Hey, so, I went on a D&D book buying streak lately, and one of the books I got is Tasha's Cauldron of Everything, which is AWESOME! However, I just wanted your guys' lovely opinions regarding what is good and what is bad about the new Tasha's Ranger. Thanks a lot!!!
Contested: Favored Foe has fans but also has problems. Yeah, you could take it and free up a spell selection for something other than Hunter's Mark. But it's still concentration, it does less damage until 14th level (which a lot of campaigns don't make it to), and it's iffy if this damage is magical and therefore able to overcome resistance to non-magical damage. I prefer Favored Enemy, because it's pro-active instead of reactive: you can hunt and track with it. But Favored Enemy and Favored Terrain work best with a DM who will work that into their campaign (which any good DM should do, just as they give wizards extra spells to find or druids creatures to encounter to build up their wild shape portfolio). I'm also split on Natural Explorer vs Deft Explorer. Both are good, to some degree it depends on how your campaign is going to work.
many people will tell you the tasha's beast master is better but there are some downsides that make me stick to the phb ones.
no autonomy. tashas beast need's the rangers command to do anything (unless downed) so it cant scout via beast sense. It cant be left to guard important things. ect.
loss of potential utility. I could get a lot of use out of utility with the phb pets. Poison harvesting, blind sight, burrow speeds, more.
bonus action conflict. everyone loves commanding tashas pets via bonus action but it conflicts with so many ranger spells/abilities PHB ranger can have the beast attack, cast a BA spell, and still make an attack that triggers said spell in the same turn. I find phb pets get more use once extra attack is in play.
pet death. tashas provides easy resurections. phb pets is more narative. it reminds players that tactics are important or you could loose somthing you treasure. it also reminds the group this and adventure with real risks and rewards. I think phb pets tell a better story and show the bond between ranger and pet more than "ghost dog tasha"
don't get me wrong tashas pet is good and I am glad both are in the game but from a powerlevel, gameplay, or narative perspective I dont see tasha's as a clear winner.
as for some of the other abilities. I still like the phb stuff if the dm and I can come to a good interpretaion of the raw.
if I dont know the dm, Tashas versions might be better. They seem more combat oriented. Whereas the PHB one is more creativity orented and require preparation to be combat useful.
- your 20th level campstone will work regardless of what enemies you face
- unlike hunter's mark, Favoured Foe does not limit action economy and has good synergy with two weapon fighting if you are a fey wanderer
cons:
- it requires concentration and does generally less damage than hunter's mark, so it becomes less and less useful as you gain more and more good concentration spells that you could be using instead of concentrating on Favoured Foe
- unlike favoured enemy, it is limited use, and pretty damm few uses too, especially early on where you are going to be using it the most
- for less combat focused characters, favoured enemy is always going to be better since the free language is always active, the advantage on certain skill checks related to your favoured enemy may not come up super often, but getting a small benefit occasionally is going to be better than no benefit at all.
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i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
Hey, so, I went on a D&D book buying streak lately, and one of the books I got is Tasha's Cauldron of Everything, which is AWESOME! However, I just wanted your guys' lovely opinions regarding what is good and what is bad about the new Tasha's Ranger. Thanks a lot!!!
I by and large approve of all of the new optional rules for Rangers except that Favored Foe was clearly phoned in and doesn't do what it's intended to do very well, which is make Hunter's Mark less appealing in comparison to other spells - any Ranger taking Favored Foe is highly likely to take Hunter's Mark for the same build, as its primary use is being HM but worse to help you conserve spell slots. To a significantly lesser degree, I feel that Deft Explorer is too constrained - it should have allowed you to pick Expertise in a Rangerish tool like the Rogue Expertise can be, the languages should explicitly allow certain hard to learn ones like Sylvan, and the movement upgrades should have been choosables from a menu with other options like tremorsense for allowing for different takes on how to play a Ranger.
Deft Explorer - Awesome and better than Natural Explorer except in very limited cases. The 6th level feature is awesome, the 10th level feature is very good and the 1st level expertise is really good. Natural explorer is better in terms of survival in favored terrain, but if you put your expertise in Survival, you are going to do well, pretty close to natural explorer and doing it in all terrains. The only time natural explorere is better is when you will be in one type of terrain a lot, when there will be very hard checks that you won't have to roll if you have NE AND you don't have spells or background traits to make up for it.
Favored Foe - Mediocre, but Favored Enemy is mediocre too. IMO FF is medicore but generally better than FE. I see people comparing FF damage to Hunter's Mark damage, but that is not appropriate. HM sucks as a spell, Given the other spells available I would rarely have it at all and I would never have it at 5th level and above. So if you are comparing FF to HM on a Ranger I play, you are comparing 1d4/6/8 to 0. When you get down to it FF is a mediocre damage boost when you are not concentrating 2 to 6 times per day. You are comparing that to improved survival and intelligence checks against a type of monster and a language. There are some campaigns that FE is better in, but think the free damage boost is generally better.
Primal Awareness - Awesome, always better than Primeval Awareness. This is free spells known and free castings per day. When you add these in to the subclass known spells in Tashas a Ranger is pretty close to a full caster both in spells known and castings per day. Even in the rare event that you really need to know if there are Dragons or Undead around, just ask an animal or plant!
Nature's Veil - Awesome. Invisibility that lasts a turn as a bonus action. Always better than Hind in Plain sight.
Blind Fighting - OK. I could see uses, but you are giving up a lot to get this.
Drudic Warrior - Good. This really makes a Gish Ranger a very viable build. While some rangers will do better with another fighting style this is definitely a viable option.
I by and large approve of all of the new optional rules for Rangers except that Favored Foe was clearly phoned in and doesn't do what it's intended to do very well, which is make Hunter's Mark less appealing in comparison to other spells - any Ranger taking Favored Foe is highly likely to take Hunter's Mark for the same build, as its primary use is being HM but worse to help you conserve spell slots. To a significantly lesser degree, I feel that Deft Explorer is too constrained - it should have allowed you to pick Expertise in a Rangerish tool like the Rogue Expertise can be, the languages should explicitly allow certain hard to learn ones like Sylvan, and the movement upgrades should have been choosables from a menu with other options like tremorsense for allowing for different takes on how to play a Ranger.
I disagree on the Hunter's Mark. While it seems all Rangers took HM 5 years ago, I see few taking HM at all any more and none that keep it when 2nd level spells become available. FF is "worse" than HM in terms of damage but it is also free to use and more importantly does not suck up a spell known. To be honest if I really thought I needed the +1d6 damage I would pick up Hex through Fey Touched because it is a much better spell than HM and would not cut into the limited Ranger spells known. There are so many great 1st level Ranger spells and even more great 2nd level spells.
RAW Deft explorer does allow Sylvan. It says 2 languages of your choice, that would mean Sylvan is allowed if that is what you choose.
favored enemy is perfectly fine if you build around it. people act like chances are high you won't get to use the ability. This is not really true if you are planing for it. having advantage on all intellegence checks related to an enemy is huge even if that enemy isn't present in the adventure. This could include tools, history, poison harvesting, archana and so much more
favored foe- some people trash on it but the fact that its not a bonus action or a spells slot is kind of great. Take HM or dont. it will at least save spells slots. (still I prefer FE)
Primeval awareness- most people just flat out use it wrong. This is a travel or end of day spellslot expender not a last minute use. Its for planing ahead and eliminating wrong theory. It also beats magical consealment but covers a large area. Most people will get better use our of primal awareness but there are some builds that will still want primeval awareness.
Hide in plain sight- is quite good if your party is willing and able to setup ambushes.(most dont these days) the wording is a little confusing but with a reasonable interpretation its fine. also beats magical and mundane detection. also unlimited use (NV is super powerful but I like the flavor of HIPS better)
Druidic warior - allows for ranger wisdom builds. nessicary addition to the game. however I wish it gave slighly more. Ritual caster or allowing atunement of druid only items would be nice.
blind fighting - allows for fog cloud builds and reduces non darkvision racial issues. watch out for team members who dont like you blocking line of sight.
Favored terrain- Gives amazing unique benifits for travel and tracking. FT is the only place to get some of these cool ranger specific features.
Hey, so, I went on a D&D book buying streak lately, and one of the books I got is Tasha's Cauldron of Everything, which is AWESOME! However, I just wanted your guys' lovely opinions regarding what is good and what is bad about the new Tasha's Ranger. Thanks a lot!!!
“I’m more striking than lovely.” -Bart Simpson
I’m a fan of the OG ranger kit. I don’t think they are underpowered at all, even the handbook beast master (post errata). I will say that Tasha’s does a wonderful job of opening up the class to players that couldn’t or wouldn’t be at a table that utilizes the parts of the game and style of play that best suits the handbook ranger. Tasha’s makes them more generalized and more of a combat “striker”. It’s well done in that regard. I’m a grateful fan. If you are playing adventurer’s league, or a similar style of play, Tasha’s is just going to be smoother for the player. If you have a chance to play in a long running game where existing in a world is important, than the handbook ranger is amazing. Knowledge, travel, adventure, mysteries, cornerstones of all great adventure models, the handbook ranger thrives at these tables. I am, and forever will be, a fan of this type of game and the handbook ranger in it.
"To be honest if I really thought I needed the +1d6 damage I would pick up Hex through Fey Touched because it is a much better spell than HM and would not cut into the limited Ranger spells known. There are so many great 1st level Ranger spells and even more great 2nd level spells."
Hex is a somewhat poor choice for a ranger, as a VSM cast it requires an open hand which complicates shield users, two weapon fighters, etc. Also the ability check debuff is only marginally useful. Hunter's Mark's V only component is much easier to work with most builds. The better spell to get from Fey Touched is bless, but I have taken Hunter's Mark as a fey touched spell before and its great to help add something like entangle and not have to select HM with your limited spell's known. Also if you are going that route, Hunter's Mark is a spell you will likely cast once a day, so it will always get used.
Hunters Mark is a trap. It is good spell, but it shouldn’t be the primary one for Rangers. You have Goodberry, Absorb Elements, Ensnaring Strike. God, even Zephyr Strike is more useful in the right situation. Once you get 2nd level spells, you get access to Pass Without a Trace. Even Summon Beast is better because you could use it as a damage sponge or to give advantage with the Help action if you have low WIS.
Hunters Mark has it niche. Like in the first turn for a invisible Gloomstalker attacking 3 times. But I think this spell brought more pain than solutions to Rangers by making people forget about other spells.
I find the reactionary "Hunter's Mark" is trash/bad spell/trap to be a little silly. Its a first level spell. It does what is says on the box and is very good at it. Is it better than conjure animals? No. Its a first level spell. Its not supposed to be.
To me it doesn't really matter that CBE+FF might be better than Longbow+ HM. Some people don't want to play a character that uses a crossbow. Sometimes you get a magic longbow. There are many builds that will use Hunter's Mark and use it well for their entire career. They will also use other spells. I would still caution players at overusing or not transitioning to other spells as their default playstyle with access to higher level spells. But it works just fine.
Not every battle is deadly and needs “maximum damage output”. Hunter’s mark is wonderful for a series of quick skirmishes. Pull out the big guns for the big battles and the tactical guns for the tactical situations.
I find the reactionary "Hunter's Mark" is trash/bad spell/trap to be a little silly. Its a first level spell. It does what is says on the box and is very good at it. Is it better than conjure animals? No. Its a first level spell. Its not supposed to be.
To me it doesn't really matter that CBE+FF might be better than Longbow+ HM. Some people don't want to play a character that uses a crossbow. Sometimes you get a magic longbow. There are many builds that will use Hunter's Mark and use it well for their entire career. They will also use other spells. I would still caution players at overusing or not transitioning to other spells as their default playstyle with access to higher level spells. But it works just fine.
The main problem is that people think Hunters Mark should be a class feature and WotC made it: Favored Foe, a lame class feature to replace something worst. It’s not silly. Because of Hunters Mark this class was considered subpar by 5 years in a row.
Seasoned players know there are several other more useful level 1 spells that greatly increase the effectiveness of Rangers. Hunters Mark in pure numbers is about +2 avg damage. Seriously. This is terrible for a level one slot. Fog Cloud is better. Ensnaring Strike and Entagle are better. Goodberry is better. Zephyr Strike is better if you are surrounded and need to escape. Rangers were fine since the beginning, even without TCoE. Hunters Mark screwed everything.
"To be honest if I really thought I needed the +1d6 damage I would pick up Hex through Fey Touched because it is a much better spell than HM and would not cut into the limited Ranger spells known. There are so many great 1st level Ranger spells and even more great 2nd level spells."
Hex is a somewhat poor choice for a ranger, as a VSM cast it requires an open hand which complicates shield users, two weapon fighters, etc. Also the ability check debuff is only marginally useful. Hunter's Mark's V only component is much easier to work with most builds. The better spell to get from Fey Touched is bless, but I have taken Hunter's Mark as a fey touched spell before and its great to help add something like entangle and not have to select HM with your limited spell's known. Also if you are going that route, Hunter's Mark is a spell you will likely cast once a day, so it will always get used.
Hex does complicate shield users, but I don't play a lot of those. TWF it is not usually a big deal because you are casting it the first turn of combat when you lose your BA anyway. For two-handers or bows it is a non-issue.
I find Hex to be a much more versatile spell than HM. Honestly I use the disadvantage a lot in play, especially when using grapple, shove, to cover for sneaking and for social encounters/deception.
Bless is nice, but I have never wanted it on a Ranger, mostly because it is a full action to cast.
I find the reactionary "Hunter's Mark" is trash/bad spell/trap to be a little silly. Its a first level spell. It does what is says on the box and is very good at it. Is it better than conjure animals? No. Its a first level spell. Its not supposed to be.
But if we are going by this metric FF is a non-spell that does what it says and is good at it. It is free to use PB times per day and compared to HM, there are more builds that will use FF and use it well their whole career. In fact many of those builds that use HM will also use FF because they are going to run out of spell slots.
FWIW I never play a character that uses a crossbow, so we agree there!
Favored Enemy: I actually really like this feature a lot. I take it on the vast majority of my Rangers. In fact, the only one I haven't taken it on is my current Monster Slayer. And that's mostly because the campaign's conceit makes taking most non-combat features a bit unreliable. I love this and I have figured out how to get the most out of it. That said, it's a feature that has a high skill ceiling. Not everyone is going to want to invest in getting the most out of it like I have. And to be honest, nobody should have to. I think the first change I would make to it would be to let the scaling allow for you eventually getting access to all the Favored Enemy types instead of capping out at three.
Favored Foe: Not as useless as a lot of people seem to think. Doesn't mess with action economy, doesn't use up spell slots, and by 20th-level, combining it with Foe Slayer pretty much gives you the equivalent of a rapier damage without the need for an additional attack roll. I do think it's undertuned, however. The fact that it takes concentration, only affects your first hit on your turn, and you only get to use it against (at most) six enemies a day is pretty limiting. Personally, I use it to supplement Slayer's Prey or other such BA-heavy features to get Hunter's Mark damage without having to actually take Hunter's Mark. It has its uses, but it could be way better.
Natural Explorer: Like Favored Enemy, I think this is a great feature...that has an extremely high skill ceiling and most people can't (and shouldn't) need to make work. If you can dedicate enough of your time and energy to maximizing the benefits of Natural Explorer, more power to you. I do think it's a bit unreasonable to ask that of everyone. Like with Favored Enemy, I think a lot of the complaints would be alleviated if you could, by level 10, include all terrain types as Favored Terrains. Unlike Favored Enemy, Natural Explorer also has the added quirk of not necessarily covering all possible terrain types in the game (where's the deep ocean? Or extra-planar stuff?) unless you squint. And it's not a guarantee that your DM will see eye-to-eye with you on that, so make of that what you will.
Deft Explorer: I have to admit, the passive, always-on benefits of Deft Explorer are very tempting. Being able to gain expertise in a skill (not hamstrung by Natural Explorer's limitations) is very sexy. I've had Rangers who have taken Expertise in Stealth, Survival, Perception, Persuasion, Insight, Athletics, History, and Arcana (I play a lot of Rangers, okay? Don't judge me.) The additional movement speed and movement options -especially that climbing speed- have come in extremely handy on a number of my Rangers. Particularly the archery builds who can get into position at a makeshift crow's nest. The Temporary Hit Points and exhaustion removal at 10th are also extremely useful. Anything that artificially increases my Ranger's durability is absolutely welcome, because I am the rare Ranger main that doesn't actually prioritize Con all the time. I focus on being slippery or out of reach in order to avoid getting hit. I know, I know. But it's just how I like to build my Rangers. Wis (and sometimes even Int) are more attractive to me. Not just for Spell Save DC's but also for skills like Survival and Perception. Anyway, my point is, the additional THP -tied to my Wis mod, even- is very welcome for me. I do love Deft Explorer quite a lot.
Primeval Awareness: I used to not care about this feature. It took witnessing what other people were capable of with it to make me change my mind. Now I love it. Thematically, I actually prefer it to Primal Awareness, as I think it allows me to build a Ranger that isn't conceptually tied to nature much more easily. And most of my Rangers aren't conceptually tied to nature. Mechanically, it's, again, a high skill ceiling. But once you get past that learning curve, it has become, in my admittedly very biased experience, one of my absolute most useful tools. I know it's a controversial opinion, but I actually really love Primeval Awareness.
Primal Awareness: Not that I have anything against Primal Awareness either. This feature is consistently reliable, always useful, and has the benefit of artificially increasing the Ranger's spells known up to a whopping 21 (assuming subclass expanded spell lists,) higher than a Sorcerer and only three or so behind a Paladin. I've used Primal Awareness before and it has honestly never let me down. It's honestly probably the stronger feature compared to Primeval Awareness, but it hamstrings you into a nature theme and it's not as evocative or exciting. Boring, but practical.
Hide in Plain Sight: To be honest, I myself have never been able to make this work for me. Which is not to say that it's a bad feature. Just that I have to defer to other people's opinions and experiences with it. Again, it could be very good. Just not in my hands.
Nature's Veil: I don't love that it's Bonus Action dependent, since Rangers already have a lot of competition for their BA. But that's honestly the worst I can say about it. A one-round, free un-counterable Greater Invisibility is phenomenal offensively (advantage on attack rolls,) defensively (disadvantage on attacks against you,) and for non-combat utility. Combine it with Nondetection, Pass without Trace, and later Vanish, and you're practically a ghost. Rogues wish they could do what you can do. And it's powerful in combat too.
Expanded Spell List: Not much to say here. Aces all around. What Ranger doesn't enjoy access to Entangle, Lesser/Greater Restoration, Aid, and Revivify?
Blind Fighting: It's alright. I can see the uses for it. I don't think I've ever considered it for one of my Rangers, but I would understand why other people have.
Thrown Weapon Fighting: Same as above. Personally, thrown weapon is not a character fantasy I'm particularly fond of, so this doesn't really do it for me on that account. But if you are a big fan of the play style, I can see why you'd be excited for this.
Druidic Warrior: Now we're talking. I'd put this right up there with Archery and Defense as one of my favorite Fighting Styles for Ranger. Getting access to Shillelagh and being able to make a full Wis build is really nice and opens up a whole new world of possibilities for Rangers. Druidcraft to be able to make seeds bloom, that you can later toss around as pellets and cast Plant Growth on is also a really sweet and unexpected tactic I've used at times. My personal favorite is Thorn Whip for flavor purposes. And then there's Guidance, which pretty much ensures you're always going to be useful to your teammates regardless of the situation.
Martial Versatility: Meh. Being able to change fighting styles every ASI level is...fine, I guess? I find that by fourth, I'm already pretty settled on a playstyle though, and definitely so by 8th. It's nice to have, but it doesn't do much for me personally. I'd much rather have had the UA version that let me swap out a single spell on a long rest.
Druidic Focus: To be honest, it's dumb that we didn't have this before. Like, why? I see this less as an optional class feature and more as a correction to an obvious oversight.
Overall, I'm a big fan of Tasha's Rangers and I think they are more universally digestible and easy for people to pick up and have fun with. I'm also a fan of the original PHB Ranger and can see a lot of value there that most people can't. But then again, I'm the type to obsess over something -especially if that something is written off or disregarded by the wider community- and fixate on how to make it work. I get that most people aren't like that -and they shouldn't be. So while I love and appreciate the original PHB Ranger (and honestly, the more time passes, the more I like it,) the more immediate and apparent power and utility of Tasha's Ranger is -in my opinion- absolutely a really welcome addition to the class.
Favored Enemy: I actually really like this feature a lot. I take it on the vast majority of my Rangers. In fact, the only one I haven't taken it on is my current Monster Slayer. And that's mostly because the campaign's conceit makes taking most non-combat features a bit unreliable. I love this and I have figured out how to get the most out of it. That said, it's a feature that has a high skill ceiling. Not everyone is going to want to invest in getting the most out of it like I have. And to be honest, nobody should have to. I think the first change I would make to it would be to let the scaling allow for you eventually getting access to all the Favored Enemy types instead of capping out at three.
Favored Foe: Not as useless as a lot of people seem to think. Doesn't mess with action economy, doesn't use up spell slots, and by 20th-level, combining it with Foe Slayer pretty much gives you the equivalent of a rapier damage without the need for an additional attack roll. I do think it's undertuned, however. The fact that it takes concentration, only affects your first hit on your turn, and you only get to use it against (at most) six enemies a day is pretty limiting. Personally, I use it to supplement Slayer's Prey or other such BA-heavy features to get Hunter's Mark damage without having to actually take Hunter's Mark. It has its uses, but it could be way better.
Natural Explorer: Like Favored Enemy, I think this is a great feature...that has an extremely high skill ceiling and most people can't (and shouldn't) need to make work. If you can dedicate enough of your time and energy to maximizing the benefits of Natural Explorer, more power to you. I do think it's a bit unreasonable to ask that of everyone. Like with Favored Enemy, I think a lot of the complaints would be alleviated if you could, by level 10, include all terrain types as Favored Terrains. Unlike Favored Enemy, Natural Explorer also has the added quirk of not necessarily covering all possible terrain types in the game (where's the deep ocean? Or extra-planar stuff?) unless you squint. And it's not a guarantee that your DM will see eye-to-eye with you on that, so make of that what you will.
Deft Explorer: I have to admit, the passive, always-on benefits of Deft Explorer are very tempting. Being able to gain expertise in a skill (not hamstrung by Natural Explorer's limitations) is very sexy. I've had Rangers who have taken Expertise in Stealth, Survival, Perception, Persuasion, Insight, Athletics, History, and Arcana (I play a lot of Rangers, okay? Don't judge me.) The additional movement speed and movement options -especially that climbing speed- have come in extremely handy on a number of my Rangers. Particularly the archery builds who can get into position at a makeshift crow's nest. The Temporary Hit Points and exhaustion removal at 10th are also extremely useful. Anything that artificially increases my Ranger's durability is absolutely welcome, because I am the rare Ranger main that doesn't actually prioritize Con all the time. I focus on being slippery or out of reach in order to avoid getting hit. I know, I know. But it's just how I like to build my Rangers. Wis (and sometimes even Int) are more attractive to me. Not just for Spell Save DC's but also for skills like Survival and Perception. Anyway, my point is, the additional THP -tied to my Wis mod, even- is very welcome for me. I do love Deft Explorer quite a lot.
Primeval Awareness: I used to not care about this feature. It took witnessing what other people were capable of with it to make me change my mind. Now I love it. Thematically, I actually prefer it to Primal Awareness, as I think it allows me to build a Ranger that isn't conceptually tied to nature much more easily. And most of my Rangers aren't conceptually tied to nature. Mechanically, it's, again, a high skill ceiling. But once you get past that learning curve, it has become, in my admittedly very biased experience, one of my absolute most useful tools. I know it's a controversial opinion, but I actually really love Primeval Awareness.
Primal Awareness: Not that I have anything against Primal Awareness either. This feature is consistently reliable, always useful, and has the benefit of artificially increasing the Ranger's spells known up to a whopping 21 (assuming subclass expanded spell lists,) higher than a Sorcerer and only three or so behind a Paladin. I've used Primal Awareness before and it has honestly never let me down. It's honestly probably the stronger feature compared to Primeval Awareness, but it hamstrings you into a nature theme and it's not as evocative or exciting. Boring, but practical.
Hide in Plain Sight: To be honest, I myself have never been able to make this work for me. Which is not to say that it's a bad feature. Just that I have to defer to other people's opinions and experiences with it. Again, it could be very good. Just not in my hands.
Nature's Veil: I don't love that it's Bonus Action dependent, since Rangers already have a lot of competition for their BA. But that's honestly the worst I can say about it. A one-round, free un-counterable Greater Invisibility is phenomenal offensively (advantage on attack rolls,) defensively (disadvantage on attacks against you,) and for non-combat utility. Combine it with Nondetection, Pass without Trace, and later Vanish, and you're practically a ghost. Rogues wish they could do what you can do. And it's powerful in combat too.
Expanded Spell List: Not much to say here. Aces all around. What Ranger doesn't enjoy access to Entangle, Lesser/Greater Restoration, Aid, and Revivify?
Blind Fighting: It's alright. I can see the uses for it. I don't think I've ever considered it for one of my Rangers, but I would understand why other people have.
Thrown Weapon Fighting: Same as above. Personally, thrown weapon is not a character fantasy I'm particularly fond of, so this doesn't really do it for me on that account. But if you are a big fan of the play style, I can see why you'd be excited for this.
Druidic Warrior: Now we're talking. I'd put this right up there with Archery and Defense as one of my favorite Fighting Styles for Ranger. Getting access to Shillelagh and being able to make a full Wis build is really nice and opens up a whole new world of possibilities for Rangers. Druidcraft to be able to make seeds bloom, that you can later toss around as pellets and cast Plant Growth on is also a really sweet and unexpected tactic I've used at times. My personal favorite is Thorn Whip for flavor purposes. And then there's Guidance, which pretty much ensures you're always going to be useful to your teammates regardless of the situation.
Martial Versatility: Meh. Being able to change fighting styles every ASI level is...fine, I guess? I find that by fourth, I'm already pretty settled on a playstyle though, and definitely so by 8th. It's nice to have, but it doesn't do much for me personally. I'd much rather have had the UA version that let me swap out a single spell on a long rest.
Druidic Focus: To be honest, it's dumb that we didn't have this before. Like, why? I see this less as an optional class feature and more as a correction to an obvious oversight.
Overall, I'm a big fan of Tasha's Rangers and I think they are more universally digestible and easy for people to pick up and have fun with. I'm also a fan of the original PHB Ranger and can see a lot of value there that most people can't. But then again, I'm the type to obsess over something -especially if that something is written off or disregarded by the wider community- and fixate on how to make it work. I get that most people aren't like that -and they shouldn't be. So while I love and appreciate the original PHB Ranger (and honestly, the more time passes, the more I like it,) the more immediate and apparent power and utility of Tasha's Ranger is -in my opinion- absolutely a really welcome addition to the class.
Good write-up - but remember at 20th level, the impact of Foe Slayer is way more than just the damage bonus, it’s meant to be used to bonus a hit roll, converting 1 miss each round into a hit and potentially far more than 5 extra damage.
For Hide in Plain Sight I allow its use to be very liberal - once camouflaged I allow the ranger to move until he hides, and only then does he have to stop and not use an action. It’s a loose read of the writing but it makes it much more likely to be used.
Blind fighting would be one of those styles that, if you liked it, you could swap out once you have Feral Senses, so Martial Versatility could come in handy haha. I love Blindsight on my dark vision-impaired PCs, because I see through darkness, see invisible things, etc.
Good write-up - but remember at 20th level, the impact of Foe Slayer is way more than just the damage bonus, it’s meant to be used to bonus a hit roll, converting 1 miss each round into a hit and potentially far more than 5 extra damage.
For Hide in Plain Sight I allow its use to be very liberal - once camouflaged I allow the ranger to move until he hides, and only then does he have to stop and not use an action. It’s a loose read of the writing but it makes it much more likely to be used.
Blind fighting would be one of those styles that, if you liked it, you could swap out once you have Feral Senses, so Martial Versatility could come in handy haha. I love Blindsight on my dark vision-impaired PCs, because I see through darkness, see invisible things, etc.
This is 100% how I read and use (as a DM) hide in plain sight. I don't even think it is that crazy of a reading of it. It makes it a very fun and useful ability when played this way.
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Hey, so, I went on a D&D book buying streak lately, and one of the books I got is Tasha's Cauldron of Everything, which is AWESOME! However, I just wanted your guys' lovely opinions regarding what is good and what is bad about the new Tasha's Ranger. Thanks a lot!!!
Ren
Good: additional spells, additional fighting style options (especially druidic warrior), Primal Awareness, Nature's Veil.
Contested: Favored Foe has fans but also has problems. Yeah, you could take it and free up a spell selection for something other than Hunter's Mark. But it's still concentration, it does less damage until 14th level (which a lot of campaigns don't make it to), and it's iffy if this damage is magical and therefore able to overcome resistance to non-magical damage. I prefer Favored Enemy, because it's pro-active instead of reactive: you can hunt and track with it. But Favored Enemy and Favored Terrain work best with a DM who will work that into their campaign (which any good DM should do, just as they give wizards extra spells to find or druids creatures to encounter to build up their wild shape portfolio). I'm also split on Natural Explorer vs Deft Explorer. Both are good, to some degree it depends on how your campaign is going to work.
Birgit | Shifter | Sorcerer | Dragonlords
Shayone | Hobgoblin | Sorcerer | Netherdeep
many people will tell you the tasha's beast master is better but there are some downsides that make me stick to the phb ones.
don't get me wrong tashas pet is good and I am glad both are in the game but from a powerlevel, gameplay, or narative perspective I dont see tasha's as a clear winner.
as for some of the other abilities. I still like the phb stuff if the dm and I can come to a good interpretaion of the raw.
if I dont know the dm, Tashas versions might be better. They seem more combat oriented. Whereas the PHB one is more creativity orented and require preparation to be combat useful.
in terms of Favoured Foe vs Favoured Enemy:
pros:
- your 20th level campstone will work regardless of what enemies you face
- unlike hunter's mark, Favoured Foe does not limit action economy and has good synergy with two weapon fighting if you are a fey wanderer
cons:
- it requires concentration and does generally less damage than hunter's mark, so it becomes less and less useful as you gain more and more good concentration spells that you could be using instead of concentrating on Favoured Foe
- unlike favoured enemy, it is limited use, and pretty damm few uses too, especially early on where you are going to be using it the most
- for less combat focused characters, favoured enemy is always going to be better since the free language is always active, the advantage on certain skill checks related to your favoured enemy may not come up super often, but getting a small benefit occasionally is going to be better than no benefit at all.
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
I by and large approve of all of the new optional rules for Rangers except that Favored Foe was clearly phoned in and doesn't do what it's intended to do very well, which is make Hunter's Mark less appealing in comparison to other spells - any Ranger taking Favored Foe is highly likely to take Hunter's Mark for the same build, as its primary use is being HM but worse to help you conserve spell slots. To a significantly lesser degree, I feel that Deft Explorer is too constrained - it should have allowed you to pick Expertise in a Rangerish tool like the Rogue Expertise can be, the languages should explicitly allow certain hard to learn ones like Sylvan, and the movement upgrades should have been choosables from a menu with other options like tremorsense for allowing for different takes on how to play a Ranger.
Deft Explorer - Awesome and better than Natural Explorer except in very limited cases. The 6th level feature is awesome, the 10th level feature is very good and the 1st level expertise is really good. Natural explorer is better in terms of survival in favored terrain, but if you put your expertise in Survival, you are going to do well, pretty close to natural explorer and doing it in all terrains. The only time natural explorere is better is when you will be in one type of terrain a lot, when there will be very hard checks that you won't have to roll if you have NE AND you don't have spells or background traits to make up for it.
Favored Foe - Mediocre, but Favored Enemy is mediocre too. IMO FF is medicore but generally better than FE. I see people comparing FF damage to Hunter's Mark damage, but that is not appropriate. HM sucks as a spell, Given the other spells available I would rarely have it at all and I would never have it at 5th level and above. So if you are comparing FF to HM on a Ranger I play, you are comparing 1d4/6/8 to 0. When you get down to it FF is a mediocre damage boost when you are not concentrating 2 to 6 times per day. You are comparing that to improved survival and intelligence checks against a type of monster and a language. There are some campaigns that FE is better in, but think the free damage boost is generally better.
Primal Awareness - Awesome, always better than Primeval Awareness. This is free spells known and free castings per day. When you add these in to the subclass known spells in Tashas a Ranger is pretty close to a full caster both in spells known and castings per day. Even in the rare event that you really need to know if there are Dragons or Undead around, just ask an animal or plant!
Nature's Veil - Awesome. Invisibility that lasts a turn as a bonus action. Always better than Hind in Plain sight.
Blind Fighting - OK. I could see uses, but you are giving up a lot to get this.
Drudic Warrior - Good. This really makes a Gish Ranger a very viable build. While some rangers will do better with another fighting style this is definitely a viable option.
I disagree on the Hunter's Mark. While it seems all Rangers took HM 5 years ago, I see few taking HM at all any more and none that keep it when 2nd level spells become available. FF is "worse" than HM in terms of damage but it is also free to use and more importantly does not suck up a spell known. To be honest if I really thought I needed the +1d6 damage I would pick up Hex through Fey Touched because it is a much better spell than HM and would not cut into the limited Ranger spells known. There are so many great 1st level Ranger spells and even more great 2nd level spells.
RAW Deft explorer does allow Sylvan. It says 2 languages of your choice, that would mean Sylvan is allowed if that is what you choose.
favored enemy is perfectly fine if you build around it. people act like chances are high you won't get to use the ability. This is not really true if you are planing for it. having advantage on all intellegence checks related to an enemy is huge even if that enemy isn't present in the adventure. This could include tools, history, poison harvesting, archana and so much more
favored foe- some people trash on it but the fact that its not a bonus action or a spells slot is kind of great. Take HM or dont. it will at least save spells slots. (still I prefer FE)
Primeval awareness- most people just flat out use it wrong. This is a travel or end of day spellslot expender not a last minute use. Its for planing ahead and eliminating wrong theory. It also beats magical consealment but covers a large area. Most people will get better use our of primal awareness but there are some builds that will still want primeval awareness.
Hide in plain sight- is quite good if your party is willing and able to setup ambushes.(most dont these days) the wording is a little confusing but with a reasonable interpretation its fine. also beats magical and mundane detection. also unlimited use (NV is super powerful but I like the flavor of HIPS better)
Druidic warior - allows for ranger wisdom builds. nessicary addition to the game. however I wish it gave slighly more. Ritual caster or allowing atunement of druid only items would be nice.
blind fighting - allows for fog cloud builds and reduces non darkvision racial issues. watch out for team members who dont like you blocking line of sight.
Favored terrain- Gives amazing unique benifits for travel and tracking. FT is the only place to get some of these cool ranger specific features.
“I’m more striking than lovely.” -Bart Simpson
I’m a fan of the OG ranger kit. I don’t think they are underpowered at all, even the handbook beast master (post errata). I will say that Tasha’s does a wonderful job of opening up the class to players that couldn’t or wouldn’t be at a table that utilizes the parts of the game and style of play that best suits the handbook ranger. Tasha’s makes them more generalized and more of a combat “striker”. It’s well done in that regard. I’m a grateful fan. If you are playing adventurer’s league, or a similar style of play, Tasha’s is just going to be smoother for the player. If you have a chance to play in a long running game where existing in a world is important, than the handbook ranger is amazing. Knowledge, travel, adventure, mysteries, cornerstones of all great adventure models, the handbook ranger thrives at these tables. I am, and forever will be, a fan of this type of game and the handbook ranger in it.
"To be honest if I really thought I needed the +1d6 damage I would pick up Hex through Fey Touched because it is a much better spell than HM and would not cut into the limited Ranger spells known. There are so many great 1st level Ranger spells and even more great 2nd level spells."
Hex is a somewhat poor choice for a ranger, as a VSM cast it requires an open hand which complicates shield users, two weapon fighters, etc. Also the ability check debuff is only marginally useful. Hunter's Mark's V only component is much easier to work with most builds. The better spell to get from Fey Touched is bless, but I have taken Hunter's Mark as a fey touched spell before and its great to help add something like entangle and not have to select HM with your limited spell's known. Also if you are going that route, Hunter's Mark is a spell you will likely cast once a day, so it will always get used.
CBE + FF is better than Longbow + Hunters Mark.
Hunters Mark is a trap. It is good spell, but it shouldn’t be the primary one for Rangers. You have Goodberry, Absorb Elements, Ensnaring Strike. God, even Zephyr Strike is more useful in the right situation. Once you get 2nd level spells, you get access to Pass Without a Trace. Even Summon Beast is better because you could use it as a damage sponge or to give advantage with the Help action if you have low WIS.
Hunters Mark has it niche. Like in the first turn for a invisible Gloomstalker attacking 3 times. But I think this spell brought more pain than solutions to Rangers by making people forget about other spells.
I find the reactionary "Hunter's Mark" is trash/bad spell/trap to be a little silly. Its a first level spell. It does what is says on the box and is very good at it. Is it better than conjure animals? No. Its a first level spell. Its not supposed to be.
To me it doesn't really matter that CBE+FF might be better than Longbow+ HM. Some people don't want to play a character that uses a crossbow. Sometimes you get a magic longbow. There are many builds that will use Hunter's Mark and use it well for their entire career. They will also use other spells. I would still caution players at overusing or not transitioning to other spells as their default playstyle with access to higher level spells. But it works just fine.
Not every battle is deadly and needs “maximum damage output”. Hunter’s mark is wonderful for a series of quick skirmishes. Pull out the big guns for the big battles and the tactical guns for the tactical situations.
The main problem is that people think Hunters Mark should be a class feature and WotC made it: Favored Foe, a lame class feature to replace something worst. It’s not silly. Because of Hunters Mark this class was considered subpar by 5 years in a row.
Seasoned players know there are several other more useful level 1 spells that greatly increase the effectiveness of Rangers. Hunters Mark in pure numbers is about +2 avg damage. Seriously. This is terrible for a level one slot. Fog Cloud is better. Ensnaring Strike and Entagle are better. Goodberry is better. Zephyr Strike is better if you are surrounded and need to escape. Rangers were fine since the beginning, even without TCoE. Hunters Mark screwed everything.
Hex does complicate shield users, but I don't play a lot of those. TWF it is not usually a big deal because you are casting it the first turn of combat when you lose your BA anyway. For two-handers or bows it is a non-issue.
I find Hex to be a much more versatile spell than HM. Honestly I use the disadvantage a lot in play, especially when using grapple, shove, to cover for sneaking and for social encounters/deception.
Bless is nice, but I have never wanted it on a Ranger, mostly because it is a full action to cast.
But if we are going by this metric FF is a non-spell that does what it says and is good at it. It is free to use PB times per day and compared to HM, there are more builds that will use FF and use it well their whole career. In fact many of those builds that use HM will also use FF because they are going to run out of spell slots.
FWIW I never play a character that uses a crossbow, so we agree there!
My take on the features:
Favored Enemy: I actually really like this feature a lot. I take it on the vast majority of my Rangers. In fact, the only one I haven't taken it on is my current Monster Slayer. And that's mostly because the campaign's conceit makes taking most non-combat features a bit unreliable. I love this and I have figured out how to get the most out of it. That said, it's a feature that has a high skill ceiling. Not everyone is going to want to invest in getting the most out of it like I have. And to be honest, nobody should have to. I think the first change I would make to it would be to let the scaling allow for you eventually getting access to all the Favored Enemy types instead of capping out at three.
Favored Foe: Not as useless as a lot of people seem to think. Doesn't mess with action economy, doesn't use up spell slots, and by 20th-level, combining it with Foe Slayer pretty much gives you the equivalent of a rapier damage without the need for an additional attack roll. I do think it's undertuned, however. The fact that it takes concentration, only affects your first hit on your turn, and you only get to use it against (at most) six enemies a day is pretty limiting. Personally, I use it to supplement Slayer's Prey or other such BA-heavy features to get Hunter's Mark damage without having to actually take Hunter's Mark. It has its uses, but it could be way better.
Natural Explorer: Like Favored Enemy, I think this is a great feature...that has an extremely high skill ceiling and most people can't (and shouldn't) need to make work. If you can dedicate enough of your time and energy to maximizing the benefits of Natural Explorer, more power to you. I do think it's a bit unreasonable to ask that of everyone. Like with Favored Enemy, I think a lot of the complaints would be alleviated if you could, by level 10, include all terrain types as Favored Terrains. Unlike Favored Enemy, Natural Explorer also has the added quirk of not necessarily covering all possible terrain types in the game (where's the deep ocean? Or extra-planar stuff?) unless you squint. And it's not a guarantee that your DM will see eye-to-eye with you on that, so make of that what you will.
Deft Explorer: I have to admit, the passive, always-on benefits of Deft Explorer are very tempting. Being able to gain expertise in a skill (not hamstrung by Natural Explorer's limitations) is very sexy. I've had Rangers who have taken Expertise in Stealth, Survival, Perception, Persuasion, Insight, Athletics, History, and Arcana (I play a lot of Rangers, okay? Don't judge me.) The additional movement speed and movement options -especially that climbing speed- have come in extremely handy on a number of my Rangers. Particularly the archery builds who can get into position at a makeshift crow's nest. The Temporary Hit Points and exhaustion removal at 10th are also extremely useful. Anything that artificially increases my Ranger's durability is absolutely welcome, because I am the rare Ranger main that doesn't actually prioritize Con all the time. I focus on being slippery or out of reach in order to avoid getting hit. I know, I know. But it's just how I like to build my Rangers. Wis (and sometimes even Int) are more attractive to me. Not just for Spell Save DC's but also for skills like Survival and Perception. Anyway, my point is, the additional THP -tied to my Wis mod, even- is very welcome for me. I do love Deft Explorer quite a lot.
Primeval Awareness: I used to not care about this feature. It took witnessing what other people were capable of with it to make me change my mind. Now I love it. Thematically, I actually prefer it to Primal Awareness, as I think it allows me to build a Ranger that isn't conceptually tied to nature much more easily. And most of my Rangers aren't conceptually tied to nature. Mechanically, it's, again, a high skill ceiling. But once you get past that learning curve, it has become, in my admittedly very biased experience, one of my absolute most useful tools. I know it's a controversial opinion, but I actually really love Primeval Awareness.
Primal Awareness: Not that I have anything against Primal Awareness either. This feature is consistently reliable, always useful, and has the benefit of artificially increasing the Ranger's spells known up to a whopping 21 (assuming subclass expanded spell lists,) higher than a Sorcerer and only three or so behind a Paladin. I've used Primal Awareness before and it has honestly never let me down. It's honestly probably the stronger feature compared to Primeval Awareness, but it hamstrings you into a nature theme and it's not as evocative or exciting. Boring, but practical.
Hide in Plain Sight: To be honest, I myself have never been able to make this work for me. Which is not to say that it's a bad feature. Just that I have to defer to other people's opinions and experiences with it. Again, it could be very good. Just not in my hands.
Nature's Veil: I don't love that it's Bonus Action dependent, since Rangers already have a lot of competition for their BA. But that's honestly the worst I can say about it. A one-round, free un-counterable Greater Invisibility is phenomenal offensively (advantage on attack rolls,) defensively (disadvantage on attacks against you,) and for non-combat utility. Combine it with Nondetection, Pass without Trace, and later Vanish, and you're practically a ghost. Rogues wish they could do what you can do. And it's powerful in combat too.
Expanded Spell List: Not much to say here. Aces all around. What Ranger doesn't enjoy access to Entangle, Lesser/Greater Restoration, Aid, and Revivify?
Blind Fighting: It's alright. I can see the uses for it. I don't think I've ever considered it for one of my Rangers, but I would understand why other people have.
Thrown Weapon Fighting: Same as above. Personally, thrown weapon is not a character fantasy I'm particularly fond of, so this doesn't really do it for me on that account. But if you are a big fan of the play style, I can see why you'd be excited for this.
Druidic Warrior: Now we're talking. I'd put this right up there with Archery and Defense as one of my favorite Fighting Styles for Ranger. Getting access to Shillelagh and being able to make a full Wis build is really nice and opens up a whole new world of possibilities for Rangers. Druidcraft to be able to make seeds bloom, that you can later toss around as pellets and cast Plant Growth on is also a really sweet and unexpected tactic I've used at times. My personal favorite is Thorn Whip for flavor purposes. And then there's Guidance, which pretty much ensures you're always going to be useful to your teammates regardless of the situation.
Martial Versatility: Meh. Being able to change fighting styles every ASI level is...fine, I guess? I find that by fourth, I'm already pretty settled on a playstyle though, and definitely so by 8th. It's nice to have, but it doesn't do much for me personally. I'd much rather have had the UA version that let me swap out a single spell on a long rest.
Druidic Focus: To be honest, it's dumb that we didn't have this before. Like, why? I see this less as an optional class feature and more as a correction to an obvious oversight.
Overall, I'm a big fan of Tasha's Rangers and I think they are more universally digestible and easy for people to pick up and have fun with. I'm also a fan of the original PHB Ranger and can see a lot of value there that most people can't. But then again, I'm the type to obsess over something -especially if that something is written off or disregarded by the wider community- and fixate on how to make it work. I get that most people aren't like that -and they shouldn't be. So while I love and appreciate the original PHB Ranger (and honestly, the more time passes, the more I like it,) the more immediate and apparent power and utility of Tasha's Ranger is -in my opinion- absolutely a really welcome addition to the class.
Good write-up - but remember at 20th level, the impact of Foe Slayer is way more than just the damage bonus, it’s meant to be used to bonus a hit roll, converting 1 miss each round into a hit and potentially far more than 5 extra damage.
For Hide in Plain Sight I allow its use to be very liberal - once camouflaged I allow the ranger to move until he hides, and only then does he have to stop and not use an action. It’s a loose read of the writing but it makes it much more likely to be used.
Blind fighting would be one of those styles that, if you liked it, you could swap out once you have Feral Senses, so Martial Versatility could come in handy haha. I love Blindsight on my dark vision-impaired PCs, because I see through darkness, see invisible things, etc.
This is 100% how I read and use (as a DM) hide in plain sight. I don't even think it is that crazy of a reading of it. It makes it a very fun and useful ability when played this way.