dealing with this s*** a minute longer!!!" -Brass Khorne, Dragonborn Rogue/Fighter Battlemaster.
"Welcome to the Weeping Willow! Ale, rooms, or both?...Yes, dogs are fine, why does everyone ask that?" -Lucky Shot, Tabaxi Eldritch Knight and Innkeeper
"Greetings, I'm Sir Dexter of House Barkton. What do I do? I'm a Good Boy." -Dexter, Awakened Dog Rogue and knight of the realm.
A DM I have had this discussion with a player and eventually told him he can only smite with his bare handed attacks if he has the ability to use it as a fighting style, meaning he needs to have the "Tavern Brawler Feat", "Unarmed Fighting" Fighting Style, "Martial Arts", or have a natural weapon for his character's hands. He can't just use his normal Unarmed Strike's straight 1+STR damage.
It honestly makes the most sense to us, since it then means you're actually proficient with fighting without a weapon and not just throwing haymakers, and you have to earn having the ability to do so. We're toying with the idea that there are consequences to having radiant energy being channeled through your bare hands, but any good paladin should already be wearing gauntlets as well.
I agree with this ruling. If one of my players wants to make a Barbadin or a Monkadin or really any "Unarmed Paladin," I'd only allow it if they have some kind of "Unarmed Fighting" ability. They have to have trained in hand combat in order to smite with their fists.
The idea that people believe there is such a thing as an "official ruling" is indicative of everything that is wrong with current D&D culture.
If you are the DM, you do as you think makes sense.
If you are a player, and you think a rule doesn't make sense to you, then make it make sense to you, and negotiate with your DM.
Well, when I read questions like these, I tend to wonder if the original poster is really asking if there is anything game-breaking if they choose to ignore an "official rule." Like, maybe there is some great imbalance that would need correction later on. (And there's nothing worse than being granted something by a generous GM only to have it taken away once they realize the consequence.)
I have a feeling the OP had already decided to let their pally punch and smite (lord knows that would look great!) but probably really just wanted some other "eyes" on the topic just in case.
For the OP: we had a pally/monk and we let her smite with her fists (once per turn). It never got outlandish and she was a Monk 8/Pally 3 before we stopped that campaign.
(We also gave her 2 battle master maneuvers for free because it's absolutely criminal that monks don't get access to something similar!)
The relevant text in the rules that addresses the question
That this particular rule was grounded in thematic purpose
That the DM can overrule that
It wouldn't break anything mechanically to do so
It does not attempt to create any new rules or assert how to do something. It's only there to explain the intent behind the choice of words used in the initial rule.
If you're angry about an increased level of transparency for the process through which the rules were decided, you may just really really want to be angry about something and don't have any better targets.
Is there any way to perform the Smite Spells with an unarmed attack?
OR
Is there a way to make an unarmed strike count as a melee weapon attack?
I was playing around with a Paladin/Monk idea, but all of the spite spells specify they need a melee weapon attack. I don't want to take a monk weapon either, so I'm hoping there's something I'm missing that lets me do it with an unarmed strike.
Short Answer: Yes. You can perform Smites with unarmed attacks and they count as melee weapon attacks, but unarmed strikes are not melee weapons.
I recommend you read this Thread: https://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/dungeons-dragons-discussion/rules-game-mechanics/24402-unarmed-strikes
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2017/09/02/errata-says-unarmed-doesnt-count-as-weapons-sage-advice-says-they-are-considered-melee-weapon-attacks-clarify/
http://media.wizards.com/2015/downloads/dnd/PH_Errata_1.1.pdf
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/06/15/melee-weapon-unarmed-strike/
Thank you very much! I tried searching but didn't have any luck.
Your username name makes me think you'll appreciate that I was working on a build to imitate Scar from FullMetal Alchemist as an Oathbreaker Paladin/Monk.
I always pictured him more as a full metal panic kinda guy. Or Full Metal Jacket... how many Full Metals are there?
"Where words fail, swords prevail. Where blood is spilled, my cup is filled" -Cartaphilus
"I have found the answer to the meaning of life. You ask me what the answer is? You already know what the answer to life is. You fear it more than the strike of a viper, the ravages of disease, the ire of a lover. The answer is always death. But death is a gentle mistress with a sweet embrace, and you owe her a debt of restitution. Life is not a gift, it is a loan."
Divine Smite and Smite spells other than Wrathful Smite are intended to be used with a melee weapon: they all reference your weapon in some way (e.g. "your weapon rings with thunder"). Unarmed strikes are melee weapon attacks, but they're not weapons.
That said, it doesn't break much for your DM to let you use those abilities without a weapon; that requirement is mainly there for story reasons (Paladins traditionally use melee weapons in combat.)
It's Full Metal Jacket, I'm old.
When I was in high school I decided I should have a more "masculine" online name, because teenage boys are teenage boys, and changed it from "Fluffy-Bunny-Boots" to "Full-Metal-Bunny". That was back in the 90s, so before Full Metal Panic or Full Metal Alchemist.
Don't forget that Banishing Smite works with ranged weapons as well as melee.
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Can´t you just give your Paladin "Brass-Knuckles-Hitting-Glorious" ?
I have no idea what that means, but your DM can homebrew absolutely anything.
There is also an official ruling in Sage Advice Compendium about this very question https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/sage-advice/sage-advice-compendium
I mean can´t u give the Paladin "Brass-Knuckles" or a "Knuckel-Duster"?
And i tried to give it a cool name like "The-Brass-Knuckles-of-Glorious-Hitting" to make them sound more edgy.
But my english skills and my lazienes hexed my post.
The idea that people believe there is such a thing as an "official ruling" is indicative of everything that is wrong with current D&D culture.
If you are the DM, you do as you think makes sense.
If you are a player, and you think a rule doesn't make sense to you, then make it make sense to you, and negotiate with your DM.
A DM I have had this discussion with a player and eventually told him he can only smite with his bare handed attacks if he has the ability to use it as a fighting style, meaning he needs to have the "Tavern Brawler Feat", "Unarmed Fighting" Fighting Style, "Martial Arts", or have a natural weapon for his character's hands. He can't just use his normal Unarmed Strike's straight 1+STR damage.
It honestly makes the most sense to us, since it then means you're actually proficient with fighting without a weapon and not just throwing haymakers, and you have to earn having the ability to do so. We're toying with the idea that there are consequences to having radiant energy being channeled through your bare hands, but any good paladin should already be wearing gauntlets as well.
"I don't give a rat's f***ing ass how big it is, it can still bleed and I'm not dealing with this s*** a minute longer!!!" -Brass Khorne, Dragonborn Rogue/Fighter Battlemaster.
"Welcome to the Weeping Willow! Ale, rooms, or both?...Yes, dogs are fine, why does everyone ask that?" -Lucky Shot, Tabaxi Eldritch Knight and Innkeeper
"Greetings, I'm Sir Dexter of House Barkton. What do I do? I'm a Good Boy." -Dexter, Awakened Dog Rogue and knight of the realm.
I don't know why you see something wrong official ruling is the term used by WoTC in its own D&D FAQ reference document.
The DMcan always rule any way wanted though.
I agree with this ruling. If one of my players wants to make a Barbadin or a Monkadin or really any "Unarmed Paladin," I'd only allow it if they have some kind of "Unarmed Fighting" ability. They have to have trained in hand combat in order to smite with their fists.
Yes this is home-brew. But I like it. Fight me.
"Official rulings on how to interpret rules are made here in the Sage Advice Compendium." That means official rulings exist. There is such a thing as an official ruling. No-one is going to come over and force you to follow them, but you're contradicting objective reality when you claim they don't exist in the first place.
Well, when I read questions like these, I tend to wonder if the original poster is really asking if there is anything game-breaking if they choose to ignore an "official rule." Like, maybe there is some great imbalance that would need correction later on. (And there's nothing worse than being granted something by a generous GM only to have it taken away once they realize the consequence.)
I have a feeling the OP had already decided to let their pally punch and smite (lord knows that would look great!) but probably really just wanted some other "eyes" on the topic just in case.
For the OP: we had a pally/monk and we let her smite with her fists (once per turn). It never got outlandish and she was a Monk 8/Pally 3 before we stopped that campaign.
(We also gave her 2 battle master maneuvers for free because it's absolutely criminal that monks don't get access to something similar!)
The ruling explicitly says:
It does not attempt to create any new rules or assert how to do something. It's only there to explain the intent behind the choice of words used in the initial rule.
If you're angry about an increased level of transparency for the process through which the rules were decided, you may just really really want to be angry about something and don't have any better targets.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm