If my spellcasting players are using component pouches I figure they have enough recourses at the beginning of an adventure to cast each spell with a NO COST component 10 times. The player can refill their component pouch easily in any mages guild, alchemy shop, or even spend down time gathering components from the environment. Any COST component like diamond dust must be strictly tracked by the player and they are expected to have the component in hand if they are preparing the spell.
There is no real need to be super strict with 10 use components. A player has cast fireball 10 times during an adventure and needs to cast another. Scraping their fingers at the bottom of the component pocket they gather scraps of bat guano and sulfur left behind by the previously used components. Allowing players a little leeway when it comes to tracking component usage. And generating a little drama into your campaign as it becomes clear recourses are dwindling. Foci are a prime way to bypass spell components usage but cripple the caster if they are left without it. Many components can be found in most environments. Finding them in a pinch can add a little spice to any campaign.
But just a heads up for others that read this house rule, the component pouch and arcane focus are considered to never run out of use. You don’t need to refill the pouch, for example. I think it gets to granular if you start measuring each individual item, but it may work for your table (though I’d ask the players if it feels limiting).
As per RAW, the only time you need to worry about components that do NOT have a gold cost is if you don’t have a focus or component pouch that is relevant to your class. You are considered to have all of them at all times.
The primary difference between these two would be:
1) Focus must be held in hand, potentially interfering with any action requiring a free hand. Can also be disarmed essentially.
2) Pouches need a free hand to use but do not occupy it otherwise. Can be stolen much more easily because it’s not being held most of the time.
From a roleplay perspective I have a player who is constantly refilling his component pouch, he might ask me if he can find “free components” in a market for some of his spells so we will roleplay out a short moment letting him interact with a few market stall NPCs, he will pay a few copper and get what he wants. Or maybe in an cave he will ask if there are any bats about, We never track it, I would never say you have run out, but it is a fun little bit of RP. It is akin to the ranger going and talking to the fletcher in each town.
If my spellcasting players are using component pouches I figure they have enough recourses at the beginning of an adventure to cast each spell with a NO COST component 10 times. The player can refill their component pouch easily in any mages guild, alchemy shop, or even spend down time gathering components from the environment. Any COST component like diamond dust must be strictly tracked by the player and they are expected to have the component in hand if they are preparing the spell.
There is no real need to be super strict with 10 use components. A player has cast fireball 10 times during an adventure and needs to cast another. Scraping their fingers at the bottom of the component pocket they gather scraps of bat guano and sulfur left behind by the previously used components. Allowing players a little leeway when it comes to tracking component usage. And generating a little drama into your campaign as it becomes clear recourses are dwindling. Foci are a prime way to bypass spell components usage but cripple the caster if they are left without it. Many components can be found in most environments. Finding them in a pinch can add a little spice to any campaign.
But just a heads up for others that read this house rule, the component pouch and arcane focus are considered to never run out of use. You don’t need to refill the pouch, for example. I think it gets to granular if you start measuring each individual item, but it may work for your table (though I’d ask the players if it feels limiting).
As per RAW, the only time you need to worry about components that do NOT have a gold cost is if you don’t have a focus or component pouch that is relevant to your class. You are considered to have all of them at all times.
The primary difference between these two would be:
1) Focus must be held in hand, potentially interfering with any action requiring a free hand. Can also be disarmed essentially.
2) Pouches need a free hand to use but do not occupy it otherwise. Can be stolen much more easily because it’s not being held most of the time.
From a roleplay perspective I have a player who is constantly refilling his component pouch, he might ask me if he can find “free components” in a market for some of his spells so we will roleplay out a short moment letting him interact with a few market stall NPCs, he will pay a few copper and get what he wants. Or maybe in an cave he will ask if there are any bats about, We never track it, I would never say you have run out, but it is a fun little bit of RP. It is akin to the ranger going and talking to the fletcher in each town.
This! Great way to RP this and make spell components add layers to this game.
Most of the material components that don't list explicit costs and aren't consumed are either little injokes, or something directly affected by the spell. Message needs to broadcast the message, Resistance needs a cloak (of resistance), Grease needs grease, Silent Image needs to fleece people, Longstrider needs something to stride on, Gentle Repose needs Charon's dues, Heat Metal needs heat and metal, Locate Animals or Plants needs a bloodhound to sniff them out, Shatter needs something shattered, Haste needs a sugar high, and so on. They're mostly just something to get a little laugh at while you just use your focus instead. xP
It's not so much a joke as a symbol of the desired effect. Many real-world occult systems use symbolic components. These are either related in some tangential sense, like the examples you noted, or based on a system of symbols related to the specific occult system. As D&D doesn't have an actual occultism to it, it can only fall back on the tangential symbols.
What, no, wait but I only started playing DnD because it brought me closer to our lord and master and gave me the power to summon real devils :).
I use components though wonder if I'm being too easy on foci users. Other thing I'm wondering. It just seems the nature of sorcerer's magic (being a force they're imbued with) sort of goes counter the needs for components. Wizards are basically working out of science manual and need their lab equipment, got it. The more divinely or primordial force worshiping/serving spell casters offering the components to their higher powers, I get that too. But sorcerers, since their magic is something that they're imbued with, and do not study, I just don't follow the need to have like a copper wire to use an antenna when I message. Is it just me or am I missing something?
Most of the material components that don't list explicit costs and aren't consumed are either little injokes, or something directly affected by the spell. Message needs to broadcast the message, Resistance needs a cloak (of resistance), Grease needs grease, Silent Image needs to fleece people, Longstrider needs something to stride on, Gentle Repose needs Charon's dues, Heat Metal needs heat and metal, Locate Animals or Plants needs a bloodhound to sniff them out, Shatter needs something shattered, Haste needs a sugar high, and so on. They're mostly just something to get a little laugh at while you just use your focus instead. xP
I think your need to catalog that trivia missed the substance of my actual question. I completely got the joke why message uses copper as an antenna (the fact that I mentioned the word antenna should have indicated that to you. Pardon as a quote from the post to which you're responded, where the substantial ask was "But sorcerers, since their magic is something that they're imbued with, and do not study, I just don't follow the need to have like a copper wire to use an antenna when I message." So the question is not "why copper wire?". That was an instance of what I'm really asking "why material components at all for sorcery, since all the magic's in your blood anyway?" But thanks for demonstrating your knowledge. It was literally diverting ;)
If the point, in-world, of spell components is to focus and guide the magic, then even if the magic is natural, it may need components/ a focus. Come to think of it, I'm surprised there isn't a metamagic option for ignoring components.
I use components though wonder if I'm being too easy on foci users. Other thing I'm wondering. It just seems the nature of sorcerer's magic (being a force they're imbued with) sort of goes counter the needs for components. Wizards are basically working out of science manual and need their lab equipment, got it. The more divinely or primordial force worshiping/serving spell casters offering the components to their higher powers, I get that too. But sorcerers, since their magic is something that they're imbued with, and do not study, I just don't follow the need to have like a copper wire to use an antenna when I message. Is it just me or am I missing something?
Most of the material components that don't list explicit costs and aren't consumed are either little injokes, or something directly affected by the spell. Message needs to broadcast the message, Resistance needs a cloak (of resistance), Grease needs grease, Silent Image needs to fleece people, Longstrider needs something to stride on, Gentle Repose needs Charon's dues, Heat Metal needs heat and metal, Locate Animals or Plants needs a bloodhound to sniff them out, Shatter needs something shattered, Haste needs a sugar high, and so on. They're mostly just something to get a little laugh at while you just use your focus instead. xP
I think you're need to catalog that trivia missed the substance of my actual question. I completely got the joke why message uses copper as an antenna (the fact that I mentioned the word antenna should have indicated that to you. Pardon as a quote from the post to which you're responded, where the substantial ask was "But sorcerers, since their magic is something that they're imbued with, and do not study, I just don't follow the need to have like a copper wire to use an antenna when I message." So the question is not "why copper wire?". That was an instance of what I'm really asking "why material components at all for sorcery, since all the magic's in your blood anyway?" But thanks for demonstrating your knowledge. It was literally diverting ;)
Ah, gotcha. I think the crux here is that the ability to manipulate magic doesn't innately provide perfect control over it. Sorcerers have innate magical abilities, wizards study magic and how to manipulate it, clerics are empowered by their god, and so on, but this just gives them the ability to use it. The answer is implied in the backstory here, in the "The Weave of Magic" section (PHB pg. 205): Magic itself is a tapestry, and the ability to use magic just lets you touch it; you still need to be able to manipulate the threads, which is what VSM components are for. It's never outright stated, but they're most likely psychosomatic tools that help a caster subconsciously shift to the right mindset to weave magic in the way they desire; to put it in computer terms, if spells are programs, then components are essentially the shortcut the caster clicks on to run the program. (Which means that things like Subtle Spell, or earlier editions' Silent Spell & Eschew Materials, are essentially proficiency with magic's command-line interface.)
So, essentially, the components are placebos & Dumbo magic feathers that help the caster think correctly when they want to cast the spell.
I do, and my players hate me for it. My general rule of thumb is to use them if you are starting a campaign at greater levels, like 3-4. Maybe make it so there is a NPC who casts a magic spell on them, and now they need components. However, I figured this out too late, and every time my friend’s level 2 bard wanted to cast Friends and I asked for the character to put on some makeup, all my players would groan and grumble. I think it did degrade my relationship with them, but now (at level 7) my players understand my choice for the campaign and the bard will mention searching for a caterpillar cocoon during downtime, then will use it when they cast Polymorph in combat. I would mention that components will come into play when you are ready for them, but don’t spring it on them suddenly. Discuss when you want to add them in with your players, but allow them to search for them during downtime, like a long or short rest. My players are enjoying the campaign, but I think some part of our friendship is gone from my forcing components on them when they weren’t ready for them.
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From a roleplay perspective I have a player who is constantly refilling his component pouch, he might ask me if he can find “free components” in a market for some of his spells so we will roleplay out a short moment letting him interact with a few market stall NPCs, he will pay a few copper and get what he wants. Or maybe in an cave he will ask if there are any bats about, We never track it, I would never say you have run out, but it is a fun little bit of RP. It is akin to the ranger going and talking to the fletcher in each town.
This! Great way to RP this and make spell components add layers to this game.
What, no, wait but I only started playing DnD because it brought me closer to our lord and master and gave me the power to summon real devils :).
I think your need to catalog that trivia missed the substance of my actual question. I completely got the joke why message uses copper as an antenna (the fact that I mentioned the word antenna should have indicated that to you. Pardon as a quote from the post to which you're responded, where the substantial ask was "But sorcerers, since their magic is something that they're imbued with, and do not study, I just don't follow the need to have like a copper wire to use an antenna when I message." So the question is not "why copper wire?". That was an instance of what I'm really asking "why material components at all for sorcery, since all the magic's in your blood anyway?" But thanks for demonstrating your knowledge. It was literally diverting ;)
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
If the point, in-world, of spell components is to focus and guide the magic, then even if the magic is natural, it may need components/ a focus. Come to think of it, I'm surprised there isn't a metamagic option for ignoring components.
Ah, gotcha. I think the crux here is that the ability to manipulate magic doesn't innately provide perfect control over it. Sorcerers have innate magical abilities, wizards study magic and how to manipulate it, clerics are empowered by their god, and so on, but this just gives them the ability to use it. The answer is implied in the backstory here, in the "The Weave of Magic" section (PHB pg. 205): Magic itself is a tapestry, and the ability to use magic just lets you touch it; you still need to be able to manipulate the threads, which is what VSM components are for. It's never outright stated, but they're most likely psychosomatic tools that help a caster subconsciously shift to the right mindset to weave magic in the way they desire; to put it in computer terms, if spells are programs, then components are essentially the shortcut the caster clicks on to run the program. (Which means that things like Subtle Spell, or earlier editions' Silent Spell & Eschew Materials, are essentially proficiency with magic's command-line interface.)
So, essentially, the components are placebos & Dumbo magic feathers that help the caster think correctly when they want to cast the spell.
I do, and my players hate me for it. My general rule of thumb is to use them if you are starting a campaign at greater levels, like 3-4. Maybe make it so there is a NPC who casts a magic spell on them, and now they need components. However, I figured this out too late, and every time my friend’s level 2 bard wanted to cast Friends and I asked for the character to put on some makeup, all my players would groan and grumble. I think it did degrade my relationship with them, but now (at level 7) my players understand my choice for the campaign and the bard will mention searching for a caterpillar cocoon during downtime, then will use it when they cast Polymorph in combat. I would mention that components will come into play when you are ready for them, but don’t spring it on them suddenly. Discuss when you want to add them in with your players, but allow them to search for them during downtime, like a long or short rest. My players are enjoying the campaign, but I think some part of our friendship is gone from my forcing components on them when they weren’t ready for them.