So I am going through various creatures and spells that inflict Poison damage. (looking at 4th level and lower spells)
Very few seem to actually inflict the Poisoned Condition (Disadvantage on Attacks and Ability Checks) on a failed savings throw. If I was to alter some attacks and spells to also inflict that condition on a failed save, how much impact do you think it would have on the power of such a spell / attack?
Specifically, I am looking at Poisonous Snakes (CR 1/8), Poison Spray, Infestation (think this may upgrade these to a 1st level spell from Cantrips), Stinking Cloud. I am using the Wizard and Sorcerer spell lists as the baseline looking for spells that inflict poison damage.
Agreed. The Poisoned Condition is one of the more debilitating conditions in the game. I think something good to compare it to is the blindness/deafness spell, which is level 1. It deals no damage, targets a single creature (it can be upcast to target more), and the target can repeat the saving throw each round. The effects of being blinded are comparable to being poisoned, so you can see how a level one spell that inflicts such a condition in addition to dealing damage, or covers an area of attack would be too powerful.
Hence why I was asking for input. Yes, I agree that the Cantrips would no longer be Cantrips. But I am comfortable with adding the Poisoned condition on a failed save to a number of the creatures that inflict Poison damage. I guess the question is how much that increases the CR level, and that would likely vary from creature to creature.
lol I'm actually more comfortable with letting more creatures inflict conditions like that. Honestly... 5e skews pretty easy. My players consistently take down enemies of a higher CR than their 4-person group, and they're not particularly min-maxed or anything. A poisonous snake is such a nothing opponent for even a low-level group... giving it the opportunity to properly inflict the poison condition would make it a bit dangerous (as opposed to nearly harmless), so I say go ahead and let it happen. Give it a fairly low DC... maybe 10 or 12, but go ahead and let it inflict the poison condition if you think it will make combat more interesting.
lol I'm actually more comfortable with letting more creatures inflict conditions like that. Honestly... 5e skews pretty easy. My players consistently take down enemies of a higher CR than their 4-person group, and they're not particularly min-maxed or anything. A poisonous snake is such a nothing opponent for even a low-level group... giving it the opportunity to properly inflict the poison condition would make it a bit dangerous (as opposed to nearly harmless), so I say go ahead and let it happen. Give it a fairly low DC... maybe 10 or 12, but go ahead and let it inflict the poison condition if you think it will make combat more interesting.
To be more specific, my crew is heading into a swamp area, in late summer. Poisonous snakes will abound. They will certainly not kill off the group, but the attrition on spells and features that mitigate poison, I think that is reasonable.
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So I am going through various creatures and spells that inflict Poison damage. (looking at 4th level and lower spells)
Very few seem to actually inflict the Poisoned Condition (Disadvantage on Attacks and Ability Checks) on a failed savings throw. If I was to alter some attacks and spells to also inflict that condition on a failed save, how much impact do you think it would have on the power of such a spell / attack?
Specifically, I am looking at Poisonous Snakes (CR 1/8), Poison Spray, Infestation (think this may upgrade these to a 1st level spell from Cantrips), Stinking Cloud. I am using the Wizard and Sorcerer spell lists as the baseline looking for spells that inflict poison damage.
Agreed. The Poisoned Condition is one of the more debilitating conditions in the game. I think something good to compare it to is the blindness/deafness spell, which is level 1. It deals no damage, targets a single creature (it can be upcast to target more), and the target can repeat the saving throw each round. The effects of being blinded are comparable to being poisoned, so you can see how a level one spell that inflicts such a condition in addition to dealing damage, or covers an area of attack would be too powerful.
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Fair enough.
Hence why I was asking for input. Yes, I agree that the Cantrips would no longer be Cantrips. But I am comfortable with adding the Poisoned condition on a failed save to a number of the creatures that inflict Poison damage. I guess the question is how much that increases the CR level, and that would likely vary from creature to creature.
lol I'm actually more comfortable with letting more creatures inflict conditions like that. Honestly... 5e skews pretty easy. My players consistently take down enemies of a higher CR than their 4-person group, and they're not particularly min-maxed or anything. A poisonous snake is such a nothing opponent for even a low-level group... giving it the opportunity to properly inflict the poison condition would make it a bit dangerous (as opposed to nearly harmless), so I say go ahead and let it happen. Give it a fairly low DC... maybe 10 or 12, but go ahead and let it inflict the poison condition if you think it will make combat more interesting.
Watch Crits for Breakfast, an adults-only RP-Heavy Roll20 Livestream at twitch.tv/afterdisbooty
And now you too can play with the amazing art and assets we use in Roll20 for our campaign at Hazel's Emporium
To be more specific, my crew is heading into a swamp area, in late summer. Poisonous snakes will abound. They will certainly not kill off the group, but the attrition on spells and features that mitigate poison, I think that is reasonable.