I'm a new DM that is running LMoP with a fairly experienced group. I met most of the players in Adventure League at a local gaming shop and with the exception of the host's wife (who doesn't have any experience but has caught on really quick) the group knows the ins and outs of the game really well. For the most part, they have steamrolled most of the encounters and up to this point I've knock 2 of them unconscious once with a bugbear sneak attack, and the second time with an orc landing a crit.
I want to not hold back with Venomfang. I feel the breath weapon at average damage (and a fail saving throw) would kill or almost kill most of my party. I want this to feel really dangerous but at the same time feel give them a chance to survive. Is it too much to roll the 12d6 and act like I'm adding up numbers and then just tell them a number I have figured out before hand? I'm trying to figure out if this is good slight of hand behind the screen or a bad idea...
They are all lvl 3 currently but understand how to work together really well. They also tend to plan for fights extremely well. If I give them a little bit of information they will try and battle the dragon on their terms or set a trap for it.
I say let the dice land where they may. As long as your players are having fun, that's all you need.
If you want to make any monster more challenging, just add more HP. The PCs don't know how much HP the dragon has, so if it seems the fight is too easy, just bump up the HP to last a couple of rounds longer.
You can also have Dragon Cultists run out of the forest to help their "master".
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"Orcs are savage raiders and pillagers with stooped postures, low foreheads, and piggish faces with prominent lower canines that resemble tusks." MM p245 (original printing) You don't OWN your books on DDB: WotC can change them any time. What do you think will happen when OneD&D comes out?
If you're worried about a TPK, drop the breath weapon to 8d6 or 6d6. That much damage will certainly give them a scare. Also, Venomfang needs to recharge his breath weapon every turn. He could not get it back for most, if not the entire fight. At level 3 I presume the characters have around 20-35 HP, so while it will still be devastating, they can survive if they plan it out well.
I'll let them choose the battle site. It may end up in the dragon lair or they may lure him out.
I'm less worried about them beating it as it just TPK with it's breath weapon (which could easily happen with a bad roll or 2) I'm leaning more toward weakening the breath weapon. That way I can use it and not feel I am holding back.
I'll let them choose the battle site. It may end up in the dragon lair or they may lure him out.
I'm less worried about them beating it as it just TPK with it's breath weapon (which could easily happen with a bad roll or 2) I'm leaning more toward weakening the breath weapon. That way I can use it and not feel I am holding back.
You could flavor it that Venomfang is allergic to the cultists, which has him sniffling a bit. The effect could be lowering the damage (either by lowering the number of die involved, using the average damage of 42, or both), the save DC, or both. Perhaps add in the description that the seems to be a bit of mucus on them. You could also give the players advantage on the saving throw, again the flavoring is that the poison has been diluted by the mucus. If you want to be really generous, do all of the above (8d6 with average damage is 28, with a DC 12 at advantage the party will have odds that have improved by about 35% to save. The save would result in 14 points of damage which should mean that they'll need to clean the soilage from their shorts and the mucus from everywhere else after the fight).
What I did was weakening the breath weapon to 35 if I remember correctly, and also brought the dc down to 14.
Devastating as it was, the party managed to overcome the challenge and scare him away, although 2 out of 4 players were knocked down. However, given the fairly easy nature of the other fights up until this point, this victory just felt all the more delicious to them.
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“I will not say: do not weep; for not all tears are an evil.” ― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King, Gandalf
I ended up reducing the breath weapon down to 6d6. The 2 rolls I got from them were 19 and 23. (I never expected the breath weapon to recharge after the first turn....) In the end, I knocked 3 different PCs down, forced them to use 2 healing potions and almost instant killed the wizard (he had false life up that caused him to be 1hp short of being instant killed)
The wizard keep using enlarge on the monk which makes him hit really hard. The players were excited and thrilled by the whole battle. I can't wait til I can have them fight another one.
We just went through this today too, had i not adjusted the breath attack everyone would have been instakilled except for the rogue that was 5 ft out of range.
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I'm a new DM that is running LMoP with a fairly experienced group. I met most of the players in Adventure League at a local gaming shop and with the exception of the host's wife (who doesn't have any experience but has caught on really quick) the group knows the ins and outs of the game really well. For the most part, they have steamrolled most of the encounters and up to this point I've knock 2 of them unconscious once with a bugbear sneak attack, and the second time with an orc landing a crit.
I want to not hold back with Venomfang. I feel the breath weapon at average damage (and a fail saving throw) would kill or almost kill most of my party. I want this to feel really dangerous but at the same time feel give them a chance to survive. Is it too much to roll the 12d6 and act like I'm adding up numbers and then just tell them a number I have figured out before hand? I'm trying to figure out if this is good slight of hand behind the screen or a bad idea...
What level are your players? Venomfang is pretty tough for anyone under 4th level.
They are all lvl 3 currently but understand how to work together really well. They also tend to plan for fights extremely well. If I give them a little bit of information they will try and battle the dragon on their terms or set a trap for it.
I say let the dice land where they may. As long as your players are having fun, that's all you need.
If you want to make any monster more challenging, just add more HP. The PCs don't know how much HP the dragon has, so if it seems the fight is too easy, just bump up the HP to last a couple of rounds longer.
You can also have Dragon Cultists run out of the forest to help their "master".
"Orcs are savage raiders and pillagers with stooped postures, low foreheads, and piggish faces with prominent lower canines that resemble tusks." MM p245 (original printing)
You don't OWN your books on DDB: WotC can change them any time. What do you think will happen when OneD&D comes out?
If you're worried about a TPK, drop the breath weapon to 8d6 or 6d6. That much damage will certainly give them a scare. Also, Venomfang needs to recharge his breath weapon every turn. He could not get it back for most, if not the entire fight. At level 3 I presume the characters have around 20-35 HP, so while it will still be devastating, they can survive if they plan it out well.
Yeah everyone is in the mid 20's for HP except the wizard who is just under 20....
I'll let them choose the battle site. It may end up in the dragon lair or they may lure him out.
I'm less worried about them beating it as it just TPK with it's breath weapon (which could easily happen with a bad roll or 2) I'm leaning more toward weakening the breath weapon. That way I can use it and not feel I am holding back.
You could flavor it that Venomfang is allergic to the cultists, which has him sniffling a bit. The effect could be lowering the damage (either by lowering the number of die involved, using the average damage of 42, or both), the save DC, or both. Perhaps add in the description that the seems to be a bit of mucus on them. You could also give the players advantage on the saving throw, again the flavoring is that the poison has been diluted by the mucus. If you want to be really generous, do all of the above (8d6 with average damage is 28, with a DC 12 at advantage the party will have odds that have improved by about 35% to save. The save would result in 14 points of damage which should mean that they'll need to clean the soilage from their shorts and the mucus from everywhere else after the fight).
What I did was weakening the breath weapon to 35 if I remember correctly, and also brought the dc down to 14.
Devastating as it was, the party managed to overcome the challenge and scare him away, although 2 out of 4 players were knocked down. However, given the fairly easy nature of the other fights up until this point, this victory just felt all the more delicious to them.
“I will not say: do not weep; for not all tears are an evil.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King, Gandalf
I ended up reducing the breath weapon down to 6d6. The 2 rolls I got from them were 19 and 23. (I never expected the breath weapon to recharge after the first turn....) In the end, I knocked 3 different PCs down, forced them to use 2 healing potions and almost instant killed the wizard (he had false life up that caused him to be 1hp short of being instant killed)
The wizard keep using enlarge on the monk which makes him hit really hard. The players were excited and thrilled by the whole battle. I can't wait til I can have them fight another one.
We just went through this today too, had i not adjusted the breath attack everyone would have been instakilled except for the rogue that was 5 ft out of range.