The Plant Growth spell does not list a height for the plants that are overgrown to the point of costing 4 feet of movement to move 1 foot.
This being the case, if a creature on the ground within the AoE of the affected plants tried to fly out of the area of Plant Growth, how would you determine the creature's ability to get above the AoE of the spell?
It strains common sense, but I might say you need to be 5’ up, the next vertical square. Seems like that avoids issues with occupying the square, since you’re in a different one.
This is something that is left up to the DM as it is highly dependant on the nature of the environment. As far as the rules are concerned any space within 100ft of the chosen origin point could be affected.
I'd rule that as the area is a radius, not a circle, any vertical movement doesn't incur the penalty. I guess that means that the plants formed are only 1 foot high by my ruling.
All plants within a 100ft radius. This is not limited to horizontal distances. Like fireball, this would be a sphere of influence. It doesn’t bypass full cover though.
All plants within a 100ft radius. This is not limited to horizontal distances. Like fireball, this would be a sphere of influence. It doesn’t bypass full cover though.
Common Misconception:
Fireball doesn't explode upwards and downwards. It just spreads around corners. Its all in the wording: Compare Fireball to Flaming Sphere for the example of wording. Spells that operate in a Sphere, or Cube or anything like that, specify that it is 3 dimensional vs 2dimensional, and specify the height as well.
All plants within a 100ft radius. This is not limited to horizontal distances. Like fireball, this would be a sphere of influence. It doesn’t bypass full cover though.
Common Misconception:
Fireball doesn't explode upwards and downwards. It just spreads around corners. Its all in the wording: Compare Fireball to Flaming Sphere for the example of wording. Spells that operate in a Sphere, or Cube or anything like that, specify that it is 3 dimensional vs 2dimensional, and specify the height as well.
From Fireball: "Each creature in a 20-foot-radius sphere centered on that point must make a Dexterity saving throw." - emphasis added.
All plants within a 100ft radius. This is not limited to horizontal distances. Like fireball, this would be a sphere of influence. It doesn’t bypass full cover though.
Common Misconception:
Fireball doesn't explode upwards and downwards. It just spreads around corners. Its all in the wording: Compare Fireball to Flaming Sphere for the example of wording. Spells that operate in a Sphere, or Cube or anything like that, specify that it is 3 dimensional vs 2dimensional, and specify the height as well.
From Fireball: "Each creature in a 20-foot-radius sphere centered on that point must make a Dexterity saving throw." - emphasis added.
interesting... thats not how its worded in the 5e spells app. which I used for reference.
Any route. I stand corrected re: fireball. But The point is still proven correct re: OP and plant growth, and similar spells. When they go upwards as well, it will specifically state sphere vs normal radius, or cube vs normal line, etc.
All plants within a 100ft radius. This is not limited to horizontal distances. Like fireball, this would be a sphere of influence. It doesn’t bypass full cover though.
I'm sorry, are you saying that plants in the area of Plant Growth would be 100 feet tall? Holy moly. If that's not what you mean, perhaps clarify a bit.
All plants within a 100ft radius. This is not limited to horizontal distances. Like fireball, this would be a sphere of influence. It doesn’t bypass full cover though.
I'm sorry, are you saying that plants in the area of Plant Growth would be 100 feet tall? Holy moly. If that's not what you mean, perhaps clarify a bit.
What I mean is that the area where plants are becomes overgrown. Plants in the game have a wide range of shapes and sizes. The option of the spell that says that the plants become overgrown and cost additional movement would only be relevant if a creature can move through the area the plant already takes up, but doesn’t cause the plant to take up additional space.
so for example if there’s grasses that are in the space it becomes more difficult to traverse that space, but doesn’t cause the grass to grow 200ft tall.
if the spell is cast in an area that is covered in vines and other plants that perhaps drape down from other environmental structures then the area where the vines or thorns drape through become more difficult to traverse. How ever difficult that was to begin with becomes more difficult.
a tree would become overgrown. Depending on the tree I’d expect the branches to become overly leafy or otherwise overgrown in such a way as to impose that difficulty of movement to what ever portions would be able to produce that effect.
dnd 5e seems to lump in mushrooms and fungal growths into the plant category so I’d similarly reflect the change upon those areas too.
all that being said the way I’ve seen it explained most often is that a horizontal area of grass, though I’m not sure if that’s in the interest of simplicity or balancing factors. The speed of play is definitely a factor and I have no problem with anyone ruling it that way not that it matters one way or another.
All plants within a 100ft radius. This is not limited to horizontal distances. Like fireball, this would be a sphere of influence. It doesn’t bypass full cover though.
Common Misconception:
Fireball doesn't explode upwards and downwards. It just spreads around corners. It’s all in the wording: Compare Fireball to Flaming Sphere for the example of wording. Spells that operate in a Sphere, or Cube or anything like that, specify that it is 3 dimensional vs 2dimensional, and specify the height as well.
The area of effect portion of the general rules portion of spell casting in the PHB goes over “typical” spell shapes: cone, cube, cylinder, line, or sphere.
It further specifies “Every area of effect has a point of origin, a location from which the spell's energy erupts.
A spell's effect expands in straight lines from the point of origin. If no unblocked straight line extends from the point of origin to a location within the area of effect, that location isn't included in the spell's area. To block one of these imaginary lines, an obstruction must provide total cover, as explained in chapter 9.
Are we saying that unless a feature specifies its shape is spherical every time, it’s a horizontal “flat” circle? I don’t believe that’s written anywhere but I’m open to links or citations.
my biggest support for this is that the point of origin isn’t required to be on the ground or target a plant. It specifies that you can choose a point within range and the range is 150ft, then the radius of effect is 100ft from that point. So if it’s limited to horizontal then what happens if you target a point about 5ft to 95ft above a plant?
All plants within a 100ft radius. This is not limited to horizontal distances. Like fireball, this would be a sphere of influence. It doesn’t bypass full cover though.
Common Misconception:
Fireball doesn't explode upwards and downwards. It just spreads around corners. It’s all in the wording: Compare Fireball to Flaming Sphere for the example of wording. Spells that operate in a Sphere, or Cube or anything like that, specify that it is 3 dimensional vs 2dimensional, and specify the height as well.
The area of effect portion of the general rules portion of spell casting in the PHB goes over “typical” spell shapes: cone, cube, cylinder, line, or sphere.
It further specifies “Every area of effect has a point of origin, a location from which the spell's energy erupts.
A spell's effect expands in straight lines from the point of origin. If no unblocked straight line extends from the point of origin to a location within the area of effect, that location isn't included in the spell's area. To block one of these imaginary lines, an obstruction must provide total cover, as explained in chapter 9.
Are we saying that unless a feature specifies its shape is spherical every time, it’s a horizontal “flat” circle? I don’t believe that’s written anywhere but I’m open to links or citations.
my biggest support for this is that the point of origin isn’t required to be on the ground or target a plant. It specifies that you can choose a point within range and the range is 150ft, then the radius of effect is 100ft from that point. So if it’s limited to horizontal then what happens if you target a point about 5ft to 95ft above a plant?
So… “I don’t believe that’s written anywhere but..”
you literally, just cited, and quoted exactly where that’s written RAW, not RAI, in this exact post, where you then said you don’t see it.
Your biggest support is the 5ft to 95 ft up: okay. So if a dragon born is flying… and is 60 ft up, and does his breath attack. It extends 30 ft up and down as well is what you imply happens.
the spell doesn’t specifically state it’s a sphere. So it’s not specifically a sphere. It generally states its radius. The radius isn’t the issue, but since specific trumps general, RAW, plant growth is not a 3-d spell. RAI maybe they meant it so, and it can certainly be home brewed that way by whomever. But RAW…..
the spell doesn’t specifically state it’s a sphere. So it’s not specifically a sphere. It generally states its radius. The radius isn’t the issue, but since specific trumps general, RAW, plant growth is not a 3-d spell. RAI maybe they meant it so, and it can certainly be home brewed that way by whomever. But RAW…..
You are correct that Plant Growth does not specify the exact shape of the area of effect. However you have provided no other justification for why you believe Plant Growth's AoE is strictly two dimensional. I can make the same argument that the spell can't be treated two dimensionally. Nowhere in Plant Growth's description does it specify that it is a two dimensional area.
In fact all of the shapes described in the Areas of Effect section in the PHB (https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/phb/spellcasting#AreasofEffect) that involve a radius are three dimensional shapes, the Sphere and the Cylinder. Also between these two shapes the one that only uses a radius measure is the Sphere, the Cylinder requires a radius and a height. So if the use of the word radius is significant in Plant Growth's description then it implies a sphere. If the word radius is not significant then the shape of all points within 100 feet of the chosen point of origin depends on if the game world itself, is two or three dimensional? If the game world is three dimensional then the shape is a sphere because being a fixed distance from a single point is the mathematical definition of a sphere.
So why didn't the authors simply describe the AoE as a sphere? I see two reasons for not describing it as a sphere. The first (and I feel most important) is that Plant Growth does not cause plants to grow beyond the space they already occupy, the area of effect is the space occupied by plants within 100 feet of the chosen point of origin. The second reason for not describing the AoE as a sphere is because the caster " . . . can exclude one or more areas of any size within the spell's area from being affected." So the exact area of effect is depending on both the space plants occupy and the specific omissions the caster makes when they cast this spell.
the spell doesn’t specifically state it’s a sphere. So it’s not specifically a sphere. It generally states its radius. The radius isn’t the issue, but since specific trumps general, RAW, plant growth is not a 3-d spell. RAI maybe they meant it so, and it can certainly be home brewed that way by whomever. But RAW…..
You are correct that Plant Growth does not specify the exact shape of the area of effect. However you have provided no other justification for why you believe Plant Growth's AoE is strictly two dimensional. I can make the same argument that the spell can't be treated two dimensionally. Nowhere in Plant Growth's description does it specify that it is a two dimensional area.
In fact all of the shapes described in the Areas of Effect section in the PHB (https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/phb/spellcasting#AreasofEffect) that involve a radius are three dimensional shapes, the Sphere and the Cylinder. Also between these two shapes the one that only uses a radius measure is the Sphere, the Cylinder requires a radius and a height. So if the use of the word radius is significant in Plant Growth's description then it implies a sphere. If the word radius is not significant then the shape of all points within 100 feet of the chosen point of origin depends on if the game world itself, is two or three dimensional? If the game world is three dimensional then the shape is a sphere because being a fixed distance from a single point is the mathematical definition of a sphere.
So why didn't the authors simply describe the AoE as a sphere? I see two reasons for not describing it as a sphere. The first (and I feel most important) is that Plant Growth does not cause plants to grow beyond the space they already occupy, the area of effect is the space occupied by plants within 100 feet of the chosen point of origin. The second reason for not describing the AoE as a sphere is because the caster " . . . can exclude one or more areas of any size within the spell's area from being affected." So the exact area of effect is depending on both the space plants occupy and the specific omissions the caster makes when they cast this spell.
If you select a point, and then affect everything within xft of that point. You have affected a sphere. You don't need to call it a sphere for it to be one.
the spell doesn’t specifically state it’s a sphere. So it’s not specifically a sphere. It generally states its radius. The radius isn’t the issue, but since specific trumps general, RAW, plant growth is not a 3-d spell. RAI maybe they meant it so, and it can certainly be home brewed that way by whomever. But RAW…..
You are correct that Plant Growth does not specify the exact shape of the area of effect. However you have provided no other justification for why you believe Plant Growth's AoE is strictly two dimensional. I can make the same argument that the spell can't be treated two dimensionally. Nowhere in Plant Growth's description does it specify that it is a two dimensional area.
In fact all of the shapes described in the Areas of Effect section in the PHB (https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/phb/spellcasting#AreasofEffect) that involve a radius are three dimensional shapes, the Sphere and the Cylinder. Also between these two shapes the one that only uses a radius measure is the Sphere, the Cylinder requires a radius and a height. So if the use of the word radius is significant in Plant Growth's description then it implies a sphere. If the word radius is not significant then the shape of all points within 100 feet of the chosen point of origin depends on if the game world itself, is two or three dimensional? If the game world is three dimensional then the shape is a sphere because being a fixed distance from a single point is the mathematical definition of a sphere.
So why didn't the authors simply describe the AoE as a sphere? I see two reasons for not describing it as a sphere. The first (and I feel most important) is that Plant Growth does not cause plants to grow beyond the space they already occupy, the area of effect is the space occupied by plants within 100 feet of the chosen point of origin. The second reason for not describing the AoE as a sphere is because the caster " . . . can exclude one or more areas of any size within the spell's area from being affected." So the exact area of effect is depending on both the space plants occupy and the specific omissions the caster makes when they cast this spell.
Is a "line" 3-dimensional?
Not one by itself, but lines can certainly traverse 3 axes at once.
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Look at what you've done. You spoiled it. You have nobody to blame but yourself. Go sit and think about your actions.
Don't be mean. Rudeness is a vicious cycle, and it has to stop somewhere. Exceptions for things that are funny. Go to the current Competition of the Finest 'Brews! It's a cool place where cool people make cool things.
How I'm posting based on text formatting: Mod Hat Off - Mod Hat Also Off (I'm not a mod)
the spell doesn’t specifically state it’s a sphere. So it’s not specifically a sphere. It generally states its radius. The radius isn’t the issue, but since specific trumps general, RAW, plant growth is not a 3-d spell. RAI maybe they meant it so, and it can certainly be home brewed that way by whomever. But RAW…..
You are correct that Plant Growth does not specify the exact shape of the area of effect. However you have provided no other justification for why you believe Plant Growth's AoE is strictly two dimensional. I can make the same argument that the spell can't be treated two dimensionally. Nowhere in Plant Growth's description does it specify that it is a two dimensional area.
In fact all of the shapes described in the Areas of Effect section in the PHB (https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/phb/spellcasting#AreasofEffect) that involve a radius are three dimensional shapes, the Sphere and the Cylinder. Also between these two shapes the one that only uses a radius measure is the Sphere, the Cylinder requires a radius and a height. So if the use of the word radius is significant in Plant Growth's description then it implies a sphere. If the word radius is not significant then the shape of all points within 100 feet of the chosen point of origin depends on if the game world itself, is two or three dimensional? If the game world is three dimensional then the shape is a sphere because being a fixed distance from a single point is the mathematical definition of a sphere.
So why didn't the authors simply describe the AoE as a sphere? I see two reasons for not describing it as a sphere. The first (and I feel most important) is that Plant Growth does not cause plants to grow beyond the space they already occupy, the area of effect is the space occupied by plants within 100 feet of the chosen point of origin. The second reason for not describing the AoE as a sphere is because the caster " . . . can exclude one or more areas of any size within the spell's area from being affected." So the exact area of effect is depending on both the space plants occupy and the specific omissions the caster makes when they cast this spell.
Is a "line" 3-dimensional?
I don’t know of a spell effect that uses a line that isn’t 3 dimensional.
The Plant Growth spell does not list a height for the plants that are overgrown to the point of costing 4 feet of movement to move 1 foot.
This being the case, if a creature on the ground within the AoE of the affected plants tried to fly out of the area of Plant Growth, how would you determine the creature's ability to get above the AoE of the spell?
It strains common sense, but I might say you need to be 5’ up, the next vertical square. Seems like that avoids issues with occupying the square, since you’re in a different one.
Trees are plants.
Thus my question. And lest we not be clade-ist, cacti and kelp are plants too. I guess fungi are defined in D&D as plants even though, ummm, fungi.
This is something that is left up to the DM as it is highly dependant on the nature of the environment. As far as the rules are concerned any space within 100ft of the chosen origin point could be affected.
With all due respect:
Ask your DM.
[REDACTED]
I'd rule that as the area is a radius, not a circle, any vertical movement doesn't incur the penalty. I guess that means that the plants formed are only 1 foot high by my ruling.
All plants within a 100ft radius. This is not limited to horizontal distances. Like fireball, this would be a sphere of influence. It doesn’t bypass full cover though.
Common Misconception:Fireball doesn't explode upwards and downwards. It just spreads around corners. Its all in the wording: Compare Fireball to Flaming Sphere for the example of wording.Spells that operate in a Sphere, or Cube or anything like that, specify that it is 3 dimensional vs 2dimensional, and specify the height as well.Blank
From Fireball: "Each creature in a 20-foot-radius sphere centered on that point must make a Dexterity saving throw." - emphasis added.
interesting... thats not how its worded in the 5e spells app. which I used for reference.
Any route. I stand corrected re: fireball. But The point is still proven correct re: OP and plant growth, and similar spells. When they go upwards as well, it will specifically state sphere vs normal radius, or cube vs normal line, etc.
Blank
I'm sorry, are you saying that plants in the area of Plant Growth would be 100 feet tall? Holy moly. If that's not what you mean, perhaps clarify a bit.
What I mean is that the area where plants are becomes overgrown. Plants in the game have a wide range of shapes and sizes. The option of the spell that says that the plants become overgrown and cost additional movement would only be relevant if a creature can move through the area the plant already takes up, but doesn’t cause the plant to take up additional space.
so for example if there’s grasses that are in the space it becomes more difficult to traverse that space, but doesn’t cause the grass to grow 200ft tall.
if the spell is cast in an area that is covered in vines and other plants that perhaps drape down from other environmental structures then the area where the vines or thorns drape through become more difficult to traverse. How ever difficult that was to begin with becomes more difficult.
a tree would become overgrown. Depending on the tree I’d expect the branches to become overly leafy or otherwise overgrown in such a way as to impose that difficulty of movement to what ever portions would be able to produce that effect.
dnd 5e seems to lump in mushrooms and fungal growths into the plant category so I’d similarly reflect the change upon those areas too.
all that being said the way I’ve seen it explained most often is that a horizontal area of grass, though I’m not sure if that’s in the interest of simplicity or balancing factors. The speed of play is definitely a factor and I have no problem with anyone ruling it that way not that it matters one way or another.
The area of effect portion of the general rules portion of spell casting in the PHB goes over “typical” spell shapes: cone, cube, cylinder, line, or sphere.
It further specifies “Every area of effect has
a point of origin, a location from which the spell's energy erupts.
A spell's effect expands in straight lines from the point of origin. If no unblocked straight line extends from the point of origin to a location within the area of effect, that location isn't included in the spell's area. To block one of these imaginary lines, an obstruction must provide total cover, as explained in chapter 9.
Are we saying that unless a feature specifies its shape is spherical every time, it’s a horizontal “flat” circle? I don’t believe that’s written anywhere but I’m open to links or citations.
my biggest support for this is that the point of origin isn’t required to be on the ground or target a plant. It specifies that you can choose a point within range and the range is 150ft, then the radius of effect is 100ft from that point. So if it’s limited to horizontal then what happens if you target a point about 5ft to 95ft above a plant?
So… “I don’t believe that’s written anywhere but..”
you literally, just cited, and quoted exactly where that’s written RAW, not RAI, in this exact post, where you then said you don’t see it.
Your biggest support is the 5ft to 95 ft up: okay. So if a dragon born is flying… and is 60 ft up, and does his breath attack. It extends 30 ft up and down as well is what you imply happens.
the spell doesn’t specifically state it’s a sphere. So it’s not specifically a sphere. It generally states its radius. The radius isn’t the issue, but since specific trumps general, RAW, plant growth is not a 3-d spell. RAI maybe they meant it so, and it can certainly be home brewed that way by whomever. But RAW…..
Blank
You are correct that Plant Growth does not specify the exact shape of the area of effect. However you have provided no other justification for why you believe Plant Growth's AoE is strictly two dimensional. I can make the same argument that the spell can't be treated two dimensionally. Nowhere in Plant Growth's description does it specify that it is a two dimensional area.
In fact all of the shapes described in the Areas of Effect section in the PHB (https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/phb/spellcasting#AreasofEffect) that involve a radius are three dimensional shapes, the Sphere and the Cylinder. Also between these two shapes the one that only uses a radius measure is the Sphere, the Cylinder requires a radius and a height. So if the use of the word radius is significant in Plant Growth's description then it implies a sphere. If the word radius is not significant then the shape of all points within 100 feet of the chosen point of origin depends on if the game world itself, is two or three dimensional? If the game world is three dimensional then the shape is a sphere because being a fixed distance from a single point is the mathematical definition of a sphere.
So why didn't the authors simply describe the AoE as a sphere? I see two reasons for not describing it as a sphere. The first (and I feel most important) is that Plant Growth does not cause plants to grow beyond the space they already occupy, the area of effect is the space occupied by plants within 100 feet of the chosen point of origin. The second reason for not describing the AoE as a sphere is because the caster " . . . can exclude one or more areas of any size within the spell's area from being affected." So the exact area of effect is depending on both the space plants occupy and the specific omissions the caster makes when they cast this spell.
Is a "line" 3-dimensional?
Blank
If you select a point, and then affect everything within xft of that point. You have affected a sphere. You don't need to call it a sphere for it to be one.
I'm probably laughing.
Not one by itself, but lines can certainly traverse 3 axes at once.
Look at what you've done. You spoiled it. You have nobody to blame but yourself. Go sit and think about your actions.
Don't be mean. Rudeness is a vicious cycle, and it has to stop somewhere. Exceptions for things that are funny.
Go to the current Competition of the Finest 'Brews! It's a cool place where cool people make cool things.
How I'm posting based on text formatting: Mod Hat Off - Mod Hat Also Off (I'm not a mod)
I don’t know of a spell effect that uses a line that isn’t 3 dimensional.