Very true. I chose this part of the forum to try to ask about why the rule is that way and as with most posts it devolved. For my part of the thread, I apologize.
Very true. I chose this part of the forum to try to ask about why the rule is that way and as with most posts it devolved. For my part of the thread, I apologize.
Personally I would 100% allow a player to willingly fail a save. However, this is the Rules and Game Mechanics forum, for discussions on what is RAW, not DM fiat.
I think the reason why you can't, is that a saving throw represents your character's reflex, and gut reaction.
Very true. I chose this part of the forum to try to ask about why the rule is that way and as with most posts it devolved.
Your question was answered in the first response to it. Being unconscious doesn't impair mental saves in the game because being unconscious doesn't impair what mental saves represent in real life. There's no need to apologize for moving the conversation in new directions after the initial topic is resolved.
Some spells restrict you to willing targets only. Declaring yourself as a willing target is something that can be done at any time (even if you're flat-footed or it isn't your turn). Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing, but a character who is conscious but immobile or helpless (such as one who is bound, cowering, grappling, paralyzed, pinned, or stunned) is not automatically willing.
Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing
Where in the rules is that? I don't recall willing being explained anywhere but based on the unconscious condition, you're unaware of iyour surrounding and being willing should require a minimum of awareness to choose or consent in my opinion.
I guess that if an unwilling character can be picked up and mover to be saved from some type of damage, then why not being picked up and carried through a dimension door?
I can see a being not wan ting to have a spell cast on them and would thus make a saving throw but how could they stop you from taking them through a DD? Its not a mental save like domination or something like that.
Some spells restrict you to willing targets only. Declaring yourself as a willing target is something that can be done at any time (even if you're flat-footed or it isn't your turn). Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing, but a character who is conscious but immobile or helpless (such as one who is bound, cowering, grappling, paralyzed, pinned, or stunned) is not automatically willing.
This is from the d20SRD for version 3.5e ... it isn't a 5e rule. One way you can tell relatively quickly is because it uses terms like "flat-footed" which are not a part of 5e. 5e doesn't have an equivalent rule.
I think this falls into the category of something not to overthink.
Bringing real life brain functions into this is pretty pointless when we don't have the details of which parts of the brain the spells target and do they target the subconscious/conscious mind. It's mysterious magic, resisted in mysterious ways. So let's just do what the good book says. 😁
I guess that if an unwilling character can be picked up and mover to be saved from some type of damage, then why not being picked up and carried through a dimension door?
I can see a being not wan ting to have a spell cast on them and would thus make a saving throw but how could they stop you from taking them through a DD? Its not a mental save like domination or something like that.
Through a dimension door you can bring along objects and willing creature, neither of which an unconcious creature is. The corpse of a dead creature could being an object but not a live one.
This ruling is really only to keep an unconscious NPC or PC from being kidnapped by a player caster.
If the DM wants an NPC to magically kidnap any character they would let them do it for story narrative. Which I have always found to be unfair to players. Whats good for the goose should be good for the gander.
There should just be a magic something that keeps someone from being magically teleported or kidnapped. Make it affordable to anyone who might be powerful enough to be kidnapped.
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Very true. I chose this part of the forum to try to ask about why the rule is that way and as with most posts it devolved. For my part of the thread, I apologize.
Personally I would 100% allow a player to willingly fail a save. However, this is the Rules and Game Mechanics forum, for discussions on what is RAW, not DM fiat.
I think the reason why you can't, is that a saving throw represents your character's reflex, and gut reaction.
[REDACTED]
Your question was answered in the first response to it. Being unconscious doesn't impair mental saves in the game because being unconscious doesn't impair what mental saves represent in real life. There's no need to apologize for moving the conversation in new directions after the initial topic is resolved.
This should help you.
Target or Targets
Some spells restrict you to willing targets only. Declaring yourself as a willing target is something that can be done at any time (even if you're flat-footed or it isn't your turn). Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing, but a character who is conscious but immobile or helpless (such as one who is bound, cowering, grappling, paralyzed, pinned, or stunned) is not automatically willing.
Where in the rules is that? I don't recall willing being explained anywhere but based on the unconscious condition, you're unaware of iyour surrounding and being willing should require a minimum of awareness to choose or consent in my opinion.
While not official ruling, the Dev have said on Twitter that unconscious creature are not willing;;
I guess that if an unwilling character can be picked up and mover to be saved from some type of damage, then why not being picked up and carried through a dimension door?
I can see a being not wan ting to have a spell cast on them and would thus make a saving throw but how could they stop you from taking them through a DD? Its not a mental save like domination or something like that.
This is from the d20SRD for version 3.5e ... it isn't a 5e rule. One way you can tell relatively quickly is because it uses terms like "flat-footed" which are not a part of 5e. 5e doesn't have an equivalent rule.
I think this falls into the category of something not to overthink.
Bringing real life brain functions into this is pretty pointless when we don't have the details of which parts of the brain the spells target and do they target the subconscious/conscious mind. It's mysterious magic, resisted in mysterious ways. So let's just do what the good book says. 😁
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Through a dimension door you can bring along objects and willing creature, neither of which an unconcious creature is. The corpse of a dead creature could being an object but not a live one.
This ruling is really only to keep an unconscious NPC or PC from being kidnapped by a player caster.
If the DM wants an NPC to magically kidnap any character they would let them do it for story narrative. Which I have always found to be unfair to players. Whats good for the goose should be good for the gander.
There should just be a magic something that keeps someone from being magically teleported or kidnapped. Make it affordable to anyone who might be powerful enough to be kidnapped.