I'm trying to DM for the first time for a party of two, who are both basically brand new to D&D. I've played D&D very casually in the past a few times, but it's closer to zero experience than anything meaningful. But I'm trying to find a good beginner friendly 4e adventure that I can ideally do for free or cheap. I want something short and sweet that acts as a good test run of the games mechanics while still allowing the players the freedom to do what they want without feeling like they're on rails, all while still maintaining my sanity.
4th edition? Interesting choice for a game to start with, and a party of 2 is going to be tough. It does have pretty functional encounter building rules, though, so it's pretty easy to build some encounters.
I didn't care for 4e as a system but there was some excellent adventure writing done for it, mainly because some of the most renowned adventure writers from the old school days were still involved in WotC at the time. There is some pretty good stuff to choose from. In fact, one could argue that the best adventures ever written were written for 4th edition.
Reavers of Harkenwold (2 part adventure) came with the Essentials Kit Box and it is hands down one of the coolest non-linear adventures ever written. It can be a bit tough to get a hold because I don't think it was ever published outside of this set.. that is, unless you know how to use ... the internet. It was written Richard Baker, hands down one of the best writers either TSR or WotC ever had.
Orcs of Stonefang Pass (slightly higher level adventure) but its much shorter and might actually be what your looking for if you want to test drive 4e as a system. There is a lot of fighting in this adventure and the players usually can't just "take it on", they need a plan. I wouldn't call it "great writing" in the way I would Reavers of Harkenwold as a story, but I think the adventure has a lot of fun and interesting challenges that go beyond "kick the door down and kill everyone".
Murder In Baldur's Gate - This was made for 3.5, 4e and for the Next playtest, but it was written by Ed Greenwood and features a mystery to solve. I think this might be very good for two players since its really a lot more investigation and putting clues together kind of adventure. Very well done and lots of fun, I've run it several times over the years, it's actually very system agnostic.
Why would you start with older rules? In 5e we have two sets of rules that are 10 years apart.
You are better off starting with the latest rules edition. Because if you have any questions on rules, not sure how helpful a community could be due to the the low number of people that would actually know the rule.
There are a several free 5e adventures and would probably be easier to find.
Why would you start with older rules? In 5e we have two sets of rules that are 10 years apart.
You are better off starting with the latest rules edition. Because if you have any questions on rules, not sure how helpful a community could be due to the the low number of people that would actually know the rule.
There are a several free 5e adventures and would probably be easier to find.
4e offers a very different play experience to 5e, and some people want that. Also, some people already have the 4e books and don't want to shell out for the 5e. 4e is fine for what it is.
However, you're not incorrect that this isn't the best place for 4e questions. Fortunately, it's not hard to find 4e-dedicated forums on the internet.
(I have played 4e, but it's been a while, and I always hand-roll my adventures, so have no advice for OP, except that, with only two players, you're gonna need to customize encounters to their roles. For instance, if there's no controller, cut down hard on the minions.)
I didn't care for 4e as a system but there was some excellent adventure writing done for it, mainly because some of the most renowned adventure writers from the old school days were still involved in WotC at the time. There is some pretty good stuff to choose from. In fact, one could argue that the best adventures ever written were written for 4th edition.
Reavers of Harkenwold (2 part adventure) came with the Essentials Kit Box and it is hands down one of the coolest non-linear adventures ever written. It can be a bit tough to get a hold because I don't think it was ever published outside of this set.. that is, unless you know how to use ... the internet. It was written Richard Baker, hands down one of the best writers either TSR or WotC ever had.
Orcs of Stonefang Pass (slightly higher level adventure) but its much shorter and might actually be what your looking for if you want to test drive 4e as a system. There is a lot of fighting in this adventure and the players usually can't just "take it on", they need a plan. I wouldn't call it "great writing" in the way I would Reavers of Harkenwold as a story, but I think the adventure has a lot of fun and interesting challenges that go beyond "kick the door down and kill everyone".
Murder In Baldur's Gate - This was made for 3.5, 4e and for the Next playtest, but it was written by Ed Greenwood and features a mystery to solve. I think this might be very good for two players since its really a lot more investigation and putting clues together kind of adventure. Very well done and lots of fun, I've run it several times over the years, it's actually very system agnostic.
Thanks for the reply, I'll check these out, sounds like what I might be looking for.
The 4e books were actually purchased by one of the players I'm going to put on the game for, he researched and came to the conclusion that 4e was the best option. Had I done the research, I would've likely chosen 5e, and in fact, I'm looking forward to getting my hands on some 5e books, but I'll probably still run some 4e for now. Waste not want not.
The 4e books were actually purchased by one of the players I'm going to put on the game for, he researched and came to the conclusion that 4e was the best option. Had I done the research, I would've likely chosen 5e, and in fact, I'm looking forward to getting my hands on some 5e books, but I'll probably still run some 4e for now. Waste not want not.
4e is focussed on detailed tactical combat; it's basically required to play it, and if you're not into that, you probably won't like it. It picked one way to play D&D, and ran with it. It sounds like that's one player's jam. I don't know about you or the other player.
4e also benefits a lot from having computer tools. The official ones are gone, but there are unofficial ones out there. You can do all the work by hand, but it can be a pain, especially if you're lazy.
5e is a less focussed design. You can do tactical combat, but you don't have to. You don't even have to use maps; you can do it all in your imagination. It tries to be all things to all people. It can't, of course, but it's much closer in nature to the pre-4e D&Ds.
While there are reasonable tools for 5e, it's probably easier to run without them. The free rules on this site are also pretty good for trying it out.
I enjoy both. I think 4e is a better design, but I don't always want to play that kind of game. (And neither do many of my potential players.) I currently run and play 5e, but am likely going to spin up a 4e game in the nearish future. (For comparison, I have zero interest in getting back into any of the older editions.)
I'm going to give no consideration to the edition of D&D you're running here and try to put across some experience.
In the last year, I've GMd: D&D 5e, D&D 5.5e, Pirate Borg, Pathfinder, Call of Cthulu, Tales of the Valiant, Pathfinder 1e, Pathfinder 2e, aD&D, OSE, Liminal, Discworld, DC20, Starfinder, Blades in the Dark, and FATE
The system is largely irrelevant to advice I'd give to any GM. The process after all is usually the same. Collaborative storytelling using dice or game mechanics to decide success or failure against challenges presented either by the GM or the adventure. There's also a reason why nearly every well developed and well designed system comes with starter adventures. They are the designer's reference for how they envisioned a system to be played. They also tend to be good standardised introductions to said system.
As a result, I'd highly recommend Keep on the Shadowfell. It is part of a three-adventure arc which was published very early on in 4e's cycle. It's a good way of introducing players to the system. As a bonus, if you all enjoy the adventure and the system you've got Thunderspire Labyrinth and Pyramid of Shadows to which your group can progress.
While I hate, and I mean hate DrivethruRPG it really is the only way of legally obtaining digital copies of the older editions. For physical stuff, Libraries in the UK allow you to request particular books. If you are able to do that in your territory then pop to your local library and request to loan the books.
As a result, I'd highly recommend Keep on the Shadowfell.
Eh... it's functional but I wouldn't say great. I would echo other people's recommendation of Reavers of Harkenwold, but yes, it's obnoxiously hard to get a usable legitimate copy. You can get the adventure from DMs Guild (https://www.dmsguild.com/product/121978/Dungeon-Masters-Kit-4e) but it's missing maps and tokens so it's nearly unusable.
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I'm trying to DM for the first time for a party of two, who are both basically brand new to D&D. I've played D&D very casually in the past a few times, but it's closer to zero experience than anything meaningful. But I'm trying to find a good beginner friendly 4e adventure that I can ideally do for free or cheap. I want something short and sweet that acts as a good test run of the games mechanics while still allowing the players the freedom to do what they want without feeling like they're on rails, all while still maintaining my sanity.
4th edition? Interesting choice for a game to start with, and a party of 2 is going to be tough. It does have pretty functional encounter building rules, though, so it's pretty easy to build some encounters.
I didn't care for 4e as a system but there was some excellent adventure writing done for it, mainly because some of the most renowned adventure writers from the old school days were still involved in WotC at the time. There is some pretty good stuff to choose from. In fact, one could argue that the best adventures ever written were written for 4th edition.
Reavers of Harkenwold (2 part adventure) came with the Essentials Kit Box and it is hands down one of the coolest non-linear adventures ever written. It can be a bit tough to get a hold because I don't think it was ever published outside of this set.. that is, unless you know how to use ... the internet. It was written Richard Baker, hands down one of the best writers either TSR or WotC ever had.
Orcs of Stonefang Pass (slightly higher level adventure) but its much shorter and might actually be what your looking for if you want to test drive 4e as a system. There is a lot of fighting in this adventure and the players usually can't just "take it on", they need a plan. I wouldn't call it "great writing" in the way I would Reavers of Harkenwold as a story, but I think the adventure has a lot of fun and interesting challenges that go beyond "kick the door down and kill everyone".
Murder In Baldur's Gate - This was made for 3.5, 4e and for the Next playtest, but it was written by Ed Greenwood and features a mystery to solve. I think this might be very good for two players since its really a lot more investigation and putting clues together kind of adventure. Very well done and lots of fun, I've run it several times over the years, it's actually very system agnostic.
Why would you start with older rules? In 5e we have two sets of rules that are 10 years apart.
You are better off starting with the latest rules edition. Because if you have any questions on rules, not sure how helpful a community could be due to the the low number of people that would actually know the rule.
There are a several free 5e adventures and would probably be easier to find.
4e offers a very different play experience to 5e, and some people want that. Also, some people already have the 4e books and don't want to shell out for the 5e. 4e is fine for what it is.
However, you're not incorrect that this isn't the best place for 4e questions. Fortunately, it's not hard to find 4e-dedicated forums on the internet.
(I have played 4e, but it's been a while, and I always hand-roll my adventures, so have no advice for OP, except that, with only two players, you're gonna need to customize encounters to their roles. For instance, if there's no controller, cut down hard on the minions.)
Thanks for the reply, I'll check these out, sounds like what I might be looking for.
The 4e books were actually purchased by one of the players I'm going to put on the game for, he researched and came to the conclusion that 4e was the best option. Had I done the research, I would've likely chosen 5e, and in fact, I'm looking forward to getting my hands on some 5e books, but I'll probably still run some 4e for now. Waste not want not.
I will say, while it's not a particularly deep or clever adventure, the dungeon crawl in the DMG is a functional introduction to game mechanics.
4e is focussed on detailed tactical combat; it's basically required to play it, and if you're not into that, you probably won't like it. It picked one way to play D&D, and ran with it. It sounds like that's one player's jam. I don't know about you or the other player.
4e also benefits a lot from having computer tools. The official ones are gone, but there are unofficial ones out there. You can do all the work by hand, but it can be a pain, especially if you're lazy.
5e is a less focussed design. You can do tactical combat, but you don't have to. You don't even have to use maps; you can do it all in your imagination. It tries to be all things to all people. It can't, of course, but it's much closer in nature to the pre-4e D&Ds.
While there are reasonable tools for 5e, it's probably easier to run without them. The free rules on this site are also pretty good for trying it out.
I enjoy both. I think 4e is a better design, but I don't always want to play that kind of game. (And neither do many of my potential players.) I currently run and play 5e, but am likely going to spin up a 4e game in the nearish future. (For comparison, I have zero interest in getting back into any of the older editions.)
I'm going to give no consideration to the edition of D&D you're running here and try to put across some experience.
In the last year, I've GMd: D&D 5e, D&D 5.5e, Pirate Borg, Pathfinder, Call of Cthulu, Tales of the Valiant, Pathfinder 1e, Pathfinder 2e, aD&D, OSE, Liminal, Discworld, DC20, Starfinder, Blades in the Dark, and FATE
The system is largely irrelevant to advice I'd give to any GM. The process after all is usually the same. Collaborative storytelling using dice or game mechanics to decide success or failure against challenges presented either by the GM or the adventure. There's also a reason why nearly every well developed and well designed system comes with starter adventures. They are the designer's reference for how they envisioned a system to be played. They also tend to be good standardised introductions to said system.
As a result, I'd highly recommend Keep on the Shadowfell. It is part of a three-adventure arc which was published very early on in 4e's cycle. It's a good way of introducing players to the system. As a bonus, if you all enjoy the adventure and the system you've got Thunderspire Labyrinth and Pyramid of Shadows to which your group can progress.
While I hate, and I mean hate DrivethruRPG it really is the only way of legally obtaining digital copies of the older editions. For physical stuff, Libraries in the UK allow you to request particular books. If you are able to do that in your territory then pop to your local library and request to loan the books.
DM session planning template - My version of maps for 'Lost Mine of Phandelver' - Send your party to The Circus - Other DM Resources - Maps, Tokens, Quests - 'Better' Player Character Injury Tables?
Actor, Writer, Director & Teacher by day - GM/DM in my off hours.
Eh... it's functional but I wouldn't say great. I would echo other people's recommendation of Reavers of Harkenwold, but yes, it's obnoxiously hard to get a usable legitimate copy. You can get the adventure from DMs Guild (https://www.dmsguild.com/product/121978/Dungeon-Masters-Kit-4e) but it's missing maps and tokens so it's nearly unusable.