Tl;dr: one of my players is a CN Tiefling Monk who is schizophrenic who triggers when he sees blood and goes into a violent murderous rage, in the middle of waterdeep.
Soooo, we're doing Waterdeep Dragon Heist. I prepped for about a month and a half for the first 3 sessions with wiggle room. The plan was to have 5 players, the day came, and there were 3. For the first 2 and a half hours they scrambled together new characters. I got a CN Human Sorceress with the charlatan background, ok fine. A LG Dwarf Paladin with the knight background, ok sweet. And then I got a CN Tiefling Monk with guild artisan background... He also wanted to be from Waterdeep. Not just from, but under. In the underdark. This mf.... I planned on surprising them with dungeon of the mad mage after this. And it gets worse! He wants to have a gang down there, called "Majin", and get this, they work with the Zhentarim. Oh, and not to mention he is a schizophrenic monk, who sees blood and murders anything he can see. How do I fix this problem, and still allow this person to have fun? He said last campaign he played was Curse of Strahd. Oh, and human sorcerer is brand new to dnd. Pls send help.
Honestly, this doesn't seem to be that insurmountable of a problem. Lots of routes to and from the Underdark lead into the warren beneath Waterdeep, so having a Teifling from down there wouldn't be that strange. Now, requiring your player to explain why his character with a Guild Artisan background and not a Criminal background is linked to some sort of Underdark gang that for some reason wants to be chummy with the Zhents while operating in prime Xanathar Guild territory seems like a reasonable ask on your part, but otherwise everything else sort of checks out.
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"The mongoose blew out its candle and was asleep in bed before the room went dark." —Llanowar fable
Yeah, easy enough to specify that any adventuring space they enter is completely unfamiliar to the monk. Then if he wants to try to use his old gang as a contact for assistance it's suddenly "oh no! They're all missing! Even the Zhentarim guild emissary has fled the city. All you find is this obvious clue pointing you directly back towards where the adventure wants you to go." Creative background stories are great, and a rich source of PC roleplay and DM adventure hook opportunities, but anyone who thinks they can get some sneaky mechanical benefit from their little biography is going to find themselves sorely mistaken...
The underdark is not the same as the undermountain. The undermountain is the DotMM territory and nothing can get into it without being brought there by The Mad Mage or by entering in through the Yawning Portal (Also, I think, Skullport). So you can still surprise them with the DotMM.
Also, don't let players include stupid stuff in their backstory (Stupid as in "I own 10M dragons from an inheritance" or stupid as in "I'm a high ranking leader in XYZ, yet I'm a level 1 character." or "I'm going to have fun by killing the fun for everyone else because it's what my character would do."). I just had that happen in my campaign. 3 months of good sessions ended on a sour note because a player decided to cheat/lie outside of the game.
Also, the Zhents are already fleshed out enough that they don't need another gang. The Zhents hiring/working in the underdark is not likely, as the Xanathar guild has claim to it, not the Zhents.
Honestly, with all the trouble I've had with a player playing like that, I'd tell him/her to pick something else or I'd immediately arrest them the first time they kill someone.
Thank you guys so much for this. I honestly wanted to do what would be best for the story and the players. I think I'll tone him down some on what he is capable of getting away with, "demanding respect from the watch", and possibly allow the dwarf Paladin to kill him.
(If the character grew up in Waterdeep, they know this law well)
I loved DMing W:DH because the book pretty much covered 90% of the "what if my player did X" type of thing. There's lot's of rules to delve into for you to explain "Waterdeep is a sophisticated city and neither the officials nor its citizens will put up with your antics."
You have gotten some good advice on how to handle this PC so far, but I feel compelled to put in my 2cp. Player agency does not extend to the kind of character they want make. They (players) are constrained by what you will allow in your game. This applies to everything from Races, Classes, Subclasses, and even optional rules like Feats...it should also be noted that personalities and such must conform as well. Most games are run with a "no PvP, no Evil, and No Chaotic Stupid!" guideline.
This player seems to have forgotten that fundamental rule.
It really seems like he has Level 20 dreams on a Level 1 character sheet.
Have him roll to see what he keeps. 1-5: Underdark. 6-19: Artisan. 20: Schizo. And he only gets one. Explain, look, I have put this together for you. You are the player and I want you to have fun. I am SO looking forward to the story you have for me. But this has to be fun for everyone, even me. So roll and see which ONE you get to take. Or, better yet, roll for him. Don't offer to let him roll. If he says something akin to that's not fair, well then, he is beginning to see how you feel and use that to find a middle ground.
The table belongs to all of you. But you as the DM are a little more vested in the arrangement, at least at the outset. Take the authority in a good way and drag him through your kindness and levelheadedness kicking and screaming. Tell him that he may well be able to build his character into his vision. It just is not possible at Level 1.
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Thank you. ChrisW
Ones are righteous. And one day, we just might believe it.
Yea, I printed out and handed him 2 copies. He crumpled up both and threw them on the ground.
It sounds like the problem is not just with the PC... This is just disrespectful of the time and effort you have put in; you have to decide if the effort to include this player in the group is going to be worth it.
I think it is the players' responsibility to come to the table with a group that is going to function, not just individual characters. To keep the LG Paladin from carting the CN monk off to the local asylum is going to take some doing on the players' side. I'll repeat that : the players' side.
Characters have to live in the world you present just as much as we have to live in this world.
The simplest solution if you want to continue playing with this person (They are probably a mate, so why wouldn't you?) is to have a separate, "murder hobo" campaign. They can be great fun and allow a lot of steam to be blown off after a long week. They also require a lot less work from the DM (usually.)
"I planned on surprising them with dungeon of the mad mage after this." Good luck with that unless your players live under rocks. Surprising them that is. I am playing in a WD:H campaign, and if we don't get to go to the DOTMM afterwards, someone is going to hang! :D Running WD:H and not following up with a mega dungeon is like inviting me for dinner and not serving pudding!
Tl;dr: one of my players is a CN Tiefling Monk who is schizophrenic who triggers when he sees blood and goes into a violent murderous rage, in the middle of waterdeep.
Soooo, we're doing Waterdeep Dragon Heist. I prepped for about a month and a half for the first 3 sessions with wiggle room. The plan was to have 5 players, the day came, and there were 3. For the first 2 and a half hours they scrambled together new characters. I got a CN Human Sorceress with the charlatan background, ok fine. A LG Dwarf Paladin with the knight background, ok sweet. And then I got a CN Tiefling Monk with guild artisan background... He also wanted to be from Waterdeep. Not just from, but under. In the underdark. This mf.... I planned on surprising them with dungeon of the mad mage after this. And it gets worse! He wants to have a gang down there, called "Majin", and get this, they work with the Zhentarim. Oh, and not to mention he is a schizophrenic monk, who sees blood and murders anything he can see. How do I fix this problem, and still allow this person to have fun? He said last campaign he played was Curse of Strahd. Oh, and human sorcerer is brand new to dnd. Pls send help.
Honestly, this doesn't seem to be that insurmountable of a problem. Lots of routes to and from the Underdark lead into the warren beneath Waterdeep, so having a Teifling from down there wouldn't be that strange. Now, requiring your player to explain why his character with a Guild Artisan background and not a Criminal background is linked to some sort of Underdark gang that for some reason wants to be chummy with the Zhents while operating in prime Xanathar Guild territory seems like a reasonable ask on your part, but otherwise everything else sort of checks out.
Yeah, easy enough to specify that any adventuring space they enter is completely unfamiliar to the monk. Then if he wants to try to use his old gang as a contact for assistance it's suddenly "oh no! They're all missing! Even the Zhentarim guild emissary has fled the city. All you find is this obvious clue pointing you directly back towards where the adventure wants you to go." Creative background stories are great, and a rich source of PC roleplay and DM adventure hook opportunities, but anyone who thinks they can get some sneaky mechanical benefit from their little biography is going to find themselves sorely mistaken...
The underdark is not the same as the undermountain. The undermountain is the DotMM territory and nothing can get into it without being brought there by The Mad Mage or by entering in through the Yawning Portal (Also, I think, Skullport). So you can still surprise them with the DotMM.
Also, don't let players include stupid stuff in their backstory (Stupid as in "I own 10M dragons from an inheritance" or stupid as in "I'm a high ranking leader in XYZ, yet I'm a level 1 character." or "I'm going to have fun by killing the fun for everyone else because it's what my character would do."). I just had that happen in my campaign. 3 months of good sessions ended on a sour note because a player decided to cheat/lie outside of the game.
Also, the Zhents are already fleshed out enough that they don't need another gang. The Zhents hiring/working in the underdark is not likely, as the Xanathar guild has claim to it, not the Zhents.
Honestly, with all the trouble I've had with a player playing like that, I'd tell him/her to pick something else or I'd immediately arrest them the first time they kill someone.
But that's just me and my take.
Thank you guys so much for this. I honestly wanted to do what would be best for the story and the players. I think I'll tone him down some on what he is capable of getting away with, "demanding respect from the watch", and possibly allow the dwarf Paladin to kill him.
If I may point something else out, have you and your player read up on this?:
The Code Legal
(If the character grew up in Waterdeep, they know this law well)
I loved DMing W:DH because the book pretty much covered 90% of the "what if my player did X" type of thing. There's lot's of rules to delve into for you to explain "Waterdeep is a sophisticated city and neither the officials nor its citizens will put up with your antics."
You have gotten some good advice on how to handle this PC so far, but I feel compelled to put in my 2cp. Player agency does not extend to the kind of character they want make. They (players) are constrained by what you will allow in your game. This applies to everything from Races, Classes, Subclasses, and even optional rules like Feats...it should also be noted that personalities and such must conform as well. Most games are run with a "no PvP, no Evil, and No Chaotic Stupid!" guideline.
This player seems to have forgotten that fundamental rule.
Yea, I printed out and handed him 2 copies. He crumpled up both and threw them on the ground.
It really seems like he has Level 20 dreams on a Level 1 character sheet.
Have him roll to see what he keeps. 1-5: Underdark. 6-19: Artisan. 20: Schizo. And he only gets one. Explain, look, I have put this together for you. You are the player and I want you to have fun. I am SO looking forward to the story you have for me. But this has to be fun for everyone, even me. So roll and see which ONE you get to take. Or, better yet, roll for him. Don't offer to let him roll. If he says something akin to that's not fair, well then, he is beginning to see how you feel and use that to find a middle ground.
The table belongs to all of you. But you as the DM are a little more vested in the arrangement, at least at the outset. Take the authority in a good way and drag him through your kindness and levelheadedness kicking and screaming. Tell him that he may well be able to build his character into his vision. It just is not possible at Level 1.
Thank you.
ChrisW
Ones are righteous. And one day, we just might believe it.
It sounds like the problem is not just with the PC...
This is just disrespectful of the time and effort you have put in; you have to decide if the effort to include this player in the group is going to be worth it.
I think it is the players' responsibility to come to the table with a group that is going to function, not just individual characters. To keep the LG Paladin from carting the CN monk off to the local asylum is going to take some doing on the players' side. I'll repeat that : the players' side.
Characters have to live in the world you present just as much as we have to live in this world.
The simplest solution if you want to continue playing with this person (They are probably a mate, so why wouldn't you?) is to have a separate, "murder hobo" campaign. They can be great fun and allow a lot of steam to be blown off after a long week. They also require a lot less work from the DM (usually.)
"I planned on surprising them with dungeon of the mad mage after this." Good luck with that unless your players live under rocks. Surprising them that is. I am playing in a WD:H campaign, and if we don't get to go to the DOTMM afterwards, someone is going to hang! :D Running WD:H and not following up with a mega dungeon is like inviting me for dinner and not serving pudding!
Roleplaying since Runequest.