I personally believe that any arguments against the lineage ASIs on the basis of "power balance" is irrelevant, just like your so-maligned Sorcerer-Warlock, Polearm-Sentinel, etc. (which don't even work), and the changing ASIs actually generally makes power levels lower. Min-maxing is not inherently evil, and it's not a bad thing really!
I agree. I think changing which ability score that is increased is totally fine!
Uh, as far as I have heard, "notorious for having a bad ASI.", "However, the same is not true for min-maxing purposes. For instance, you say that half orc is more meant for melee than a drow. True, but many min-maxers get up to shenanigans with racial features and don't use them for the intended purpose. So for instance, I've seen min-maxers use half-orc's relentless endurance, not to make them a better melee combatant, but to do a crazy shenanigan involving breaking a staff of the magi to kill everyone around them, then avoid dying using relentless endurance.", "make min-maxing a bit easier. ", to briefly quote your bigoted, misinformed ideas.
Ouch... That's actually kinda insulting
Those are not contradictory. It does make min-maxing slightly easier. That does not mean it's bad. To quote you, "Min-maxing is not inherently evil, and it's not a bad thing really!". It's usually just be slightly annoying, mainly if the DM doesn't know your min-maxing.
I will just add - the staff of the magi will outright kill a half-orc, unless they have more than 400 hp, which is not achievable by normal means.
If it's full charges sure. If you say have 200 hp (not that extreme for d10 and d12 hit die classes at high levels), then it needs to deal 400 damage to kill you outright. That means you could potentially be doing 384 damage to everyone around you, and still survive. That's fairly op. And you can have even more than 200 hp with d12 hit die or just extreme constitution (with 20 con and d10 hit die you will average 214.5 hp if rolling, and will have 228 is using fixed hp.)
Sorry, I won't say anymore on this topic. I don't want a flame war or anything like that.
(Oh, and Sorcerer-Warlock, Polearm-Sentinel does actually kinda work. I played it with some other people playing min-maxed builds so we could defeat multiple challenge rating 20+ monsters at once... And we could pump out hundreds of damage every round constantly.)
I will also add the Sorlock loses 1 sorcery point each conversion due to stupid sorcerer rules, so you actively lose when you try to "optimize".
And, yes, I really will shut up now.
I'm not even going to really reply to this. I meant it as an off-hand comment... I said what I needed to say on this (see what happened when I tried this).
I will just add - the staff of the magi will outright kill a half-orc, unless they have more than 400 hp, which is not achievable by normal means.
I made a test character with over 400 hit points before. I could have gotten even more if I gave it a berserker axe. It was a hill dwarf, but it is still possible for a half orc to have over 400 hit points.
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I will just add - the staff of the magi will outright kill a half-orc, unless they have more than 400 hp, which is not achievable by normal means.
I made a test character with over 400 hit points before. I could have gotten even more if I gave it a berserker axe. It was a hill dwarf, but it is still possible for a half orc to have over 400 hit points.
Dragonslayer9, I don't think Yamana_Eajii wants to continue the argument/debate.
I will just add - the staff of the magi will outright kill a half-orc, unless they have more than 400 hp, which is not achievable by normal means.
I made a test character with over 400 hit points before. I could have gotten even more if I gave it a berserker axe. It was a hill dwarf, but it is still possible for a half orc to have over 400 hit points.
Dragonslayer9, I don't think Yamana_Eajii wants to continue the argument/debate.
I just wanted to say that it is possible. Sorry about that.
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I updated the race in another post. Is that still your opinion?
Yes.
Let's look at another race with a metric ton of features. The wood elf:
Darkvision
Perception proficiency
Fey ancestry
Trance
Weapon training
+ 5 speed
You can hide while lightly obscured in specific circumstances.
Let's put it next to the Thri-Kreen:
Darkvision
+10 speed
Standing Leap
Unarmored defence
Advantage on Stealth rolls
Bite
Arms
Sleepless
You may have rolled 2 of these in 1 feature, but they're still distinct advantages. Now let's see what we can compare.
We cross off darkvision and the inability to be put to sleep.
Wood elf gets 1 more ASI. This is good, but not that important on SAD builds.
Sleepless is better than Trance. Being able to keep watch all night for free is really good and probably shouldn't be on a race to begin with (looking at you, warforged) because it eliminates a component of the game. Wood elf might take 2 watches, but not all of them.
10 speed > 5 speed
Advantage on a skill stacks with proficiency. Proficiency doesn't stack with proficiency and requires multiple levels in rogue/bard or a feat to get expertise (which Thri-kreen can still do)
We can't directly compare Bite, Arms, Standing Leap and Unarmored defence to weapon training, fey ancestry's advantage on charmed or a very specific hiding buff... But let's just say that weapon training is hardly ever relevant, mask of the wild is extremely situational (A.) you need to be in natural terrain and B.) for some reason there isn't any wall to hide behind C.) You're probably still dropping prone to take advantage of it so any movement you might've gotten out of this is reduced significantly.) Advantage on charm saving throws is really nice though.
Unarmored defence is a fantastic trait to have, I've previously laid out why I don't like paralysed (even at a low chance this can randomly delete targets because you're playing in a party) but poison is a good ailment to inflict also, arms lets you hold a focus and a weapon and a shield without speccing into warcaster (yes, I know focuses don't have weapon traits like light assigned to them but a wand weighs as much as a shortsword.) Leap is kind of situational also but it can come up.
So IMO, this is substantially better than a wood elf, which is already a really, really good race. But here's the thing: the only feature by itself I have an issue with is Bite. The other features only become OP because there's so many good ones stacked on top of each other.
That is terrifying. If an attack has a range of 0 feet it usually specifies one target in its space.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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You can only bite in this way once per turn, and only a number of times equal to your proficiency bonus, and you regain the ability to do so when you finish a long rest.
Changes:
Re-added the “once-per-turn”
changed recharge from short/long rest to long rest
You know the yuan-ti pureblood and how it’s so OP? The race is pretty close in power level to it. Change it to a 1d6 bonus and it would be fine.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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This isn't actually a signature, just something I copy and paste onto the bottom of all my posts. Or is it? Yep, it is. Or is it..? I’m a hobbit, and the master cranial imploder of the "Oops, I Accidently Destroyed Someone's Brain" cult. Extended sig. I'm actually in Limbo, it says I'm in Mechanus because that's where I get my WiFi from. Please don't tell the modrons, they're still angry from the 'Spawning Stone' fiasco. No connection to Dragonslayer8 other than knowing them in real life.
Fey as a creature type is widely accepted to be absolutely insane in power levels. Fey Ancestry is a reasonable alternative that is still hugely great.
If it's full charges sure. If you say have 200 hp (not that extreme for d10 and d12 hit die classes at high levels), then it needs to deal 400 damage to kill you outright. That means you could potentially be doing 384 damage to everyone around you, and still survive. That's fairly op. And you can have even more than 200 hp with d12 hit die or just extreme constitution (with 20 con and d10 hit die you will average 214.5 hp if rolling, and will have 228 is using fixed hp.)
Sorry, I won't say anymore on this topic. I don't want a flame war or anything like that.
I am an average mathematics enjoyer.
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I'm not even going to really reply to this. I meant it as an off-hand comment... I said what I needed to say on this (see what happened when I tried this).
I am an average mathematics enjoyer.
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Let’s not debate these things. The question is, is the race balanced?
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Yep, sorry. (sorry to you too Yamana_Eajii)
I think so? I'm really bad at races.
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Not in the slightest. See my previous post.
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I updated the race in another post. Is that still your opinion?
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I made a test character with over 400 hit points before. I could have gotten even more if I gave it a berserker axe. It was a hill dwarf, but it is still possible for a half orc to have over 400 hit points.
This isn't actually a signature, just something I copy and paste onto the bottom of all my posts. Or is it? Yep, it is. Or is it..? I’m a hobbit, and the master cranial imploder of the "Oops, I Accidently Destroyed Someone's Brain" cult. Extended sig. I'm actually in Limbo, it says I'm in Mechanus because that's where I get my WiFi from. Please don't tell the modrons, they're still angry from the 'Spawning Stone' fiasco.
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Dragonslayer9, I don't think Yamana_Eajii wants to continue the argument/debate.
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I just wanted to say that it is possible. Sorry about that.
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Yes.
Let's look at another race with a metric ton of features. The wood elf:
Let's put it next to the Thri-Kreen:
You may have rolled 2 of these in 1 feature, but they're still distinct advantages. Now let's see what we can compare.
We can't directly compare Bite, Arms, Standing Leap and Unarmored defence to weapon training, fey ancestry's advantage on charmed or a very specific hiding buff... But let's just say that weapon training is hardly ever relevant, mask of the wild is extremely situational (A.) you need to be in natural terrain and B.) for some reason there isn't any wall to hide behind C.) You're probably still dropping prone to take advantage of it so any movement you might've gotten out of this is reduced significantly.) Advantage on charm saving throws is really nice though.
Unarmored defence is a fantastic trait to have, I've previously laid out why I don't like paralysed (even at a low chance this can randomly delete targets because you're playing in a party) but poison is a good ailment to inflict also, arms lets you hold a focus and a weapon and a shield without speccing into warcaster (yes, I know focuses don't have weapon traits like light assigned to them but a wand weighs as much as a shortsword.) Leap is kind of situational also but it can come up.
So IMO, this is substantially better than a wood elf, which is already a really, really good race. But here's the thing: the only feature by itself I have an issue with is Bite. The other features only become OP because there's so many good ones stacked on top of each other.
Homebrew creations:
Path of the Feral Trance Barbarian Class | Thread
Wyrmforge Artificer Class | Thread
May I just say that the advantage only applies to hiding?
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…have a nightmare (and also leave feedback)
Umbrella Spider
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That is terrifying. If an attack has a range of 0 feet it usually specifies one target in its space.
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Amended Clause for the Bite of my Thri-Kreen:
You can only bite in this way once per turn, and only a number of times equal to your proficiency bonus, and you regain the ability to do so when you finish a long rest.
Changes:
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“Bet you can’t make a monster and make a race based on it”
”Selkies are just merfolk reflavored”
”Selkies aren’t cool”
none of these are actually things people said to me but regardless
Selkie (Monster)
Selkie (Race)
please leave feedback on this
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You know the yuan-ti pureblood and how it’s so OP? The race is pretty close in power level to it. Change it to a 1d6 bonus and it would be fine.
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1d6 bonus to what? Magic Resistance? Magic Resistance isn’t only on Yuan-Ti, it’s also on the Satyr, and that, to me, is a balanced race.
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I don’t have the Theros book, so I didn’t know that. Maybe it is balanced, I don’t know
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Fey as a creature type is widely accepted to be absolutely insane in power levels. Fey Ancestry is a reasonable alternative that is still hugely great.
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Empowerment of Vitality
Thief of Hearts
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