I have been pondering something rather intriguing.
Traditionally, half-elves tend to be of mixed human and elven heritage. However, there seems to be no inherent reason restricting half-elves from embracing more diverse parentage, be it elf/orc, elf/goblin, elf/halfling, or even the exotic combination of elf/elf, like a sun elf and a sea elf.
Have any of you ventured into the realm of unconventional half-elves in your roleplaying exploits?
XD.
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A caffeinated nerd who has played TTRPGs or a number of years and is very much a fantasy adventure geek.
Partly because back in the day it was more or less the only option; dwarves and elves had enough species/culture clash to largely preclude intimate relationships, halflings and gnomes have generally been something of afterthoughts in larger lore, and the chief deities for both the elves and orcs basically agreed that they hate each other too much to allow an orc/elf hybrid to be conceived. Thus of the long-standing core races, only humans stood out as viable partners, per the general lore. Plus there’s just the fact that the material was written from a human perspective and riffing off of Tolkien. I believe some later materials had rules/options for creating other hybrids, but by the the time 5e got rolling WotC became aware that the whole “hybrid races with mixed traits” thing can be tied to some unfortunate implications, so they didn’t write any game material for it after the PHB and are now in the process of phasing it going forward with the UA guidelines on mixed race characters.
There is no reason your 1/2 elf can't be form a traditionally 1/2 elven community (village, town, etc) with their own culture and traditions. So maybe your ancestors were half elven going back a bunch of generations and found or founded a village or 1/2 elves.
So the dragonlance novels has a great line which may not accompany everyone's thought process is a good starting point.
Tanis Half-Elven is a main character of the series and has a line directed at him about this situation. In the first book of the trilogy that starts off the series he is asked by someone who will become on of his companions, Riverwind, "Why is it that you are called half-elf and not half-man?"
Tanis' answer is simple: "According to humans, half an elf is but part of a whole being. Half a man is a cripple."
Granted while he gave this answer to Riverwind (a barbarian human), you could see the see the fact that the elves he originated with did not feel his statement at all, they despised what he was, especially those who were bigots who dislike the human race and blamed them for the misfortunes of the world.
Regardless of the match up you would have the same issue/differing viewpoints from the world around you, depending on the environment the characters/players were in,.
I have been pondering something rather intriguing.
Traditionally, half-elves tend to be of mixed human and elven heritage. However, there seems to be no inherent reason restricting half-elves from embracing more diverse parentage, be it elf/orc, elf/goblin, elf/halfling, or even the exotic combination of elf/elf, like a sun elf and a sea elf.
Have any of you ventured into the realm of unconventional half-elves in your roleplaying exploits?
XD.
I've seen players play elf/tiefling in two separate games.
But half-elf and half-orc normally being part human is because that's the way the game wrote it, since at least AD&D, and I'm pretty sure the reason for that was that ripping offhomaging Tolkien was a design goal of the early versions of the game, and Tolkien only had half-elves and (possibly, depending on how you read it) half-orcs.
Humans have been considered particularly fecund since the origins of the game. Between that and being such a large slice of the overall population, it’s simple math: more humans than other races + humans more likely to make babies with anything = more half human whatevers
Probably for the same reason why the most popular race is Human, and by a large margin at almost twice as common as second place, which is an Elf. It therefore makes perfect sense that the most common combination would be...Human/Elf. Especially when you add in that it's the only one with official mechanical support and it happens to be one of the strongest choices (of mixes or plain) for a race in the game.
You could start talking about how having Human aspect makes it easier to roleplay while the Elf provides an exotic aspect etc etc, but I'm pretty sure that my first paragraph covers the bulk of the reason. They're the most popular races and the only mixed heritage to be mechanically supported.
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If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
Thinking about it and looking over the races, there’s also the fact that of 5 long-running core races, humans are the only ones with a lifespan that’s not comparable to that of the elves. Even halflings can pull two and a half centuries, whereas a default human gets 80-100, tops. Thus half elves of human/elf lineage get the sharp contrast of vastly outliving one side while falling far short of the other, whereas with the other three an extra century or two of life is noteworthy, but it doesn’t generally represent an entire era for them the way it does for humans. Thus the combination produces significant thematic weight that the others don’t.
Yes, I have come across unconventional half-elves. In one of my first 5e games a player was half-elf with elf & dwarf parentage.
People usually play half-elves as being half-human because they usually are. If one of the parents is an orc then it's a half-orc. If both of the parents are elves, even with different types of elves, then it's still an elf.
Traditionally goblins have been ugly and completely evil so there'd be no reason for any elf to breed with one. That's how reproduction works. You hook up with what you find attractive. It's only been in the last few years that non-evil goblins have come about.
I agree with many of you; although it would be cool to see more mixes among different species, not just humans.
I was thinking about creating a half-elf with a unique lineage and realised most half-elves usually have elf and human parents. That got me wondering why there are so few mixes with other species. It's a bit sad because I'd love to see more diversity.
Like the one I was thinking of creating: a half-elf with halfling and elf parents.
I was looking at the half-elf thinking, is there anything specific to humans in here, that would preclude me from just using it and saying my half-elf was halfling/elf, when I realised that there actually wasn’t.
Thats what got me wondering why we don’t see more people playing half elves with a not human parent.
Yeah it's partly a lack of adventurousness. It's described as half human, so therefore...
The other aspect is that it's much easier to integrate a relatively known mentality (human) with one exotic (elf) than it is to integrate two exotic ones.
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If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
To my mind, everyone always plays all races as being at least 75% human. And for good reason: We don't actually have any other races, so either we invent everything from mannerisms to language to daily routine to biology from scratch - or we base most everything on humans. Elves are just a prettified version of how human in a forest, orcs are a un-prettified version of savage tribals, and so on. Pick a few traits and change them to something ... visibly not human, then keep everything else.
This, by the way, is not to criticize anyone or anything, I believe it's unavoidable - and also good. I'd never have the patience for another player explaining all the ways in which his imaginary race is just so-so different from humans. And it leaves room for a very few truly weird and inhuman races, like mind flayers. Or ... um ... beholders. Or ... I dunno, I want to say aarackocra, but I've never seen them fleshed out enough to actually be that. But you know - stranger races.
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Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
Humans and Elves kinda stick to the "rules of symmetry" at their "peaks" of beauty and at their apex they're both attractive to look at, so... Dwarves on the other hand are "bottom heavy" to these human eyes and often the women folk have beards too. Orcs can tend towards gnarly scars or aggressive and intimidating features. The other races can be various combos of the above and I think that's maybe why D&D's got the popularity it has - you can be the idealised version of yourself and that's a gross generalisation based upon my experience of how humans are, but hey it's a make believe game and I want to be a dashing, heroic elven Bard.
I play with a good-natured Orc Guard, doggedly trying to save the world he's in, a Bugbear Warlock - bound to a pact they don't want (that's more like a curse) and a bewildered Dragonborn, very unsure of themselves in a conflicted world. They're a good bunch + fun to DM for/play with.
In "current Campaign" I've had three different Jack Sparrows presented... and it's my fault... The first, I was returning to D&D after Covid and just "didn't think", the second sneaked up on me and it became quite clear what they were doing (but only after a few sessions) and the third was just "no, sorry". I am lucky to be with the party I am, but that 4th space that would make work commitments + holidays and stuff a lot easier to work around scheduling... I'd kill for a PC that excites me that isn't a Mary/Marvin Sue.
Traditionally, half-anything* had to be human on the other side (half-elf, half-orc, even half-dwarves.) Offspring from other pairings like orc-elves and gnome-dwarves just didn't exist and were deemed impossible. The core book dropping later this year will have guidelines to make any pairing possible as long as they're humanoid.
Usually that's what's presumed in the lore & the art.
Personally speaking I enjoy the idea that humans can breed with anyone lol, like that's their only actually fantastical ability they have. It also makes humans special in a way like that. I'm not really a fan of other hybrids for these reasons, yeah I know everyone wants those dope elf traits and to make their half-angel half-demon half-giant 3/12ths tabaxi 2/16ths brass dragon 1/5th high elf void warrior fighter/gloomstalker ranger/assassin rogue multiclass monstrosity cheese or wants to embody some form of realism akin to our world, but I much more prefer (at least in the mechanics/official lore & products) for this particular niche to be protected just cuz it tickles me tbh.
The simple answer is because a lot of Tolkien's fanbase finds elves sexy, plus a lot of those fans then migrated to become fans of D&D and AD&D. Since D&D is a power fantasy wish-fulfilment for many of the players, a lot of them find it easier to imagine being the children of an elf and a human rather than the child of an elf and any other "race."
The simple answer is because a lot of Tolkien's fanbase finds elves sexy, plus a lot of those fans then migrated to become fans of D&D and AD&D. Since D&D is a power fantasy wish-fulfilment for many of the players, a lot of them find it easier to imagine being the children of an elf and a human rather than the child of an elf and any other "race."
The only half-races in Tolkien's writing are half-elves and half-orcs (Uruk-hai). Both those races made it into D&D. Elves are considered sexy, but orcs? If half orcs, why not half dwarves, or half-halflings and why only human for the other half regardless? The answer is simply 'Because.'
The 'Because' being people are hooked on the stuff that Tolkien was selling them back whenever they first got introduced to fantasy lit and never considered if his rules made sense in a completely different setting. The "Because" is the way that nostalgia influences people to think in particular ways related to fond memories and to hold onto those habits whether or not (often not) they continue to function for an altogether different place and time.
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Greetings,
I have been pondering something rather intriguing.
Traditionally, half-elves tend to be of mixed human and elven heritage. However, there seems to be no inherent reason restricting half-elves from embracing more diverse parentage, be it elf/orc, elf/goblin, elf/halfling, or even the exotic combination of elf/elf, like a sun elf and a sea elf.
Have any of you ventured into the realm of unconventional half-elves in your roleplaying exploits?
XD.
A caffeinated nerd who has played TTRPGs or a number of years and is very much a fantasy adventure geek.
Partly because back in the day it was more or less the only option; dwarves and elves had enough species/culture clash to largely preclude intimate relationships, halflings and gnomes have generally been something of afterthoughts in larger lore, and the chief deities for both the elves and orcs basically agreed that they hate each other too much to allow an orc/elf hybrid to be conceived. Thus of the long-standing core races, only humans stood out as viable partners, per the general lore. Plus there’s just the fact that the material was written from a human perspective and riffing off of Tolkien. I believe some later materials had rules/options for creating other hybrids, but by the the time 5e got rolling WotC became aware that the whole “hybrid races with mixed traits” thing can be tied to some unfortunate implications, so they didn’t write any game material for it after the PHB and are now in the process of phasing it going forward with the UA guidelines on mixed race characters.
There is no reason your 1/2 elf can't be form a traditionally 1/2 elven community (village, town, etc) with their own culture and traditions. So maybe your ancestors were half elven going back a bunch of generations and found or founded a village or 1/2 elves.
Food, Scifi/fantasy, anime, DND 5E and OSR geek.
So the dragonlance novels has a great line which may not accompany everyone's thought process is a good starting point.
Tanis Half-Elven is a main character of the series and has a line directed at him about this situation. In the first book of the trilogy that starts off the series he is asked by someone who will become on of his companions, Riverwind, "Why is it that you are called half-elf and not half-man?"
Tanis' answer is simple: "According to humans, half an elf is but part of a whole being. Half a man is a cripple."
Granted while he gave this answer to Riverwind (a barbarian human), you could see the see the fact that the elves he originated with did not feel his statement at all, they despised what he was, especially those who were bigots who dislike the human race and blamed them for the misfortunes of the world.
Regardless of the match up you would have the same issue/differing viewpoints from the world around you, depending on the environment the characters/players were in,.
I've seen players play elf/tiefling in two separate games.
But half-elf and half-orc normally being part human is because that's the way the game wrote it, since at least AD&D, and I'm pretty sure the reason for that was that
ripping offhomaging Tolkien was a design goal of the early versions of the game, and Tolkien only had half-elves and (possibly, depending on how you read it) half-orcs.An half-elves originate from human and elf as per PHB, so most do but i played half-drow/duargar in an Underdark campaign before.
I also once played a Fey'ri, some half-demon as a result of interbreeding between a sun elf and tanar'ri.
Humans have been considered particularly fecund since the origins of the game. Between that and being such a large slice of the overall population, it’s simple math: more humans than other races + humans more likely to make babies with anything = more half human whatevers
Probably for the same reason why the most popular race is Human, and by a large margin at almost twice as common as second place, which is an Elf. It therefore makes perfect sense that the most common combination would be...Human/Elf. Especially when you add in that it's the only one with official mechanical support and it happens to be one of the strongest choices (of mixes or plain) for a race in the game.
You could start talking about how having Human aspect makes it easier to roleplay while the Elf provides an exotic aspect etc etc, but I'm pretty sure that my first paragraph covers the bulk of the reason. They're the most popular races and the only mixed heritage to be mechanically supported.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
Thinking about it and looking over the races, there’s also the fact that of 5 long-running core races, humans are the only ones with a lifespan that’s not comparable to that of the elves. Even halflings can pull two and a half centuries, whereas a default human gets 80-100, tops. Thus half elves of human/elf lineage get the sharp contrast of vastly outliving one side while falling far short of the other, whereas with the other three an extra century or two of life is noteworthy, but it doesn’t generally represent an entire era for them the way it does for humans. Thus the combination produces significant thematic weight that the others don’t.
Yes, I have come across unconventional half-elves. In one of my first 5e games a player was half-elf with elf & dwarf parentage.
People usually play half-elves as being half-human because they usually are. If one of the parents is an orc then it's a half-orc. If both of the parents are elves, even with different types of elves, then it's still an elf.
Traditionally goblins have been ugly and completely evil so there'd be no reason for any elf to breed with one. That's how reproduction works. You hook up with what you find attractive. It's only been in the last few years that non-evil goblins have come about.
Interesting thoughts, everyone.
I agree with many of you; although it would be cool to see more mixes among different species, not just humans.
I was thinking about creating a half-elf with a unique lineage and realised most half-elves usually have elf and human parents. That got me wondering why there are so few mixes with other species. It's a bit sad because I'd love to see more diversity.
Like the one I was thinking of creating: a half-elf with halfling and elf parents.
I was looking at the half-elf thinking, is there anything specific to humans in here, that would preclude me from just using it and saying my half-elf was halfling/elf, when I realised that there actually wasn’t.
Thats what got me wondering why we don’t see more people playing half elves with a not human parent.
A caffeinated nerd who has played TTRPGs or a number of years and is very much a fantasy adventure geek.
Yeah it's partly a lack of adventurousness. It's described as half human, so therefore...
The other aspect is that it's much easier to integrate a relatively known mentality (human) with one exotic (elf) than it is to integrate two exotic ones.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
To my mind, everyone always plays all races as being at least 75% human. And for good reason: We don't actually have any other races, so either we invent everything from mannerisms to language to daily routine to biology from scratch - or we base most everything on humans. Elves are just a prettified version of how human in a forest, orcs are a un-prettified version of savage tribals, and so on. Pick a few traits and change them to something ... visibly not human, then keep everything else.
This, by the way, is not to criticize anyone or anything, I believe it's unavoidable - and also good. I'd never have the patience for another player explaining all the ways in which his imaginary race is just so-so different from humans. And it leaves room for a very few truly weird and inhuman races, like mind flayers. Or ... um ... beholders. Or ... I dunno, I want to say aarackocra, but I've never seen them fleshed out enough to actually be that. But you know - stranger races.
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
Humans and Elves kinda stick to the "rules of symmetry" at their "peaks" of beauty and at their apex they're both attractive to look at, so...
Dwarves on the other hand are "bottom heavy" to these human eyes and often the women folk have beards too.
Orcs can tend towards gnarly scars or aggressive and intimidating features.
The other races can be various combos of the above and I think that's maybe why D&D's got the popularity it has - you can be the idealised version of yourself and that's a gross generalisation based upon my experience of how humans are, but hey it's a make believe game and I want to be a dashing, heroic elven Bard.
I play with a good-natured Orc Guard, doggedly trying to save the world he's in, a Bugbear Warlock - bound to a pact they don't want (that's more like a curse) and a bewildered Dragonborn, very unsure of themselves in a conflicted world. They're a good bunch + fun to DM for/play with.
In "current Campaign" I've had three different Jack Sparrows presented... and it's my fault... The first, I was returning to D&D after Covid and just "didn't think", the second sneaked up on me and it became quite clear what they were doing (but only after a few sessions) and the third was just "no, sorry".
I am lucky to be with the party I am, but that 4th space that would make work commitments + holidays and stuff a lot easier to work around scheduling... I'd kill for a PC that excites me that isn't a Mary/Marvin Sue.
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Traditionally, half-anything* had to be human on the other side (half-elf, half-orc, even half-dwarves.) Offspring from other pairings like orc-elves and gnome-dwarves just didn't exist and were deemed impossible. The core book dropping later this year will have guidelines to make any pairing possible as long as they're humanoid.
*except halfling, obviously
Usually that's what's presumed in the lore & the art.
Personally speaking I enjoy the idea that humans can breed with anyone lol, like that's their only actually fantastical ability they have. It also makes humans special in a way like that. I'm not really a fan of other hybrids for these reasons, yeah I know everyone wants those dope elf traits and to make their half-angel half-demon half-giant 3/12ths tabaxi 2/16ths brass dragon 1/5th high elf void warrior fighter/gloomstalker ranger/assassin rogue multiclass monstrosity cheese or wants to embody some form of realism akin to our world, but I much more prefer (at least in the mechanics/official lore & products) for this particular niche to be protected just cuz it tickles me tbh.
Er ek geng, þat er í þeim skóm er ek valda.
UwU
I play my half-dragon (dragonborn) as being half-elf.
weren't they shunned from certain elven society? I recall reading that not all elven subraces cared for half-elfs.
Plus we are humans. Easyer
The simple answer is because a lot of Tolkien's fanbase finds elves sexy, plus a lot of those fans then migrated to become fans of D&D and AD&D. Since D&D is a power fantasy wish-fulfilment for many of the players, a lot of them find it easier to imagine being the children of an elf and a human rather than the child of an elf and any other "race."
The 'Because' being people are hooked on the stuff that Tolkien was selling them back whenever they first got introduced to fantasy lit and never considered if his rules made sense in a completely different setting. The "Because" is the way that nostalgia influences people to think in particular ways related to fond memories and to hold onto those habits whether or not (often not) they continue to function for an altogether different place and time.