Hello there. You have probably heard how bad True Strike is. However, it has one VERY important use. The arcane trickster roque can take true strike as a cantrip. They can use this to use their sneak attack, providing an actual use to True Strike.
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There are other, better ways of gaining advantage. True strike costs an action, requires concentration (which could get in the way of other spells the arcane trickster might want to have going), and doesn't grant advantage until the next turn. Even if the arcane trickster quickens it via sorcerer dip or metamagic adept feat, it still only grants advantage on the next turn.
Instead of casting true strike, any rogue, regardless of subclass, can:
Use steady aim as a bonus action for advantage on the current turn.
Hide as a bonus action for advantage on the current turn.
Arcane tricksters have cunning action and stealth (bonus action to hide) or steady aim (bonus + move) will give advantage. Either option gives advantage for an attack that is over 30' away where true strike is limited to 30'.
What scenario do you think would make true strike a better option?
It''s a nice utility spell to get a fair knowledge of the Resistences and Inmunities of the selected target. So the only use is, as a reaction ( and there're only few spells here ) you can cast a defensive spell or try to Dash, to try getting a BA.
It''s a nice utility spell to get a fair knowledge of the Resistences and Inmunities of the selected target. So the only use is, as a reaction ( and there're only few spells here ) you can cast a defensive spell or try to Dash, to try getting a BA.
How does true strike give any knowledge of the resistances or immunities?
It also takes an action to cast the spell, unless you dip sorcerer or take the feat and even then casting it is a bonus action. Which, as an arcane trickster you can already use to get advantage.
Its one of the most useless low level spells in the game. The DM would have to create a situation where it would be used, not useful, just used.
Arcane tricksters have cunning action and stealth (bonus action to hide) or steady aim (bonus + move) will give advantage. Either option gives advantage for an attack that is over 30' away where true strike is limited to 30'.
What scenario do you think would make true strike a better option?
This is not exactly true. Cunning action only gives advantage if the Rogue is heavily obscured and only then if he rolls higher on stealth than his opponents passive perception. Steady aim only works if you don't need to move at all, which is kind of rare and almost never for a melee-oriented Rogue. There are many times niether of these will be possible and more still where they are possible but he fails his stealth check.
I do agree that there are much better cantrip options than true strike, but I could see getting it on a scroll for this use. If I was going to use true strike I would use it as a readied action to execute right before my next turn so I did not have to carry the concentration for the whole round.
In my experience True Strike is mostly useful when you know you're going to cast a big attack spell and don't want to miss (because missing sucks hard when it wastes a higher level slot).
You might take it on a Sorcerer with Quickened Spell, because you can setup advantage for your next turn and still cast whatever you want during the current turn; it's a bit expensive on sorcery points though, and thanks to Tasha's Cauldron you may be better off just taking Seeking Spell (re-roll a miss for two sorcery points). However, you can also combine the two for maximum hit chance (it's a whopping 4 SP but that's for advantage with re-roll, and only if you need the latter), plus we don't get that many metamagic choices, so if True Strike saves one then it may not be a terrible trade if you need it a lot.
The other main case is for an opening attack; True Strike is a cantrip so you can cast it as often as you like. If you know or suspect a combat is coming, and can see the target you want to go for, you can just tell your DM that you're constantly casting it, so when combat begins you have advantage right away. This case can work for a melee Arcane Trickster specifically if you're being confronted by enemies you expect to attack you, as you can get advantage in the first round while standing right in front of them. It may also be good just to have in case sneaking up to a target goes poorly (i.e- you're trying to hide for advantage but the enemy's perception roll beat your stealth).
Overall it's not the easiest cantrip to recommend; you have to have a very specific idea in mind of what you want it for. I can see its uses on an Arcane Trickster but I wouldn't take it personally because we get so few cantrip choices. This is the same reason I wouldn't normally take it on a Wizard, not at lower levels anyway. At higher levels I might take it for when I know I want to use a big attack spell, but I'd prefer it on a sorcerer where you can counteract the cost (in a lost turn) of using it.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
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It may also be good just to have in case sneaking up to a target goes poorly (i.e- you're trying to hide for advantage but the enemy's perception roll beat your stealth).
This actually may be a reasonable use for an AT. use cunning action to try and hide and if you fail, then use your action to cast true strike instead of attacking for base weapon damage only.
You basically ensure a sneak attack the next turn as long as you don't lose concentration.
I still think it is a very high price to pay, especially when you only get to choose 2 cantrips.
It could, theoretically, be put to a functional use on a bladsinger. They could Extra Attack, using attack action to both attack and cast this cantrip. Then, on the next turn burn a higher level slot on a targeted spell. Would this be an 'optimized' strategy? No. Would it be super strong? No. Would it be one of the very few semi-functional ways to try to force this cantrip into normal play? Yeah.
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I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
You're right, in that using it on an AT a couple seconds before you personally initiate combat with a sneak attack is one of the optimal uses of true strike. And it can be good at that, for sure, especially when there's high a chance that your stealth might be broken; sure, you could use a bit of cunning play to get the advantage next turn, but sacrificing an action before combat begins leaves you free to Dash or Disengage after landing your hit.
...The problem is just that there are very few cases where this is both necessary, and an improvement over doing something else this turn. True strike needs to be used before combat, combat has to start within 6 seconds of using true strike, you need to be at risk of losing all other sources of advantage or sneak attack within those 6 seconds, at absolute minimum; if including TCE content, you need to be in a position that forces you to expend your bonus action on Dash, Disengage, or attempting to Hide again after attacking, too. There are situations where it's the absolute best thing you could do with your action, it's just that those situations are insanely rare.
You're right, in that using it on an AT a couple seconds before you personally initiate combat with a sneak attack is one of the optimal uses of true strike. And it can be good at that, for sure, especially when there's high a chance that your stealth might be broken; sure, you could use a bit of cunning play to get the advantage next turn, but sacrificing an action before combat begins leaves you free to Dash or Disengage after landing your hit.
...The problem is just that there are very few cases where this is both necessary, and an improvement over doing something else this turn. True strike needs to be used before combat, combat has to start within 6 seconds of using true strike, you need to be at risk of losing all other sources of advantage or sneak attack within those 6 seconds, at absolute minimum; if including TCE content, you need to be in a position that forces you to expend your bonus action on Dash, Disengage, or attempting to Hide again after attacking, too. There are situations where it's the absolute best thing you could do with your action, it's just that those situations are insanely rare.
Even in this corner case though. I can cast true strike now to have or I can cast mage hand and use my bonus to try to steal an enemies weapon before combat begins AND I have my hand out and available for bonus actions the entire combat.
Arcane tricksters have cunning action and stealth (bonus action to hide) or steady aim (bonus + move) will give advantage. Either option gives advantage for an attack that is over 30' away where true strike is limited to 30'.
What scenario do you think would make true strike a better option?
This is not exactly true. Cunning action only gives advantage if the Rogue is heavily obscured and only then if he rolls higher on stealth than his opponents passive perception. Steady aim only works if you don't need to move at all, which is kind of rare and almost never for a melee-oriented Rogue. There are many times niether of these will be possible and more still where they are possible but he fails his stealth check.
I do agree that there are much better cantrip options than true strike, but I could see getting it on a scroll for this use. If I was going to use true strike I would use it as a readied action to execute right before my next turn so I did not have to carry the concentration for the whole round.
So you would give up an entire round of attacking or hiding or moving to a more advantageous position or some combination in order to cast true strike.
Remember True Strike only has a range of 30 feet. You're already in melee range.
In my experience True Strike is mostly useful when you know you're going to cast a big attack spell and don't want to miss (because missing sucks hard when it wastes a higher level slot).
You might take it on a Sorcerer with Quickened Spell, because you can setup advantage for your next turn and still cast whatever you want during the current turn; it's a bit expensive on sorcery points though, and thanks to Tasha's Cauldron you may be better off just taking Seeking Spell (re-roll a miss for two sorcery points). However, you can also combine the two for maximum hit chance (it's a whopping 4 SP but that's for advantage with re-roll, and only if you need the latter), plus we don't get that many metamagic choices, so if True Strike saves one then it may not be a terrible trade if you need it a lot.
The other main case is for an opening attack; True Strike is a cantrip so you can cast it as often as you like. If you know or suspect a combat is coming, and can see the target you want to go for, you can just tell your DM that you're constantly casting it, so when combat begins you have advantage right away. This case can work for a melee Arcane Trickster specifically if you're being confronted by enemies you expect to attack you, as you can get advantage in the first round while standing right in front of them. It may also be good just to have in case sneaking up to a target goes poorly (i.e- you're trying to hide for advantage but the enemy's perception roll beat your stealth).
Overall it's not the easiest cantrip to recommend; you have to have a very specific idea in mind of what you want it for. I can see its uses on an Arcane Trickster but I wouldn't take it personally because we get so few cantrip choices. This is the same reason I wouldn't normally take it on a Wizard, not at lower levels anyway. At higher levels I might take it for when I know I want to use a big attack spell, but I'd prefer it on a sorcerer where you can counteract the cost (in a lost turn) of using it.
The sorcerer example is the only reason I can honestly see to take true strike. The downside being there just aren't that many to hit spells available to sorcerers.
Your second point though, you can't continually cast true strike on an opponent when you suspect a combat. The range is only 30 feet and you are actively casting a spell which is noticeable. You would have to use subtle on true strike for every casting. You'd be better off quickening it, but that gets back to the first point.
So you would give up an entire round of attacking or hiding or moving to a more advantageous position or some combination in order to cast true strike.
Remember True Strike only has a range of 30 feet. You're already in melee range.
At times yes.
For example - let's say I my 11th level Rogue is poisioned or frightened and has disadvantage can't get sneak attack because of that. So attack with disadvantage this turn and next turn and do 1d8+dex on each if you hit. Or pull out your truestrike scroll and ready an action to use it right before your next turn, then true strike cancels the disadvantage and as long as the enemy is engaged you can sneak attack and do 1d8+6d6+dex on a straight up roll.
As for moving, you can move into a more advantageous position and you can even use cunning action dash if you want.
Like I said it is situational, but there definitely are situations where it will be useful.
So you would give up an entire round of attacking or hiding or moving to a more advantageous position or some combination in order to cast true strike.
Remember True Strike only has a range of 30 feet. You're already in melee range.
At times yes.
For example - let's say I my 11th level Rogue is poisioned or frightened and has disadvantage can't get sneak attack because of that. So attack with disadvantage this turn and next turn and do 1d8+dex on each if you hit. Or pull out your truestrike scroll and ready an action to use it right before your next turn, then true strike cancels the disadvantage and as long as the enemy is engaged you can sneak attack and do 1d8+6d6+dex on a straight up roll.
As for moving, you can move into a more advantageous position and you can even use cunning action dash if you want.
Like I said it is situational, but there definitely are situations where it will be useful.
You're stretching. Since the enemy is engaged, that 11th level rogue can use steady aim this turn and get sneak attack and then again next turn.
There are a very small number of situations where true strike would be nice. However you have to consider what you're giving up in order to use it.
Look at the spell, it takes a full action to use, it has a range of 30 feet and it is concentration.
Full action - without quicken it is a full action in order to cast. This means for the rogue that's usually giving up an attack, more than likely a sneak attack at that.
Range 30' - you have to be in melee range in order to use it (30' is melee since most creatures move it or greater). After casting, if you or the target move more than 30' from each other the spell (action) is wasted.
Concentration - immediately drop concentration on any other spell you've got up and then true strike has a duration of 1 round. You can't cast and hold it for later. Admittedly if you're not a primary caster this may not be that great of an issue, but even arcane tricksters tend to like concentration spells.
I'm not saying true strike is completely worthless (just mostly ~98%). To make use of it at all required specific subclasses and even then it mostly comes down to corner cases. The only three non-specialized multiclass options I can think of are: Fighter Eldritch knight's war magic, Wizard bladesinger extra attack and a sorcerer that quickens and cast a to hit spell.
If you've got some odd rogue/sorcerer/wizard/feat build that you want true strike then take it. But if you're going mostly rogue you're going to find you always have better rogue only options.
War Magic seems like it can use true strike, but it actually can't; the cantrip explicitly applies to an attack next turn, not this turn. War Magic does let you still get at least one attack in when casting it, keeping the turn from being a total loss, but you're still giving up 0-3 attacks just to make one attack more likely to land.
Your second point though, you can't continually cast true strike on an opponent when you suspect a combat. The range is only 30 feet and you are actively casting a spell which is noticeable. You would have to use subtle on true strike for every casting. You'd be better off quickening it, but that gets back to the first point.
You don't need advantage if you're planning to attack from a distance as we already have Steady Aim for that (Tasha's Cauldron) or simply being hidden, that example is for melee striking a target at close range when they can see you so 30 feet should be plenty. As for the casting being noticeable, the only visible component of True Strike is that you must point at the target (somatic), but you can hide that (e.g- within a coat or pocket), or do it brazenly as part of dialogue, in a threatening manner, or just like a weirdo. There is no way for the enemy to know that you're casting anything unless they use Detect Magic, as it's indistinguishable from just pointing.
The point is that you do it in the round before combat begins; it's really no different to casting Guidance speculatively for advantage on initiative (since it's an ability check), or Blade Ward expecting to be hit and so-on. Since cantrips are free you might as well do it as worst case you don't gain any benefit but it also didn't cost you anything. You just need to be clear with your DM that that's what you are doing.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
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Casting is obvious but the effect may not be. I know what is in the PHB, which is conveniently ignored by the rest of the book. But, if casting isn't obvious, then what is the point of subtle spell or counterspell?
Hello there. You have probably heard how bad True Strike is. However, it has one VERY important use. The arcane trickster roque can take true strike as a cantrip. They can use this to use their sneak attack, providing an actual use to True Strike.
Lets summon archdevils
Platymaster of the Church (Cult) of the Platypus
Arachnapriest of the Guild of Spiders
Disclaimer: Underfan8 is not to be held responsible for any of the following events happening as a result of talking to Underfan8, touching Underfan8, or even just seeing Underfan8: The rise of Tiamat, resurrection of vecna, pissed of genies, a complete and udder power change in the blood war, or a fate worse than a fate worse than total annihilation. Exist with Underfan8 at you own risk.
There are other, better ways of gaining advantage. True strike costs an action, requires concentration (which could get in the way of other spells the arcane trickster might want to have going), and doesn't grant advantage until the next turn. Even if the arcane trickster quickens it via sorcerer dip or metamagic adept feat, it still only grants advantage on the next turn.
Instead of casting true strike, any rogue, regardless of subclass, can:
Arcane tricksters have cunning action and stealth (bonus action to hide) or steady aim (bonus + move) will give advantage. Either option gives advantage for an attack that is over 30' away where true strike is limited to 30'.
What scenario do you think would make true strike a better option?
It''s a nice utility spell to get a fair knowledge of the Resistences and Inmunities of the selected target. So the only use is, as a reaction ( and there're only few spells here ) you can cast a defensive spell or try to Dash, to try getting a BA.
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Dertinus Tristany // Amilcar Barca // Vicenç Sacrarius // Oriol Deulofeu // Grovtuk
How does true strike give any knowledge of the resistances or immunities?
It also takes an action to cast the spell, unless you dip sorcerer or take the feat and even then casting it is a bonus action. Which, as an arcane trickster you can already use to get advantage.
Its one of the most useless low level spells in the game. The DM would have to create a situation where it would be used, not useful, just used.
A better question is why is this in the Wizards class forum?
I guess because it's a wizard spell? Idk.
This is not exactly true. Cunning action only gives advantage if the Rogue is heavily obscured and only then if he rolls higher on stealth than his opponents passive perception. Steady aim only works if you don't need to move at all, which is kind of rare and almost never for a melee-oriented Rogue. There are many times niether of these will be possible and more still where they are possible but he fails his stealth check.
I do agree that there are much better cantrip options than true strike, but I could see getting it on a scroll for this use. If I was going to use true strike I would use it as a readied action to execute right before my next turn so I did not have to carry the concentration for the whole round.
In my experience True Strike is mostly useful when you know you're going to cast a big attack spell and don't want to miss (because missing sucks hard when it wastes a higher level slot).
You might take it on a Sorcerer with Quickened Spell, because you can setup advantage for your next turn and still cast whatever you want during the current turn; it's a bit expensive on sorcery points though, and thanks to Tasha's Cauldron you may be better off just taking Seeking Spell (re-roll a miss for two sorcery points). However, you can also combine the two for maximum hit chance (it's a whopping 4 SP but that's for advantage with re-roll, and only if you need the latter), plus we don't get that many metamagic choices, so if True Strike saves one then it may not be a terrible trade if you need it a lot.
The other main case is for an opening attack; True Strike is a cantrip so you can cast it as often as you like. If you know or suspect a combat is coming, and can see the target you want to go for, you can just tell your DM that you're constantly casting it, so when combat begins you have advantage right away. This case can work for a melee Arcane Trickster specifically if you're being confronted by enemies you expect to attack you, as you can get advantage in the first round while standing right in front of them. It may also be good just to have in case sneaking up to a target goes poorly (i.e- you're trying to hide for advantage but the enemy's perception roll beat your stealth).
Overall it's not the easiest cantrip to recommend; you have to have a very specific idea in mind of what you want it for. I can see its uses on an Arcane Trickster but I wouldn't take it personally because we get so few cantrip choices. This is the same reason I wouldn't normally take it on a Wizard, not at lower levels anyway. At higher levels I might take it for when I know I want to use a big attack spell, but I'd prefer it on a sorcerer where you can counteract the cost (in a lost turn) of using it.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
This actually may be a reasonable use for an AT. use cunning action to try and hide and if you fail, then use your action to cast true strike instead of attacking for base weapon damage only.
You basically ensure a sneak attack the next turn as long as you don't lose concentration.
I still think it is a very high price to pay, especially when you only get to choose 2 cantrips.
It could, theoretically, be put to a functional use on a bladsinger. They could Extra Attack, using attack action to both attack and cast this cantrip. Then, on the next turn burn a higher level slot on a targeted spell. Would this be an 'optimized' strategy? No. Would it be super strong? No. Would it be one of the very few semi-functional ways to try to force this cantrip into normal play? Yeah.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
You're right, in that using it on an AT a couple seconds before you personally initiate combat with a sneak attack is one of the optimal uses of true strike. And it can be good at that, for sure, especially when there's high a chance that your stealth might be broken; sure, you could use a bit of cunning play to get the advantage next turn, but sacrificing an action before combat begins leaves you free to Dash or Disengage after landing your hit.
...The problem is just that there are very few cases where this is both necessary, and an improvement over doing something else this turn. True strike needs to be used before combat, combat has to start within 6 seconds of using true strike, you need to be at risk of losing all other sources of advantage or sneak attack within those 6 seconds, at absolute minimum; if including TCE content, you need to be in a position that forces you to expend your bonus action on Dash, Disengage, or attempting to Hide again after attacking, too. There are situations where it's the absolute best thing you could do with your action, it's just that those situations are insanely rare.
Even in this corner case though. I can cast true strike now to have or I can cast mage hand and use my bonus to try to steal an enemies weapon before combat begins AND I have my hand out and available for bonus actions the entire combat.
So you would give up an entire round of attacking or hiding or moving to a more advantageous position or some combination in order to cast true strike.
Remember True Strike only has a range of 30 feet. You're already in melee range.
The sorcerer example is the only reason I can honestly see to take true strike. The downside being there just aren't that many to hit spells available to sorcerers.
Your second point though, you can't continually cast true strike on an opponent when you suspect a combat. The range is only 30 feet and you are actively casting a spell which is noticeable. You would have to use subtle on true strike for every casting. You'd be better off quickening it, but that gets back to the first point.
At times yes.
For example - let's say I my 11th level Rogue is poisioned or frightened and has disadvantage can't get sneak attack because of that. So attack with disadvantage this turn and next turn and do 1d8+dex on each if you hit. Or pull out your truestrike scroll and ready an action to use it right before your next turn, then true strike cancels the disadvantage and as long as the enemy is engaged you can sneak attack and do 1d8+6d6+dex on a straight up roll.
As for moving, you can move into a more advantageous position and you can even use cunning action dash if you want.
Like I said it is situational, but there definitely are situations where it will be useful.
You're stretching. Since the enemy is engaged, that 11th level rogue can use steady aim this turn and get sneak attack and then again next turn.
There are a very small number of situations where true strike would be nice. However you have to consider what you're giving up in order to use it.
Look at the spell, it takes a full action to use, it has a range of 30 feet and it is concentration.
Full action - without quicken it is a full action in order to cast. This means for the rogue that's usually giving up an attack, more than likely a sneak attack at that.
Range 30' - you have to be in melee range in order to use it (30' is melee since most creatures move it or greater). After casting, if you or the target move more than 30' from each other the spell (action) is wasted.
Concentration - immediately drop concentration on any other spell you've got up and then true strike has a duration of 1 round. You can't cast and hold it for later. Admittedly if you're not a primary caster this may not be that great of an issue, but even arcane tricksters tend to like concentration spells.
I'm not saying true strike is completely worthless (just mostly ~98%). To make use of it at all required specific subclasses and even then it mostly comes down to corner cases. The only three non-specialized multiclass options I can think of are: Fighter Eldritch knight's war magic, Wizard bladesinger extra attack and a sorcerer that quickens and cast a to hit spell.
If you've got some odd rogue/sorcerer/wizard/feat build that you want true strike then take it. But if you're going mostly rogue you're going to find you always have better rogue only options.
War Magic seems like it can use true strike, but it actually can't; the cantrip explicitly applies to an attack next turn, not this turn. War Magic does let you still get at least one attack in when casting it, keeping the turn from being a total loss, but you're still giving up 0-3 attacks just to make one attack more likely to land.
For war magic you attack and cast then next round get adv on your first attack, assuming the targwt is still valid.
I'm not suggesting this just saying it could work.
You don't need advantage if you're planning to attack from a distance as we already have Steady Aim for that (Tasha's Cauldron) or simply being hidden, that example is for melee striking a target at close range when they can see you so 30 feet should be plenty. As for the casting being noticeable, the only visible component of True Strike is that you must point at the target (somatic), but you can hide that (e.g- within a coat or pocket), or do it brazenly as part of dialogue, in a threatening manner, or just like a weirdo. There is no way for the enemy to know that you're casting anything unless they use Detect Magic, as it's indistinguishable from just pointing.
The point is that you do it in the round before combat begins; it's really no different to casting Guidance speculatively for advantage on initiative (since it's an ability check), or Blade Ward expecting to be hit and so-on. Since cantrips are free you might as well do it as worst case you don't gain any benefit but it also didn't cost you anything. You just need to be clear with your DM that that's what you are doing.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
Casting is obvious but the effect may not be. I know what is in the PHB, which is conveniently ignored by the rest of the book. But, if casting isn't obvious, then what is the point of subtle spell or counterspell?