I would have had the Monk's martial die start with a d8 and end with a d20. And start with 4 DP. Why not? Wizards start with four or five 1st spells plus cantrips.
I would have had the Monk's martial die start with a d8 and end with a d20. And start with 4 DP. Why not? Wizards start with four or five 1st spells plus cantrips.
Discipline points and spells known aren't the same thing; Discipline points are more equivalent to spell slots, as these are both limited use resources. Where the spells known is relevant though is in the Monk's lack of things to do with their uses, especially at higher levels.
My biggest complaint with the UA8 Monk is that we still only have Stunning Strike as a core feature; while it's nice that the basic abilities are all a bit better (and get boosted later on), we still really need more to do with our discipline points as standard, to make core Monk more of a control/support skirmisher. Sub-classes shouldn't need to pick up that slack, they should have more to build on. This is more comparable to the Wizard's spells known.
Rogue gained Cunning Strikes, Barbarian gained Brutal Strikes, and while I don't advocate either being removed, Monk arguably needs a feature in that vein more, especially since Stunning Strike is once per turn only now (a much needed change), as that means even some of the sub-classes don't have a lot to spend Discipline on, especially at higher levels.
Overall I'm positive about the UA8 Monk, and if it remains as-is it'll be a positive improvement, but it just needs that little bit more IMO.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
I would have had the Monk's martial die start with a d8 and end with a d20. And start with 4 DP. Why not? Wizards start with four or five 1st spells plus cantrips.
Discipline points and spells known aren't the same thing; Discipline points are more equivalent to spell slots, as these are both limited use resources. Where the spells known is relevant though is in the Monk's lack of things to do with their uses, especially at higher levels.
Nothing is ever the same, but we can use similarities based the context. In this case slots are resources just as DP's. Monks don't even get DP's until level 1 and then only 1 point when they gain three points worth of stuff they can do. The new rules don't change the number of DP's, but at least as you gain rank, you are no longer needing to spend DP's for every action you want to take.
My biggest complaint with the UA8 Monk is that we still only have Stunning Strike as a core feature; while it's nice that the basic abilities are all a bit better (and get boosted later on), we still really need more to do with our discipline points as standard, to make core Monk more of a control/support skirmisher. Sub-classes shouldn't need to pick up that slack, they should have more to build on. This is more comparable to the Wizard's spells known.
The Stunning Strike has been with the monk for 40+ years. It's not going anyplace. I was actually sad that the new rules now forbid using it with every attack that was a bit much. I don't think that the Monk's function in a party has ever been accurately stated. We have to remember that it started as a sub-class of the Cleric (hence the d8 for hit points) and there after it was treated as a Fighter/Thief (no Rogue class at the time) hybrid. And then in 1e as a thief/druid hybrid. Finally it was removed and put in a entirely separate realm for "Oriental" classes. Now people want it to be part of the Fighter class, but you can see that it still has Thief-like abilities.
Rogue gained Cunning Strikes, Barbarian gained Brutal Strikes, and while I don't advocate either being removed, Monk arguably needs a feature in that vein more, especially since Stunning Strike is once per turn only now (a much needed change), as that means even some of the sub-classes don't have a lot to spend Discipline on, especially at higher levels.
The Monk gained Deflect Attacks (previously only missiles) and Deflect Energy. They also gain the ability to now use their unarmed bonus attacks independent of their action attacks. Being able to disengage as bonus action comes in handy if you are getting overwhelmed Spending a DP to also dodge is a luxury you don't have at tier 1, if you already spent your points on Flurry of Blows. But still Dodging or Deflecting Attacks are still free on their own. At the higher ranks all of the abilities are very good, especially the capstone of getting 4 free points for Dex and Wis. Some might complain that most campaigns never get that high, but I would argue that you need to be more selective about your DM's. If you have some DM who only listens to Youtubers, you will go 30 sessions before you finally go up a level , no matter how many monsters your team killed. I've also watched some sessions that went 3 hours, without a single combat. Just a bunch of dialogue back and forth. While it may not hold true in 5e, IIRC Basic, 1e and 2e all stated players should go up a level once ever 2 or three sessions. I don't know why that would change now? Oh well. I know I went off in a different direction...
Nothing is ever the same, but we can use similarities based the context. In this case slots are resources just as DP's. Monks don't even get DP's until level 1 and then only 1 point when they gain three points worth of stuff they can do. The new rules don't change the number of DP's, but at least as you gain rank, you are no longer needing to spend DP's for every action you want to take.
You were comparing Discipline points to the number of spells that a Wizard knows; spells are more akin to options, the spell slots are the resource that fuels them, same as Discipline points are the resource that fuel Monk abilities. So to compare (sort of) like for like, Discipline Points compare to spell slots and spells compare to Monk abilities (Flurry of Blows, Patient Defense etc.).
The Stunning Strike has been with the monk for 40+ years. It's not going anyplace.
I'm not talking about getting rid of Stunning Strike, I'm talking about the need for more things to do other than Stunning Strike.
Again, Barbarians and Rogues got Brutal/Cunning Strikes which gave them several options, with more at higher levels but Monk still really only has the same options it had before. Stunning Strike is great when it lands, but we need options that are more reliable and flexible, even if the effects are more minor; even just a basic 5 foot push would open up a lot of control options to move enemies or help allies (who no longer need to Disengage) etc. And it's about that progression, so we get more "special moves" later.
One of the problems in 5e is that Open Hand got a lot of things that make sense for any Monk to have, and we've been trapped that way ever since. OneD&D is an opportunity to move more of that out into the base Monk toolkit, and have Open Hand then double down on it instead (e.g- more powerful effects, able to do multiple at once etc.). But there are also other things that would be nice to have, like tripping attacks and such (some of which we lost along with Weapon Mastery in UA8, and now can't get back without a feat or multi-class).
The Monk gained Deflect Attacks (previously only missiles) and Deflect Energy. They also gain the ability to now use their unarmed bonus attacks independent of their action attacks. Being able to disengage as bonus action comes in handy if you are getting overwhelmed Spending a DP to also dodge is a luxury you don't have at tier 1, if you already spent your points on Flurry of Blows. But still Dodging or Deflecting Attacks are still free on their own. At the higher ranks all of the abilities are very good, especially the capstone of getting 4 free points for Dex and Wis.
All of these are gained early, I'm talking about progression and having more options later on, as Brutal Strikes and Cunning Strikes do. For Monks all we really get later is Stunning Strikes at 5th-level as an offensive move and then that's it; sure we get little upgrades to things we already have, but no new options of the kind as such.
With the core class lacking some basic progression of offensive abilities, that means that the sub-classes have to provide them instead which they haven't historically been very good at. I'd rather know that every Monk has at least some progression of that type, so sub-classes can focus on what else they can bring to the table.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
I had a chance to look at the Drunken Monk and thought that the 17th level ability had promise by gaining three more unarmed bonus attacks to a total of five. Unfortunately all five would have to be used against five different opponents. That is just ridiculous. This would have been good if added to the Monk's base class, but I guess having 7 attacks (two regular attacks and 5 bonus ones), against one opponent, would make it too competitive with the Fighter? 🤔
I had a chance to look at the Drunken Monk and thought that the 17th level ability had promise by gaining three more unarmed bonus attacks to a total of five. Unfortunately all five would have to be used against five different opponents. That is just ridiculous. This would have been good if added to the Monk's base class, but I guess having 7 attacks (two regular attacks and 5 bonus ones), against one opponent, would make it too competitive with the Fighter? 🤔
This is the current iteration released in Xanathar's Guide. The One DND playtest packet 8 did not include the Drunken Monk. It wasn't in 6 either (which was basically completely scrapped when the released 8). I don't think we'll see a revision to that subclass in the One DND PHB.
I had a chance to look at the Drunken Monk and thought that the 17th level ability had promise by gaining three more unarmed bonus attacks to a total of five. Unfortunately all five would have to be used against five different opponents. That is just ridiculous. This would have been good if added to the Monk's base class, but I guess having 7 attacks (two regular attacks and 5 bonus ones), against one opponent, would make it too competitive with the Fighter? 🤔
This is the current iteration released in Xanathar's Guide. The One DND playtest packet 8 did not include the Drunken Monk. It wasn't in 6 either (which was basically completely scrapped when the released 8). I don't think we'll see a revision to that subclass in the One DND PHB.
Which is unfortunate, it's a fun sub-class conceptually, just needs some minor tweaks like moving redirect attack to 3rd-level, making Drunkard's Luck less costly (e.g- 1 Ki to cancel disadvantage on a check or saving throw, two to cancel of all attacks until the end of your next turn). Then add something else at 6th-level, like maybe half-cover if you have two or more enemies within 5 feet?
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
I had a chance to look at the Drunken Monk and thought that the 17th level ability had promise by gaining three more unarmed bonus attacks to a total of five. Unfortunately all five would have to be used against five different opponents. That is just ridiculous. This would have been good if added to the Monk's base class, but I guess having 7 attacks (two regular attacks and 5 bonus ones), against one opponent, would make it too competitive with the Fighter? 🤔
It is ridiculous that it's a 17th level ability when Hunter Rangers get something very similar at level 11 or so.
As to competition with Fighters, well, that's one of the principal arguments of my first post to this thread.
My biggest complaint with the UA8 Monk is that we still only have Stunning Strike as a core feature; while it's nice that the basic abilities are all a bit better (and get boosted later on), we still really need more to do with our discipline points as standard, to make core Monk more of a control/support skirmisher. Sub-classes shouldn't need to pick up that slack, they should have more to build on. This is more comparable to the Wizard's spells known.
Rogue gained Cunning Strikes, Barbarian gained Brutal Strikes, and while I don't advocate either being removed, Monk arguably needs a feature in that vein more, especially since Stunning Strike is once per turn only now (a much needed change), as that means even some of the sub-classes don't have a lot to spend Discipline on, especially at higher levels.
Overall I'm positive about the UA8 Monk, and if it remains as-is it'll be a positive improvement, but it just needs that little bit more IMO.
I think the fact that they don't want to give any Weapon Mastery to Monks but want to give it to every other martial class in OneD&D really reinforces my argument that the devs see Monk as a "world apart" from the other classes. While they won't say it out loud, there is a cultural difference element to this, as well as what they can talk about: mechanical differentiation. Of course, this continues the problem of making Monks more difficult to multi-class with.
I had a chance to look at the Drunken Monk and thought that the 17th level ability had promise by gaining three more unarmed bonus attacks to a total of five. Unfortunately all five would have to be used against five different opponents. That is just ridiculous. This would have been good if added to the Monk's base class, but I guess having 7 attacks (two regular attacks and 5 bonus ones), against one opponent, would make it too competitive with the Fighter? 🤔
It is ridiculous that it's a 17th level ability when Hunter Rangers get something very similar at level 11 or so.
While I agree 17th-level is pretty late, to be fair the whirlwind attack isn't quite the same thing; it can only hit each creature once, and they all have to be within 5 feet of where you are when you take the action. Intoxicated Frenzy can still deal three attacks to one of your targets (two from Extra Attack which can be using a weapon, plus 1 unarmed strike from the frenzy) plus you can attack while moving so can attack 5 creatures anywhere within your (extremely high, as a Monk) movement range.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
I had a chance to look at the Drunken Monk and thought that the 17th level ability had promise by gaining three more unarmed bonus attacks to a total of five. Unfortunately all five would have to be used against five different opponents. That is just ridiculous. This would have been good if added to the Monk's base class, but I guess having 7 attacks (two regular attacks and 5 bonus ones), against one opponent, would make it too competitive with the Fighter? 🤔
It is ridiculous that it's a 17th level ability when Hunter Rangers get something very similar at level 11 or so.
While I agree 17th-level is pretty late, to be fair the whirlwind attack isn't quite the same thing; it can only hit each creature once, and they all have to be within 5 feet of where you are when you take the action. Intoxicated Frenzy can still deal three attacks to one of your targets (two from Extra Attack which can be using a weapon, plus 1 unarmed strike from the frenzy) plus you can attack while moving so can attack 5 creatures anywhere within your (extremely high, as a Monk) movement range.
Perhaps I misread that earlier, but I am still not convinced that getting 7 attacks as late as 17th level (which only a tiny % of people play to) with 1d10 damage when most of those must be spread out to 5 targets is a very good unless you want to blow your Ki stash on trying to stun all of your targets. Granted, the Whirlwind Attack from Hunter Ranger isn't very hot either but Volley at 11th level lets you make unlimited ranged attacks against clustered creatures without spending any real resources (assuming that you have enough money by 11th level to get all the arrows/bolts you could want). With any magic bow, Volley can easily match the damage of DM Monk's 17th level ability most of the time...without spending a resource and being able to add the magic weapon rider effects into it. It's a similar problem to the Astral Self Monk, which, despite having extra arms, cannot give you any more attacks than a typical Monk until 17th level. It looks cool on paper, but the effects are lackluster until very high levels compared to other martial classes (except maybe the non-magical Rogues, which also have a damage problem).
My biggest complaint with the UA8 Monk is that we still only have Stunning Strike as a core feature; while it's nice that the basic abilities are all a bit better (and get boosted later on), we still really need more to do with our discipline points as standard, to make core Monk more of a control/support skirmisher. Sub-classes shouldn't need to pick up that slack, they should have more to build on. This is more comparable to the Wizard's spells known.
Rogue gained Cunning Strikes, Barbarian gained Brutal Strikes, and while I don't advocate either being removed, Monk arguably needs a feature in that vein more, especially since Stunning Strike is once per turn only now (a much needed change), as that means even some of the sub-classes don't have a lot to spend Discipline on, especially at higher levels.
Overall I'm positive about the UA8 Monk, and if it remains as-is it'll be a positive improvement, but it just needs that little bit more IMO.
I think the fact that they don't want to give any Weapon Mastery to Monks but want to give it to every other martial class in OneD&D really reinforces my argument that the devs see Monk as a "world apart" from the other classes. While they won't say it out loud, there is a cultural difference element to this, as well as what they can talk about: mechanical differentiation. Of course, this continues the problem of making Monks more difficult to multi-class with.
I was initially also pretty disappointed by that. However, the answer to fixing monks isn't making them more like other martial classes. It's giving them a unique identity that is also equally powerful. I think the One DND playtest 8 version of the monk did a pretty good job of that.
I was initially also pretty disappointed by that. However, the answer to fixing monks isn't making them more like other martial classes. It's giving them a unique identity that is also equally powerful. I think the One DND playtest 8 version of the monk did a pretty good job of that.
It's still a harder hill to climb if you want to multi-class, though. Unless their whole intention is that nobody multi-class in OneD&D...
I don’t think their intention is that nobody multiclass but that classes don’t need to be designed to facilitate it either.
I feel that MC dips (1-3 levels) are probably the most common than MC that invest a good chunk of levels in all the classes in an MC combo. I don’t have any data on that, it’s just a gut feeling. And all subclasses going to 3rd level may reduce some MC combos because of this. But I don’t think that’s their goal
I would have had the Monk's martial die start with a d8 and end with a d20. And start with 4 DP. Why not? Wizards start with four or five 1st spells plus cantrips.
Discipline points and spells known aren't the same thing; Discipline points are more equivalent to spell slots, as these are both limited use resources. Where the spells known is relevant though is in the Monk's lack of things to do with their uses, especially at higher levels.
My biggest complaint with the UA8 Monk is that we still only have Stunning Strike as a core feature; while it's nice that the basic abilities are all a bit better (and get boosted later on), we still really need more to do with our discipline points as standard, to make core Monk more of a control/support skirmisher. Sub-classes shouldn't need to pick up that slack, they should have more to build on. This is more comparable to the Wizard's spells known.
Rogue gained Cunning Strikes, Barbarian gained Brutal Strikes, and while I don't advocate either being removed, Monk arguably needs a feature in that vein more, especially since Stunning Strike is once per turn only now (a much needed change), as that means even some of the sub-classes don't have a lot to spend Discipline on, especially at higher levels.
Overall I'm positive about the UA8 Monk, and if it remains as-is it'll be a positive improvement, but it just needs that little bit more IMO.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
Nothing is ever the same, but we can use similarities based the context. In this case slots are resources just as DP's. Monks don't even get DP's until level 1 and then only 1 point when they gain three points worth of stuff they can do. The new rules don't change the number of DP's, but at least as you gain rank, you are no longer needing to spend DP's for every action you want to take.
The Stunning Strike has been with the monk for 40+ years. It's not going anyplace. I was actually sad that the new rules now forbid using it with every attack that was a bit much. I don't think that the Monk's function in a party has ever been accurately stated. We have to remember that it started as a sub-class of the Cleric (hence the d8 for hit points) and there after it was treated as a Fighter/Thief (no Rogue class at the time) hybrid. And then in 1e as a thief/druid hybrid. Finally it was removed and put in a entirely separate realm for "Oriental" classes. Now people want it to be part of the Fighter class, but you can see that it still has Thief-like abilities.
The Monk gained Deflect Attacks (previously only missiles) and Deflect Energy. They also gain the ability to now use their unarmed bonus attacks independent of their action attacks. Being able to disengage as bonus action comes in handy if you are getting overwhelmed Spending a DP to also dodge is a luxury you don't have at tier 1, if you already spent your points on Flurry of Blows. But still Dodging or Deflecting Attacks are still free on their own. At the higher ranks all of the abilities are very good, especially the capstone of getting 4 free points for Dex and Wis. Some might complain that most campaigns never get that high, but I would argue that you need to be more selective about your DM's. If you have some DM who only listens to Youtubers, you will go 30 sessions before you finally go up a level , no matter how many monsters your team killed. I've also watched some sessions that went 3 hours, without a single combat. Just a bunch of dialogue back and forth. While it may not hold true in 5e, IIRC Basic, 1e and 2e all stated players should go up a level once ever 2 or three sessions. I don't know why that would change now? Oh well. I know I went off in a different direction...
You were comparing Discipline points to the number of spells that a Wizard knows; spells are more akin to options, the spell slots are the resource that fuels them, same as Discipline points are the resource that fuel Monk abilities. So to compare (sort of) like for like, Discipline Points compare to spell slots and spells compare to Monk abilities (Flurry of Blows, Patient Defense etc.).
I'm not talking about getting rid of Stunning Strike, I'm talking about the need for more things to do other than Stunning Strike.
Again, Barbarians and Rogues got Brutal/Cunning Strikes which gave them several options, with more at higher levels but Monk still really only has the same options it had before. Stunning Strike is great when it lands, but we need options that are more reliable and flexible, even if the effects are more minor; even just a basic 5 foot push would open up a lot of control options to move enemies or help allies (who no longer need to Disengage) etc. And it's about that progression, so we get more "special moves" later.
One of the problems in 5e is that Open Hand got a lot of things that make sense for any Monk to have, and we've been trapped that way ever since. OneD&D is an opportunity to move more of that out into the base Monk toolkit, and have Open Hand then double down on it instead (e.g- more powerful effects, able to do multiple at once etc.). But there are also other things that would be nice to have, like tripping attacks and such (some of which we lost along with Weapon Mastery in UA8, and now can't get back without a feat or multi-class).
All of these are gained early, I'm talking about progression and having more options later on, as Brutal Strikes and Cunning Strikes do. For Monks all we really get later is Stunning Strikes at 5th-level as an offensive move and then that's it; sure we get little upgrades to things we already have, but no new options of the kind as such.
With the core class lacking some basic progression of offensive abilities, that means that the sub-classes have to provide them instead which they haven't historically been very good at. I'd rather know that every Monk has at least some progression of that type, so sub-classes can focus on what else they can bring to the table.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
I had a chance to look at the Drunken Monk and thought that the 17th level ability had promise by gaining three more unarmed bonus attacks to a total of five. Unfortunately all five would have to be used against five different opponents. That is just ridiculous. This would have been good if added to the Monk's base class, but I guess having 7 attacks (two regular attacks and 5 bonus ones), against one opponent, would make it too competitive with the Fighter? 🤔
This is the current iteration released in Xanathar's Guide. The One DND playtest packet 8 did not include the Drunken Monk. It wasn't in 6 either (which was basically completely scrapped when the released 8). I don't think we'll see a revision to that subclass in the One DND PHB.
Which is unfortunate, it's a fun sub-class conceptually, just needs some minor tweaks like moving redirect attack to 3rd-level, making Drunkard's Luck less costly (e.g- 1 Ki to cancel disadvantage on a check or saving throw, two to cancel of all attacks until the end of your next turn). Then add something else at 6th-level, like maybe half-cover if you have two or more enemies within 5 feet?
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
It is ridiculous that it's a 17th level ability when Hunter Rangers get something very similar at level 11 or so.
As to competition with Fighters, well, that's one of the principal arguments of my first post to this thread.
I think the fact that they don't want to give any Weapon Mastery to Monks but want to give it to every other martial class in OneD&D really reinforces my argument that the devs see Monk as a "world apart" from the other classes. While they won't say it out loud, there is a cultural difference element to this, as well as what they can talk about: mechanical differentiation. Of course, this continues the problem of making Monks more difficult to multi-class with.
While I agree 17th-level is pretty late, to be fair the whirlwind attack isn't quite the same thing; it can only hit each creature once, and they all have to be within 5 feet of where you are when you take the action. Intoxicated Frenzy can still deal three attacks to one of your targets (two from Extra Attack which can be using a weapon, plus 1 unarmed strike from the frenzy) plus you can attack while moving so can attack 5 creatures anywhere within your (extremely high, as a Monk) movement range.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
Perhaps I misread that earlier, but I am still not convinced that getting 7 attacks as late as 17th level (which only a tiny % of people play to) with 1d10 damage when most of those must be spread out to 5 targets is a very good unless you want to blow your Ki stash on trying to stun all of your targets. Granted, the Whirlwind Attack from Hunter Ranger isn't very hot either but Volley at 11th level lets you make unlimited ranged attacks against clustered creatures without spending any real resources (assuming that you have enough money by 11th level to get all the arrows/bolts you could want). With any magic bow, Volley can easily match the damage of DM Monk's 17th level ability most of the time...without spending a resource and being able to add the magic weapon rider effects into it. It's a similar problem to the Astral Self Monk, which, despite having extra arms, cannot give you any more attacks than a typical Monk until 17th level. It looks cool on paper, but the effects are lackluster until very high levels compared to other martial classes (except maybe the non-magical Rogues, which also have a damage problem).
I was initially also pretty disappointed by that. However, the answer to fixing monks isn't making them more like other martial classes. It's giving them a unique identity that is also equally powerful. I think the One DND playtest 8 version of the monk did a pretty good job of that.
It's still a harder hill to climb if you want to multi-class, though. Unless their whole intention is that nobody multi-class in OneD&D...
I don’t think their intention is that nobody multiclass but that classes don’t need to be designed to facilitate it either.
I feel that MC dips (1-3 levels) are probably the most common than MC that invest a good chunk of levels in all the classes in an MC combo. I don’t have any data on that, it’s just a gut feeling. And all subclasses going to 3rd level may reduce some MC combos because of this. But I don’t think that’s their goal
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?